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Does anyone know about archetypes? (Read 4696 times)
Alan McDougall
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Does anyone know about archetypes?
Apr 7th, 2009 at 5:17am
 
Greetings forum

I have lately being investigating my prime archetypes (Caroline Myss)

Is there anyone in the forum who had knowledge about this means of realising who you are etc

My archetype wheel came out as below, rather strange?

1 Mystic - Personality and Ego
2 Prophet - Life Values
3 Muse - Self Expression and Siblings
4 Addict - Home
5 Dreamer - Occupation and health
6 Teacher - Relationships
7 Messiah - Other Peoples Resources
8 Seeker - Spirituality
9 Redeemer - Interactions with the World
10 prostitute
11 Victim
12 Saboteur

Alan
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Re: Does anyone know about archetypes?
Reply #1 - Apr 7th, 2009 at 8:52am
 
i didnt really get ur point alan... Embarrassed
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identcat
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Re: Does anyone know about archetypes?
Reply #2 - Apr 7th, 2009 at 2:02pm
 
I read the book by Carolyn Myss and have worked out a workbook for myself. Also, I went to see her at the Kripalu Center in Lenox, MA two years ago. She only briefly spoke about the archetypes. She was promoting her new book, "Entering the Castle".  I enjoyed the weekend very much, but the archetypes is ver difficult to get through and at the end of her book, she wants you to write down all the types, then put them in a bowl, pick out at random the types to see where spirit is guiding you. I wrote another whole book trying to decifer hers!! I got a lot out of the book, but it took me about 3 months to read because of all the notes I took. Also, I found I had to have absolute quiet to obsorbe it all.  ---cat
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The three things you can never take back:
The spoken word.
The unkind thought.
The misused hour.
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betson
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Re: Does anyone know about archetypes?
Reply #3 - Apr 7th, 2009 at 3:31pm
 
Hi Alan,

I can understand why the top half of the list fits you, but why the bottom half ? (I don't know Caroline Myss' use of archetypes, however.)

Bets
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Re: Does anyone know about archetypes?
Reply #4 - Apr 8th, 2009 at 1:00am
 
Carolyn Myss (pronounced Mace) gives 12 archetypes and there are many sub archetypes that tie in to the original 12. Her book is entitled "Sacred Contracts". As I said, it's very detailed and takes a long time to go through. ---cat
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Alan McDougall
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Re: Does anyone know about archetypes?
Reply #5 - Apr 8th, 2009 at 3:49am
 
Hi Betson sand identcat

I am busy studying archetypes via Caroline Myss and it is a work in progress. The archetypes that appear to me wrong Bets, those don't for instant mean I am/was a prostitute in real life, but it is an aspect of our innate character we all use from time to time to get our way in life, even if we are not aware of it.

identcat I think you might know more about this topic than I do, so correct me if I am wrong

Thanks for responding

Love

Alan
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Alan McDougall
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Re: Does anyone know about archetypes?
Reply #6 - Apr 8th, 2009 at 7:59am
 
I am not infringing copyright the archetype articles by Caroline Myss can be accessed by anyone doing a web search.I have joined her community and you guys might find my archetypes interesting

Hi folk you might find this of interest

Martie, I state below, the reason I chose this archetype, but I know in reality those archetypes chose me, they are intrinsic me quintessential and innate me if you like




1) Addict

From a symbolic perspective, the shadow aspect of the Addict represents a struggle with will power and the absence of self-control. People who are extremely intellectual or emotional frequently have a close link to this archetype, because they struggle to balance these powers. Without this internal balance, the will may give up its power to an external substance that exerts authority, providing shadow order to your life. The shadow Addict compromises your integrity and honesty. Many addicts, for example, steal as a means of supporting their habit

Reason I chose this archetype

.I have an addictive personality even obsessive, the use of ideas and drugs help me cope and isolate from the pain of society and withdraw Manic Depression make this part of my psyche much worse. Strangle it made me become more spiritual, but this took years.  It is still a real part of my life but now under control. My family and medical people help ovoid the destructivity that could have ultimately led to my early death

Thinking about this archetype is frightening and it has appeared in my dream, with someone forcing drugs down my throat



2) Artist

The shadow Artist comprises many clichés, including an eccentric nature and the madness that often accompanies genius. The Starving Artist represents the fear of financial ruin or the belief that fame and fortune come only after death, which often cause artists to suppress their talents. In evaluating your relationship to this archetype, recognize that the need to bring art to others, such as dedicating part of the energy of your life to supporting artists, is as much an expression of the Artist archetype as actually holding a brush in your hand.

