Some near death experiences speak of how they are anxious to return to the spirit world because life is much better there than here.

I can't complain about my life here, but because I'm quite certain that the afterlife will be wonderful when it is my time to join it, I look forward to when my day to join it arrives.

Some near death experiencers (and other experiencers) have stated that they had experiences where it seemed as if they were in the spirit world for many years, and when they returned here just a short moment of time had passed.

Suppose it will be your time to rejoin the spirit world 30 years from now. If you have an experience where you experience the spirit world for 200 years while still  having a physical body, according to your perspective, it will seem like 230 years before you return to the spirit world for good.

Would you want to have such an experience and have to experience 230 years before you return to the spirit world for good, or would you rather not have such an experience and return to the spirit world for good in 30 years?

When I say all of this, I am not factoring in whether the 230 version has some benefits that the other version doesn't have.

seagullresting wrote on Aug 11^th, 2017 at 9:01pm:


Seagullresting nails it. Which is why we go look for ourselves, rather than relying on the accounts of others.

Last I noticed there are no requirements of indebtedness to writers of travelogues. The city or country they may describe likely bear little or no resemblance to my own experience of the place. That's because their account is written from the lens of their own being. My own experience is guaranteed to be different because I am who I am, as are we all.

Indeed, landmarks come and go and even geography is fluid. Moreso, a travel writer's impressions may adversely colour my own expectations. Also noted that maps are frequently wrong, inaccurate and/or out-of-date. Often maps contain intentional errors.

Our journeys are our own.

seagull resting:

One reason is that years ago I had an NDE-like experience without a near death like event, and during this experience I was certain that the afterlife exists. At the time I was somewhere between an atheist and an agnostic, and I believed that science explained what reality is about. During this experience my old way of believing and my new way of understanding operated at the same time, and it was very clear that what I realized spiritually represented the truth.

Because of the above experience I understand why many near death experiencers are certain of what they experience.

I have had other non physical experiences that made the point that a future of divine love and peace awaits me. To some degree meditation reveals this. To some degree an inner knowing does so.

Not too long ago I had a lucid dream experience where I was in the spirit world. It was basically a positive place. The negativity of this world did not exist there. Yet the people there weren't completely fulfilled. I feel more fulfilled during some of my meditations than they did while abiding in the spirit world. Why? Because these people hadn't reached the point where they want to rejoin God, the source of everything. I believe that we will never be completely fulfilled until we rejoin God.

I have noticed that in recent years that there are some people in what might be called "new age land" that seem to have little interest in the being that made their existence possible. They are really into this independence thing. Some of them speak as if they are Gods themselves. I believe that such people are fooling themselves. They will never find true fulfillment until they seek to rejoin that which is the source of all. No matter how large they are, they are just a speck compared to their true source. They'll play the game of observing various things until they eventually find that true fulfillment isn't received in such a way.



seagullresting wrote on Aug 14^th, 2017 at 6:29pm:

Morrighan:

It would be difficult to find the precise articles and video locations where I've read or heard people speak in a way where they spoke as if they are God's themselves. One guy who is fairly well known spoke as if each of us is the creator of our own universe and he didn't mean that we each experience our own interpretation of the universe we are a part of.

When it comes to experiencing love and peace while we are in a body, I do not believe that our bodies could handle the amount of energy there is at God level. Therefore, even though we can experience love and peace now, we won't be able to do so to an extent that is possible when we rejoin God.

I can feel love and peace as I do things such as walk around, but not as much as when I meditate. In fact, I've found that if I stop meditating, open my eyes, and look at the place I am located at, to some degree the amount of love and peace I feel decreases a "bit," because my focus partially gets redirected from the divine level to the level of this world.

It isn't just a matter of the energy level of my body, the limitations of my biological brain, and the limiting thought patterns I have, it is also a matter of the energy level of this physical world, and the thought and emotional energy that billions of humans and even more animals create. Such energy levels differ from the energy levels of a higher level of being.

