Conversation Board - Reincarnation: Children report past lives

Lucy

Super Member

Offline

Posts: 1158
C1

Reincarnation: Children report past lives
Jan 6^th, 2014 at 7:38am

In some ways, a most interesting aspect of this was that it was on NPR radio. Does that mean the mainstream is starting to look at reincarnation?

http://www.wbur.org/npr/259886077/searching-for-science-behind-reincarnation

The University of Virginia has long been ahead of the curve on this. Ian Stevenson has been dead for several years but the work goes on. Some of these cases are pretty interesting.

Back to top

IP Logged

Lights of Love

Super Member

Offline

Afterlife Knowledge Member

Posts: 881

Re: Reincarnation: Children report past lives
Reply #1 - Jan 6^th, 2014 at 12:01pm

Quote:

Jim Tucker. A psychiatrist at the University of Virginia

... I think it's very difficult to just map these cases onto materialist understanding of reality. I mean, if physical matter, if the physical world is all there is, then I don't know how you can accept these cases and believe in them. But I think there are good reasons to think that consciousness could be considered a separate entity from physical reality. And in fact, some leading scientists in the past, like Max Planck, who's the father of quantum theory, said that he viewed consciousness as fundamental and that matter was derived from it. So, in that case, it would mean that consciousness would not necessarily be dependent on a physical brain in order to survive and could continue after the physical brain and after the body dies. In these cases, it seems, at least on the face of it, that a consciousness has then become attached to a new brain and has shown up as past life memories.

... it may well be that our brains are conduits for consciousness but it is actually being created somewhere else.

Hi Lucy,

Interesting interview. What Tucker says in the quote above, that consciousness is fundamental and all that really exists is something I keep running into from several fields of science. Biologists, physicists, psychiatrists, and so on. Maybe the numbers are about to tip and mainstream science will start giving these ideas and theories some credence.

Kathy

Back to top

Tread softly through life with a tender heart and a gentle, understanding spirit.

IP Logged

recoverer Super Member Offline Afterlife Knowledge Member Posts: 5027 Gender:	Re: Reincarnation: Children report past lives Reply #2 - Jan 6^th, 2014 at 1:58pm Check out Carl Wickland's "thirty years amongst the dead" for an alternative perspective to what Ian Stevenson found. Check out the chapter on Reincarnation. A PDF file of the book is available for free on the internet.
Back to top	IP Logged

Lucy Super Member Offline Posts: 1158 C1	Re: Reincarnation: Children report past lives Reply #3 - Jan 10^th, 2014 at 4:27am Quote: Check out the chapter on Reincarnation. which is the chapter on reincarnation? what's your point? though I don't see much to compare with the body of work Stevenson produced and it certainly may be different than current work.
Back to top	IP Logged

2bets

Junior Member

Offline

ALK Member

Posts: 51
SE USA
Gender: female

Re: Reincarnation: Children report past lives
Reply #4 - Jan 10^th, 2014 at 9:05am

Here's a view of a comparison between Wickland and Stevenson, just for the sake of developing this topic. It's from an Amazon book review (OK to quote since credit is given, I hope)--
"A must read for all ssychiatrists
By Shawn T. Murphy on November 27, 2004
Format: Paperback
Dr. Carl Wickland MD would not have agreed with the conclusions of Dr. Stevens [...]. He specifically stated that all of the memories observed in such cases were actually originating from the discarnate spirit of the deceased, who was attached to the patient. He did not accept the case of the deceased spirit entering into a new incarnation. Of course Dr. Wickland was dealing with the psychosis of much older patients and did not to my knowledge examine any of the type of patients that Dr. Stevens did."

Back to top

IP Logged

a channel

Ex Member

Re: Reincarnation: Children report past lives
Reply #5 - Jan 13^th, 2014 at 1:57pm

Kathy wrote, "Maybe the numbers are about to tip and mainstream science will start giving these ideas and theories some credence."

