Berserk2 wrote on Jan 17^th, 2014 at 10:14pm:


   Wouldn't necessarily be self refuting if you look at it from a "Disk" type perspective.  For example, Bob Monroe was still alive when Bruce Moen incarnated. 

     Even within the same Disk, there are varying degrees of connection between different "probes" (in the temporary sense, especially when considering involvement with the physical) and time is no barrier or separator here at all .  As we live our own in physical life, we often cycle through various patterns and energies of different aspects of our own Disk, even if we are not literally a direct reincarnation of a particular individual within our Disk.  For one month, moment, week, etc, i may act, feel, think, a lot like John Doe in my Disk, and then some other time like Jane Doe.  Course, i also always have my own individual pattern, will, etc which is unique.

  This is very apparent and strong when we are children, especially before we become more individualized and set in our own unique personality and life pattern.

    We also deal with karma of other aspects and individuals are our Disk. 

    Edgar Cayce's son, Hugh Lynn, was told in a reading to watch for an appearing and disappearing mark on his hand--it related to a wound one of his Disk members received during his life--there apparently would be a strong energetic connection between these selves/lives at some points, which would even manifest physically as marks in the body relating to those experiences. 

  Now, i don't know if Hugh Lynn was a direct, literal, reincarnation of this "past" self, or if they were just part of the same Disk.  Knowing how rare direct, literal reincarnations are, i would say that most likely they were fellow Disk members. 

   I've learned that i'm a literal direct reincarnation of an individual (an Egyptian dude) who previously lived an in physical life.  My life and pattern, not unsurprisingly, has mirrored and had major similar themes as his---especially the challenges and things he needed to work on or overcome in his life.

  For example, he experienced getting kicked out of groups he was involved with and cared about.  This has been a major pattern and challenge with me as well. 



   

    

a channel,
True, but the Watseka Wonder makes possession more viable than the Disk interpretation, which strikes me as the most implausible option.  I mean, contemporaries in the same so-called Disk should have shared lives domonstrated by shared memories.

Doc:

Do you really know that the Disk interpretation is "just that - an interpretation?"

What is it an interpretation of?

Outside of people who think in terms of higher self, oversoul, total self, disk, I-there, some NDErs have spoken in such a way. For example, consider what Thomas Sawyer said.

"Reincarnation is not a linear thing. One of the problems in defining it is that there is no analogy to it. It is outside of time, yet we can't help but think of it in terms of the past and the future, and this incarnation. The whole story is so big and so involved.

Reincarnation is an opportunity to reach a goal. The goal is true self-realization. Self-realization is to know that you are a soul, a part of God, yet also the Whole. Perhaps no one has a very good image at all of his or her soul - the whole self. And they have no idea of what proportion their personality is in relationship to their soul.

As an example, a characteristic of your personality is one percent of all of your personality characteristics put together, and all of your personality characteristics make up your personality, and your personality is only about five percent of your soul, then we are blinding ourselves to 95 percent of the rest of our soul in order to reincarnate.

Reincarnation is an opportunity to evolve through many personalities. The definition of reincarnation is that your personality is who you are in your current lifetime, and that it can be reincarnated as an entirely different personality with the characteristics of the previous personality and previous personalities including even characteristics of another soul altogether. That is, characteristics of your present personality may be the reincarnation of other characteristics of personalities from your previous lifetimes as well as characteristics from personalities from other souls.

If a person dies and goes totally homogenous back into the light it is reasonably improbable that there will be another reincarnation. It is improbable. However, it is more usual for people to die and go partially back into the light while remaining partially in the realm of the Earth realm. That means remaining partially within the earthly confines of the human condition with an attachment of sorts to the human condition.

Once you go into the spirit realm, you may realize that you haven't learned everything you should, so you find another personality, another body and your soul is maintained throughout. As you transform into another personality, your soul does not get bigger or smaller. You carry with you characteristics of your former personalities. The simplest example is to say that the phrase "burning off bad karma" means that you have characteristics that you have to deal with."

When Ron Kruger wrote about his NDE, he also spoke of meeting something like a disk (he didn't use the word "disk").

P.M.H. wrote that just one small part of a Soul incarnates into this World. I mentioned this to her at a conference and asked her if she is just one finger of her Soul, and she "very" admantly answered "Yes!" (she might've said "Absolutely yes.") She said that when she experienced her Soul during her NDE she found it to be a very large being and that there is no way the entirety of it could incarnate into one body. It sounds to me that she considers herself to be like a "probe."

This matches my experience.

Perhaps it is our ego that causes us to be afraid of the possibility that our soul is much more than the punny personality we know about while incarnated in this World.

There is also the matter of our Souls becoming connected to Soul Groups. Even though there may be children that receive past live memories from possessing spirits, it may also be possible for people to receive memories from Soul Groups.

Quote:

This is my experience and understanding as well. 

