Conversation Board - Re Neale Donald Walsch's Group of 1000

I Am Dude

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Re: Re Neale Donald Walsch's Group of 1000
Reply #15 - Dec 29^th, 2011 at 4:37pm

I strongly believe that rather than becoming totally brainwashed by these questionable sources, most people do as I do, which is take from it what they need without needing to worship the material.

The fact that anything (including authors and their words) causes negativity in someone clearly shows that there is an underlying issue that needs to be worked on, as those in the vibration of Christ Consciousness operate from a state of love and acceptance, and there is little love and acceptance in a state of botheration. In other words, if one allows something as unimportant as a book or a group of donators to bring them out of a higher state of being, then they are choosing to be misaligned with the Christ. It is possible to transform negativity and falseness through light, rather than through more negativity.

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recoverer

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Re: Re Neale Donald Walsch's Group of 1000
Reply #16 - Dec 29^th, 2011 at 4:51pm

Not to suggest that I'm at Christ Consciousness level, but I don't believe that Christ Consciousness and doing nothing goes together.

I've had meditations where I am in this bliss state and my higher self/spirit guidance starts showing me imagery of various things including negative things. The negative things didn't trouble me because during such meditations I was at a level of being where I couldn't be harmed.

This doesn't mean that the troublesome things I see aren't negative. If we want to be a fully integrated being we just can't repose ourselves with in our inner bliss. We need to open ourselves to a love that inspires us to be concerned for others even if we feel inwardly content.

I'd rather be judged by others to be Mr. Negative rather than sit by and do "NOTHING" as the misleaders of this World get away with deceiving many spiritual seekers.

Mr. negative himself: "Albert I'll bliss out when it's time to do so Haust."

I Am Dude wrote on Dec 29^th, 2011 at 4:37pm:

I strongly believe that rather than becoming totally brainwashed by these questionable sources, most people do as I do, which is take from it what they need without needing to worship the material.

The fact that anything (including authors and their words) causes negativity in someone clearly shows that there is an underlying issue that needs to be worked on, as those in the vibration of Christ Consciousness operate from a state of love and acceptance, and there is little love and acceptance in a state of botheration. In other words, if one allows something as unimportant as a book or a group of donators to bring them out of a higher state of being, then they are choosing to be misaligned with the Christ. It is possible to transform negativity and falseness through light, rather than through more negativity.

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recoverer

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Re: Re Neale Donald Walsch's Group of 1000
Reply #17 - Dec 29^th, 2011 at 4:56pm

Here's another person's thoughts about Walsch. Further below is the link.

"Neale isn't offering any new cutting edge philosophy, the criticism of him isn't because he's being 'persecuted' for his great ideas. He is a charlatan, he promotes a rather creepy moral relativism and claims to speak with/for God himself. I think he had a Mr. Rushmore-sized ego to begin with and he is quite openly materalistic and greedy. I saw an interview with him and he was showing off his new $800 boots and saying how he didn't feel guilty about buying them because God wants us to have whatever we want (and he knows what God wants!)

He also promotes cheating on one's spouse because he, sorry, God says it's much worse to cheat oneself out of having as much sex as possible than to betray your marriage vows. He promotes moral relativism and the idea that by thinking the right thoughts you can pull yourself out of poverty (poverty is your own fault, you just chose it and you can just as easily un-choose it). He also blames victims of sexual abuse for 'attracting' the abuse and says there are 'no victims or villians' in life. Standard New Age B.S.

There is a new movie out about him that I think is trying to capitalize on The Secret's success called "Introducing Neale Donald Walsch: God's Latest Scribe?" (2009). I came across it yesterday on Amazon.com. I'm trying to sell my old Abraham-Hicks DVD's and since I did a search on pricing Amazon.com put it up as a DVD I might be intersteing in (no thanks!) I'm trying to put all that nonsense behind me, I hope people will wake up and stop giving up their personal power to these charlatans. Walsch IS a charlatan. Although he may not be as bad as a Warren Jeffs he still promotes a very destructive philosophy. I wasn't aware there were actual Humanity's Team group homes so it may be even worse than I thought. I know the OP was a few years ago, but I hope the poster's son has not given those large sums of money he withdrew to Humanity's Team or NDW and is doing OK."

http://forum.rickross.com/read.php?12,3654,47842

I don't believe the above poster was being negative. She was just sharing useful information with others.