Once certain hindering forces are taken out of the equation, then yes, i think this will eventually happen.

But science has become like a religion in many respects, as to dogma, control, money, and politics being very involved.

Here is an interesting article i read regarding the Big Bang theory. http://rense.com/general53/bbng.htm
Note the strong words used about this major area of science becoming so dogmatic and controlled and scienctific research being so fudged. And this is about material science based on physical reality, not something as "out there" as consciousness, nonphysical reality or the like.

The question is, is this completely a natural development because of how human nature tends to be, is it something before forced from higher up the food chain to speak, or a combo of both.

I would say, and i think those who created the documentary Thrive might agree, that it's a combo and that there are individuals in this world with immense wealth and material influence who have something to gain from the control/manipulation and dogmatism of science and purposely want it limited in it's scope and conclusions.

Consciousness and nonphysical reality is just too much of a freeing concept. Crap, what if people lose their fear of death? Things might really start to change in this world, but they like the way the world is now, fearful, easily manipulated and controlled, etc.

And these folks will not roll over lightly and give up the fight easily. They will hold on until it's taken forcefully from their grasp, as the Creative Forces plan to do to give us a fighting chance on this sad planet.

Back to top

IP Logged

Berserk2

Super Member

Offline

Posts: 844
Gender: male

Re: Reincarnation: Children report past lives
Reply #6 - Jan 15^th, 2014 at 8:25pm

Dr. Wickland's research confirms Swedenborg's discovery that the past life recall of children is no evidence for reincarnation. Rather, it signifies unknown discarnate spirit attachment in which the discarnate spirit's memories seem to be one' own. Even a coople of Ian Stevenson's cases point in this direction: that is, the child's alleged prior personality was still alive at the time of the child's birth!

Don

Back to top

IP Logged

carl

Full Member

Offline

Posts: 122

Re: Reincarnation: Children report past lives
Reply #7 - Jan 15^th, 2014 at 11:13pm

Berserk2 wrote on Jan 15^th, 2014 at 8:25pm:

Dr. Wickland's research confirms Swedenborg's discovery that the past life recall of children is no evidence for reincarnation. Rather, it signifies unknown discarnate spirit attachment in which the discarnate spirit's memories seem to be one' own. Even a coople of Ian Stevenson's cases point in this direction: that is, the child's alleged prior personality was still alive at the time of the child's birth!

Don

Dr.Carl Wickland dismissed reincarnation as false!?? His wife, a medium, supposedly received this information from spiritual heavyweights like Madam Blavatsky, and others like Mary Baker Eddy, plus others. Wickland also said that the person called 'Jesus Christ', did not die our sins! In fact in his book, "Thirty Years Among The dead", he states that the Christ of the Christian bible is false, and that he did not die for anybodies sins! Just google up his book "Thirty years among the dead"...It's a free Internet download and read. Blessings and Love. Carl

Back to top

IP Logged

Lucy

Super Member

Offline

Posts: 1158
C1

Re: Reincarnation: Children report past lives
Reply #8 - Jan 16^th, 2014 at 8:24am

Quote:

The question is, is this completely a natural development because of how human nature tends to be, is it something before forced from higher up the food chain to speak, or a combo of both.

I find I am somehow intrigued by the question of what are we choosing from this side and what did we choose from the other side. I find Natalie Sudman's description of her experiences compelling. Sort of like, you put the pin ball into play from the other side and watch what unfolds here in this earthly pinball machine.

Re: Wickland
I find his assumptions too limiting. Guess the only thing one can do is go on one's own experiences. I currently have no personal memories to guide me but I don't like to be limited.

