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How to beat the cancer with Self-Love (Read 20662 times)
Lights of Love
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Re: How to beat the cancer with Self-Love
Reply #30 - Jan 19th, 2012 at 4:02pm
 
Hi Volu,

Yes, I think I understand what you are saying.  All gurus, teachers, humans don't always have good intent.  Sometimes they have a mixture part good and part no so good.  And other times their intent is fear based.  Would you agree?

Kathy
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Lights of Love
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Re: How to beat the cancer with Self-Love
Reply #31 - Jan 20th, 2012 at 1:39pm
 
I happen think this morning that there may be some confusion about someone's intent or motivation behind an action and the ending result. 

Take for example a woman in the news recently who shot and killed a man that had broken into her home.  Even though a man, the intruder ended up dead because the woman shot him does not mean her intent was wrong.  Her intent was to protect her child and herself from someone that clearly intended harm.  She had right, and yes, loving intent, even though she killed a man. 

K
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crossbow
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Re: How to beat the cancer with Self-Love
Reply #32 - Jan 20th, 2012 at 1:43pm
 
Maybe she just hated home intruders.
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Lights of Love
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Re: How to beat the cancer with Self-Love
Reply #33 - Jan 20th, 2012 at 2:08pm
 
crossbow wrote on Jan 20th, 2012 at 1:43pm:
Maybe she just hated home intruders.

Crossbow, the few posts I've read of yours seemed to be full of wisdom, however, this comment is a mystery to me. 

Anyone protecting their child from harm is doing so out of love, not hatred.
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crossbow
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Re: How to beat the cancer with Self-Love
Reply #34 - Jan 20th, 2012 at 3:23pm
 
Lights of Love wrote on Jan 20th, 2012 at 2:08pm:
crossbow wrote on Jan 20th, 2012 at 1:43pm:
Maybe she just hated home intruders.

Crossbow, the few posts I've read of yours seemed to be full of wisdom, however, this comment is a mystery to me. 

Anyone protecting their child from harm is doing so out of love, not hatred.

Maybe it was love, or maybe it was fear, instinct, curiosity, protectiveness, opportunism, panic, desire, a sense of indignation, hatred, practicality, or other, or probably most likely a combination of some sort. I don't know what her motivating state was. But I do know the range of human motivations is infinitely wide. And I know I've often been wrong when I've assumed what is or was going on inside another. And I've done things that others have told me I did out of love, spiritual calling, self sacrifice, selfishness, etc, when in fact I did them out of sense of adventure and curiosity, sometimes just because I wanted to or because I liked it. When I don't know what a person's motivating state is or was, then I prefer to use the words maybe or perhaps while allowing for all possibilities. I find that wide angle view and receptiveness to all possibilities without preference is part of what enables me to know the truth, when I am able to know it.       
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Lights of Love
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Re: How to beat the cancer with Self-Love
Reply #35 - Jan 20th, 2012 at 5:06pm
 
Yes, Crossbow, now I understand what you are saying.  Evaluating others true intent is often difficult if not impossible much of the time.  As mentioned earlier in this thread we do often have cross-purposes within our intent. 

Intent can also be seen from two different perspectives: one from the greater consciousness system perspective and the other from a human perspective.

The purpose of my example was to try to show that sometimes one can have good, loving, and right intent even though the outcome (a dead man in my example) is not what someone might expect to occur even though a person's intent was good, loving and right. 

Kathy
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crossbow
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Re: How to beat the cancer with Self-Love
Reply #36 - Jan 21st, 2012 at 5:12am
 
Yes, we're tricky animals us humans.
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Lucy
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Re: How to beat the cancer with Self-Love
Reply #37 - Jan 21st, 2012 at 5:38am
 
I think you are referring to the incident in which a young (18 yr old) mother, whose husband had just died of cancer , was home alone with her relatively new baby, and two guys, one who may have been stalking her, started to forcefully break into her home,  and she was on the phone to the rescue services or police, she shot the intruder as he came through the door, which btw is legal in the state she lives in, and killed him.

I think I probably would have done the same thing. But this is not PUL. So maybe this is why we say "PUL" instead of the more generic "love." and I'm not sure what she was feeling, and culturally we talk about a mom's fierce protective love, but I think it is fear-based. Then too, animals do something similar, sometimes fighting to the death to defend their young, or sacrificing themselves in other ways; is that love? Of course, even if the baby wasn't there, she could have shot the guy.