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recoverer

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Re: Re Neale Donald Walsch's Group of 1000
Reply #18 - Dec 29^th, 2011 at 5:09pm

Kathy:

The link I provided isn't the same link I provided before.

Regarding the validity of the information that was posted, one needs to try to discern whether it is valid. To simply throw it out because it might not be valid--well, you really give the misleaders of this World a big break if you dismiss what is said by people who claim to used to be associated with such misleaders.

It is also disrespectful and unloving towards people who out of the goodness of their hearts try to let people know about their experiences with misleading spiritual teachers. It reminds me of when a rape victim ends up becoming the accused.

Lights of Love wrote on Dec 29^th, 2011 at 4:22pm:

Good Grief Albert!

That link is from the website you posted in your first post. I saw it and read it earlier. Who's to say this guy isn't someone just like you... posting a bunch of BS for his own reasons. It doesn't make it true. It's all gossip! The truth is you don't know the truth because you have not experienced it firsthand, so why gossip about it? Or is it your intention to delude people?

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Lights of Love

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Re: Re Neale Donald Walsch's Group of 1000
Reply #19 - Dec 29^th, 2011 at 6:03pm

Albert I said the link is FROM the first web link you posted. You sure are a hard case. Click on the link in your first post which leads to a forum, scroll down and there is the link to that guys story.

I'm sure he has his reasons for posting what he posted. He certainly sounds a bit disgruntled to me, however I have no idea if what he says is true or not and neither do you. To further promote and speculate is to attempt to mislead/delude people yourself. It is all hearsay!

And to associate something like this with an abuse victim is way out of line. I know a little something about that.

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I Am Dude

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Re: Re Neale Donald Walsch's Group of 1000
Reply #20 - Dec 29^th, 2011 at 6:08pm

I feel that more service can be given by focusing on light rather than darkness. You can show someone how to be weary of deception, and they may adopt a judgmental and untrusting mindset, or you can show someone how to be in their divine light, and the deceptions that come their way will be automatically eradicated through their knowing.

Christ Consciousness is not passive, it is active and it is truth. But there is an infinite variety of actions one can take in the moment, and not all of them are of this higher frequency. One can complain about falseness and wrongdoings, or one can inspire through truth. Having compassion for others does not necessitate adopting a negative mindset towards potential victimizers. You said you feel bothered by these sources, and so have chosen to relinquish your inner contentment. It does not have to be this way my friend!

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recoverer

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Re: Re Neale Donald Walsch's Group of 1000
Reply #21 - Dec 29^th, 2011 at 6:39pm

That isn't how I found the link. I found it during another search, so I didn't associate the truth.

Regarding fake guru victim versus fake rape victim it isn't quite the same thing. Nevertheless, I'm aware of a number of people who were good enough to let people know about the false spiritual teachers they were involved with, and they ended up being turned into the accused by people who didn't want to consider what they had to say.

Lights of Love wrote on Dec 29^th, 2011 at 6:03pm:

Albert I said the link is FROM the first web link you posted. You sure are a hard case. Click on the link in your first post which leads to a forum, scroll down and there is the link to that guys story.

I'm sure he has his reasons for posting what he posted. He certainly sounds a bit disgruntled to me, however I have no idea if what he says is true or not and neither do you. To further promote and speculate is to attempt to mislead/delude people yourself. It is all hearsay!

And to associate something like this with an abuse victim is way out of line. I know a little something about that.

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recoverer

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Re: Re Neale Donald Walsch's Group of 1000
Reply #22 - Dec 29^th, 2011 at 7:33pm

Goodness Dude, see my responses within brackets.

I Am Dude wrote on Dec 29^th, 2011 at 6:08pm:

I feel that more service can be given by focusing on light rather than darkness. [[If a person has an issue that troubles him it isn't going to go away by ignoring it and focusing only on positive thoughts. He'll have to deal with the issue even if it causes him to experience something negative for a while. Similarly, the negative things of this World aren't going to away by ignoring them. Constructive actions need to be taken even if doing so means one has to involve one's self with thoughts that aren't pleasant for a while. The fact of how you don't seem to see this makes me wonder if you've been influenced by all is good, all is good, channeled sources in an unbalanced way more than you realize.]]

