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Hi,

I would say that it is quite important to resolve your differences with others while on the earth plane--that seems to be one of the principal purposes of our lives here. The earth is like a spiritual gym, and we incarnate to experience tough situations that will test our patience and our ability to love. Working through such challenges will result in spiritual growth.

After death we go through a process often called the "life review." We will have to review all our thoughts, intentions, and actions--at least, the ones that pertain to our spiritual growth--and we will then have to forgive everyone from our earth lives, including ourselves. When one considers that fact, it really does make sense to get a head start and begin forgiving others for their actions now!

(Most spirits say that forgiving earthly enemies and rivals is incredibly easy once they see things from an eternal perspective; forgiving oneself remains the true challenge. But no matter what sort of things we've done on earth, working on our own ability to forgive now can only help matters after we die. It's never to late to start!)

In the afterlife, we are reunited with those we love, and yes, we often simply carry on. Our relationships continue to evolve and grow as we experience new things, and we may at some point choose to incarnate again with some of the same people. Most of us belong to "soul groups," or small groups of individuals who are at roughly the same level of spiritual growth. Soul groups tend to incarnate together regularly, so that the various spirits can experience the human condition through different roles and genders with like-minded individuals.

I will also point out that love is all that binds us to one another in the afterlife. If we were associated with a person on earth only because of material ties, then we will not be required to be with that person in the hereafter. For example, those who enter into abusive relationships or marriages of convenience will likely be relieved to find that death has truly "done them part."

I like your telephone analogy. However, I will point out that it is not necessary to wait until you cross over to resume relationships with those on the other side. With modern technology, communication with the so-called dead has never been easier. I myself am one of several dozen ITC researchers working with the Dr. R. Craig Hogan on what is effectively a preliminary method of phone-like communication that can be used by those with no psychic ability whatsoever.

I'd like to explore this topic myself, particularly as my father passed away in Christmas. Lucid Dreaming may end up being my chosen method to find out.

I've documented all my questions on this topic so far and will look to practise LD in order to communicate. It's getting beyond my current level of commitment in the here and know to make time.

It was interesting reading  Jurgen Ziewe account of speaking to his deceased mother and asking her when she last spoke to his father (also deceased). She mentioned that he was busy working on an art project. Jurgen later attempted to visit his father and was taken to a countryside house where a boy became aware of Jurgens presence and called him by his first name. It turned out this was his father reincarnated. So who was his mother talking to?

Perhaps it ties in some way to what Bruce writes in his books on different aspects of self.

Resolving differences in relationships is subjective to what each individual feels, what their expectations are, what their needs are at that time, and how much they choose to work on their own growth and development.  Many believe that "resolution" means their own needs are served as quickly as possible without regard to the other person's needs, or without considering the fact that un-resolved conflict may actually stimulate their own personal development simply by letting go and moving on with their lives.  I think we have this inherent belief that we need to move, grow, and agree on everything or else we're not "ok" with each other.

It's definitely ok to be in different places about beliefs about something without worrying whether we're messing something up on a spiritual level.  I think the problem most people have is that they think of themselves as being a singular awareness at any given moment and they associate that belief to what they believe must be their true being. 

I don't put too much stock in caring if something is resolved or not.  What I DO care most about is treating each moment as if it's the only moment that counts, therefore living with integrity, saying what I want or need to say, and being satisfied with how I feel. 

Feeling settled and resolved within myself is more important than trying to resolve differences in all of my relationships. 

I think how our relationship proceed into the next life will depend on how we feel when we get there.  Is it important to seek out someone, to reconnect, to spend time with them?  If it's something you both want than why not?  I think there's always going to be something that needs tending to on some level that we may not even be too consciously aware of, while at the same time we have things in the forefront of our awareness that we try to seek out and work out.  I think that's the nature of our being to do that.

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I wonder at the distinct possibility that the purpose of reincarnation is to return to the level of Consciousness in which these Aspects were split off in order to retrieve them.

