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Exploring the Hypnagogic State (Read 16959 times)
moonsandjunes
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Re: Exploring the Hypnagogic State
Reply #15 - May 6th, 2009 at 2:47am
 
Why is the hypnagogic state so powerful?  
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Just a few notes: Loss of the distraction of the body. The body is supremely comfortable to the point of the mind's loss of awareness of it, for the most part. This gives more power to the mind. It also allows the mind to slip into an 'accepting' state. This 'accepting' state is very powerful.


Why can we not accomplish the same communications or manifestations of intent in our everyday lives with our waking thoughts?
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I think we can, if we are alert to our state of mind in our everyday lives, and if we have enough peace and quiet (or can vividly remember our training, through repetition). It is interesting to me that so many 'spiritual' people insist on smoking. Well, it does put one into a very relaxed state. Chanting and other behaviors bring us into this kind of alignment, also, in my mind. The key is the 'disappearance' of the body -- immersion, I guess.


But what is this collective unconcsious we impress our beliefs onto?  
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It almost feels like the intention is like an iron and our lives are like the clothing. We can iron the clothes so that they are smooth and neat....or we can iron the clothes so that they are rumpled and scorched. It is a skill to develop. The cloth is life itself, the fabric of our lives, which are connected to many other people and creatures and to our actual environment.


Why does it respond to our intent?  
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I want to say something silly. But that's what came into my mind, seriously, it is.

Because it is there.
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spooky2
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Re: Exploring the Hypnagogic State
Reply #16 - May 6th, 2009 at 9:22pm
 
Bets' post arises the question what kind of consciousness-states should be called "hypnagogic" at all.

What I have thought of when I read the term is "at the edge of sleep". This formulation says what it is (at least to an untrained): A very fragile in-between state, hard to control. The thinking switches from words to impressions, and can very quickly become dreaming, or something "important" enters your mind and you wake up from that in-between-state. This, for me, is as well the state when I won't be able to sit on a simple chair as my body (head) would nod off.

This above state now seems not to be necessary for making such trips as taught by TMI or Bruce. Bruce suggests to sit on a chair while focusing on nonphysical territory, and he wrote about retrievals he did while active in the physical. And in classical meditation you sit upright, you can't do it when your body falls asleep.

So, what is it, should we call it two states of different nature, or call it more or less one state with different "depths" and/or different degrees of focusation?

Spooky
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"I'm going where the pavement turns to sand"&&Neil Young, "Thrasher"
 
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Lucy
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Re: Exploring the Hypnagogic State
Reply #17 - May 8th, 2009 at 10:54am
 
Is "hypnagogic" one of the states we transition through as we move away from body-centered conciousness?

Like

C1 -> day-dreaming -> hypnagogic -> ? then what? sleep? OOBE? maybe it branches?

I was dreaming right before waking the other day, and I think the radio alarm had come on, and I think I incorproated some of what I heard into my dream. Does that indicate we move back through the hypnagogic state to fully waking?
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betson
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Re: Exploring the Hypnagogic State
Reply #18 - May 8th, 2009 at 2:00pm
 
Hi Lucy,

When we move back into wakefulness, science calls it hypnapompic (sic?)--cute sound! I don't understand why it needs it's own word, but it is also a recognized state of mind.

I've never heard of people controlling/ using that state.  It must be headed the wrong way.

Your series looks right to me. Just take out 'then what' and the question marks  Smiley Your 'then what' is the stage at which the choice is made to sleep or go into another realm so it's a forked branch there.

Bets
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There are more things in heaven and earth, Horatio,
Than are dreamt of in your philosophy.
Shakespeare
 
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Lucy
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Re: Exploring the Hypnagogic State
Reply #19 - May 9th, 2009 at 9:31pm
 
Bets! Thanks. I don't recall reading about that, and that's an old term. Wiki claims Frederick Meyers coined the term. That was a while ago.

I assume someone has some brainwave traces to support the idea that the two states are very different.