You can show someone how to be weary of deception, and they may adopt a judgmental and untrusting mindset, or you can show someone how to be in their divine light, and the deceptions that come their way will be automatically eradicated through their knowing. [[The judgemental part, that's your concept. You seem to be advocating the very common new age viewpoint that you can never say anything critical (accurate) about a new age source, because if you do you are being negative and judgmental. If people accessed "their knowing" to the extent they claim, so many false gurus and channelers wouldn't get away with the nonsense they get away with. A person can't truly live according to his inner light until he removes the clutter. If he is to afraid to look at this clutter because he wants to remain "positive" he'll never get around to removing it.]]

Christ Consciousness is not passive, it is active and it is truth. [[I agree with this. This is one of the reasons I'm not passive when it comes to revealing frauds like Walsch.]]

But there is an infinite variety of actions one can take in the moment, and not all of them are of this higher frequency. One can complain about falseness and wrongdoings, or one can inspire through truth. [[Complain? I believe this is quite a mischaracterization of what I'm doing. Please refer to my first comment on this post.]]

This relates to my previous comments above about not Having compassion for others does not necessitate adopting a negative mindset towards potential victimizers. [[If you want to disregard my statements on earlier posts on not having judgmental thoughts towards Walsch that's your choice. I will not be painted into the corner of accepting the premise that I can't say what is true about Walsh or another fraud because doing so supposedly means I am judgmental towards them.]]

You said you feel bothered by these sources, and so have chosen to relinquish your inner contentment. It does not have to be this way my friend! [[You seem to be representing one of the things I dislike about sources such as nondual teachings, ACIM and CWG. Some of these teachings can get a person to be indifferent in some way by getting them to not acknowledge the problems that exist in this World. It does trouble me that teachings that get people to be indifferent are put on a pedestal. I don't mind being troubled because my unhappiness about the matter comes from the part of myself that loves and cares about others. As far as I am concerned, a state of being where one never feels distressed about the negative things that happen is not an advanced spiritual state. Rather, some people go for what is basically an "ignorance is bliss approach" that isn't in touch with reality at all levels in a harmonious way.

I don't believe that one needs to always focus one's attention to these problems, but there are occasions when it is appropriate to do so. As far as I'm concerned if a person wants to reach the point where he can live according to love completely, then he needs to allow himself to become aware of the negativity that takes place in a way that inspires him to do something about it.

A while back we spoke about Eckart Tolle. I wrote a post stating that I would tune into what Tolle refers to as the now years ago. When I did I felt more peace than if I went with the ramblings of my mind. What I experience now when I do so is different than what I experienced years ago. The peace is deeper and the amount of love is more abundant. A part of the reason this is so is because I chose to look at unpleasant things that needed to be considered.

Because of what I have found, I don't believe a person should not make the mistake of resting on his laurels and ignore what needs to be taken care of either personal or of this World, simply because he is able to experience some bliss now. The more we give our hearts to others, a choice that sometimes requires dynamic action, the deeper we'll be able to abide in that which is holy.]]

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Lights of Love

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Re: Re Neale Donald Walsch's Group of 1000
Reply #23 - Dec 29^th, 2011 at 8:09pm

I agree with what Albert is saying above. This world has a lot of problems that need to be addressed. If someone is not part of the solution, then that person is part of the problem.

I'd just like to see a little more skepticism when it comes to the research being done. Otherwise it accomplishes little else except to add to the falsity.

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recoverer

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Re: Re Neale Donald Walsch's Group of 1000
Reply #24 - Dec 29^th, 2011 at 8:27pm

Kathy:

By skepticism, I believe you mean the article I referred to where a person described being pressed for money by Walsch's organization. I agree that one shouldn't automatically assume that such allegations are correct.

Perhaps what is more material is the words Walsch attributes to God. If one considers them closely, it is less necessary to refer to what people say about their experiences with him (the same is true when discerning other sources). I've found that in some cases such an approach can be somewhat helpful, but usually not complete.

