Conversation Board - My Feelings on the Condemnation of AL Sources

Seraphis1

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Re: My Feelings on the Condemnation of AL Sources
Reply #75 - Apr 16^th, 2011 at 11:11am

Hi b2: Spoken (opps I mean written) like a true observer.

S.

Quote:

Life is an experiment in self-expression, not always a 'safe' and 'cozy' place. So we must reinvent ourselves over and over to adapt to what we cannot change. Which does not necessarily mean we must 'ignore' what we cannot change. But Bruce Moen's advice in places of personal conflict during meditation is, I find, a good one to practice at other times as well. To 'see it not there' is not actually 'putting the blinders on' but placing oneself in the center of a prayer of intent. What would you have 'in its place' is the question. Something, nothing? To recognize choices is a pause, is a pause and then a step in the 'right' direction. What is right for you? Do you wish to participate, or not? It is always a choice. Sometimes, for me, this results in a sense of 'unreality', a sense that life is so slippery, a sense that I don't actually 'know' what is real. And this leaves room for my imagination to grow. I suspect that is good for me, so my feelings are of gratitude. I respect and am grateful for you all, with all of your colors and sentiments. It is all good. Love to you all.

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Seraphis1

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Re: My Feelings on the Condemnation of AL Sources
Reply #76 - Apr 17^th, 2011 at 9:11am

recoverer wrote on Apr 13^th, 2011 at 4:30pm:

Seraphis asked: What are the errors(of ACIM)?

1. It has too much of an all or nothing approach. It makes statements that make it seem as if there is no point in trying to overcome specific limited patterns of mind because until you undo the supposed separation, it won't matter. I have found that the more I have dealt with specific limiting thought patterns the more I've grown spiritually.

I accidentally stumbled in the material below:

recoverer you got ACIM all wrong… you mixed it up with spiritual paths which are designed to guide one toward enlightenment… the following from a ACIM practicianer states the primary goal of ACIM is like AA… it is designed for recovering addicts, alcoholics etc…

[b]One way is through what's called A Course In Miracles. The course itself, contains three parts: The Text, The Workbook, and the Teacher's Manual.
The part that I recommend is the workbook. It has been highly recommended by David Hawkins and many others as the path to healing addictions, physical disease, and many other mental and emotional disorders. [/b]

You overstated Hawkins connection to ACIM and what ACIM is
supposed to do… you should get your facts straight.

S.

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recoverer

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Re: My Feelings on the Condemnation of AL Sources
Reply #77 - Apr 17^th, 2011 at 1:53pm

If people want to get their facts straight about ACIM, i recommend they try to make contact with Christ and find out from him.

Seraphis1 wrote on Apr 17^th, 2011 at 9:11am:

recoverer wrote on Apr 13^th, 2011 at 4:30pm:

Seraphis asked: What are the errors(of ACIM)?

1. It has too much of an all or nothing approach. It makes statements that make it seem as if there is no point in trying to overcome specific limited patterns of mind because until you undo the supposed separation, it won't matter. I have found that the more I have dealt with specific limiting thought patterns the more I've grown spiritually.

I accidentally stumbled in the material below:

recoverer you got ACIM all wrong… you mixed it up with spiritual paths which are designed to guide one toward enlightenment… the following from a ACIM practicianer states the primary goal of ACIM is like AA… it is designed for recovering addicts, alcoholics etc…

[b]One way is through what's called A Course In Miracles. The course itself, contains three parts: The Text, The Workbook, and the Teacher's Manual.
The part that I recommend is the workbook. It has been highly recommended by David Hawkins and many others as the path to healing addictions, physical disease, and many other mental and emotional disorders. [/b]

You overstated Hawkins connection to ACIM and what ACIM is
supposed to do… you should get your facts straight.

S.

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Seraphis1

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Re: My Feelings on the Condemnation of AL Sources
Reply #78 - Apr 17^th, 2011 at 2:43pm

recoverer wrote on Apr 17^th, 2011 at 1:53pm:

If people want to get their facts straight about ACIM, i recommend they try to make contact with Christ and find out from him.

