Several years ago, I had a lucid dream in which I performed a retrieval of Janet, an ex-girlfriend who had recently committed suicide.  This retrieval was very cathartic for me because I felt guilt and sadness for breaking up with her a couple of years prior.  During the retrieval dream I had absolutely no doubt that the retrieval was real.

3 years ago, my Dad died rather suddenly and my brother and I couldn't get there (Kelowna, BC)  before he passed.  Then last year he showed up in a lucid dream and we went for a long walk during which I was able to express my love for him.  During that dream I was certain the contact was genuine.

But in both cases, I later reluctantly came to the conclusion that neither dream was real; rather, both were expressions of unconscious wish fulfillment.  "Why would you do that to yourself?"  you might ask.  Actually, it wasn't a choice; my skepticism just dawned on me very gradually. 

Still, I have often asked myself why and the answer, I think, is twofold. (1)  The happy postmortem survival of my Dad and Janet is far more important to me than my deep need to be reassured about their actual current state.  So when I feel internal pressure to believe something wonderful but irrational, I automatically push back with skepticism, awaiting convincing verification. 
(2) Secondly, I have learned how convincing many lucid dreams can be because the people and events in them, though clearly fictional, behave so convincingly beyond my conscious creative input. 

I am convinced that the starting point for true wisdom is knowing clearly what you don't know and honestly acknowledging that uncomfortable uncertainty.  The spiritual belief systems of many people blur the line between certain intuitive knowledge about spiritual experiences and odd coincidences that promote wishful thinking in the interests of a more logically coherent world view.  My skepticism about many of my experiences has the effect of making my indubitable paranormal revelations all the more sacred and precious.

    Skepticism from an astrological symbolism perspective:  The symbols I most associate with skepticism are Mercury and Saturn.  Mercury symbolizes and relates to, in general, the intellectual, left brain, linear logical side of us. Our conscious minds.
   I've noticed that people with very powerful Mercury in their charts, tend to have a good amount of some kind of yellow and/or tan color.  If it's linked to a very strong Sun at the same time, usually it's more towards the rare, "golden yellow" shades, which are faster vibratory and more infused with White Light that relates to PUL.
   Mercury, all in all, relates to the more positive side of skepticism, which is the necessary grounding balance of the left brain, logic type pattern, on the receptive/receiving right brain. 
     Saturn and skepticism: Saturn relates more to the fear based aspect or level of skepticism.  Mercury desires clarity and truth for the sake of same.  These are inherently important to Mercury. 
     Saturn on the other hand, is very "socially conscious".  Saturn is very related to not only fear in general, but especially one's self image in relation to "what will others think" ego type fear/worry. 
       Let's use a more concrete example.  Say you were born with Mercury in Capricorn, closely opposed Saturn in Cancer.  Mercury in Capricorn, is already careful, methodical, cautious, deliberate, and fairly grounded.  Cancer is a Sign that tends strongly towards self protection and defensiveness, especially emotionally.   
      Saturn in Cancer, would only highlight that pattern.  But what happens when you take Capricorn Mercury + Cancer Saturn in a powerful, direct aspects, it = a mind that has a strong pattern and tendency to be VERY worried and concerned about being accurate and correct in general, and especially in relation to one's socially oriented self image. A very strong concern and attachment to being perceived as accurate or well thought of in the mental sense.
     If a more mature Soul is born with such a pattern/indication, they probably will channel it mostly constructively, and the Love they attune to and become aware of, can help over-ride some of the less positive, possible expressions.  But, chances are, they will very strongly tend towards the a mental approach of skepticism, and at times, probably too much so. 
     Here is a link talking a little more about Saturn in a more holistic way:
http://afterlife-knowledge.com/cgi-bin/yabb/YaBB.cgi?num=1495135766 ;