Bruce

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Bruce, I really like that viewpoint and belief.  It really resonates with me and makes sense because ultimately we are each responsible for our own spiritual growth.  If there ever was a reason to keep coming here that would be one that makes most sense to me. 

Vicky wrote on Sep 5^th, 2016 at 12:34pm:


I wonder at the distinct possibility that the purpose of reincarnation is to return to the level of Consciousness in which these Aspects were split off in order to retrieve them.

Bruce

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Bruce, I really like that viewpoint and belief.  It really resonates with me and makes sense because ultimately we are each responsible for our own spiritual growth.  If there ever was a reason to keep coming here that would be one that makes most sense to me. 


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This is a few reasons I reject the concept of reincarnation and the philosophy of Karma.

http://www.impantokratoros.gr/dogma-reincarnation.en.aspx

True Christianity which I have embraced in these last few years of my already protracted lifespan of 76 years

According to the Christian faith, man is not uncreated and eternal, but a creation: not a result of God's substance, but the fruit of divine will and love. In the Old Testament, the distinction between the Maker and his creations is underlined, between the human and the rest of creation.


He who believes in karma and reincarnation sinks into his misery and does not hope. He does not seek a God, nor anyone from his surroundings.

He is expected to passively accept his state without 'attachment'. He cannot experience faith and gratitude for God's presence in his life.

Even if he refers to 'a law of grace', it is aimed at  mechanistic and automatic consequences of a blind law, and this is why he is called on to act without internal involvement, without 'attachment', as he claims. Nevertheless, man is by nature a communion of persons.

This is why the complete loneliness in which the dogma of karma and reincarnation immerses its believer constitutes an 'unnatural' state.

In the law of Karma good is rewarded in the life to come, and evil is punished. It is believed that everyone gets what he or she deserves in life. There is no mercy towards the less fortunate because it is believed that they had bad karma in their past life or lives.

We get the untouchables cruel cast system of India, from the belief in reincarnation and Karma.

Over here in South Africa where we have the largest community of people of Indian descent outside of India. A lady told me that this philosophy was evil and worse than Apartheid (Which be the way, means separate)

Alan







"What is reincarnation?"

http://www.godonthe.net/evidence/manylife.htm
Reincarnation is a core doctrine of many Eastern religions, such as Hinduism.  It is the belief that a single soul goes through many physical lives, that when a person's body dies, his soul enters a new body prior to that body's birth.  When that body dies the soul enters a third body, etc.
Eventually, the soul reaches Nirvana.

Buddhism believes this is accomplished by following the Eightfold Path to Enlightenment, and that when a soul reaches Nirvana the soul ceases to exist. (The idea of reincarnation is not limited to a single religion and the concept varies.  Technically, at least Tibetan Buddhism teaches that man does not have a soul.)

Hinduism believes that Nirvana involves a reunion with Brahm, the all-pervading force of the universe which Hinduism considers to be a god.  This is like a drop of water rejoining the ocean. The soul loses its individual identity when it rejoins Brahm but does not cease to exist.

Understand that a lot of "teaching" about reincarnation in the United States is "pop theology" thrown together from various TV shows such as Buffy the Vampire Slayer and horror movies and is simply the imagination of Hollywood scriptwriters, with no basis in any historical religious or philosophical tradition or belief system.



Only the human being is made 'in God's image'. His position in God's world is a position of authority, which according to God's plan translates into a position of responsibility and love on man's part towards all of God's creation. 

Based on this perception, man is indeed doomed to loneliness. He is deserted to his 'destiny' helpless. Nobody can change his fate, not himself, nor another person, not even God. He has substituted Divine Love and Divine Providence with karmic plans, which define events in his life just like episodes of a movie, which are projected from a machine onto a screen. In the end, what is written in the movie will be screened, irrespectively of how philanthropic or horrific the scenes of the 'movie' are which are played in each life.   