So now you are the direct link to Christ and we are not supposed to question what you say and take your 'personal known' as the only truth accepting it without regard to what the facts on the ground just because you said it. I see... do we have to prostrate ourselves and bow three times toward your post before reading it.

Just wonderiing??

S.

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Beau

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Re: My Feelings on the Condemnation of AL Sources
Reply #79 - Apr 17^th, 2011 at 3:34pm

I don't think Albert is saying he has the market cornered on Christ, but I do think sometimes his wording can give that impression. It seems to me that we are all trying to reach the same or similar destinations but because we are all starting from different "places" we can only grow from what we feel are our personal truths or knowns. Its hard to talk about something like the afterlife and even morality without sounding like a know it all.

I am not a dualist (except perhaps in my weakest moments in the past when I would feel like everything is coming down on me and I'm willing to try anything). So the idea of something beyond myself somehow saving me is a hard pill to swallow because I don't see how it aids my growth...but certainly I have been wrong before and I will take my licks like a human being if I've made a mistake along the way.

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All the world's a stage...whose stage?--that is the question!...or is it the answer...Who is on first.

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recoverer

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Re: My Feelings on the Condemnation of AL Sources
Reply #80 - Apr 17^th, 2011 at 5:49pm

No, I suggested that people can try to find out about ACIM by asking Christ himself, which is quite a different thing than taking my word for it. I'm not the only person who has made contact with Christ.

Since "some" people claim that ACIM comes from Christ, I believe it is fair and reasonable to ask him if it actually does.

Seraphis1 wrote on Apr 17^th, 2011 at 2:43pm:

recoverer wrote on Apr 17^th, 2011 at 1:53pm:

If people want to get their facts straight about ACIM, i recommend they try to make contact with Christ and find out from him.

So now you are the direct link to Christ and we are not supposed to question what you say and take your 'personal known' as the only truth accepting it without regard to what the facts on the ground just because you said it. I see... do we have to prostrate ourselves and bow three times toward your post before reading it.

Just wonderiing??

S.

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recoverer

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Re: My Feelings on the Condemnation of AL Sources
Reply #81 - Apr 17^th, 2011 at 5:50pm

Thank you Beau.

Beau wrote on Apr 17^th, 2011 at 3:34pm:

I don't think Albert is saying he has the market cornered on Christ, but I do think sometimes his wording can give that impression. It seems to me that we are all trying to reach the same or similar destinations but because we are all starting from different "places" we can only grow from what we feel are our personal truths or knowns. Its hard to talk about something like the afterlife and even morality without sounding like a know it all.

I am not a dualist (except perhaps in my weakest moments in the past when I would feel like everything is coming down on me and I'm willing to try anything). So the idea of something beyond myself somehow saving me is a hard pill to swallow because I don't see how it aids my growth...but certainly I have been wrong before and I will take my licks like a human being if I've made a mistake along the way.

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Volu

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Re: My Feelings on the Condemnation of AL Sources
Reply #82 - Apr 17^th, 2011 at 6:10pm

Seraphis1,
"I see... do we have to prostrate ourselves and bow three times toward your post before reading it."

Hey padawan, I've trademarked the usage of hyperbole on this site, and for that you may bow three times. Your service as an esteemed sideburn holder isn't quite over yet, so please don't trip while bowing, you'd look clumsy and I'd take the pain. http://tiny.cc/on2i5

As for the topic,
At some point during one's progression I think it's only fair to learn to listen to the inner voice and trust one's decisions. For one thing, there's nobody else to blame if one makes a poor decision, and victimhood turns out to be an equally poor excuse in that regard. Move on. There are so many whom in different degrees want one's power and will gladly tell one what to believe. I haven't been and isn't void of that sentiment, though I may feel like having good intentions while doing my thing. The one thing I do know is that one learns the basics before the advanced, and part of that learning does include mistakes. If one takes away the mistakes or room for making mistakes, there wouldn't be much to do on earth. One's mistake is another's ladder onto greatness.