I provided some of the CWG words at the beginning of this thread with the thought that the words themselves can be examined.

Lights of Love wrote on Dec 29^th, 2011 at 8:09pm:

I agree with what Albert is saying above. This world has a lot of problems that need to be addressed. If someone is not part of the solution, then that person is part of the problem.

I'd just like to see a little more skepticism when it comes to the research being done. Otherwise it accomplishes little else except to add to the falsity.

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I Am Dude

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Re: Re Neale Donald Walsch's Group of 1000
Reply #25 - Dec 30^th, 2011 at 3:52am

Quote:

Constructive actions need to be taken even if doing so means one has to involve one's self with thoughts that aren't pleasant for a while. The fact of how you don't seem to see this makes me wonder if you've been influenced by all is good, all is good, channeled sources in an unbalanced way more than you realize.

Negative thoughts are not necessary to deal with negative situations. This scam of Walsch's may be real, and he may be channeling a deceitful entity rather than God, and there is a way of dealing with these things while remaining in a higher vibration.

This is how I see the situation here: Perhaps some less-than-savory things are going on here. These people were not forced to give their money to anyone. They chose to because they felt it would serve them in some way, maybe even in the highest spiritual way in that service to others is service to self. They made a bad choice, and chances are this isn't the only bad choice of this nature they have made. They have some learning to do when it comes to discernment and gullibility, among other potential areas of self improvement. Eventually the error of their ways will come to light, as all things do, and they will learn from the experience exactly what they needed to.

If you really want to be constructive, perhaps you should write to the members who are being scammed, or to Neil, or to the authorities. Smiley

I don't see many Walsch supporters speaking up, and in general I don't see many people being helped by your smear campaign against channelled sources. The type of posts I do see people benefiting from are posts that help people gain first hand experience of their true divine nature, whether through instruction or inspiration. And I mean "see" as in with my physical eyes, not in my mind's eye. Like I said, you can bash one source after the other, but until people learn to discern truth from deception by accessing their higher knowing, it will be a never-ending battle. Year after year of bashing must get tiring! I see why you are distressed! But, ya know what's not tiring? Bringing people towards the light. Been doing it for years and it never gets old.

Quote:

As far as I am concerned, a state of being where one never feels distressed about the negative things that happen is not an advanced spiritual state.

Being in a state of distress is contradictory to being in a state of attunement with Christ Consciousness. Negative thoughts or emotions stem from fear of some sort, and when one is in touch with divine truth, there is no fear. It is possible to care for someone in a state of love and joy, rather than of worry, distress, and anger. I doubt Jesus felt negative, fear-based emotions in his enlightened state.

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« Last Edit: Dec 30^th, 2011 at 5:16am by I Am Dude »

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heisenberg69

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Re: Re Neale Donald Walsch's Group of 1000
Reply #26 - Dec 30^th, 2011 at 5:24am

May I make the point that asking for monetary contributions per se is not the problem- all non-profit organisations (including TMI) and churches do it (e.g. collection at the end of the service). The key point is whether NDW is using the money for the betterment of humankind or to buy himself expensive Italian sports cars ...

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Lights of Love

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Re: Re Neale Donald Walsch's Group of 1000
Reply #27 - Dec 30^th, 2011 at 11:10am

recoverer wrote on Dec 29^th, 2011 at 8:27pm:

By skepticism, I believe you mean the article I referred to where a person described being pressed for money by Walsch's organization. I agree that one shouldn't automatically assume that such allegations are correct.

Yes, this is what I'm saying. If your mind is not open enough AND skeptical enough to present a non-biased factual case, then you are as Dude indicates, simply running a smear campaign, which solves nothing. And in that case one becomes part of the problem by contributing to the falsity that already exists.

Heisenberg makes a good point. This group of 1000 is listed as a non-profit organization in which I believe is required to report how the money they receive is spent. If you really want to do something to help find a resolution (if one is truly needed) then why don't you focus your research in that direction?

