Don:

Interesting quote below.

I've done some research, and found that in the old testament "satan" was sometimes used instead of the word "adversary", and sometimes was used by people to refer to anybody who was opposed to them.

In some cases it was used to explain why people were having bad luck, rather than blaming their bad luck on God. They could've just blamed the humans who caused them to have problems. Why blame God for what we do to each other?

In a place such as the book of Job,  satan or adversary was some being that effected Job with God's permission, as oppossed to a being who does things against God's will.

Some people say that Isaiah speaks of the source of satan (e.g., in King James version of the Bible); however, the earlier Hebrew version simply spoke of a fallen king of Babylon.

Revelations speaks of a giant dragon and a beast from the sea, but when you read how they are spoken of,  it seems like they are symbolic representations for something other than actual beasts. For example "seven heads" can mean seven nations and/or kings that were in opposition to the groups of people St. John was aligned with.

I'm not trying to tell you what the Bible says. I'm certain you know it much better than I.  Just pointing out some things that stood out to me.

I definitely don't believe in fallen angels. It just doesn't seem possible to me that an angel who was created by God for a special purpose,  and who was in the presence of God and understood what his power and glory is like, could possibly go against him. Even if it wanted to, it would understand that it would be like a wave trying to take on an ocean of which it is a part.

And even if such an angel did fall, I find it hard to believe that it could get a third of angels to follow it, or that God would allow it to do such a thing.

Some people might say that it did so because it was given a free will. But having a free will doesn't mean you have to be as stupid as an angel would half to be in order to do what satan as fallen angel supposedly did.

Plus, if angels can fall, what would prevent heavenly spirits who used to be embodied spirits from falling too?

Nope, heaven has to be way too glorious for spirits who occupy it to start falling.  And I don't believe that a being like satan could visit God and speak to him as was done in job or would be able to start a war in heaven, because its vibrational rate would be way too low to ascend to heaven. Plus the love and light there would just blow such a being away.

I do believe that we have negative aspects of ourselves to deal with while we are in the physical, because such aspects play a role in allowing us to grow as distinct and unique children of God.

Regarding negative spirits that bug people, do you see how it may be possible that perhaps they are just really angry earth bound spirits, even if they manifest in a really negative manner? A manner that would be partly dependent on the beliefs they accumulated before they passed away.

This could be true even if they act irreverant towards their concept of God. And I say "their concept of God," because if they really knew God, they couldn't possibly act irreverent towards him.


[quote author=Berserk
Note:  Also, don't be put off by the term "Satan."  It means "adversary."  The nature and origin of Satan can be left as an unsolved mystery. [/quote]

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recoverer, do you have any quotes from his last words, just before his death? Do you, Don?

Well, let's not give whoever or whatever too much power. Seems to me they've cut themselves off from God, so I don't know where they would get their power from. Perhaps some people give them the power when they indulge in dark ways of being, or allow themselves to get intimidated into giving it away, or approach the World of spirits in a foolish manner. "Yeah, I'll play around with this Ouija board, what could happen? It's just a game, right?"



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