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Beau

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Re: My Feelings on the Condemnation of AL Sources
Reply #83 - Apr 17^th, 2011 at 6:52pm

Yes, absolutely, the inner voice is what its all about. That is it on the head. I wonder if coming down too hard on someone's source (something they are using at a particular time) might not be counter productive to that person in the short run if not the long. Though some may find it hard to believe, I'm not suggesting that the opinion be stifled. I just think we could be less crushing and still be direct about how we see it.

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All the world's a stage...whose stage?--that is the question!...or is it the answer...Who is on first.

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Pat E. Full Member Offline Posts: 207 Northern California Gender:	Re: My Feelings on the Condemnation of AL Sources Reply #84 - Apr 18^th, 2011 at 1:50am Volu, "I've trademarked the usage of hyperbole on this site..." I'm glad to hear that. Thought for awhile you were specializing in meanness and mockery. Or are those just sidelines?
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Lucy

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Re: My Feelings on the Condemnation of AL Sources
Reply #85 - Apr 18^th, 2011 at 7:14am

Quote:

No, I suggested that people can try to find out about ACIM by asking Christ himself, which is quite a different thing than taking my word for it. I'm not the only person who has made contact with Christ.

but, recoverer, what if people do that and get different answers?

Who has the "right" answer and how can I tell that?

What if I think Jesus has spoken to me at times through ACIM?

Is this like that old TV show, What's My Line?

"And now, will the REAL Jesus Christ PLEASE STAND UP!"

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Seraphis1

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Re: My Feelings on the Condemnation of AL Sources
Reply #86 - Apr 18^th, 2011 at 7:24am

Lucy wrote on Apr 18^th, 2011 at 7:14am:

Quote:

No, I suggested that people can try to find out about ACIM by asking Christ himself, which is quite a different thing than taking my word for it. I'm not the only person who has made contact with Christ.

but, recoverer, what if people do that and get different answers?

Who has the "right" answer and how can I tell that?

What if I think Jesus has spoken to me at times through ACIM?

Is this like that old TV show, What's My Line?

"And now, will the REAL Jesus Christ PLEASE STAND UP!"

Precisely!!

S.

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Volu

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Re: My Feelings on the Condemnation of AL Sources
Reply #87 - Apr 18^th, 2011 at 1:01pm

Pat,

"I'm glad to hear that. Thought for awhile you were specializing in meanness and mockery. Or are those just sidelines?"

No sidelines, it's pure meanness and mockery a.k.a PMS, not to be confused with basketball or blood. The honey of guilt is oh so sweet, but you've got to work on your sting little bee, because it doesn't hurt a bit. Cry

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recoverer

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Re: My Feelings on the Condemnation of AL Sources
Reply #88 - Apr 18^th, 2011 at 4:35pm

Lucy:

If people receive different answers, it would probably be because they receive answers from beings that have differing natures .

I trust the beings I receive messages from because their energy feels like love, peace, expansiveness and divinity. Also, if you receive a sufficient number of messages from a being (or beings) and consider how they are delivered and what is said, you will be able to tell that such beings represent something very positive.

I do not believe that beings of a like-mind will answer differently about ACIM. Instead, they will strive to tell the truth. If they don't know the answer, they won't say anything, rather than make something up.

I believe it is a mistake to set things up so we can't get definite answers that can't be trusted.

The only way to tell if it's possible to make contact with spirit beings you know you can trust, is to communicate with them on a regular basis over an extended period of time, and see how it goes.

Perhaps it is significant that even though I am very conscious of all of the frauds that exist, I was still able to make contact with spirit beings I can trust. This shows that I'm not a complete cynic.

Lucy wrote on Apr 18^th, 2011 at 7:14am:

Quote:

No, I suggested that people can try to find out about ACIM by asking Christ himself, which is quite a different thing than taking my word for it. I'm not the only person who has made contact with Christ.

but, recoverer, what if people do that and get different answers?