Jonestown? Do you actually believe that I am speaking of such a thing?

Morrighan:

It seems to me that you are denying the validity of what other people have experienced, even though you didn't have their experiences. It is so convenient for you to deny the validity of what everybody else has experienced and learned. Perhaps this is a way for you avoid having to deal with some of what others have found. No need to avoid, since in the end things work out quite well.

Eben Alexander had an NDE where his body-based memory was cleared to an extent, where such memories didn't effect him in the way they usually do when people have NDEs. During his experience he forgot all about his life in this world.

Eventually he met up with a being he called either Core, Om or God, as he wrote his book called "Proof of Heaven." He did this because he didn't want God's magnificence to be minimized by some of the false and limiting concepts people associate with God. At a later time, during an interview, he stated that he now uses the word "God." (It is sad that so many people have a problem with this name.)

On page 47 of "Proof Heaven he says "God, the Creator, the Source who is responsible for making the universe and all that is in it. This being was so close that there seemed to be no distance at all between God and myself. Yet at the same time, I could sense the infinite vastness of the Creator,  could see how completely minuscule I was by comparison."

On pages 85-86 he wrote: "One of the biggest mistakes people make when they think about God is to imagine God as impersonal. Yes, God is behind the numbers, the perfection of the universe that science measures and struggles to understand. But-again, paradoxically-Om [God] is "human" as well--even more human than you and I are.  Om understands and sympathizes with our human situation more profoundly and personally than we can even imagine because Om knows what we have forgotten, and understands the terrible burden it is to live with amnesia of the divine for even a moment."

Eben also wrote in his book that God allowed evil because such allowance enables us to have free will. Related to this, I believe that wanting to return to God is a choice. When we avoid reacquainting ourselves with our divine source, perhaps by pretending to be beyond what everybody else has learned, we don't do ourselves a favor. If we want to grow spiritually, it is essential to open ourselves to our divine source. It is okay to receive inspiration from people who have had success doing so. It is not superior to deny what others have learned.

Since during his NDE Eben went beyond his body-based memories and made contact with the creator of everything, God, I believe his experience reflects more than a belief system. What he says about God seems correct to me.

Morrighan:

On reply # 1 Seagull said: "I don't know whether someone can answer that question rationally without having factual knowledge of what the afterlife offers."

In my responses I referred to NDEs, OBEs, my non-physical experiences, meditations and inner knowing.

On reply # 2 you said: "Seagullresting nails it. Which is why we go look for ourselves, rather than relying on the accounts of others."

As you are prone to do, you decided to delegitimize the validity of what people other than yourself have experienced and learned. I don't know how a person can have an intelligent conversation with a person who finds it necessary to constantly deny the validity of the spiritual experiences and findings of others. I speak of NDEs and such, and you speak of Jonestown suicides.

I can understand about not wanting to be limited by one's psychological conditioning as one tries to find out what is true, but blindly disregarding what others have found and not being limited by psychological conditioning, are not the same thing. It is possible to consider what others say about their experiences and findings, without being fooled and limited by what they say, as long as one doesn't become overly emotionally attached to what they say, or doesn't have related pre-existing emotional attachments. Such emotional freedom will enable one to consider what somebody else says with discernment.

There might be occasions when people other than yourself have discovered and concluded in a way that is true. If we become emotionally attached to not considering what others have to say, we might lose the openness to discover the same thing.

Don't avoid becoming aware of God's existence, because you are afraid of getting caught up in someone else's psychological conditioning.


Morrighan wrote on Aug 15^th, 2017 at 5:35pm:

Morrighan:

Don't act so thin skinned when on more than one occasion you have spoken as if what other people have discovered through NDEs and such, shouldn't be considered to be valid information. Perhaps on a spiritual forum you should be more respectful.

Perhaps you should apologize to the NDErs etc that took the time to share their WISDOM with others.


Morrighan wrote on Aug 15^th, 2017 at 6:37pm: