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Frederick Myers. dimentions of reality (Read 4222 times)
Alan McDougall
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Frederick Myers. dimentions of reality
Jan 14th, 2008 at 7:05am
 
According to Frederick Myers, stage one is the earth dimension. As soon as the earth experience has been thoroughly comprehended – either through reincarnation or through the exchange of experiences with others in other dimensions – the soul may proceed to dimensions beyond the reach of the material dimension.
Stage two is called the Intermediate Realm or Hades. This is the spiritual condition, which is referred to in the ancient religious traditions as "hell." This is the realm where all must go upon experiencing the earth realm. Here, memories of our entire past lives flash before us. Whether or not this experience is "hellish" depends upon the memory of the particular person. If it contains sinister episodes and terrifying experiences, these will drift by the person's vision along with the more joyful happenings.
Some persons begin at this stage to feel what is called "the earth pull, the birth pull" and the person may decide to return to stage one, the earth realm. For others, stage two is brief and is followed by entry into a more stable world, which is stage three, the Realm of illusion.
The Realm of Illusion is a dimension where things may be created with the mind and shaped by the direct action of the imagination. Though a person may linger in this stage for undeterminable period of time, an eventual decision must be made. The soul returns either to earth or to progresses to stage four. Before leaving, however, the more enterprising souls may have an opportunity to experience one of the great wonders of this dimension of consciousness – a tour through some section of "The Great Memory." Just as on earth, one may go to a library and see newsreels of important earth events of history, so, in stage three, one may witness any event that occurred from the beginning of human experience. The Cosmic Memory has recorded everything that has ever happened.
Stage four is the Realm of Color. This dimension is an indescribably lovely existence. Here one must leave behind all rigid intellectual structures and dogmas, be they scientific, religious, or philosophical. An infinite variety of new sounds, colors and feelings are experienced here and souls find a much wider freedom to function with highly energized intellect and spirit. If, in this dimension, the soul becomes free from the earth pull, it is qualified to experience cosmic ranges beyond earth's confines, such as the next dimension.
Stage five is the Realm of Flame. In this dimension, the soul acquires a body of flame, enabling it to tour the stellar universe without being harmed by its temperatures and turbulence and to return with a fuller experience of these cosmic reaches. 
Stage six is the Realm of Light. Souls in this dimension are matured spirits, having lived through, with conscious comprehension, all the aspects of the created universe. They are capable of living now without form, of existing as white light in the pure thought of the Creator. They have joined the immortals, thus fulfilling their final purpose of the evolution of consciousness. 
Stage seven is the Realm of Timelessness.  In this dimension, souls enter full partnership with God. This dimension is of an advanced spiritual nature, so close to the ultimate essence of creativity that no adequate vocabulary has yet been evolved to describe it, and hence it is difficult to communicate to earth-level beings.

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Re: Frederick Myers. dimentions of reality
Reply #1 - Jan 14th, 2008 at 10:23am
 
This Myers sound like an interesting spiritualist.  Apparently his description of levels corresponds to Edgar Cayce's.  It is said too that immediately after his death, he communicated from the other side to a fair number of mediums across the world.  I have to do some further research - Thanks Alan, it piques my curiousity.

Matthew
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Re: Frederick Myers. dimentions of reality
Reply #2 - Jan 14th, 2008 at 10:50am
 
I found this description of Meyer's involvement with mediums - and it is fascinating because it brings up many issues that Don from this board has raised (of course this was in the late 1800s):

The source is: http://www.trans4mind.com/spiritual/myers1.html
Frederic Myers
Frederick Myers was a professor of classics at Cambridge University in England. He was born in 1843 and he died in 1901. One overriding interest characterized this man: a passionate curiosity about the meaning of human life. He devoted most of his adult years to trying to satisfy this curiosity, but he did it in a rather unusual way. He did not pore over theological writings and philosophical speculation. He felt that if human life did have a purpose, then it could be discovered in only one way: through the study of human experiences. This conviction led him, in 1882, to found the first Society for Psychical Research with some of his Cambridge colleagues.
In particular, Myers and his associates wanted to know if human beings survived bodily death. If they did, then life in a body must have a discoverable purpose. Myers was a man of enormous energy and great intellectual ability. After twenty years of intensive investigation, he concluded that he had answered this question. He wrote a book about what he had learned that became a classic - probably the most important work ever written in this strange field - called "Human Personality and Its Survival of Bodily Death".

Myers had a strong interest in mediumship, and grappled to the end of his life with the problems involved in interpreting its results. The difficulties lay not with the limitations of the mediums' powers, but with their scope. When a medium became entranced, and a voice, remarkably like that of a dead person, issued forth from her mouth, claiming to be that person and showing an encyclopedic knowledge of that person's life, then it seemed to Myers that contact was being made with the dead. Or when a medium, in a half-trance, seemed to be talking to someone who had been in his grave for some time, and was able to answer detailed questions about his life, Myers at first reached the conclusion that the dead still live.

But his research, in the end, didn't turn out to be quite that simple. For he became aware of cases in which those attending a seance had been given such detail about a person they knew who claimed in the communication to be dead. Later, however, they would discover that he was still alive! And in a few cases, as an experiment, someone had gone to a medium and mentally concentrated on an entirely fictitious personality, only to receive 'communications' from that 'personality,' claiming to come from beyond the grave! In other words, when mediums went into trance states, they could at times pick up accurate information about living or fictitious persons telepathically and deliver it as if it came from the dead. In other words, the medium may be unable to distinguish between telepathic communication from the living and telepathic communication from the dead.

So this posed a problem. Mediums did not seem to do such things in a fraudulent spirit; they were sometimes unable to tell whether information came from the living or from the dead, but tended to make the sometimes false assumption it was from the latter. Myers never solved this problem during his life. What he did was even more impressive. He solved it after he was dead!


2. The Cross-Correspondences
Within a few weeks of Myers's death in 1901, some very strange communications began to be received by psychics in England, the United States and India. They came through automatic writing to a total of a dozen psychics and continued for a period of thirty years and then later by his fellow leaders of the Society for Psychical Research, Professor Henry Sidgwick and Edmund Gurney as they too died. What was strangest about them was that they made no sense. Or perhaps they did - for they were so mysteriously worded that it almost seemed their meaning was being deliberately concealed. And most of them were signed, "Myers." In all more than three thousand scripts were transmitted over thirty years. Some of them were more than forty typed pages long.
But although the text of the messages seemed indecipherable, the 'instructions' which often accompanied them were clear. These instructions repeated a number of themes. The 'script' should be sent to a particular person, who would turn out to be one of the other psychics involved. Or it should be sent to the Society for Psychical Research. And that although its content may seem to be senseless, it was in reality anything but: it was an attempt by the deseased communicator to prove his continued existence. These instructions and explanations were, in fact, frequent and explicit. "Record the bits," wrote Myers, "and when fitted they will make the whole." And again, "I will give the words between you that neither alone can read but together they will give the clue."

It was some time, however, before the people involved fully realized what was happening. When they did, they gathered the fragments together and found that they had communications which were clear, coherent and continuous. Most of these scripts consisted of references to and quotations from both classical and modern literature. Some were so obscure that only a scolar, and a specialized one at that, would recognize them. The intention was to make these scripts seem random and pointless to the individual psychics, in order to avoid giving clues to the train of thought behind them. They would only become meaningful and show evidence of design when pieced together by an independent investigator. The interest lies in the question: Who selected them to convey a train a thought which could not be deduced from any one person's script? The answer was the dead communicator.

Myers was trying to prove that the mind of the medium could not be the creator of the message: how could it be when the message was only a fragment which made no sense unless linked with other, equally 'meaningless' fragments. Myers was quite explicit about what he was doing. He was causing a dozen psychics, in various widely separated parts of the world, not only to refer to the same topic - often a highly obscure one - but to do so in ways which were complementary. Like the parts of a jigsaw puzzle, these 'pieces' did more than refer to the same theme; they did so in ways which were intricately intertwined. Those who studied and tried to interpret these 'jigsaw puzzles' called them cross-correspondences.

The simplest case involved the repetition of particular themes drawn from various language and literary sources. On April 24, 1907, while in trance in the United States, an American medium named Mrs Piper three times uttered the word "Thantos," a Greek word meaning 'death,' despite the fact that she had no knowledge of Greek. Such repetitions were often a signal that cross-correspondences were about to begin. But it had begun already. About a week earlier, in India, Mrs Holland had done some automatic writing, and in that script the following enigmatic communication had appeared: "Mors [Latin for death]. And with that the shadow of death fell upon his limbs." On April 29th, in England, Mrs Verrall, writing automatically, produced the words: "Warmed both hands before the fire of life. It fades and I am ready to depart." This is a quotation from a poem by nineteenth-century English poet, Walter Landor. Mrs Verrall next drew a triangle. This could be Delta, the fourth letter of the Greek alphabet. She had always considered it a symbol of death. She then wrote: "Manibus date lilia plenis" [give lilies with full hands]. This is a quotation from Virgil's Aeneid in which an early death is foretold. This was followed by the statement: "Come away, come away, Pallida mors [Latin for pale death]," and, finally, an explicit statement from the communicator: "You have got the word plainly written all along in your writing. Look back." The 'word,' or 'theme,' was quite obvious when these fragments, given in the same month to three mediums thousands of miles apart, were put together and scrutinized. And in view of the lifelong interest of the communicator, it was certainly an appropriate theme. Death.

