Love Bob 

Scott,

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Based on my understandings and experiences we are consciousness period. The only difference between *here* and *there* that we choose to manifest in physicality, and with that choice we agree" as this physical dimension "blueprint" that we manifest in body, AND agreed to apply  "belief systems" without NO exception...

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The biggest difference is that most individual due to the rigid and unmovable -knowing the truth-  beliefs  seeing themselves as a single "entity" therefore seeing themselves as a "thing". so body is a thing here, then we have to  be a  *thing* there also, *here* is a lower or higher direction here then it has to be* there* also..based on the  never examined or understood separation and duplicity beliefs...  

I  could share my own understanding but certainly not with this clarity as the following...

ELIAS: “Everything, every thing, underline three times, is composed of links of consciousness, for there is no existence that is not consciousness!”

ELIAS: “You are not a shell! You do not possess a vessel! You are not a boat floating upon a river! You are not a vase containing flowers! You are a magnificent expression of extremely complicated arrangements of links of consciousness which physically manifest into matter of atoms and molecules that you manipulate.

ELIAS: “Let us view the workings of consciousness – what IS consciousness – and the distinctions of essence and consciousness. You may notice throughout this information that I express a distinction between essence and consciousness. Essence is consciousness, but there is consciousness that is not essence. Essence is also unlimited. This be the area that is very difficult for your understanding within physical focus, for you are so very accustomed to thinking in singular terms. All that you create within your physical dimension moves in this direction.

“You create things. You identify things. Even things that you may not see you classify as things, and this creates great difficulty within your thinking and your imagining of how there may be an element that is not a thing and that may be some quality in itself but unbounded simultaneously, that may be thought of in the manner of a distinction but not separate....

“In this, I have spoken previously of links of consciousness. Links of consciousness are not things either. They are elements of consciousness, but they hold no form. They are not within what you term to be a time framework, although they may be inserted into a time framework, but the time framework itself is comprised of links of consciousness, and these links of consciousness have no necessary space arrangement. They exist within all space arrangements simultaneously and within all time frameworks simultaneously.

(Intently) “Essence is not separate and apart from consciousness. There is no separate and apart from consciousness. There is no boundary to consciousness. There is no limit to consciousness. Therefore, there is no thing, no element, no action outside of consciousness, for there is no outside. Within consciousness, the configuration of these links of consciousness creating personality tone is the designation of essence.

“You are thinking of your essence as a ‘thing’ – an ‘entity.’ As I explained, I am not an entity. You are not, either. An entity denotes a separate thing. You are not a thing.”

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It matters not.... we all resonate materials according to our own awareness, in my beliefs that is just different, in others view  I'm wrong... the difference is that I understand that the only thing I KNOW, that I  know nothing, and that certainly set me free from the battle of "truth fighting" and I'm not slave of my own beliefs...

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yes, George, I believe based on a retrieval I did where I could "feel" by tactile touch the girl's body as warm and as solid as any body I have ever touched, so I do believe that this condition of perception can be just as "real" as our physical bodies are now appearing to be real. also I have been an orb once complete with all my other senses I use in the physical body except I could see in back of me as well. also there is a state of awareness one can be in where there is no apparent body until desire to have one takes effect. apparently we can have our cake and eat it too. George, you have become a lightworker here of substantial value! I thank you for your presence and your interesting questions.

love, alysia
images.bravenet.com/common/images/smilies/enlighten.gif

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Personally, I interpret the creation story in the Book of Genesis in a looser, more metaphorical sense than what fundamentalist Christians believe.  I believe it is possible to reconcile the Biblical story of creation with scientific theories such as the Big Bang and evolution of species (albeit with modifications requiring divine intervention to accomplish creative purposes).  For example, there could have been a Big Bang, and this corresponds to when God said "Let there be light."  There could be evolution of species and this corresponds to the six-day progression in which life on earth was created according to the Genesis account, each day representing an age or epoch.  God planned it and determined it, but it happened through the functioning of physical laws over long periods of time.  God works in mysterious ways that are sometimes not easily provable as divine intervention, but they really are.  I see it as more a teleological issue rather than a question of precisely how God accomplishes His will.  Some Christians will debate against evolution until their face turns blue, but I think they're missing the point.  Physical evolution combined with teleological divine purpose can be just as glorious as a more literalistic method of creation.