There is no injustice in reality. The ones who 'do us injustice' as we think, are only carriers of actions that, according to the 'scenario' of our life's movie, must take place, for our evolution's sake! If we endure without protesting, we will have learned our 'lesson' and in a future life we will advance in evolution! (self-evolution).

Perhaps when an individual becomes whole that person finds that there are really no differences to resolve anyway. Perhaps they find that all is well, and all has always been well.

I find that when I am most whole, most at peace, most relaxed, that there is no problem. Not at all. It seems to be a matter of focus.

However, to grow, it seems that we must create problems to solve. There would be no stressors, nothing to push back against or to play with, if there were no problems to solve.

But, again, there is really no problem. When I remember how temporary my perspective as a human being here on earth actually is, there is really no problem.

It is true that pain can feel real. But, when it is over, how real is it? It floats away.

Vicky wrote on Sep 5^th, 2016 at 9:17pm:


Without a little stirring between members, there would be nothing to debate. If we all thought and believed exactly alike, the forum would have to close shop forever.

And lastly are you not a seeker of truth are you positive what you believe it accurate?

Alan

Vicky wrote on Sep 7^th, 2016 at 10:33am:


In my last post, I made no reference to religion all I suggested that we should be seekers of truth!

As far as everyone to their own I disagree with that logic of yours, "Jeffrey Dahmer to his own murdered young men and ate them."

There must somewhere be an absolute truth and absolute morality

As far as retrievals go I simply cannot believe that, we mortal cannot retrieve a lost soul when we are imperfect and lost ourselves.

Alan

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Yes I agree.  I hope I didn't sound like I was implying that I "do" retrievals or that that's a superior skill.  I didn't mean that.  I agree with you.

Oh, not at all, Vicky. The term "do" is frequently used and I wanted to clarify my own conception of what happens. I was just responding to what I perceived as Alan's idea that a human being might not be able to help for the reason of not being "pure" enough. The process does require a suspension of disbelief, an ability to trust in it. Not everyone can do this nor should they feel they need to do it if it causes them any kind of distress.

Also, you once described how you see things during a retrieval and it sounds very similar to my own experience, a feeling of a sort of grainy darkishness in which various scenes appear and interactions occur but some of the details are more sensed than seen. I don't know if anyone else has the experience of vivid color, but I don't.

I haven't been on here much lately. 

I'll go visit the dream forum and look at your "Mom" dreams.   

I've been writing out my dreams and keeping them in a binder for many years.

Alan,

You've brought up this topic in more than one thread...so what's your point?  You obviously feel very strongly and passionately about this topic of evil.  Yes you can believe whatever you like.  I have said before that I agree with that.  I'm not trying to change you.  I'm trying to join into a discussion like some friends sitting around a table having a nice conversation, and the way you're behaving makes me want to just get up and leave the table. 

You say I don't have the authority to retrieve someone and say I’m delusional to believe it.  So here’s a fun challenge for you...Have you read Bruce Moen's books?  Have you tried doing retrievals yourself?  I'd really be interested in hearing what your experiences are with that.  A discussion about personal experiences is far more interesting to me. 

Just because I don’t have all the answers to every situation in this world doesn’t mean that I shouldn’t trust my own experiences.  I believe what I experience with my own conscious awareness because it’s not possible for me to experience anything in any other way.  To do so would be like asking me to think with someone else’s brain, or to use someone else’s body. 

Hi friends. I had to re-register to get back here. My name is Tim F. I left because of  Christian  folks acting in a less than compassionate way  towards anything that didn't fit in with their belief-system.  I''m here now. The  actual point of this forum,  the true intention of it,  is in my blood.  I actually  hate talking about spiritual  matters. Talk is cheap. Tell me what you've done with your hands.  And .....

Regarding retrievals, and for anybody who might believe that it is something the Robert Monroe school came up with, below are excerpts from a 1960 book called “The Study and Practice of Astral Projection” by Dr. Robert Crookall. The book speaks of numerous OBEs people have had.

