Speaking only from my experience and understanding, I would say most likely any medium at any given time is not in contact with a person's deceased loved one even though genuine contact of a recently deceased person may be entirely possible, just unlikely.  Any information gleaned most likely comes from what Don calls ESP and/or what I think of as being in contact with memory held within the larger consciousness system... a database of past history and/or future probabilities of someone and/or an event.  In my opinion thought is non-physical and actually arises from feeling.  It's not a product of the brain, instead it is a stream of consciousness or information that is in a sense "fed" to us and filtered through the brain to give us the impression of being an individual consciousness separated from the whole of consciousness.  There is great purpose in this, but that's for another thread.

I think the biggest problem anyone faces in trying to gather scientific evidence to show the existence of an afterlife is that very few of us, if any, truly understands what non-physical realities are like.  The only thing we know is the physics of the world we live in, the laws this reality is governed by.  We tend to project our ideas onto what a non-physical reality is like because that's all we know and we thereby create belief systems.  However, for those that have been able to explore the non-physical realities after a while you realize that it is next to impossible to describe these without interjecting physical "type" physics where none actually exists.  It is much, much easier to describe what a non-physical reality is not like, rather than describe what it is like.

Asking questions like "What have you been doing since your death six months ago." is incompatible to the person/individualized consciousness that was known to exist previous to their physical death. That person, that individualized consciousness no longer exists as those in the physical world once knew them.  They have changed and moved on to a different reality with different laws that govern their being.  They are not the same as they were, therefore those types of questions are irrelevant.  Yet, the life they lived in this world, the interactions they had, the events that occurred remain in the memory/database of the consciousness system.  After our death the life we lived becomes more like a dream we had.  Much of it fades from conscious memory because we've changed and moved on to a completely different governing process.  If that change doesn't occur then that person is probably stuck and in need of retrieval.

It is only our needy ego and the fear behind it that drives us to believe in "genuine contact" from a medium/physic or something outside of our self. If we truly want to know, not simply believe, then the only way to know is to begin by exploring our own inner being, our own consciousness, which originates from the spiritual/non-physical in which we are never separated from.  Meditation and the hypnagogic, the state between sleep and wakefulness are the best ways I know of and there are many modalities to get there as Matthew mentioned, such as Bruce's methods, TMI, as well as others.  Contact from the non-physical can and does take place in many ways.  Being open, yet skeptical will help with the discernment process.  Perhaps the most difficult to remember is to not impose the laws of this world onto that which is not this world.

Kathy

Don-

One essential point that ES stressed: the afterlife is full of deception.  He cautioned other potential explorers to be very careful (in fact I think he advised against) in exploring the afterlife for this reason.

As an aside, this also raises concerns about the messages from mediums, not to mention fooling around with the ouija board.

Do you recall if ES acknowledged whether any information he himself obtained might very well have been compromised from deceptive sources?

R

Rondele,

Remember, that ES learns by direct experience that when discarnate humans merge with our spirits, the untrained cannot recognize this, and the memories of the merging spirit are experienced as if they are one's own memories from a prior lifetime.  ES's experiences with negative discarnate humans prompt him to offer this warning:

"When spirits begin to speak, care should be taken not to believe them; for nearly everything they say is made up by them...They love to pretend, and if a man listens and believes, they become insistent, and in various ways deceive and seduce."

I gleaned this quote from the internet site, which quoted from ES's "Miscellaneous Theological Works."  I'll try to track down more relevant quotes.

Hi,

I know very little about Swedenborg, can anyone recommend a good starting point book about/by him ? I think I need to know more about this man whose work seems so influential.

D

Don, yes I do think a genuine medium/psychic is either as you mention reading discarnate minds without the deceased person's awareness, or could be connecting to memory held within a database.  Could also be interacting with a helpful guide, a playful and/or deceitful spirit or could be actually connecting with the deceased person though I think this to be the least likely.  My point in regards to the questions we ask was that a deceased loved one that has moved on most likely can no longer identify with the meaning of such questions and therefore would become confused, unable to answer.  Same for those "descending" to a different plane/reality as you mentioned with RB's comments. 

There are numerous, even countless planes or realities and as a being moves within these that being's conscious reality as well as its "beingness" changes because the governing physics of each reality can be quite different.  Existing in another reality is different than what we would ordinarily think.  For example, if here on earth we move to a different country we may be living in a different culture that is unfamiliar to us, yet we are still existing within the same physics/laws of the earth reality.  We remember, perhaps even long for home, our friends and loved ones.  We don't forget because the earth plane/reality is where our consciousness exists. It's what we know, what we identify with.  A being existing on one plane/reality consciously exists within that world and that is what is known to that being.  When no longer existing within that reality, under that particular set of governing rules/laws that being has for lack of a better way to explain, become deceased in that reality and is no longer subject to it... again memory of it fades and the being progresses to perhaps exist consciously within another different reality.

I think God allows the consciousness system as well as all individualized consciousness to be as they will be.  In other words, I don't think it is God whom restricts or restrains us.  I think the laws/rules/constraints of realities/planes of existence are simply one of the aspects in the process of consciousness evolution and yes, perhaps in that we are a part of this system these limitations could be in a sense self-imposed. Hopefully we are all evolving, growing spiritually toward more awareness and understanding.  Though I don't think it is possible to know and completely understand everything, it may be a copout as you say to simply accept the position that we are not meant to know certain things.  Isn't it our desire to know and understand that fuels us toward betterment?  Well, I guess that depends upon our intent, but I get what you're saying.

I don't want to get off on a tangent here, but I find it really annoying when someone says... it's God's will.  Granted believing and accepting a situation occurs by believing something is meant to be, however, it also lays responsibility on God rather than taking responsibility for oneself and one's own participation in the situation.  More and more I think God allows us to be as we will be.  We have the inherent ability to choose, so why would God restrict that in any way?

Well Don, if you ever find a new and improved ES, please do let me know!

Kathy

Thanks Mathew I'll try to get up to speed on Swedenborg.

D

Regarding whether some mediums contact the deceased loved ones of the people they try to help, I figure the below possibilities exists. One possibility doesn't become invalid simply because another exists.

1. Some mediums are frauds.

2. Some mediums receive information telepathicially from the people they try to help.

3. Some mediums receive information from the place where memories reside, as suggested by Lights of Love.

4. Some mediums receive information from their higher selves, or the higher selves of the people they  try to help, or another higher level of being, or some combination.

5. Some mediums receive information from the deceased people they say they receive it from.

6. Some mediums do some combination of 2 through 5.

7. Some mediums receive information from deceptive spirits.

Perhaps it is inaccurate to say that only one of the above is true because of what a few sample cases have shown.

It is also important to consider after death communication cases as shown on the below links. If these people can make contact with actual deceased loved ones, then perhaps some mediums can also do so.

http://www.adcrf.org/

http://www.after-death.com/