This is also what many scientists are theorizing.  They say at a fundamental level the only thing that actually exists is an unimaginably huge information or consciousness system that is evolving.  For example, this system evolved time when it first noticed a difference between one state and another state.  It developed free choice when it became conscious of its ability to choose between different states at will.  It also evolved into a substance or essence or beingness that further evolved feeling states of consciousness.  Since "love" for lack of a better word was/is the most profitable way to evolve, that's what it evolved into... an enormous being/substance/essence of love that continues to evolve in that direction, though most of us cannot even begin to imagine it, but essentially this "love being" is better organizing its own consciousness and "love" is like a byproduct of better organization of consciousness.

Eventually it evolved what I'll call souls or light beings to exist in virtual realities in which the souls themselves, having the same fundamental attributes, can identify themselves as individualized consciousnesses from within these realities.  If it were not for the existence of these virtual realities created and held in place within the whole of consciousness, a soul would not have the ability to distinguish itself from the entirety of the whole of consciousness. 

These souls created of the same substance as the whole of consciousness also have the capability to create what I'll call "spirits" by incarnating a portion of their "energy" or substance/essence/consciousness into a human for example.  The purpose in this is to further evolve not only the soul itself, but also the entire consciousness of the greater being.  A human is nothing more than a virtual form that a soul or light being can "blend" with, or merge into to experience that particular virtual reality.  There are so many virtual realities a soul can choose to participate in (incarnate in) that it is impossible to number them.  Many souls or light beings do incarnate into ELS even thousands of times not from some never ending wheel of karma, but because they choose to experience as much as they possibly can experience of ELS to further their evolutionary experience, which takes that long because of the limited life spans of ELS forms.

Nanci Danison in her books indicates the same thing though she uses different words and descriptions based on her own understanding and interpretation of her NDE and subsequent "paranormal" experiences.  I haven't had a lot of time to read lately, but soon as I finish her book, I'll post more.  The bottom line is that we never "die" because we were never "born" in the first place.  Our soul, which is a "light being" that most NDE'ers describe, is what we are and always have been.  It's our light being soul that is experiencing our life vicariously by inhabiting a virtual, animal human form.  In other words, we are not human.  We are having an experience to see what it is like to live/exist as a human.  Ego comes from the way humans have evolved, which is fear based, so another part of our light being soul mission is to help the human race evolve toward love.  Sounds kind of sci-fi doesn't it?  Still, I'm fascinated by the possibilities.

Kathy

Doc:

A few times I was shown structures that I couldn't describe and I can barely remember. It is possible that Bruce was presented with a Disk image because it is fairly accurate and easy to describe.

This whole image thing, even what we see when we look at another person's body isn't an accurate representation of what a person's body is.

If an oversoul would want to learn by incarnating into this World the first time it does so, why wouldn't it want to send extensions of itself more than once?

Perhaps Soul Groups are composed of a number of Oversouls.

Kathy:

I get what you wrote.

Hi Roger,

Yes, I agree.  Reincarnation is not about "getting it right", and I'm also not inclined to say that we "reincarnate" either.  The light being soul may incarnate portions of its energy/essence/consciousness in humans on a regular basis, however, I wonder how likely it would be for those elements of energy/essence/consciousness to be exactly the same time and again?  It could be, especially if those consciousness elements were productive in furthering their evolution. I don't know, but I think that would be the most likely reason if reincarnation does occur.

Yes, consciousness would be expanding as it evolves in the sense that it is gathering more and more information and organizing that information in positive ways that affect its beingness.  As with any type of system evolution, what is not beneficial or profitable to the system falls away, dies off, or destroys itself.

ELS is like an individualized consciousness system within a greater consciousness system.  It is the inhabitants of the ELS that evolved and continues to evolve morality.  In other words, it is our ELS group consciousness that defines right or wrong based on the experiences of humans.  And of course, this evolving morality has a great impact on the way human consciousness either evolves or de-evolves.  The greater consciousness system doesn't judge in the same way as we do.  Within it all other consciousness / information simply exists.  Still, the larger system must have some way to discard information that is not useful or profitable to its evolution, so there may be some form of judgment in that regard, but I'd say it would be more like non-profitable patterns could possibly be deleted, but more likely reorganized into patterns that would have the potential to become profitable.

For lack of a better metaphoric description, Danison indicates that in the documentary she was shown that there is no missing link in the evolution of humans, but that humans evolved twice.  Could this have been an intentional reorganization of human consciousness that originally was not a profitable pattern of development?  That the patterns were changed in ways that had the potential to evolve a more productive human race?  Of course, I'm speculating, but sometimes that's kind of fun to do.

K

Hi Albert,

I'm not so sure it's as cut and dried as that.  Remember we're talking about a consciousness, or informational system that provides the means by which light being souls can evolve.  That greater system (God if you want to call it that) likely is only interested in patterns as they develop, where a light being soul while still interested in patterns developed would also be more interested in individualized consciousness as a part of itself as good or bad. 

It may be possible that a light being soul could create both a Hitler and a Mother Teresa and both would be a part of itself.  I mean, don't we all have a little of both good and bad in us?  The bad, in my opinion stems from fear and humans are extremely fearful as a species.  So I have to wonder if a soul wouldn't simply reorganize a developing pattern it notices within itself?  For example, if my child were like a Hitler, that child would still be a part of me and I would try to guide him in more productive directions.  Does that make sense?

Kathy

PS  As a side note, I think of God as the ground of all being including the evolving consciousness system.