This gives some indication of the complexity of even the simplest cross-correspondence. And most of those who have studied them have concluded that they were exactly what they claimed to be: an experiment conducted from beyond the grave to establish that Myers still lived.

Myers pursued this task with a diligence characteristic of him in life. From 1901 to 1932, more than three thousand scripts were communicated. Receiving and interpreting such a vast body of material was often burdensome to those involved. But for Myers, the whole enterprise was a source of anguish. He had survived physical death, as others do, and now he was desperately eager to communicate this fact in a fashion which would convince his still living colleagues. But, because he had no body, he had to use the minds of others. He had to struggle to 'get through.' And in the scripts he sent, he refers again and again to the suffering that this cost him.


"Oh, if I could only leave you the proof that I continue. Yet another attempt to run the blockade - to strive to get a message through. How can I make your hand docile enough - how can I convince them? I am trying, amid unspeakable difficulties. It is impossible for me to know how much of what I send reaches you. I feel as if I had presented my credentials - reiterated the proofs of my identity in a wearisomely repetitive manner. The nearest simile I can find to express the difficulty of sending a message is that I appear to be standing behind a sheet of frosted glass, which blurs sight and deadens sound, dicatating feebly to a reluctant and somewhat obtuse secretary. A feeling of terrible impotence burdens me. Oh it is a dark road."
Myers, for all the grand scope of his interests, was a very modest man. And he was also a very systematic one. These two qualities perfectly explained the style and timing of his after-death communications. He had first to prove to his friends that he still lived and he devoted thirty years to that. But what was of even greater interest, once that was established, was his description of what it was like to be dead. Myers, always the scholar, was not about to run hastily into a discussion about such a momentous subject. He was very systematic and cautious about that too. He had been dead for nearly twenty-three years before, at last, he started to communicate on that most mysterious of all geographies - the world of the dead.

Myers was not, of course, the first to describe life after death. Plenty of other communicators had done that in spiritualist seances, but although their reports had at first been examined with fascinated anticipation, thay were soon dismissed with snorts of derision. For Heaven, the afterlife, had always been something very special to man - a transcendent paradise where the pain and struggle of this life would be surmounted and the mysteries of human life and death would at last be revealed in the very abode of God himself. But what was reported was quite something else indeed. For what the communicators described was nothing but an earth-life. It was terribly beautiful, and the 'dead' were very happy, and active too. What exactly did they do there? Well, pretty much what they had always done - they played golf, for example, and drank Scotch. They had sexual adventures and they smoked cigars. They played cards, lived in houses like those they had occupied on earth, and even went to work! Now this, obviously, could not be Heaven: it was clearly spiritualist self-delusion. Myers, however, was to show that these communicators were right - at least in part. For it had never occurred to the critics that if men were going to transcend their earth-lives after death and move onwards to a 'divine' realm, then it would certainly be a kindness to them them to start them off with something familiar - to match the lives and beliefs they were familiar with on earth.

Myers wrote a book :Human Pesonality and Its Survival of Bodily Death (Studies in consciousness).  I think it will make an interesting read.  


Matthew
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Re: Frederick Myers. dimentions of reality
Reply #3 - Jan 14th, 2008 at 12:10pm
 
More interesting reports of Myers ADCs:
From    http://www.survivalafterdeath.org/researchers/myers.htm

