Rondele,

You are the voice of reason in an appalling demonstration of the antithesis of Pure Unconditional Love.  I am now Democratic in my political leanings, largely because I see the desperate plight of so many homeless families who need remedial programs that churches can only provide to a limited extent.  But despite my disagreements with George W. Bush, I consider him a man of the highest integrity and agree with you that his haters display their dirty linen by their obvious refusal to give him the benefit of the doubt.  Such guttersniping conspiracy theories are precisely what I would expect from the New Age Ghetto and are constantly displayed on George Noory's the New Age radio program "Coast to Coast"  (e. g. all the Illuminati paranoia).  GW is a United Methodist, not a Fundamentalist, and United Methodists realize that the Babylon image in biblical apocalyptic is a symbol of Rome, and not of the ancient empire centered in what is now Iraq.  To blame GW for the Iraq invasion on the basis of such ignorant apocalyptic nonsense is mean-spirited. This nonsense reveals the mindset of key denizens of this site and is just one reason why I no longer trust recoverer's judgment or interpretations of his experiences of the afterlife. 

Do you think man has really walked on the moon  .

You want to know another conspiracy theory? Don probably believes I communicate with demons (he has suggested the same for Bruce Moen and Robert Monroe).

This is ironic, since I suggested that malicious beings might influence people in positions of power, such as Bush and Cheney. If such malicious beings exist, is it unreasonable to hypothesize that they might influence people who do negative things such as start unecessary wars, support torture, and lie to the people who sort of elected them?

I on the other hand am suggesting that we look out for the negative deeds that have happened, and that might've happened (e.g.; an inside 911 job). Would demons influence one to look out in such a perhaps responsible way?

[Andy B] Do you think man has really walked on the moon  .

[/quote]

No, it is well known in the New Age movement that the moon-landing was faked in a New Mexico hangar to give us a propaganda adventage over the Commies. And Satan planted countless fossils in the ground to invent the lie of evolution.  And G. W. faked his life-changing conversion to give himself political capital to run for President so he could engineer the mass murder of 3,000 New Yorkers and make a name for himself by overthrowing Sadam Hussein.

And recoverer, integrity is a function of personal beliefs, not of outcomes (e. g. no WMD).  I think you are misreading Howard Storm.  I have been in personal contact with him vail e-mail.  In my view, neither his NDE Jesus nor the historical Jesus would agree with your blanket statement.  Jesus taught the right of self-defense (Luke 22:36-38) and even recruited Simon the Zealot as one of the  twelve apostles.   The Zealots later evolved in the rebels who staged an unseccessful revolt against Rome. 

And why are you lying and claiming that your and Bruce's astral sources are disguised demons?  To point out that there are spirit impersonators that deceive or that unverified astral travel might in some cases be delusary is very different than attributing it to demons.  The spirit impersonators might, as Swedenborg contends, be discarnate humans.  I never made the claim you allege.

Don:

It seems to me that Storm was quite clear at being told that war is unacceptable.

Regarding the right to defend ourselves, when did Iraq attack the United States? Is a supposed pre-emptive strike really a self defense?

Whatever the case, do you really believe that Jesus believes it was acceptable for the United States to attack Iraq?

Maybe you didn't say demon, but I have read posts where you stated that Robert Monroe was misled by a deceptive spirit. Deceptive spirit--demon, what's the difference?

Regarding your conspiracy theory about me, that was a joke more than anything. Perhaps you believe I am deluded and don't receive any information at all. If so, it's funny that the information and energetic work I received has helped me grow spiritually. It's funny that I received information about things I didn't know about before hand. It's funny that I opened myself up to divine inspiration and guidance with great sincerity, and I only experienced self-delusion.







Berserk2 wrote on May 6^th, 2011 at 6:20pm:


No, it is well known in the New Age movement that the moon-landing was faked in a New Mexico hangar to give us a propaganda adventage over the Commies. And Satan planted countless fossils in the ground to invent the lie of evolution.  And G. W. faked his life-changing conversion to give himself political capital to run for President so he could engineer the mass murder of 3,000 New Yorkers and make a name for himself by overthrowing Sadam Hussein.

And recoverer, integrity is a function of personal beliefs, not of outcomes (e. g. no WMD).  I think you are misreading Howard Storm.  I have been in personal contact with him vail e-mail.  In my view, neither his NDE Jesus nor the historical Jesus would agree with your blanket statement.  Jesus taught the right of self-defense (Luke 22:36-38) and even recruited Simon the Zealot as one of the  twelve apostles.   The Zealots later evolved in the rebels who staged an unseccessful revolt against Rome. 

And why are you lying and claiming that your and Bruce's astral sources are disguised demons?  To point out that there are spirit impersonators that deceive or that unverified astral travel might in some cases be delusary is very different than attributing it to demons.  The spirit impersonators might, as Swedenborg contends, be discarnate humans.  I never made the claim you allege.  [/quote]

GW's invasion of Iraq was predicated on Sadam's possession of WMDs and his willngness to use them against us and perhaps his own people.  Most experts mistakenly agreed that he had them.   GW made an error of judgment but this does ot impugn his personal integrity.  Is Iraq better off without Sadam?  Of course.  Would the oro-democracy uprisings throughout the Arab world have happened without the Iraqi precedent?  Perhaps not.  So might not the net effect be a lot more good than evil?  Probably.  Would Jesus have approved of the invasion?  Perhaps.  I don't know and neither do you.  But you are ducking the key issues: (1) slandering GW without sufficient evidence (= no PUL); (2) falsely accusing me of attributing Bruce's and your astral contacts to demons.  I am grateful for Bruce's site and his reports of his discoveries.  But I feel obligated to compare competing claims on the basis of who has the best verifications.  The possibility of confusing genuine astral contact with some form of consciousness akin to lucid dreamnig and the possibility of mischievous discarnate humans providing false information are well attested by Swedenborg and are in any case nowhere near the cleim  that Bruce and you experience demonic astral contacts.  That insinuation is an unkind lie which you cannot back up from any of my old threads.

rondele wrote on May 4^th, 2011 at 7:37pm:

The reason I ask this question is that a person from Europe on his way to a meeting saw the Pentagon attack "plane", and noticed that it made a sharp S-curve, impossible to do for a civil air plane. He also noticed that it was a small plane, not a Boeing. So he just assumed that it was a military plane at low height and that everything was fine.

He _didn't_ see the actually crash into Pentagon, be he was able to follow the small plane (which has been assumed to be a Global Hawk drone, by inspection of a later photo of its burnt out engine) until about 10-15 seconds before the crash.

He also saw the huge orange-yellow fire ball and noticed that it was expanding as it rose, which indicates that it may not have been usual air plane fuel, but U.S. military explosives which brought down part of the Pentagon building.

So...

Ok.

Could you please tell me _exactly_ how the plane moved through the air the last one minute before the crash?

Don:

I remember very clearly that there are posts where you said that on some occasions Robert Monroe received information from lower level beings. Such accusations really stood out to me.  There are a lot of threads on this forum and it would be unrealistic to try to find the posts where you said this. I don't become a liar because your memory isn't serving you well.


I don't buy that business about Bush making a WMD mistake. The evidence was too flimsy. The Valerie Plame story needs to be considered. People such as Bush are able to mislead people because people allow themselves to be misled.

It isn't a matter of accusing without having a trial. It is a matter of wanting to have a trial. When people are so opposed to questioning as you are, a trial will never happen.

I got to tell you Don, you seem to be very naive about what has gone on with the American government.