Baudelaire wrote that "genius is childhood recaptured," and in that sense the Magical Child is something of a genius too. The Magical Child is gifted with the power of imagination and the belief that everything is possible. The shadow energy of the Magical Child manifests as the absence of the possibility of miracles and of the transformation of evil to good. Attitudes of pessimism and depression, particularly when exploring dreams, often emerge from an injured

Magical Child whose dreams were "once upon a time" thought foolish by cynical adults. The shadow may also manifest as a belief that energy and action are not required, allowing one to retreat into fantasy.


Reason I chose this archetype


I am extremely creative and suffer from what many call the Brilliant Madness, manic depression most of my life. The fires of my very vivid imagination were stroked by this intrinsic flaw in me.  I think the unspeakably pain and horror of the extreme mania made me write some dark poetry as well as beautiful. I paint with word not brush]



3) Child: Magical/Innocent

Baudelaire wrote that "genius is childhood recaptured," and in that sense the Magical Child is something of a genius too. The Magical Child is gifted with the power of imagination and the belief that everything is possible. The shadow energy of the Magical Child manifests as the absence of the possibility of miracles and of the transformation of evil to good. Attitudes of pessimism and depression, particularly when exploring dreams, often emerge from an injured Magical Child whose dreams were "once upon a time" thought foolish by cynical adults. The shadow may also manifest as a belief that energy and action are not required, allowing one to retreat into fantasy.



Reason I chose this archetype

I have always been the Child Magical/Innocent for the exact same reason of my artist archetype



4) Exorcist (Shaman)
The ability to confront evil in the form of possession by destructive or antisocial impulses in oneself and others is as valuable today as it was in the time of Jesus, the master Exorcist. Just as modern biblical scholars suggest that the demons that Jesus cast out may have been forms of psychological illness, so we can see our own inner demons as arising from forces that we feel are beyond our control. Shamans, for example, conduct rituals for the release of negative spirits from a person's soul. To include this among your family of archetypes, however, you would have to find a life-long pattern or exorcising the negative spirits of others or of social groups or society.


Reason I chose this archetype

I seem to have a power over evil and have cleared a home from the dark energy of a poltergeist. I am extremely sensitive to evil as well as good energy and at the very first moment of meeting a stranger I can sense this.



5) Wounded Healer
The Wounded Healer is initiated into the art of healing through some form of personal hardship--anything from an actual physical injury or illness to the loss of all one's earthly possessions. Regardless of the shape of the wound, the challenge inherent in this initiation process is that one is unable to turn to others for help beyond a certain degree of support. Only the initiate can ultimately heal the wound; if it is an illness or accident, it will frequently be one for which there is no conventional cure. The Wounded Healer archetype emerges in your psyche with the demand that you push yourself to a level of inner effort that becomes more a process of transformation than an attempt to heal an illness. If you have successfully completed the initiation, you inevitably experience an exceptional healing, and a path of service seems to be divinely provided shortly after the initiation is complete.
The shadow of both the Healer and Wounded Healer manifests through a desire to take advantage of those who need help, including claims that you can heal any and every illness a person has

Reason I chose this archetype

My life long battle with manic depression , my childhood illnesses, my time in a convalescent home made me the wounded healer I am today I have no shadow in this archetype and have spiritually healed

.