    As I basically said earlier, I think faith needs to be balanced with skepticism and skepticism balanced out with faith.  Faith is more innate Love attuned and not concerned with self image, and is ready to dive in where Angels fear to tread. Faith is standing up on a cliff, looking down into the water, jumping off knowing you will be ok. Where there is a lack of self focus and consciousness, there tends to be positive faith tendencies and expression. 
     This is the faith aspect that Yeshua focused on, and for a reason.  He knew that his Piscean Age, would morph into a very intellectually polarized time period/cycle, and his messages about faith, were not just for the people around or his times, but for also for this future time of intellectual polarization.
      Astrologically, the concept of faith relates most to the Planet Jupiter.  A good counter balance to over Mercury Saturn attunement, especially if it become non constructive, is that of Jupiter.  For example, take that same Mercury in Capricorn position and instead of combining with a powerful aspect to Saturn in Cancer, you combine with a very close trine to Jupiter in Virgo. 
    This would indicate a much more balanced and positively faith informed kind of mind set and approach.  You have the natural skepticism, depth, penetration, and groundedness of Capricorn, but combined with the very expanded, positive, very intuitive, more Love/Universal Consciousness that Jupiter represents.
     Jupiter's "dark side" is that of "over doing", usually of that which is positive otherwise.  Capricorn Mercury here, would lend a necessary balance to faith filled Jupiter, and vice versa Jupiter would balance out the limiting tendencies of Capricorn Mercury.
      I tend to like to look at conditions and patterns very holistically.  Astrology might be a new language to some here, and not familiar, but it can really help one to become more conscious to that which tends to be unconscious in life, others, and/or self. Besides going within and contacting positive Guidance and meditation in general, I would say astrology is one of the most potent ways to be able to peer into the unconscious and/or shadow side of self and/or others. 
      I did full charts from age 16 to 26 or so for others. It has always amazed me, and though it's not much of a focus anymore, it's still interesting to look at things from this "multi-leveled consciousness symbolism language". It powerfully reminds me constantly, of how One everything truly is.
    Astrology is like a combo of microscope and telescope into the larger Universe of Consciousness. Course, like anything language related, your ability to perceive and interpret matters a lot in it's degree of helpfulness.

Justin, faith can be quite wise, and not as blind as some people might think.

Recoverer 2 wrote on May 18^th, 2017 at 9:05pm:


  Indeed.  As mentioned, I (and many other astrologer students) associate Jupiter the most with that kind of positive faith.  Cayce's guidance linked Jupiter to the next most expanded consciousness state/dimension in our little system of dimensions, second only to the Sun which is the fastest vibratory/most expanded. 

     Some excerpts relating to Jupiter, for those who came in with experiences in the non physical dimension(s) that Jupiter symbolizes:

   "In Jupiter we find the great ennobling influences, the broadmindedness, the ability to consider others, the universal consciousnesses that are part of the entity's unfoldment."  2890-2

  "Jupiter has made for not only the high ennobling influence but the tendency for relationships that deal with large numbers of peoples." 189-3

"In the influences seen in Jupiter, makes for that in the entity's experience of gaining a lesson from every experience, and with the application of will may the the entity use such experience as a stepping-stone for development of self, as related to the making of self in a closer relationship to the fellow man, thus fulfilling that of divine force or power..."  99-6

  Anyways, these are just a few examples.  Cayce's guidance often of linked Jupiter to themes, patterns, and tendencies of spiritual strength, Universal Consciousness, and ennobling tendencies. It's the bigness, the openness of heart which leads to faith.  And in that sense, the Sun is also linked to great faith, spiritual strength and lack of fear as well.

   

  It's kind of like that old saying, "to err is human..."  I might add that also "to be human is to be deluded to some extent, on some level, in some area." 
      There is no such thing as perfect perception if we're connected to a human body, and not fully connected to PUL and Source.  This recent situation showed me that perception can be a tricksy thing (especially in interaction with others).
       My very first impression before any, was that this person had been here before, which is why I asked them that early on.  Then because they told me they hadn't and because of what they were talking about skepticism, importance of lack of belief, etc, continually, and in the way they interacting, like they thought themselves wiser, more aware than me and others, led me to think it might be T.C.
    Before I meditated, I had a dream about the situation and the dream symbol figure, ended up surprising me by their distortion/lack of clarity in their vibe/essence and manner.   But having bought into a belief that someone led me down in a deceptive way, kept me from viewing them and the situation completely accurately. 
    The dream guidance was completely true, I just misinterpreted it based on preconceptions and believing another human. 
    Does this mean that from now on, I shouldn't trust my dream guidance because I garbled things a bit? No, I don't think so.  I think more than anything, I just need to focus on opening to Love more, and not be trusting of fellow humans.  It actually reinforced my previous view of trusting dreams more than meditation sought info, because the latter are easier to distort/garble. 
    When it comes to being human and perception, it's like the old saying, "you win some, you lose some".  Part of the trick is to be ok with "losing" being wrong sometimes. It's the human body ego side of us that HAS to be right at all costs. (and feels pangs when it's not.  I felt some of that briefly, to be honest.)
    I just came up with a saying, "He who never goes out on a limb, never falls, but rarely does he ever get to the top of the tree."  Parable for the topic. Ok, really going on a ALK vacay now. 