Hmm this bears further reading. Though the claims that are made don't make sense to me because I can't experientially distinguish the differences they claim are there.
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banana
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Re: Exploring the Hypnagogic State
Reply #20 - May 11th, 2009 at 2:47pm
 
My brother came to me two more times in the hypnagogic stage.Once last night and again two nights ago. Again I am slipping into sleep just about to "click out" and he comes and moves the bed ,touches my shoulders, moves the covers or makes his presence known. I have tried with the methods of Dr.Raymond Moody and his mirror gazing to get into the hypnagogic state in the middle of the day and hopefully have the same thing happen but I have struck out. I have fought when I am slipping into sleep to control that moment to be able to wait to see but I can't and I almost think he is trying to help me mantain it....maybe to have an OBE? Its so hard to have control to be in that moment!!!!!!I have had 5 Twilight experiences since March 13 or Hypnagogic experiences. I have just ordered Bruces books to figure out what to do next.
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Berserk2
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Re: Exploring the Hypnagogic State
Reply #21 - May 11th, 2009 at 6:55pm
 
In his experiments with nitrous oxide, psychologist William James came to this conclusion: our consciousness is divided into thin layers, each its own feeling tone and function.  He called for exploration of each level to shed light on this hidden potential.  I suspect that evidence that tends to refute the genuineness of contact with astral worlds arises from our inability to identify and determine which level of consciousness is generating our experiences on a given occasion.  The deception of spirit impersonators should not be blamed for all the astral errors of adepts like Robert Monroe, Robert Bruce, and Emanuel Swedenborg; these adepts probably operate on an oversimplified model of the levels of consciousness they are experiencing.  

We need to drop the New Age doctrine of "the higher self" and replace it with the more modest and neutral notion of the hidden self yet to be discovered.  In my view, the imagination operates at several unconscious levels that do not involve actual spiritual dimensions.  Failure to recognize this leads to erroneous descriptions of afterlife realms and beings.  I wonder whether the transition from waking to sleeping or vice versa takes us through a transitional level of consciousness that is more conducive to spirit contact than either waking or sleeping.  Perhaps, ES stumbled on to this transitional level and learned to stay in it through trial and error.

Some of my bizarre waking experiences make me wonder about this transional level of consciousness.  I am often awakened by loud psychic knocks, a loud voice calling my name, and by a whirling sensation as if my soul ins re-entering my body through some spin cycle akin to a washing machine.  Last night, I was awakened by the sound of my car's horn honking repeatedly and at first I attributed this to some annoying mechanical malfunction that woke up my neighbors!  But as I regained consciousness, the knocking stopped and I realized it was all in my mind--or was it?   I certainly would never deliberately wake myself up in these bizarre ways.  Am I experiencing mischief built into my hidden unconsicous self (not my higher self!)?  Or are passing spirits making sport of me or trying to contact me?  At this point, the more mundane interpretation seems more plausible.

Don
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Lights of Love
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Re: Exploring the Hypnagogic State
Reply #22 - May 11th, 2009 at 8:01pm
 
Quote:
We need to drop the New Age doctrine of "the higher self" and replace it with the more modest and neutral notion of the hidden self yet to be discovered.


Hidden self... yes I like that. It's certainly seems a more appropriate description.

I've also yet to figure the noisy knocking, voices, etc. that I hear sometimes, too. Maybe the system of consciousness is simply trying to let us know more exists than what we ordinary think.

K
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Tread softly through life with a tender heart and a gentle, understanding spirit.
 
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recoverer
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Re: Exploring the Hypnagogic State
Reply #23 - May 11th, 2009 at 8:10pm
 
Year's ago before I found out about the higher self viewpoint, I took nitrous oxide while at the dentist, and I felt as if I was aware of another bigger me I'm not usually aware of. It was very curious...at the time.



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recoverer
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Re: Exploring the Hypnagogic State
Reply #24 - May 12th, 2009 at 12:20pm
 
Here's another thought:

If for the purpose of learning we're all taking part in a big holographic projection that is more than visual, perhaps some of us play the roles of disks, some of play the role of disk projections, some of us play the role of other things; and these things are just learning vehicles just as our bodies are learning vehicles, and what we are is quite beyond any of the learning vehicles.
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« Last Edit: May 12th, 2009 at 7:32pm by recoverer »  
 
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