Who has the "right" answer and how can I tell that?

What if I think Jesus has spoken to me at times through ACIM?

Is this like that old TV show, What's My Line?

"And now, will the REAL Jesus Christ PLEASE STAND UP!"

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Justin aka Vasya

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Re: My Feelings on the Condemnation of AL Sources
Reply #89 - Apr 23^rd, 2011 at 11:32am

Hi Lucy,

To be fair and honest, i have spoken critically about a few sources here over the years. For the most part, with the exception of R.B., the sources i've spoken critically about are ones i've had experience with and/or my guidance has pointed out red flags in relation to.

RE: Recoverer. I have perhaps the unique position and perspective here of having spent some time hanging out in physical with him. I'm a pretty sensitive person and sometimes pick up on vibes etc. over the I-net, but especially so when spending some inphysical time with a person.

I found Albert to be a gentle and loving personality. Like with Bruce Moen, despite their very different styles, i've received positive messages from guidance about him. One possibly even saying that he is even more intune than Bruce.

So, because of this and because i consider him a friend, i speak well of him. If i had to offer a criticism of him, it would only be that at times he has tendencies towards fixity.

You mention Don and seem to compare the situations somewhat. My perspective and perception is that these are very different because Don would sometimes personally put down and criticize the folks on the board to "get his message across".

I don't find that Recoverer does this and so i see a big difference between the two. He keeps it impersonal and speaks mostly about the source or issue at hand rather than the individuals who believe in or promote same.

Re: Christianity etc. and the question of why would i care if anyone bashes it on this site. First off, i would agree with you, there doesn't seem to be much Christ in a lot of organized Christian religions (except maybe Unitarian).
I don't personally care one way or the other if a person criticizes or bashes Christianity. That was not my point, but in the context of people complaining about people speaking critically about sources and belief system, that it's not fair to only point fingers to some and not to others. If people have a problem with that then they should be speaking up for ALL belief systems and approaches.

I personally don't have a problem with people speaking critically about sources and beliefs, even those i personally believe in. Again, i only mentioned Christianity in the specific context of pointing out the hypocrisy with speaking out against criticism of beliefs and outer sources in some cases but not in others.

Lucy wrote on Apr 14^th, 2011 at 5:37am:

Justin

I missed the posts where you said something that tied you in with recoverer. I don't think your posts are the ones that have driven people from this site or caused people to not post experiences here. I don't always agree with what you say or with your tone but I think you are pretty mild-mannered. I do recall seeing recoverer write something about the two of you trying to warn people about some of the things that are posted here. yeah I should go back and find it but it takes a lot of time.

every time certain topics come up recoverer jumps in and puts down the source. If you do that I missed it but that kind of behavior creates a situation that is undesirable, to me anyway. Our friend Don used to do the same thing. People left this board because of that.

Christianity and I have a complex relationship. Sometimes it is a mistake to use the same word for so many things. We need as many words for Christianity as the Eskimos have for snow.

Organized religion I can do without, across the board. I think organized religion is crowd control. Often is I use the word Christianity it is wrt organized religion. I hestitate to criticize organized religion in many circumstances, 1 because it makes me unpopular ! and 2 because people turn to the other people in their religious communities in times of need and I don't want to mess with that.

beyond that, I think the whole institution is fair game and we don't have time now for all my ideas on that! I am an ex-Christian and that is worse than an ex-smoker! I don't think there's much Christ in Christianity and as such it ought to be marginalized.

I understand you have a personal relationship with a spirit you identify as Christ. I can't argue with that. I can't argue with anyone's personal experience. and You are pretty independent and I don't think you would feel comfortable with someone asuming that you fit any one of several "Christian" molds because of that. And if it is truly holy and true, I can't do anything to damage your relationship because by definition, if it is true, I can't make it not true. So what do you care if I bash Christianity?

I'm going around in circles in my mind trying to discern some underlying disagrement we are all having here.

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