Note: it was fashionable at the time (Wickland's) to have a wife who was a medium....sort of funny to me now. I looked at the book but haven't read it. I did so like The Betty Book.

for my own amusement I looked Betty up again, I have read the husband's letter on her dying before but it is still interesting.

http://www.spiritwritings.com/bettywhite.html

Back to top

IP Logged

Bardo Senior Member Offline Posts: 291 Gender:	Re: Reincarnation: Children report past lives Reply #9 - Jan 16^th, 2014 at 2:08pm All things spiritual were fashionable in the '20s. While I certainly think some of it is credible (Cayce for example), I think that period spawned a lot of charlatans as well. Not saying that these folks were, at all.
Back to top	IP Logged

a channel Ex Member	Re: Reincarnation: Children report past lives Reply #10 - Jan 16^th, 2014 at 2:20pm "The question is, is this completely a natural development because of how human nature tends to be, is it something before forced from higher up the food chain to speak, or a combo of both." Meant to write, "...is it something being forced..."
Back to top	IP Logged

recoverer

Super Member

Offline

Afterlife Knowledge Member

Posts: 5027
Gender: male

Re: Reincarnation: Children report past lives
Reply #11 - Jan 17^th, 2014 at 2:01pm

If you open the PDF file that is available on the internet and search "Jesus," you'll find that overall Jesus is spoken of in a positive way. Regarding dying for our sins, consider Matthew 7:21.

Plus, certainly it is possible that there are times that Carl Wickland's understanding wasn't accurate. This doesn't mean that he and his wife didn't do the work they said they did.

carl wrote on Jan 15^th, 2014 at 11:13pm:

Berserk2 wrote on Jan 15^th, 2014 at 8:25pm:

Dr. Wickland's research confirms Swedenborg's discovery that the past life recall of children is no evidence for reincarnation. Rather, it signifies unknown discarnate spirit attachment in which the discarnate spirit's memories seem to be one' own. Even a coople of Ian Stevenson's cases point in this direction: that is, the child's alleged prior personality was still alive at the time of the child's birth!

Don

Dr.Carl Wickland dismissed reincarnation as false!?? His wife, a medium, supposedly received this information from spiritual heavyweights like Madam Blavatsky, and others like Mary Baker Eddy, plus others. Wickland also said that the person called 'Jesus Christ', did not die our sins! In fact in his book, "Thirty Years Among The dead", he states that the Christ of the Christian bible is false, and that he did not die for anybodies sins! Just google up his book "Thirty years among the dead"...It's a free Internet download and read. Blessings and Love. Carl

Back to top

« Last Edit: Jan 17^th, 2014 at 4:34pm by recoverer »

IP Logged

recoverer

Super Member

Offline

Afterlife Knowledge Member

Posts: 5027
Gender: male

Re: Reincarnation: Children report past lives
Reply #12 - Jan 17^th, 2014 at 2:08pm

The chapter is actually called "Theosophy." It says that some people, because of their belief in reincarnation, try to re-enter a body after they die and they end up possessing the person who is using such a body.

Lucy wrote on Jan 10^th, 2014 at 4:27am:

Quote:

Check out the chapter on Reincarnation.

which is the chapter on reincarnation?
what's your point?

though I don't see much to compare with the body of work Stevenson produced and it certainly may be different than current work.

Back to top

IP Logged

recoverer Super Member Offline Afterlife Knowledge Member Posts: 5027 Gender:	Re: Reincarnation: Children report past lives Reply #13 - Jan 17^th, 2014 at 4:35pm I corrected my post to say Matthew 7:21. Nevertheless, Matthew 6:21 does relate.
Back to top	IP Logged

Berserk2

Super Member

Offline

Posts: 844
Gender: male

Re: Reincarnation: Children report past lives
Reply #14 - Jan 17^th, 2014 at 10:14pm

In my desire to point out parallels with various types of alleged afterlife communication, I often seem to forget to add that almost all channeling in IMO bogus. My main point is this: Ian Stevenson's cases are self-refuting because of cases in which the child's alleged "prior personality" was still alive at the time of birth. ES's perspective therefore seems to make the best sense of all the relevant date.

In this regard, I am rather surprised what is often deemed the best evidential case for survival ever is seldom discussed here--the Lurancy Vennum case.

Don

Back to top

IP Logged