Recoverer 2 wrote on May 19^th, 2017 at 2:11pm:


Why would it be delusional to conclude that? Is it reasonable to assume that I was the first person ever to be deluded about such things, or that I will be the last? Please explain your logic.

Dude:

Just as holocaust victims know more about the holocaust than people who believe the conspiracy theories that state that the holocaust never happened, the people who go through certain experiences know them better than you, a person who didn't have their experiences.

The fact of how you believe you are able to judge other people's experience better than them, shows that you have yet to develop discrimination.

You're showing about as much discrimination now, as when you came on this forum and said that the holocaust was a hoax.


I Am Dude wrote on May 19^th, 2017 at 4:18pm:

Recoverer 2 wrote on May 19^th, 2017 at 5:07pm:


You haven't answered my questions. I'll ask again.

Is it reasonable to assume that I was the first person ever to be deluded about such things, or that I will be the last?

If the answer to these questions is no, which it most likely is, then it is entirely logical to conclude that others may also be deluded about such things. Subjective experiences that rely solely on memories and are usually always colored by one's own beliefs can be very difficult to accurately interpret and understand. My previous post simply illustrates how one's interpretations of one's own experiences can change over time depending on the mind state and beliefs of the individual.

Notice how I haven't stated any absolutes. Please stop pretending that I have.

Also note I never said anyone else was delusional, but rather it was you who projected what I said about my own experience onto others. Seems like you're begging for a confrontation.

Quote:


I never said this, nor do I think it. Please stop lying, it's not very befitting.

Quote:


Your compulsion to always make things personal is detrimental to this forum. Please stop or you will be reported and action will likely be taken.

Dude, I wish you all the best. God bless you in your spiritual journey.

R

Dude:

It doesn't make sense for you to speak of personal attacks, when you have no problem with suggesting that some of the beliefs of Bruce and others on this forum are demonic. Don't be a hypocrit.

I've had thousands of spiritual experiences, and I would be an utter fool to not believe in them, because of what you and Don experienced.

I spoke of faith earlier and about how I prayed to God and Christ thousands of times for guidance. If I have only been fooled, well then, what does that say about power of prayer?

Dude, if I may, let me suggest you ignore him. He and his sidekick are disruptive and contentious. They claim they are attuned to PUL and yet engage in ad hominen attacks and overall backbiting. They are blind to their own hypocrisy.

R

[/quote] QUOTE FROM DUDE:

Allow me to prove why your claim is false. Making a statement about a concept such as Discs is much different from making claims about a particular person's character. There is no hypocrisy in what I've said.

An example. If one makes the claim, "the New Age is deceptive," we should be able to discuss the evidence for or against this without bringing it to the level of making personal statements about the debaters (ad hominems), but unfortunately this is not the case on this forum.

Another example. Two people watch a magic show. One believes the magic is real, the other does not. A fruitful debate will involve discussing the evidence for each viewpoint. The wrong approach would be to call one another gullible fools.

No one has told you not to believe in what you've experienced. Again, I've only related my own experience. Please stop making my statements into that which they are not and were never intended to be.
[/quote] 



I also agree with this.  This forum is for discussion and I hope you all can settle down and get back to actual discussion.

The magic show analogy is a great one in and of itself, but also for the point you're making.

I'm not taking anyone's side on any of this.  I am just trying to help you guys all settle down and back off each other.

