Alysia said:  I have too many examples of meeting with others out there, until one begins to question which reality is real, which is fabrication or wishful thinking? When the dreamworld or obe world becomes real, it sometimes produces a belief system crash, where you begin to feel quite crazy.

This has been so true for me, and when you become many different beings or nothing but a mathematical point of awareness or perhaps find yourself in your I/there, disc, or white birthday cake, the things that seemed so all important in this reality can become just a passing thought.

Infinity is what I think I am suggesting here.  I have not experienced infinity consciously and don't know how I could, nor do I want to now, but it does seem to me that we may, in fact, go on forever.

The reality of never ending could be overwhelming and so, I think, this is why we build boxes and take it a chunk at a time.

Like Alan said, (which gave me a chuckle)  Gosh!  I hope this makes some sense?

PUL  SHSS   

SHSS wrote on May 19^th, 2008 at 6:02pm:


maybe Next Sunday you can come. I've been here 8 yrs and still haven't gotten my point across very well SHSS! lol....birds of a feather....

I'm with you, with I'm talking imagination, I too am talking real. we have more in common than meets the eye here, as you say "I take my dreams etc very seriously in a humorous way.....ok, haha! check out my user name!
as far as god being a monster..thats the human propensity to shuffle the blame unto the creator for our sufferings...but I wonder where the atheist shuffles the blame over to? probably unto society..what a vicious circle.
In the times ahead for us, if I can play fortune teller here, a new consciousness arises; something like instant self responsibility perhaps.

then we all can say the devil didn't make me do it, but then neither did god make me do it so I must be the one responsible! anyhoo..I'm looking forward to a new world, actually I think I'm already there and just keep typing on this board like I'm really here..hahaha!!

just read your newest post, quote: The reality of never ending could be overwhelming and so, I think, this is why we build boxes and take it a chunk at a time.
the next poster agrees, and I agree chunk at a time is to KISS. keep it simple silly. Otherwise we should on ourselves too easily and blow out brain circuits thinking too hard.

I think our of friend Monroe, Robert Monroe who started the Monroe Institute. When he first began having Obes, he suffered a belief system crash of major proportion.
He began making the rounds of various doctors, starting with a general practicioner on up to psychiatrist, I imagine he took some tranquilizers in there somewhere, as of course, none of the doctors really knew how to help him and the obes continued.
anyhow, he felt crazy. Because no one around him were having similar experiences..which is what they are, experiences.
As it turned out he was fulfilling his destiny to build the Monroe Institute and also supply us with his books, which in turn others like Bruce Moen came along as his student, suppling us with further books, tapes and teachings. Then Vickie is ready to publish her book now. I published mine, mentioning retrievals. Gordon Phinn, another member here has since published two books about our afterlife and his travels. who else? Bob, another member has promised a book. I must go light his fire and get him moving!  I wish. 

What is it that survives is the name of this topic thread. to get back on topic Ian, maybe it is what we leave behind in physical reality is what survives...it has to be a part of that at the least. I always say, it's the kids who are the future..lets leave them something to read.

Yet leaving something behind can be as simple as a child that knows how to love people because you raised it to do that. its an idea.

There's other books and people like Monroe, but it was Monroe's books that made me question if I was able to do what he did, a retrieval, that caused me to find out that I can do them, and that if he's not crazy to discover this other world, then I'm not crazy either for flippin out o me body!

well now we have phasing. we're gonna have to teach you phasing SHSS! its soooooo much easier than obe, obe is difficult to master. Phasing, you are just there.

love, alysia

Hi Alysia, pardon my slow reply - I've as you know been diving in and out and other stuff caught my eye.

To your points on the 'who am I' question, and your comment that it becomes hard to tell which experience is real, and which the dream. And your mention of blinking in and out.

I can identify so much with this - there's times the physical starts to feel dreamlike, and to lose some of its compulsive quality. I was making headway via my meditation which with energy work was producing states that seemed to carry out into normal life. Then this family problem blew up last week and suddenly I'm leaden and locked in again. 

Patience is a great word for what's required. Equanimity is another, as is presence. Courage to stay, to trust too. To quote Eckhardt Tolle  - there is nothing except now, nothing else is real. But it takes so much of whatever the ingredient is to rest in it, to not start into the mental gymnastics of ruminating about the past, or the future, or some other imagined reality.

Time plays its part too. I've heard it described as a way of slowing things down to a pace we can handle while learning, although of course that's only one view of the whole deal. Thistle's 'one chunk at a time'.