Case No. 113 – Mrs Phyllis Fischer says the following on page 114.

“On a “subsequent occasion, I was taken by a guide into the dark regions. It was exactly like Dante’s Inferno-people groped in darkness, scarcely discernible as human beings. I have since done much Rescue Work in these regions.

Pages 39-42 speak of case 43, Mme d’Eserance
First she experienced a higher level of being, and then she experienced beings that are in lower realms. Too many words to type, here are some of them.

“My interest in the mysterious dream-life drew me…near to a misty cloud-like region in which one felt stifled and cramped, as though the atmosphere had become close, thick and substantial. A feeling of almost fear and anxiety oppressed me, and I felt a desire to escape for the sense of heaviness which was gradually closing in. Yet the desire to learn was stronger and I combated the instinct which would lead to clearer air and freedom. [Discarnate communicators from “Paradise conditions say that, in order to contact people in lower conditions (including those in physical embodiment) and the earthbound (in the body-veil, delayed in Hades conditions), they must attune themselves by lowering their vibration. This process tends to reduce their consciousness from the clear, bright and intense super-normal type to the somewhat dreamy and confused sub-normal type, while the environment tends to no longer be bright and clear but more or less misty, foggy etc. (in extreme case dark). Thus, those who come from Paradise conditions to help either the earthbound or mortals find the process neither easy nor pleasant: they say some at some cost.]”

The words within brackets come from the book’s author rather than the experiencer. It makes sense to me that beings at a higher level of being might have some difficulty making contact with lower energy levels. They would need to change a part of their energy in order to do so. Going by how my retrieval experiences seem, I make contact with a higher level of being and lower levels at the same time. My connection to a higher level enables me to provide cleansing energy to a being that needs assistance. On some occasions I feel the negative energy that a lower level being has, and the more this being gets cleansed the more I experience love and peace.

Regarding retrieving aspects of self: it seems as if I have done so.

http://www.encyclopedia.com/doc/1G2-3403803849.html

Actually "rescue" is a more relevant term.  To retrieve someone or something is to bring them back from where they came.

To free souls who are unable to find their way is more accurately described as a rescue.

R

I don't know the precise history of the term retrieval. Robert Monroe used to retrieve aspects of himself, so perhaps this is the term's origin.

rondele wrote on Oct 3^rd, 2016 at 11:14am:

Hi Seagull,

Interesting topic on hearing voices.  I think it could be true that some schizophrenic people are hearing and responding to real voices but don't know how to distinguish them from what's part of their illness.  When I was going to college and rode the public bus, a young man who is saw everyday would sit there conversing with someone no one could see.  I began talking with him and he would carry on quite normally with me and was very pleasant.  In talking with him I learned that he knows he has mental issues, and he rides the bus going to and from psychiatric therapy.  He said that he cannot distinguish between real people and those who are not really there, so he just treats everyone the same, with kindness and graciousness.  He truly was a very genuinely kind person.  I thought it was fascinating.  His conversations with whoever else he was talking to were quite real sounding, pleasant, and normal.  So I don't know what to think.  Perhaps not all of the voices he hears are illness... some are, but it could be his illness also allows him to perceive on levels most of us cannot.

I myself have heard a voice that tells me things, which I've come to realize is the voice of my Guidance.  It's rare, I wish it happened more, but I'm now no longer afraid of it.  Yes, when it first began I thought I was having mental issues!  But what I hear is positive, helpful advice about things I couldn't possibly know through normal means of perception.  It tells me of things from the near future or across the miles, things I can't possibly know, so as they become verified I've learned I can trust it.  I know it is just part of how my psychic ability works. 

Sometimes when I'm doing retrieval or other nonphysical contact experiences I hear voices from those I'm in contact with.  To me it's just another way to perceive.  Truly fascinating!

You and I have such similar experience Albert!

recoverer wrote on Oct 8^th, 2016 at 11:59am:


Nope, we don't have everything in common that's for sure.  Just a lot of similarities in the way we experience things.