After Myers' death a flood of communications was put down to his spirit by many mediums. The most important ones were those received through Mrs. Piper, Mrs. Verrall and Mrs. Holland. As regards the latter, Frank Podmore and Miss Alice Johnson agree that the Myers control is a subconscious creation of the medium. The views there expressed are alien to the mentality of the living Myers. Mrs. Verrall obtained the contents of a sealed letter which Myers had written in 1891 and left in the care of Oliver Lodge for such a test. However, when the letter was opened in 1904 the contents were found to be entirely different. In 1907, Eleanor Sidgwick obtained good identity proofs through Mrs. Piper. On her behalf Mrs. Verrall asked some questions to which she did not know the answer and received correct replies as regards the contents of the last conversation that had taken place between Mrs. Sidgwick and Myers. Many other impressive indications of his surviving self were found in cross-correspondences, especially during Mrs. Piper's second visit to Britain in 1906-07. The whole system of cross-correspondences appears to have been elaborated by him and the wealth of classical knowledge displayed in the connected fragments, given by several mediums, raises a strong presumption that they have emanated from Myers' mind. The most striking evidence of this nature was obtained after Mrs. Piper's return to America by Mr. G. B. Dorr in 1908. Podmore considers it "perhaps the strongest evidence yet obtained for the identity of any communicator." In The Road to Immortality which was automatically produced by Geraldine Cummins a stupendous vista is opened up by F. W. H. Myers of the soul's progression through the after-death states. As regards the authorship of the book, Oliver Lodge received independent testimony through Mrs. Leonard from Myers of his communications through Miss Cummins. Oliver Lodge sees no reason to dissent from the view that the remarkable accounts of the fourth, fifth, sixth and seventh state "are the kind of ideas which F. W. H. Myers may by this time (1932) have been able to form."

M
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Alan McDougall
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Re: Frederick Myers. dimentions of reality
Reply #4 - Jan 14th, 2008 at 12:33pm
 
Hi Doc,

I did not know much about Fredrick Myers, and had the article stored as a old word document, but thanks for the info i will read your detailed response and respond in full later.

alan
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Re: Frederick Myers. dimentions of reality
Reply #5 - Jan 14th, 2008 at 3:41pm
 
DocM wrote on Jan 14th, 2008 at 10:23am:
This Myers sound like an interesting spiritualist.  Apparently his description of levels corresponds to Edgar Cayce's. 



  Only very, very, very generally, not much specifically at all.   The commonality is that they agree there are seven main dimensions or planes of consciousness connected to the total Earth Life system (and another, 8th dimension which is an interconnecting dimension from our system to others), which is the same as our Solar system...  Or rather the outer Solar system is a reflection of the inner consciousness states and major dimensions.   Kind of, "as above, so below" kind of thing.   

  For the most part, Cayce's guidance didn't describe the other dimensions, because there is little way that we could understand through words and language, what say the 5th dimension really represents.

  They did talk a little bit about the 4th dimension, and one of the clues they gave was that its the dimension wherein physical objects are understood from the spiritual/energetic perspective, and spiritual/energetic consciousness was understood from the physical--meaning how they intertwine and are connected, and yet are different in nature and tendency.

  They did sometimes associate a particular Planet with a particular dimension, for example Venus was said to correspond to the 4th dimension, and Jupiter to the 5th, but these weren't always completely consistent, there seemed to be a relativity with it when relating to astrological forces and an individual's chart.

  There is some info here and there, which is a little more specific or hints at same.  For example, a couple of times it was mentioned or hinted that some "guides" operate primarily from the 5th dimension, but these seemed to be the more average type guide and not a nearly nor completely ascended type.   A couple of times, this was connected to the Jupiter forces and consciousness.   In one reading, some parents of a young baby where told that their son "comes from among us" and when later asked where and what exactly that meant, they said something like, "He is of the Jupiter consciousness where we are operating from, and Jupiter is that plane and experience of the just, the righteous, the helpful."  Essentially spiritual guides, but not perfected.

  In Monroe terms, it's probably beyond the park, but before the Gathering, somewhere in between vibrationally speaking.   

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Re: Frederick Myers. dimentions of reality
Reply #6 - Jan 14th, 2008 at 5:19pm
 
Interesting, Alan.

I've been doing some research into shamanic herbs and the experiences that they produce (lots of reports are available at Erowid or the Lycaeum) and have arrived at a vaguely similar model. The experiences of the users of many herbs (eg: salvia divinorum) seem to agree roughly with Myers model, although the terms I use are different.

Earth - I equate this with fundamental existence. The most basic factor for existence is extension, the ability to "be" and to take on attributes by which to be manifested. Subjectively, it seems to be represented by experiences such as multiple images of the moment, as in bi-location, as well as basic awareness.

Hades - This, to me, is the initial level of interaction, and our primary sensations. To go there and look, it seems to be a mass of flames. The subjective experience is often described as being "sliced and diced", or "shredded", or ripped apart by innumerable pins-and-needles prickly sensations. I associate it with mass and gravitation, the fundamental manifestation of an extended object.