For all of you:
Please remember to engage in the conversation of the topic at hand.  "Engaging in kind" is a better way to look at how to properly have a conversation.  It means to talk about it and stay on topic.   In essence, if you don't like the topic at hand, then don't engage.  Like the magic show analogy, either talk about it and share your views, or don't.  But to argue about the topic itself is really bad form guys. 

If I don't see anything going obviously against the posting guidelines, then I will let you continue your topics of conversation.  I do see where some of you take things way too personally and end up skewing the conversation as such, and then the original topic gets side tracked.  Please be considerate to each other and stay on topic.  If the conversation naturally evolves to other things that's ok as long as you follow the posting guidelines. 

Vicky wrote on May 19^th, 2017 at 7:49pm:


I also agree. We need to decide for ourselves what to make of our own subjective experiences. What I don't agree with is the implication that I've somehow told anyone not to believe in their experiences, as this has not taken place.

I hope you can see what's going on here. It obviously hasn't stopped since I last PMed you.

I agree Vince.  I don't know why this continues.

It should be ok for two people to talk to each other within a thread.  If someone addresses someone else, then those two are having a conversation within the thread.  I see where that goes on and that's fine.

Justin,

I know you're making a point to show that Don wrote on your thread after apparently stating he wouldn't, but in all fairness he did not say anything offense or break the posting guidelines.  Then he and Dude began talking to each other.  Am I right guys?  That's ok.

My suggestion to those who are the offenders, please allow others to talk to whomever they wish.  Please allow others to share their viewpoints and opinions.  Please carry on discussions in a mature and appropriate manner. 

If any of you continue to argue and complain, I'll have to send out private warnings and bannings.  So from this point on, please just drop it.

Either have a conversation about something or not, but let's just completely drop this fighting.  I suggestion for a while that those of you who don't get along, leave each other's conversations alone for a while.  There are some good posts amidst the arguing and it's a shame. 


ALSO:  To make everyone feel they are being treated fairly, I've now sent out PMs with warnings to some of you that this pettiness and arguing and attacking needs to stop.  You are all aware that the next step is banning.  I hope it doesn't come to that.  And I personally hope none of you leave.  I hope that I'm playing a role in cooling things down and helping you all continue to stay and post and enjoy being here.

Justin, I'm sorry that I'm using your thread to say all this.  I'll leave this thread here in case you or anyone else wants to resume the original topic of conversation or anything else appropriate ok?

Thanks everyone   

I came into helping Bruce after those incidences you mentioned, but I see that Bruce moved that one to off topic.  I glanced through it and it looks like everyone was having a decent discussion on it.

At this point I don't want to have to backtrack into old threads to see who started what, who hates who, etc.  It's way, way too much.  My input in the last couple of days was in the spirit of trying to put all this to rest and everyone just moves forward.  That way, I'm not held responsible for going through all those old threads and posts and trying to figure out who did what.

I see a little bit of jabbing coming from everyone, and I see baiting and I see people being too easily offended.  So my hope is that from this point on it stops and we all move forward.

Then, if someone does something wrong, I hope no one else joins in and adds fuel to it.  Then the offending person will have to be banned, per Bruce's rules not mine.  I gave warnings to several of you as a way to even the playing field. 

Perhaps those threads of a religious nature, whether they are for debate or not, should be started in the Religion & Their Beliefs Forum.  Is everyone in agreement to that? 

Recoverer 2 wrote on May 19^th, 2017 at 10:22pm:


I'm taking it all in Albert, and I hear what you're saying.  I'm going to check with Bruce what he thinks.

Bruce had me move to off topic the thread with the mention of demons, but that was because people were fighting and complaining about each other.  And like I said I saw that he put the previous thread about the same thing off topic.  I can't say that I know why, but I will ask him.  So as far as that's concerned, it's been taken care of.

Is there another thread which still talks about this same thing?  Let me know which ones.   

I'm going to get Bruce involved and ask his thoughts about this and about what you've mentioned here Albert, and see what he thinks and what he wants done if anything. 

I'm being as fair and open-minded to all of you, and I hope you all feel it.  We'll get this straightened out somehow. 