6) Mentor (Master, Counselor, Tutor)
A Mentor is a teacher in whom you can place your implicit trust. The word comes from the character in The Odyssey to whom Odysseus, on setting out for Troy, entrusted the care of his house and the education of his son, Telemachus. Today the role of Mentor is crucial in a surprising range of life situations, from many forms of art and artisanship to business and spiritual practice. Mentors do more than just teach; they pass on wisdom and refine their students' character. In its shadow aspect, however, the Mentor can take on an overbearing attitude that is more about imposing control than imparting wisdom. A characteristic of the shadow Mentor is an inability to allow the student to move on into the role of Master, maintaining control over the student's development of mind, body, and skills

Desperate people are always asking my counsel I think I have great wisdom to share and can mentor on many topics


7) Mystic (Renunciate, Anchorite, Hermit)

Perhaps no archetype is more coveted by my students, or more misunderstood than the Mystic. Many want to believe that they have mystical inclinations, yet underestimate how arduous the genuine mystical path is. When they find out, they're usually happy to let someone else have this role. The lives of the world's great mystics often included extraordinary states of consciousness such as prolonged ecstatic trance, and preternatural abilities of precognition or bilocation. Yet they also contained sometimes great physical as well as spiritual suffering, hard work, and mundane activities that made up much of their days. If you truly want to name this archetype as part of your sacred consortium, ask yourself if you are ready to pay the price in blood, sweat, and tears. If mystical consciousness is something you engage in once a day during meditation, or on a weekend retreat or a yoga workshop, you may be a spiritual seeker, but not a Mystic.


Reason I chose this archetype

An excerpt from one of my mystical experiences should answer the question, I did not learn how to be a mystic I simply am a mystic, from a tiny boy in fact I could perceive other realms other things that other people simple could not. Indeed this ability frightened my family and especially my perplexed parents, when I was little. I could come into a room and immediately go to one of the people and point to their head and say aunty so and so, why is your head hurting so

xcerpt below

The greatest emotion there was the feeling of unconditional all encompassing eternal love by our creator and all the joyful beings in this everlasting blinding pure domain of light and life. All life was of prime importance and the souls of animals were loved by the creator God.  We sang there all together in perfect harmony the creation song of Gods existence and eternal mystery.

This timeless reality was so very much more real than the three-dimensional reality we experience on earth. In this state, my mind was clear and I could feel an incredible energy and power coursing through me in this new wonderful indescribable time place. There seem to be nothing but a sense of knowing, being and loving. A strange thing was that in this dimension one could alternate between the subjective and objective anytime at will .Oh! How my soul did delight then and how reluctant I was to return to the bleak mundane existence of my earthly life. Reflecting back on my early life I wondered how many moments or days of subjoin on earth in my mortal body had being truly happy.

Colors unknown and unseen of earth blazed, flashed, revolved in glorious maelstroms like colossal aurora borealis in such glory in the heavily planes and the physical universe that would have blinded human eyes. Cerulean clouds of energy rolled and merged changing into aubergine, incarnadine and green viridity

“Plasma Beings” using magnetic energy in beautiful alabaster robes, joined our journey and raced across the ethereal realms with us like dolphins do on earth. I remembered a story I had read as a child “I am the magnetic body electric” I was this for too short a time (of course there is no concept of time, but is the best word here)


I was now experiencing a continual sustained happiness beyond description together with unimaginable joy, peace and glory. I knew God would not let souls remain in a state of eternal bliss, as life, learning and purpose continues after we die and leave the earth.

During my sojourn in these other realms, I went amongst the stars, saw their mighty glory and glorious multi-colored planets, and observed great beings that were countless million kilometers high, which sailed on radiant light in the dark oceans of space that makes up most of the universe. I asked the infinite one if there was life in the universe and knew it was awash with life.

Wave after wave of revelation swept through my whole being and the wonder and joy of it all was almost too much for me stand or comprehend. I knew will of God for existing was to ever progress upwards through many dimensions (heavens) towards the light of the ultimate absolute reality (which is God) while always retaining our blessed uniqueness... We would then still be ourselves but also have access to the infinite knowledge power and presence of the creator God as we finally withdraw once again into ourselves,

Some of the future events coming to planet earth were revealed and shown to me. Humanity would have to migrate from planet earth into the universe, as the earth’s resources were finite. No nuclear holocaust would obliterate earth and the greatest threat was the population explosion. In addition, the future was not set in stone and the divisions taken by a person or a nation could alter the outcome of the future.

The future only needs one good person to make a colossal difference towards the ultimate good of humanity. The reverse is unfortunately also the case and this might be the explanation for the enigma for the existence of evil. Although our heritage is very important to us all it is much more important to leave a positive legacy.

