Vicky,

Vicky wrote on Jan 7^th, 2011 at 2:34pm:


No, it all took place while she was asleep and there was no conscious memory of the events.

I am not sure where the idea to form the mirror came from but I've seen this sort of assistance from Helpers come to me before.

Bruce

Spooky,

spooky2 wrote on Jan 9^th, 2011 at 10:05am:


Thanks, I hadn't thought about it the way you describe it but you are right.  It was only by reacting (reflecting) attention toward the Aspect that communication was initiated.  And that was the key the whole retrieval.  Observing Ernie's more whole self injecting thoughts into his Aspects awareness to guide the retrieval was fascinating.

Bruce

Bruce Moen wrote on Jan 11^th, 2011 at 5:15am:


Hi: How did Ernie know to retrieve this sliver of himself?

S.

Hi, Bruce.
Glad to see you on the board with a new and very interesting retrieval. Could you explain better the concept of "fragments"? Can't recall if you talk about it in your books.
Thank you very much.
Claudio

Hi Calypso,

Most accounts of NDEs, and communications via other means show that our loved ones often meet us when we die, and have an unbreakable bond with us, that transcends death and spiritual advancement.  Time and again, I have seen the notion of "grace," the idea that we are permitted these reunions with our loved ones at least for a time, through a certain code of God and the universe.  After a settling in time, after we die, it appears we pursue our true love, and move on, as do our loved ones.

Also, please keep in mind that much of what is posted on this board are people's own experiences or knowledge.  These experiences are interpreted as best they can be by their "interpretors" to make sense of what they have encountered.  Its all a matter of perspective.  We do our best to make sense of it all.

However, the idea that your dad, and all of us are splintered into many fragments, and that you would not recognize him on reuniting is both horrifying, and not at all supported by what is out there in the literature.

We get so involved in conversation on the board, but don't forget that it is all conjecture.  Do most of us have thought form fragments spun off that need to be collected?  I don't know, but I don't think so.  I think for certain people with fear and traumatic experiences, they may carry a hindering belief or "block" with them that may, at times be visible to an adept such as Bruce as a separate thought form.

My feeling is that for most of us, the life review allows us to absorb emotional issues better and come out more aware and more loving afterward.  Most of us can process these emotions without putting up such a large psychic block to spin off a thought form that acts like we do. 

There is an "I" that travels with each of us throughout our journey in the physical world.  If we have suffered, loved, laughed or cried, this "I" goes through it, changing and evolving but still there.  I think therefore I am - the one proof Descartes came up with when he used reason to get at life's most basic question.

Spooky talks of embedding our little experiences in our whole being, and that being is really embedded into a bigger being (God and the universe).  This is at the heart of the nature of the unity of all things. 

When we choose to separate ourselves from God and others, we dive into the physical plane and are born into flesh.  Many religions and people consider this to be a self imposed illusion; one that dissolves when we stop acting out of selfishness and ego, and embrace love. 

For myself, my intuition tells me that spun off thought forms that must be hunted down, are not the rule of our afterlife existence but may happen for some people who suffer from emotional trauma and blocks. 

Matthew

Hello Bruce,

We have not spoken before.

Regarding reply #16.
I find it interesting that Rosalie had no recollection of witnessing and involvement in such an event. Nearly every out-of-body experience I had in which my wife was involved in, she recalled the experience as a dream, often right down to fine details. Other people too, whom I have met out of body have remembered it as a dream - although I have never let on to others, as I did with my wife, that I was there in reality and though it was a dream for them, it was not for me. Sometimes, even though dreams may not have been mentioned, I have hinted at the subject matter of the oob conversations and been amused as they say the same sentences as they did when oob the previous night. Sometimes they don't need prompting, they just bring up the subjectmatter and say much the same as what they said in the night.

If I were to have what I was sure was an out of body experience, and another person was present whom I know in daily life, and if they remembered none of it and showed no sign in their conversation of connection with it, then I would have some self doubt, either about the reality of the trip or about the reality of the other person's real presence in it.

I am not suggesting your experience was a fancyful dream or delusion, although I do allow for that possibility, for even if it was me I would allow for that possibility, but I do wonder if you questioned her about it fairly soon afterwards, such as the next morning or day. Also, does she remember her dreams? If she generally doesn't, then maybe that explains it. Another possibility I thought of - perhaps it wasn't her. Perhaps it was someone else (assistant/helper) presenting him/her self as her for ease of facilitating the event and minimising distractions. I do think this occurs sometimes. Or may it have been someone else, but you saw them as her, through your own expectations. Or, although the event may have been real, her presence in it was a projection of your own imagination?

I am certainly not casting doubt upon you here; just throwing ideas around as I would to myself if I had had a similar experience.

Another possibility just occured to me. Perhaps a lacking of that type of experience, where others have not remembered, is mine. Perhaps I have not had enough oob experiences where other persons present in it have shown no indication in daily life of connection with it. I don't know how I would treat such experiences if they were common for me. Perhaps I would doubt it all.  Perhaps I am fortunate to have experienced what I needed to stay faithful to myself.

Just thoughts.

Crossbow,

I haven't had very many OOBEs in my life, perhaps five or ten at most.  I was never able to develop the ability to do OOBEs at will.  The method I typically use is just to shift my focus of attention to the area of consciousness I intend to visit or work in.  That is what I did in this retrieval. 

There have been experiences in which other physical folks have been aware of my presence but these are far out numbered by experiences in which they have not.  Also, there have been a number of experiences in which others were aware of me but I was not aware of them or our activities together.

During Partnered Exploring sessions it is quite common for mutal awareness on the part of paticipating physical folks.  The awareness of each other and of each others activities in this exploration technique is often a source of mutual validation of nonphysical experiences.  But in partnered exploring the nonphysical meetings are a planned part of the technique so it comes as no surprise that they occur.  Validation comes, as with your OOBE through memory of the details of mutual experience.

All of this into account, in my experience memory of mutual nonphysical actiivities as you describe is only sometimes available as a means of validation.   More often valdation comes through information gathered from the deceased person.

Even if Rosalie had remembered the mutual experience in great detail that could only validate that she and I were present within an experience.  It could not validate that a retriieval of the man's fragment actually took place as this could have been a mutually shared, or created, fantasy.

In the case with Rosalie described above the only way that might validate the retrieval portion of the experience will be if the man's fragment no longer wanders through her condo.

If validation was a goal of this experience my way of obtaining it would have been to ask the man's more whole self to show me, tell me or give me something as proof the experience was real.  It would have to be something I had absolutely no way of knowing except by way of communicatiion with the deceased man.  Even that isn't necessarily "proof" but it can be very strong evidence.

Bruce