Too bad Bruce isn't feeling so great these days.  But I spoke with him a few days ago and he's still the same old Bruce    He cares very much about this site, and I care very much about him.  You do the math.  It's why I'm here trying to help keep the site running for him. 

Vicky

 Justin: "Not that long ago, both Don and Vince complained about Albert and I responding to their posts and on their threads." 

That is simply false--and you know it.  We simply want you to directly address the subject under discussion. 

Justin: "Since that time, I have started a new thread in this section, and surprise, surprise, whom shows up to but [Don, Vince, and Roger."

I thought you would welcome an honest experience-based testimony on how our skepticism has evolved and functions.

Justin: "Two of the former folks who whined earlier that they wanted Albert and I to completely leave them alone." 

This blatant falsehood reflects your need to interpret as personal attacks our efforts to explore honest disagreement over experiences and sources. 

Albert: "it would be good to not try to turn forum into a fundamentalist Christian forum, when it wasn't started for that purpose."

Do you even understand the meaning of the word "Fundamentalist?" You (not me) brought up my perspective on the groupthink of thought Ghettos.  Neither you nor Justin seem willing to think outside the New Age box.  Much of what I have experienced and have to say is anathema to Fundamentalists!  Will you ever be willing to engage the hard work of honest and critical reflection?  Every true intellectual recognizes this foundational question for productive inquiry: If my thinking and beliefs are fundamentally misguided, and if some of my most influential experiences are delusional or distorted, how would I ever be able to find that out?  From the perspective of philosophical epistemology, a rational overview is meaningless if it is in principle unfalsifiable.

Albert: "Fundamentalist Strategy #1: Define new age experiences that don't seem to support the Bible as either delusional or demonic."

First, I have never described Bruce's, Justin's, or your experiences as "demonic."   I have pointed out Swedenborg's experiences that point to reincarnationism as delusional and the reasons for this judgment.   In view of ES's awesome verifications, I would think you'd welcome that counterpoint.  You and Justin profess to love and revere Christ.  As you know, in a blinding vision Christ called Paul to be His mouthpiece in the Gospel era.  So I'd think you'd be interested in Paul's claim that his opponents who also professed love and reverence for Jesus had visions and revelations that were demonic. 

Albert: "Fundamentalist Strategy #2: Provide Fundamentalist Christian perspectives."

This site features a section on "Religion and Their Beliefs."  Your comment seems to begrudge an active use of this section. 

Albert: "Fundamentalist Strategy #3: Act indignant when people take exception with this and see what's going on, and try to get those people banned."

I have never tried to get you or Justin banned.  On the contrary, I have thought that I should limit my stay here because the site few New Age posters now.  Keep in mind that I only returned as a result of encouragement from Roger and Matthew, neither of whom are even professing Christians! 

     

 

  If people sincerely and deeply pray to the Creator, Yeshua, and/or the collective Beings of pure Light (aka the purely Creative Forces) for help, then such an individual will be helped by these. If they live their lives backing up such seeking, then that help will become ever more apparent, and a strong interconnection will be built up between the individual and that collective Force of pure Light. 

    In either case, if one is seeking information, then one should always use their discrimination and discernment.  There are certain techniques and methods, besides the above prayer/intention setting, that also help and strengthen this connection. 

  The one that Bruce teaches about remembering the feeling of Love, is an excellent one. Feeling and tuning into gratitude/appreciation also helps.   

  There is no need for outright fear. This Universe/Creation is primarily benevolent in the larger reality.  It's here on earth, that there is the most problems with dark forces.  But even then, the truth is, the majority of people are decent hearted and trying to spiritually grow.  Only a minority are psychopathic, and truly and more fully evil. 

  Well, it's like that in the larger reality too. Yes, there are some bad apples out there, but there are entire groves of trees with healthy, growing fruit at the same time.  Specific intentions and prayers are important.  So aren't one's inner motivations.  In other words, according to the Universal Law built into all of Creation, Like attracts and begets Like.  Light attracts and begets Light.  Negativity/selfishness/fear attracts and begets negativity (and attracts/builds up connection to dark forces from without.)