Ilusion - Here I would place attachment to patterns of manifestation. At this point a posture is taken, which I associate with location in space, the initial mode of fixing manifestation into a limited and well defined context. To go there and look, this seems to be the level at which the actor seems to take on independent existence.

Color - My inclination would be to view this as the level at which polar charge is defined, so that electromagnetic events can occur. Light is one of the obvious ways to manifest charge. To go there and look, I got only an impression of energies and luminance in complex patterns.

Flame - I feel that this might be synonymous with the classical Mental level.

Light -   I associate this with Astral levels.

Timeless - I associate this with God-Mind - Cosmic Consciousness etc.

Obviously my research has been in the lower and more primitive aspects, so what I have is only a fractional perspective.

It might be useful here to notice that "seven" is a "lucky number" because of the properties of a specific number sequence. This was known to the Egyptians, and with a bit of effort can be found in their paintings and mysticism. The sequence begins with the smallest possible set of terms that can stand alone, which is two elements, a dyad. Each term is the contextual space for the other. The total information in this universe is in their relationships, for A to say, "I am not-B" as B says, "I am not-A". It a very primitive universe - hence I identify it with Myers' Earth level.

The next term is the maximum amount of new information that can be obtained from that dyad. This is obviously limited to whatever we can get by adding the two terms together. That gives us the initial dyad, plus a new term, so we now have a set of three. (If the dyad is {A, B} then this gives us{A, B, AB} which is a triad.) Trinities are exceptionally common in all religions, as well as in QM, where we have energetic process A, acting on massive objects B, so as to alter their collective relationships AB.

The next term is again made by extracting all possible information from its predecessor triad. We do that by adding all the terms together in every possible manner, giving us seven terms, four of which are new, and the three terms of the triad are carried over. (If the triad is {A, B, C} we now have {A, B, C, AB, AC, BC, ABC} which is all that we can get.) Sevens are common in many expressions of the world, such as the "seven deadly sins", or "seven properties of matter" and so on.

We can continue with the same progression, the next set being 127 terms - close enough to the number of chemical elements to be interesting. And the next sets are quite large and would relate to cosmic events.

Number theorists will recognize this as the sequence of iterated complexions (or "power sets" if you prefer that term) which forms the meta-eigenmatrix of reality. That is, some member of this series, times a matrix of numbers to tell how much of each relational property is involved, gives a set of relational properties that defines a material state. This particular sequence of numbers includes all possible states of the universe, from a lower limit of one attribute (God sitting all alone in Nowhere) to an upper limit of infinity.

Looking into the physics of eg. Kaluza-Klein models of charge and gravitation, we come to a universe of six dimensions, plus a common term left over. If we allow all orthogonal descriptive vectors to be "dimensions", then we already live in a multi-dimensional universe. However, three spatial dimensions are sufficient for our needs, and the others are dimensions of mass, charge, and so on. (This avoid trying to justify having "curled up" dimensions, which is one of the big issues of string models.)

Thus, not only will seven be a "mystical number", but it appears to offer a good fit to the actual emergence of reality as we actually know it.

dave
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Re: Frederick Myers. dimentions of reality
Reply #7 - Jan 15th, 2008 at 10:47am
 
Hi Guys,

Do some forum members remember my first thread on “what comes afterlife?”

The realm of afterlife knowledge that Fredrick Myers explains below seems to equate exactly with where my soul went in that nde

alan


“”The Realm of Illusion is a dimension where things may be created with the mind and shaped by the direct action of the imagination. Though a person may linger in this stage for undeterminable period of time, an eventual decision must be made. The soul returns either to earth or to progresses to stage four.
"Before leaving, however, the more enterprising souls may have an opportunity to experience one of the great wonders of this dimension of consciousness – a tour through some section of "The Great Memory." Just as on earth, one may go to a library and see newsreels of important earth events of history, so, in stage three, one may witness any event that occurred from the beginning of human experience””.  "(((Yes this seems to be where I was)))"

alan
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Re: Frederick Myers. dimentions of reality
Reply #8 - Jan 15th, 2008 at 4:56pm
 
The bit about the "reluctant and somewhat obtuse" secretary behind the frosted glass has always been one of my favorite descriptions of why they don't send us exact information (like lottery numbers), and why a lot of folks don't seem to communicate at all...probably a lot give up in frustration!
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