The loss of moral absolutes was sadness to the divine and the restoration of these was of paramount important if humankind was to escape extinction. All persons should not only believe but also know that all will ultimately have to account to the divine for what they have done while on their journey of life, as mere mortal beings while on planet earth. In the end, however, good will prevail in the universe and evil banished into outer darkness forever. The mystery of evil was an inscrutable mystery beyond the understanding of any person. All things process in cycles of spiritual metamorphosis though many heavily realms towards the light


8) Poet
Closely related to both the Author and the Artist, the Poet combines lyricism with sharp insight, finding the essence of beauty and truth not only in the great epic affairs of humanity, but also in everyday acts and objects. Great poetry extolls momentous events and great deeds, and also expresses wonder at the hidden joys and sorrows that most of us might overlook. And although you don't have to be a published poet to have this as one of your twelve archetypes, you do need to be driven by the need and the ability to discover beauty in the people and things around you, and express it in a way that helps others, too, see that beauty.

Reason I chose this archetype is because I am a poet I do not strive to be a poet I am one



9) Saboteur (see text for extended description)
The Saboteur archetype is made up of the fears and issues related to low self-esteem that cause you to make choices in life that block your own empowerment and success. As with the Victim and Prostitute, you need to face this powerful archetype that we all possess and make it an ally. When you do, you will find that it calls your attention to situations in which you are in danger of being sabotaged, or of sabotaging yourself. Once you are comfortable with the Saboteur, you learn to hear and heed these warnings, saving yourself untold grief from making the same mistakes over and over. Ignore it, and the shadow Saboteur will manifest in the form of self-destructive behavior or the desire to undermine others.


Reason I chose this archetype . A life long sense of inferiority made worst by having to live in the shadow of a genius brother who excelled in everything. But my insatiable curiosity led my to become hugely more knowledgeable that him But I had to strive to master thing that came easy to him,



10) Rescuer
In its empowered profile, the Rescuer assists when needed and, once the rescue mission is accomplished, withdraws. A Rescuer provides an infusion of strength and support to help others to survive a difficult situation, crisis, or process that they lack the stamina or the inner knowledge to maneuver through themselves. Unlike the Knight, to which it is related, the Rescuer is more common among women, especially in its shadow aspect. The shadow Rescuer often surfaces through a romantic connection in which one party seeks to establish an intimate bond by lending emotional support, with a hidden agenda that assumes the rescued party will return the Rescuer's romantic feelings. Such romances are destined to fail, because the shadow agenda has to keep the "rescuer" in need of being rescued, lest the Rescuer lose her significance.
Healing and empowering the Rescuer within is a common emotional challenge, because being needed is essential to our nature. Most people can relate in part to the characteristics of this archetype which somewhat parallel the Knight, Healer, Hero, and even Servant. If you feel drawn to this archetype, then, be careful to compare the characteristics of those others before deciding to add the Rescuer to your family.



Reason I chose this archetype.  The above is why my archetype is a rescuer at times


11) Prostitute (see text for extended description)
The Prostitute archetype engages lessons in integrity and the sale or negotiation of one's integrity or spirit due to fears of physical and financial survival or for financial gain. This archetype activates the aspects of the unconscious that are related to seduction and control, whereby you are as capable of buying a controlling interest in another person as you are in selling your own power. Prostitution should also be understood as the selling of your talents, ideas, and any other expression of the self--or the selling-out of them. This archetype is universal and its core learning relates to the need to birth and refine self-esteem and self-respect

Reason I chose this archetype.  Caroline states this ache type is universal so I leave it at that





12) Student (Disciple, Devotee, Follower, Apprentice)

The student archetype suggests a pattern of constant learning, an openness to absorbing new information as an essential part of one's well-being. The Student archetype suggests an absence of mastery of any one subject but rather a continual pursuit of intellectual development. Within the spiritual aspect, the Student, Disciple, Devotee, and Follower imply that one has found a source of teaching, such as a Guru or Spiritual Master, who becomes the instructor and spiritual guide.

Reason I chose this archetype Insatiable thirst for knowledge








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Re: Does anyone know about archetypes?
Reply #7 - Apr 8th, 2009 at 12:33pm
 
Alan, that is correct.  Carolyn chose character roles that we could relate to then apply them both psychologically and spiritually.  For example: prostitute--- Have you ever comprimised one thing to get another? Did you "brown nose" one person to "gain a higher status/or article" for material gain? If so, then you prostituted yourself. Have you made bargans with God--- I'll promise to do this, God if you will just cure that.  If so, then you prostituted yourself.