  Perhaps when an individual is more dark than Light themselves within, they project that darkness onto others and the larger reality?   Perhaps such individuals unbeknownst to themselves, have Reptilian claws embedded in their energy system, helping to skew and distort their perceptions and beingness? 

 

Albert,

No one longs to believe in retrievals and even perform them more than me.  The Bible teaches the possibility of soul retrievals and the possibility of retrievals is one way to make real the fact that God's love does not abandon anyone after death.  So I joined this site around 2001 because I hoped that testimonies would encourage me to believe that many today are actually performing retrievals. 
So it was with great sadness that my perusal of retrieval stories and my practice with the Gateway CDs reluctantly convinced me that the reported retrievals, including my onw, were not authentic. 

I liken that journey to my lifelong experience and observation of speaking in tongues.  In my view, no human experience (including NDE encounters with the Being of Light) can even remotely approach the power, beauty, and transforming character of the genuine manifestation of tongues.  So it is with great sadness that I have reluctantly come to the conclusion that 95% of glossolalia experiences I have observed are bogus.  That conclusion makes me cautious about recommending that others pursue this gift, because I don't want to send then down a path the ultimately climaxes in disillusionment.  What I can and will do in my thread on this subject is identify the method that worked for me.

   Hi Don,

    Still waiting on that apology for you basically calling me a liar. I gave you clear proof of what I was talking about.  Previously you used strong words in relation to me and what I had said, such as "blatant falsehood". 
 
     What do you think Yeshua would think and feel about you accusing people of lying/falsehoods without merit, and then without apologizing when you were shown wrong?  Do you think he would be happy with, or like such behavior?  How does that reflect on Christians and the Christian community?  Are you serving God or him when engaging in such judgmental and limiting behavior?

    Anyways, a simple sorry, I was wrong and misspoke, would suffice. This odd human is quick to look past other's errors or attacks directed his way, particularly with those he knows tend to be sincere most of the time otherwise. I'm making this an issue, because I sense that humility would be a helpful pattern for you to engage in more. 

   I know a little something about that. The Sun Sign I'm born under, Capricorn, rules the knees in the body Temple. The deeper, spiritual significance of same is that of bending the knee in prayer to a higher power, and to service to the whole--think Yeshua washing his disciples' feet. In other words, humility and learning to be led. I've had to learn to be more humble and give up my self will.
    Did I not tell you not long ago in a p.m. that you had a strong focus on self will, aka symbolically strong focus on the throat center?  The counter part/balance to same is the knees.

TheDonald wrote on May 20^th, 2017 at 4:22pm:


Don,

I assume you've shared your experiences before and your reasons for not believing your own experiences to be authentic, but can you sum up why you feel that way? 

I appreciate your desire for research, but perhaps too much focus on research of other people's experience while at the same time seeking your own experiences isn't the best way to go. 

My technique going about it is that when something catches my interest, before doing research about it I first seek out my own direct experience if I can.  There is a lot behind the saying "beginner's luck".  What it is is that when we go into something with a fresh mind like a clean slate we have nothing to block our expectations, perceptions, or beliefs.  I've found it to be the best and most authentic way to gather now only my own direct experience but also my own untainted opinions and beliefs. 

Yes, belittling of any kind is not ok and definitely not in the spirit of what Bruce wants here. 

Here's hoping things will move forward smoothly!