I think, getting back to the original post, that this Anita Moorjani story is really incredible. If it is well-documented, what can people like Randi possibly say? That may be a big "if." I am waiting for the debunkers to come out of the woodwork. Otherwise, this is one of the most astounding events of recent years brought to public attention (I bet there are many private ones).

Of course, here  one is preaching to the choir. Or is one? If this really happened, then what does that change in our thinking? Like, what does that say about all our so called medical knowledge? What does it say about underlying reality?

I think it means we got it all wrong in medical science, but saying why medical science looks successful when it is really an illusion is the difficult part. Do we believe our illusions so completely that we cannot let go of them when something this clear comes along and throws everything into question?

And I also wonder, if I got myself into a situation where some creep was breaking down the door to do me harm, if I could move to a state of accepting my magnificence and enter a state of self-PUL, what would happen? or would I even care?
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Lights of Love
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Re: How to beat the cancer with Self-Love
Reply #38 - Jan 22nd, 2012 at 12:55pm
 
Quote:
Do we believe our illusions so completely that we cannot let go of them when something this clear comes along and throws everything into question?


I think we do try to hold onto what is familiar especially when we don't understand something or are afraid of change. 

Quote:
And I also wonder, if I got myself into a situation where some creep was breaking down the door to do me harm, if I could move to a state of accepting my magnificence and enter a state of self-PUL, what would happen? or would I even care?


Many times when a person is confronted with a potentially traumatic or dangerous situation a profound presence of mind comes over them where they feel extremely calm and peaceful, along with an unusually high degree of clarity of mind and awareness.  There is little or no thinking along with little or no emotion and any action one is able to take in the situation is accomplished through that calm, peaceful heightened awareness.  This awareness, this alertness is similar to Anita Moorjani's description of the awareness she had with the exception that the focus of the awareness during a tramatic event is grounded in the corporal situation at hand.

What we seem to forget when discussing these things is that we are not in any way or at any time separate from our total self.  Usually when we think about something happening to us we scare ourselves beyond belief both before and after such an event takes place, yet many times during a traumatic or dangerous event our sense of the totality of our being is clearly present.

Kathy
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spooky2
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Re: How to beat the cancer with Self-Love
Reply #39 - Jan 22nd, 2012 at 9:30pm
 
"Love your neighbour as you love yourself".
Yes, I've often heard comments on that saying that one needs to be able to love oneself, only then he/she can love others. Of course this is not wrong, but is this interpretation really helpful?
   I think a more rich and rewarding interpretation would be to see it as a hint to a new perception. Not to perceive anymore two "loves", one for oneself, one for the others, but to realize the identity of both. That would be true PUL, in my opinion. This would require indeed the elimination of the ego, but when I see how "ego" is understood commonly, I'd say we must go farther to reach this ideal. We must truely become aware what we mean when we say "I", and what it really is- or not is.

Spooky
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crossbow
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Re: How to beat the cancer with Self-Love
Reply #40 - Jan 23rd, 2012 at 12:05am
 
There are many selfish power loving people who like to control others, who even hate others but pretend to be loving. They like to look innocent and caring while implying that those who think differently to them are not. They are the crowd pushing the creeping restrictions and bans across our societies; who force and pressure others to speak and think like themselves and to comply with their narrow socio-political ideology or else be labelled with one of their overused put-downs. They use empty buzzwords like diversity, multiculturalism, compassion, tolerance, equality, but these words are only the tools they use for controlling others and falsely elevating their selves. They portray themselves as the virtuous ones, the caring ones, the good people, but they are the worst of the hypocrites. They really only care about their own image being elevated in comparison to others image. They cannot truly elevate themselves because they reject the very basics of how to do so. They cannot face things as they are, so truth cannot be seen by them. They reject individual responsibility and accountability, so freewill and its potential to learn and grow is not realised by them. Their consideration-for-others is self serving for them, so love remains a mystery to them. They have many false sayings which on their surface sound nice and idealistic, but underneath are used as justifications for getting their selfish ways. One of their many sayings which they use for ill-intent is, "You must love your self before you can love others".


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Lucy
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Re: How to beat the cancer with Self-Love
Reply #41 - Jan 23rd, 2012 at 12:06pm
 
Yes but Crossbow, I really DO believe that you must love yourself before you can love others. You are not loving others unless you are loving yourself. I think Spooky has a good take on this. (btw, like the new pic Spooky!)

this is not an intellectual argument from me, though you guys do get lots of those. This is from hard core experience.

The difficult part is saying what self-love is, what loving yourself is.

Hving a good grip on what "Love God with all your heart with all your soul with all your might" means...because you are a little piece of God...a chip off the old block, so to speak.