As for man being created in God's image, I don't think that means the physical body.  I think it means that we are spiritual beings like God, with His attributes latent within us.  We are like the spiritual offspring of God and therefore are part of His family in a metaphorical sense.

Freebird

P.S.  To box a quote, you can hit the "quote" button instead of the "reply" button, or you can use quote tags -- put the word quote in brackets at the beginning of the text you wish to quote, and then again at the end, but with a / (the forward slash character) before the word quote.

Thank you dearest Alysia. I'm not trying to cause any trouble here, only trying to get things back on track to the loving open forum that this was and can still be. I remember when it was a joy to read of other's experiences, question them yes, but not try to make someone feel that it was all in their head (which basically it is LOL because it's all a journey inward, even to the afterlife).  The newbies have no idea what it was like before. I was so excited because I had read Bruce's first 3 books and wanted to learn all I could and when I faltering posted my first retrieval, was so thrilled when Bruce said it was a class textbook retrieval.  What is the last retrieval posted here?  There's hardly any talk of retrievals anymore.  I realize that times change but I refuse to buy into all the negativity that has resulted from the skepticism.

No, no one has to believe it because we say it's true. If only people would find out for themselves instead of putting people's experiences down. As you know Alysia, no one can convince anyone else of KNOWNS.  They come from direct experience.

Much Love dear friend,
Mairlyn   

Alysia,

I think what’s happening is that we have posters/readers coming from a minimum of three angles. The first and probably the originals were/are those who wanted to continue the journeys described by Monroe, Moen and others and keyed in Bruce’s web site directly.  That’s how I came here 3-4 years ago and continue to do so. The second group is coming to this site by browsing “afterlife” seeking answers about the afterlife and come with an “empty cup”.  They since have become more and more involved in experiencing the afterlife directly and sharing their stories.  I love reading their input. The third group surfs the web “afterlife” to confirm or debate what they believe about the general category “afterlife” but basically come with a “full cup”.  Personally boring (to me) but they need to have their say too because, after all, they just might have something interesting or challenging to say/learn or I might.   

The web has become a wonderful tool to connect with information and share with others what can sometimes be a lonely existence.  The web can also be used to obfuscate any issue while at the same time getting your name in print to a wider audience.   It’s a wonderful thing that more and more of us are able to read/write/study, write long papers and even cut and paste other writers to argue a point.  But what I gain the most from is people’s personal experience with those who have left the physical plane.  These truly comfort me especially since I have become involved in the mental health field.  When I go to work and listen to the stories, those “crazies” they aren’t so crazy after all.  It’s a shame that the best we have to offer them is “better life through chemistry” and that Monroe and Moen would be considered crazy in my field. My “clients” stories parallel my experiences and those of the authors I’ve read on many nonphysical encounters including those on this board and have yet to contain anything really unfamiliar.
 
I love this board but also have problems when seeking what I came here in the first place because much of what is currently happening is bordering on the proselytizing of personal belief systems. It’s becoming more difficult to weed through the monologues to get to meat of personal stories.  These other topics may be interesting in themselves and definitely old and familiar, but don’t comfort me in my personal journey through the later years of my life. The Monroe/Moen related material does and the personal accounts on this board do.  But then again, I’m getting a first hand education on limited belief systems that individuals (including myself) hold that prevent themjkeyes from realizing that theyjkeyes are more than there/my bodies and that they/I can learn this through first hand experience.

I “live” for your postings and those of the many others who resonate with this site, all give so freely with love.  Thanks & keep up with the good work.  Take HEART and welcome to the “now” where we each (including the monologers with full cups ) are so connected/intertwined with each other due to technology and our increased awarness. All must continue to be welcome to contribute or we'll wind up resembling a religion.   
 

Jean          

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Bob, thank you so much for posting this.  You have clearly put it into words for me and explained why I see and talk to people on the other side and I know them well... yet I don't know their name.

Love, Kathy