   Alan, you bring up an excellent issue that is definitely worth going into more. I understand what you're saying and why you're saying it. My short, summarized answer is that it's not a black and white issue.
    The first, original Creator, or we could say, the very "first Self/awareness" is the same as some call God and what Yeshua often referred to as Abba (Father).  Yeshua referred to God in this way, as Abba, because he was highlighting the connection between the creative, force aspect of God and that of what some call Yang, masculine, etc energy and attunement.   
     God was originally polarized to the Yin, Feminine, before It changed within Itself and integrated It's Yang/Masculine side which led to the creation of many different Spirits from within Itself. 
     Yeshua is connected to one of those original Spirits or "Children", whom was the very first to fully re-merge with Source/the Creator/original, first Self. In doing so, Yeshua's Spirit not only became a full companion and One with God, but also became a Co-Creator with God.
    The result?   Many of our Spirits and the origin of this particular Universe.  Yeshua's Spirit self imagined this Universe (not the dense physical part) into existence.  It was act of self expression, creativity, and artistry in motion.  In a human sense though, we could say that God is greater than Yeshua's Spirit, for God came first, God is the Consciousness and Force that set ALL of this into motion originally.  God is the First and Primary Creator. 
       But in a different sense, there is no "greater or lesser" among Beings whom are so One with each other.  Humans cannot even begin to conceive of the Oneness that exists between God, Yeshua, and the other fully returned Children of God.  You know how when a huge flock of birds all turn on a dime at the same time?  That's like the Oneness between God, Yeshua and the other pure Light Beings.  There is no separation, though they ALL are individuals. 
       Or, in more human terms, a parable:  One day, you meet an older man whom is very kind, very wise, very loving, and owns a huge non profit business.  He strikes up a conversation with you, and he says, "Alan, I would love for you to meet my Son, whom I'm very pleased with. 
        He has become a full partner in my company, and since he has joined, the company has grown and expanded phenomenally.  He has been bringing in other business partners that are helping the company grow and expand more too!   I am so happy with him.  If you ever need anything from me or the company, you can ask me or him, because I have given him all powers and authority when he became my full partner."
     When you do meet the Son, you find that the Son is MUCH like the Father in many ways.  He also is very kind, very wise, and very loving.  The Son even looks a lot like the Father, though there are some minor differences.
        Truly do we have an advocate with the Abba/Immah in Yeshua.  God made Yeshua a full business partner in It's vast company.  Every Spirit and Soul that fully merges it's little light with the Big Light of God, becomes part of "managment" level at this same vast and eternal company.  But in this Universe, because it's a direct Co-Creation of Yeshua's, with help from God, it is God and Yeshua that have the most authority in this Universe.
        If you could go to another Universe, that was Co-Created by another fully grown up Child of God, then in that Reality, the Co-Creator of that one, along with God, would be the primary authorities. 
        However, as mentioned, there is a Oneness between God and It's fully grown up Children, whom have become Co-Creators and full companions, so that their Will is so in alignment, that it's more like a "collective Will" that ALL is intune with God's. 
      When we pray to God, in a very real sense, we are also praying to that collective of pure Light Beings that are fully One with God, and who know and do God's Will. 
       Because for awhile, Yeshua was connected to a human body with limitations and distortion, until his Resurrection, he didn't always have full awareness of everything, like he does now.  You'll find that even in Yeshua, there were some differences in him before and after the Resurrection--especially as to degree of awareness. 
      When he was still connected to a human form, he told his disciples not to pray to him, and he was being wise, humble, and pragmatic about that. Now that he has had his awareness fully opened up, he knows that there is not much difference between praying to God or him, for they are in perfect attunement, harmony, and accord.

    At the end of the day, you should pray how most feels right to you.  If you prefer to pray to God only--that's fine. If it feels and seems right to pray to both God and Yeshua--well, I think they will understand and that it's OK. 
      Yeshua said that he would send an advocate for him/on his and his Father's behalf.  Do NOT pray to this advocate should one come to know him. This advocate, according to Yeshua, would speak of Yeshua and make plain his truths to humanity. Yeshua said he would speak through this person, to others. 

   Albert, I agree with a lot of what you said. This is part of the reason why I tend to trust dream guidance messages more than ones received during meditation. 

   A lacking in Light, negative person, Soul, non human, etc can try to inject limiting/distorted info when a person is in dream state--like when they are meditating, BUT during the dream state, the Soul and/or Higher self levels of a person is much more in control of determining which dreams we actually remember. 

  Hence, any interference, distortion, meddling, etc that can occur during the dream state from outside sources, is easily put aside. 

  When a person is meditating and thus fully awake, one's conscious, personality mind is much more active and involved in receiving, translating/interpreting whatever comes through. Distortions can happen because of outside meddling, and can happen because of one's own distortions of the personality, conscious mind and the "body ego".

    This is probably why, much of the most major and most important guidance messages that I've received, has come most often in the form of dreams--that, or guidance knows that I trust that avenue the most.