Mental gymnastics as above have the opposite effect. Eqanimity creates space which enables sensing and awareness, and hence opening into realities beyond the one that usually holds us entranced. Ultimately into creation of realities.

This all tends to come together for me with the idea (as I think you said) of an awareness hopping between multiple realities. All are presumably equally valid. The hopper is perhaps the 'I'. Lightness and lack of heavy identification with any belief system is perhaps the ticket to ride - get caught in one and you're grounded.

The C1 earth physical being so intense and addictive is the obvious candidate for the sort of clinging to it Monroe describes, but it seems to be possible to get attached to and locked into others too.

It certainly seems that more and more is manifesting. I wonder why this is. Is it a personal experience caused simply by opening, or something more generalised?

I recently started Yoga, and met a teacher last Friday as arranged weeks before. After formalities the flow of our conversation immediately led her to (unprompted) start talking in a really helpful way about dealing with difficult family relationships. I couldn't help laughing, as by then I was only just starting to get myself together again after the problem mentioned above which blew up out of nowhere -  after the meeting was arranged...

..

SHSS:

Regarding OBEs with all the effects, I used to have them, but once I energetically developed it was no longer necessary. Therefore, I don't believe you have to worry about all the effects. That open door or window thing sounds cool. The sort of thing your spirit guidance (perhaps your disk) might be setting up for you.

Here is how retrievels started for me. First while laying in bed awake or meditating I would see an image of a person looking at me and it would seem is if this person was stressed out in some way. The image would dissapear and I'd imagine myself talking to this person in retrievel terms. It wouldn't take long before I found myself in some place non-physically and events would take place without my imagining them. After receiving a few verifications I didn't feel the need to keep questioning whether something is actually taking place.

SHSS wrote on May 21^st, 2008 at 5:41pm:

Ian said: It certainly seems that more and more is manifesting. I wonder why this is.
___

Some say theres a speed up of the cycle of rotation of our planet which means we have less hours in a day, they say we only have 16 hours in a day now. but I call it the shift in consciousness because we are all shifting our beliefs around as we grow. just a simple explanation for what is difficult to put in words.
_____

Is it a personal experience caused simply by opening, or something more generalised?
____

we can close down to it, but like you said caused by opening to it, once you get on the path, so to speak, it's because you wanted to know yourself, you don't want to shut down to knowledge of yourself, you wouldn't want to do that anyway, so I always say enjoy the ride.
____ 

I recently started Yoga, and met a teacher last Friday as arranged weeks before. After formalities the flow of our conversation immediately led her to (unprompted) start talking in a really helpful way about dealing with difficult family relationships. I couldn't help laughing, as by then I was only just starting to get myself together again after the problem mentioned above which blew up out of nowhere -  after the meeting was arranged...
____

it's not a coincidence, the things that happen this way, they always cause the giggles in me too. I ascertained later, I remember putting out a call for a certain answer to come, and it shows up in a body form sometimes, a real person is delivering the answer to a prayer. this person to my way of perspective, doesn't know spirit is using them to tell me what I need to know. sometimes if their into my studies we can both know what's going on, but generally most folks don't study these areas, so good for you, I hope the Yoga teacher was able to assist. it shows the oneness aspect of us all.

a friend of mine told me something I needed to hear once or twice, he said as we grow spiritually, our circle of friends changes, the family members and those relations may even change. So we should be on our toes if that happens, I suppose, it's hard to leave old friends..not to speak of leaving our family members...I one time had to die to a daughter role to my mother, I think I told you about that already. Turns out we role play as spirit in a body.
thanks for telling us that cheery story Ian!

Thank you recoverer and Alysia.  I want to do retrievals so bad it's killing me.  I have not set up a home inside, I don't know how.  Yesterday I talked, (telepathy) with an old dead friend I had forgotten all about and this was somewhat shocking and from what has been going on lately, I feel doing retrievals is getting close.
I did not quit here.  I had an awful Sunday and needed some time to recover.  Not many people are accepting of this stuff and I was blessed with a very religious family that does a lot of praying for my lost soul.  I don't mention what I'm into, but if you come over to my house, you can't help but see thousands of very weird books.  Oh well.
If it were not for the internet, I would not have anyone to talk to about this stuff.  I don't know where Monroe found all his friends.  PUL

Thanks recoverer.

That's an interesting post.  Yes, I think things can be arranged this way.  I forget.
I have started to write down my dreams again.  I had quit because I had so much at one time, my fingers got tired.  I will pay attention to this because I have a feeling this may be going on-unconscious retrievals.