MAybe PUL is a new dimension..not an extension of what we call "love."

That is what those rare fleeting moments of grace and peace have taught me.

Crossbow, at the same time I don't disagree with your admonition to be careful...I always think of the portrayal of Cardinal Richelieu in the movie The Three Musketeers as the embodiment of that diabolically based message. I don't know if the real guy was that ...nasty, I'm just referring to the movie character.

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Volu
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Re: How to beat the cancer with Self-Love
Reply #42 - Jan 23rd, 2012 at 12:34pm
 
When you meet a lovely, fantastic being, it's natural to smile and want to be near that someone. But life has a way needing focus elsewhere too, so please forgive me mirror, but I'll soon be back with you.

The higher self is the ultimate killer whom pulls the plug when time is up, sorry poor life style to steal your thunder. When you know the time here is circling the drain it's also a possibility for a life review and a window of opportunity to do some actions you otherwise wouldn't do before suddenly dropping dead.
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Rondele
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Re: How to beat the cancer with Self-Love
Reply #43 - Jan 23rd, 2012 at 2:53pm
 
<<They use empty buzzwords like diversity, multiculturalism, compassion, tolerance, equality, but these words are only the tools they use for controlling others and falsely elevating their selves.>>

Crossbow- These people, by the way, are the very same people who have pushed their "self esteem" agenda to the absurdity that every child gets a trophy regardless of performance.  And increasingly, grades are no longer given out in order not to make anyone feel bad.

I realize this is off topic, but your point is so well taken I couldn't resist.

R
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Lights of Love
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Re: How to beat the cancer with Self-Love
Reply #44 - Jan 23rd, 2012 at 5:02pm
 
Quote:
The difficult part is saying what self-love is, what loving yourself is.


Yes, it can be difficult not only to describe what self-love is, but also to actually do it.  Sometimes people are filled with such self-hatred they don't even know where to begin the process of self-love.

To me self-love from a human perspective is essentially taking the responsibility to meet your own needs.  On a physical level this means taking care of your needs on a bodily level; eating healthy food in the right amounts, exercising regularly, enjoying physical activities such sleeping, eating, sex, etc.

From an emotional standpoint, one needs to learn to develop a positive, understanding emotional relationship with one's self.  This is where it usually gets more difficult since most of us are unwilling to completely accept ourselves the way we are.  For example, feeling guilty for all intents and purposes is non-productive.  Feeling guilty is essentially rejecting the state we are in, indicating that we are unwilling to accept ourselves the way we are in the moment.  If we are feeling guilty for something we have either done or not done, then we are either procrastinating about doing something to rectify it, or we are still processing it, or we have made the choice to punish ourselves with guilt feelings because our actions did not express our integrity.

Many times it is far easier to feel guilty for something than it is to take the necessary action to maintain our integrity.  We fear whatever it is we must do.  It is easier to feel guilty than to face our fear, so here our guilt suppresses our fear, however that leads to self-rejection.  And we choose self-rejection over fear.

It might sound ridiculous to someone who has not felt self-hatred or to someone who's in denial, but I think it is more than likely that the most epidemic health problem we have is self-hatred.  Whenever you get to know anyone deeply, you will most likely see that inside that person there is a kernel of self-hatred inside them that runs very deep.  Most of the time we use the term low self-esteem and inside each person resides a constant and ongoing struggle for self-esteem that covers up the self-hatred.  We tend to measure ourselves based on a set of standards we learned in childhood. 

We may not be conscious of it, but we try to prove our self worth to others and it shows in our behavior, both by overachieving and underachieving.  We base our self-worth on what we expect of ourselves, many times demanding perfection from ourselves.  Then when we don't achieve perfection we judge and reject ourselves.  And when we do meet our own expectations, instead of acknowledging our accomplishment, allowing ourselves to feel satisfaction, we many times ignore and devalue it.  It's no wonder why there are people who don't even try to accomplish anything.  Like a vicious circle, they see the folly in the whole thing and simply refuse to participate.  Unfortunately, they destroy their spirit, their life energy, their creativity and sometimes their bodies in the process.

The bottom line is to cultivate self-acceptance.  Acceptance does not mean surrender.  It means to deeply trust, love and accept our lives and ourselves no matter what.  It means to really get to know our inner being, communing with it, identifying with it, and finding its divinity or finding God within the very core of our being. It means to live gracefully in the face of whatever life brings our way. Many have no idea how freeing taking out the emotional trash can be. 

Kathy
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