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Rondele

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Re: Re Neale Donald Walsch's Group of 1000
Reply #28 - Dec 30^th, 2011 at 1:23pm

Well, I guess I should retract what I said about Walsch. Maybe he's a scammer, maybe not.

But here's what I do know- several years ago I found his book among a collection of books at a vacation beach house where we were staying. Deal was, if a guest wanted to take home a book, that was ok as long as a replacement was left behind.

I ended up doing just that. Book was way too long to finish at the beach, not to mention all the other distractions in such an environment. Anyway, since Walsch claimed these were actual, literal conversations between him and God as opposed to imaginary ones, it was far too intriguing not to finish.

While reading it at home, I began to have that "deja vu" feeling that somewhere I had already read certain passages. I knew I had never read the Walsch book before. The more I read, the more I came upon more phrases that "God" had used in his conversations with Walsch that I knew I had seen elsewhere.

Several years before our beach trip I was reading ACIM. I was really into that book at the time, so much so that our D-I-L gave me its Concordance as a BD gift.

Once I finished Conversations, and had marked those passages that had a familiar ring to them, I cross referenced key phrases and/or words with the Concordance. And what do you know, some of God's sentences were almost a direct lift from ACIM with only a few words either omitted or changed around in their sequence.

So either God read ACIM before he began his conversations with Walsch, in which case Jesus could probably claim plagiarism, or Walsch read ACIM and realized there is more than enough spiritual red meat in that heavy book to re-work it into high sounding pronunciations from God himself. After all, it wouldn't be the first time he claimed he was the author of something that in truth was written by someone else. The only difference in that case is that he admitted it.

I suppose there's a 3rd option- God really did decide to sit down with Neale. And Neale faithfully transcribed every last Word for his devoted followers.

John Lennon summed it up nicely in one of his songs:

Nobody told me there'd be days like these
Nobody told me there'd be days like these
Nobody told me there'd be days like these
Strange days indeed --
Most Peculiar, Mama!

R

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recoverer

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Re: Re Neale Donald Walsch's Group of 1000
Reply #29 - Dec 30^th, 2011 at 2:30pm

Discerning thoughts aren't negative thoughts.

If a person has a checkered past, sometimes it is valid to point this out. For example, I believe it is useful to point out that Sai Baba was a child molestor so some people will be less likely to get involved with his teachings.

I don't believe it is about smear campaigns. Somebody needs to take on the responsibility of exposing false sources of information.

Regarding learning discrimination, becoming involved with a false guru helped me learn discrimination, but this doesn't mean that everybody needs to get involved with a cult in order to learn discrimination. I believe this learning experience is way over done.

Plus, because I questioned the validity of some supposedly untouchable gurus that nobody would question, I had to do so all by myself. It would've been helpful if there was something I could've read that would've helped me discriminate their false concepts, instead I was all on my own.

Afterwards I made contact with my higher self and spirit guidance and they helped me clear up some of the lose ends I had missed. They helped me see through some false viewpoints I hadn't seen through sufficiently enough.

There is also the matter of how there are unfriendly beings who are trying to prevent the spiritual progress of this World. One of the ways they do so is by getting people involved with false teachings that have just enought benefits so that people fail to see the teachings' shortcomings.

Therefore, it isn't simply a matter of what lessons a person needs, it is also a matter of not enabling misleading beings to have so much success with misleading people.

I don't believe in counting our chickens before they hatch and putting the cart before the horse, so I don't mind getting annoyed about some things. If my cliches bother you, please feel free to be annoyed. Grin

Regarding ACIM versus CWG, pages 50-51 of the first book of CWG says:

Whoever: "All attack is a call for help.

Walsch: "I read that in A Course in Miracles.

Whoever: "I put it there."

Walsch: "Boy, You have an answer for everything."

From page 100 of the 3rd volume of CWG:

Walsch" "What are you saying?"

Whoever: "I'm saying what I said through Judith Schucman (the book says Judith rather than Helen) in A Course in Miracles: You teach what you have to learn."

The above words suggest that God had something to do with ACIM. This is kind of odd because despite what some people such as myself believe about ACIM, if you go by the course's own words God doesn't have anything to do with this World. At most, he would have the holy spirit interact with it. The course itself speaks as if it comes from Jesus.

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