Do you get the gist of it?  I don't have my book in front of me right now, but Carolyn also uses the 12 architypes like one uses an astrology chart. She sets it up similar to an astrology chart, too because we are familar with that design.

Hope this helps a little. ----hugs cat
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Alan McDougall
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Re: Does anyone know about archetypes?
Reply #8 - Apr 8th, 2009 at 2:35pm
 
idencat

Quote:
Alan, that is correct.  Carolyn chose character roles that we could relate to then apply them both psychologically and spiritually.  For example: prostitute--- Have you ever comprimised one thing to get another? Did you "brown nose" one person to "gain a higher status/or article" for material gain? If so, then you prostituted yourself. Have you made bargans with God--- I'll promise to do this, God if you will just cure that.  If so, then you prostituted yourself.


I have done all those things if I reflect truly on who I really am.

Take this quote, I have never told a lie, that would be the biggest lie you/me/others ever told

We are all very imperfect beings are we not?

Yes that is why Caroline says that the prostitute archetype is universal, we are all prostitutes like it or not
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Re: Does anyone know about archetypes?
Reply #9 - Apr 16th, 2009 at 3:13pm
 
Together with Sigmund Freud, Carl Jung is one of the pioneers of modern psychiatry.  Archetypes are not innate ideas.  For Jung archetypes designate innate tendencies to organize our experience around certain symbols.  To some extent, the widely shared elements of NDEs seem archetypal and, as such, may say more about the structure of our unconscious than about "external" spiritual planes.  The role of archetypes needs to be "filtered out" to help us distinguish criteria for the activation of these archtypes from spiritual planes.

Let me offer two Jungian examples.  Two archetypes are white and black.  Westerners are the "pink" people; they did not refer to themselves as "white" and to Africans as "blacks" until the dawn of the slave trade.    As an archetype "whiteness" stands for what is life-giving, noble, beautiful, and true--even in African tribal cultures.
"Blackness" stands for what is sinister, evil, threatening, and false.
Clearly these archetypes evolved from long experience with the life-giving role of the sun and the dangers from nocturnal predators.

Our self-image as "white" men has energized this archetype in a way that has deluded us into imagining that our racial superiority justifies the enslavement of "black" people.  The activation of the "blackness" archetype helped whites has often reinforced a negative self image in the African slaves we sought brainwash.  Truly both archetypes have been tools of evil in bygone eras.  In the 1960s, African Americans opposed such thinking with their new slogan, "Black is beautiful."  This slogan was much needed, but racial equality has been an uphill battle, in part, because its supporters must combat the prejudice rooted in the misapplication of these archetypes. 

Don

P.S. I'm not a fan of Carolyn Myss's work.
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Re: Does anyone know about archetypes?
Reply #10 - Apr 16th, 2009 at 3:39pm
 
Hi,

I love discussions about archetypes! IMO they are profound symbols of our basic natures. 
They are so important as a means of thinking about personality that I expect they are used by Guiding Angels in the  'Pre- Afterlife-'-
Assigning us archetypal roles are a means of giving us patterns of behaviour that will help us learn the lessons we need to learn. I expect certain ones become a part of the mental subtle body for a lifetime of use. Tarot cards are said to convey the primaary truths of archetypes.  Wink

I love Jung's explanations of them! I find Myss's work harder to fit together, less eloquently described maybe.
Here's a brief dictionary explanation:
archetype |ˈärk(i)ˌtīp|
noun
a very typical example of a certain person or thing : the book is a perfect archetype of the genre. See note at model .
• an original that has been imitated : the archetype of faith is Abraham.
• a recurrent symbol or motif in literature, art, or mythology : mythological archetypes of good and evil.
• Psychoanalysis (in Jungian psychology) a primitive mental image inherited from the earliest human ancestors, and supposed to be present in the collective unconscious.

Bravo for the wisdom found in archetypal concepts !

Bets
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There are more things in heaven and earth, Horatio,
Than are dreamt of in your philosophy.
Shakespeare
 
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