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God, no God? (Read 6413 times)
hawkeye
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God, no God?
Oct 16th, 2008 at 1:33pm
 
While rereading Ultimate Journey I came across Monroe's idea that there is no God, but better put as a Creator. This is by far closer to what I personally believe. Some of Monroe's knowns became...
This, our Creator:
-is beyond our comprehension as long as we remain human
-is the designer of the ongoing process of which we are a part
-has a purpose for such action beyond our ability to understand
-makes adjustments, fine tuning, in this process as needed
-establishes simple laws that apply to everyone and everything
-does not demand worship, adoration, or recognition
-does not punish for "evil" and "misdeeds"
-does not intercede or interdict in our life activity

Bob truly became to understand truth. No "hells" beyond what you create for yourself. No judgment before higher being. Only before yourself. Many people who come to this site may not be getting it. To me its as obvious as the nose on you face. I think that is one of the reasons I mention my problem with organised religions on a number of occasions. There is nothing wrong with an organised method of doing good but no need to live in fear of a Almighty God, who was developed in order to control the masses through fear and intimidation. Do what I say or go to hell. What dung. Isn't time to change our overview of the whole religious indoctrinations and what our real purpose is in having the opportunity to live within physical reality?
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betson
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Re: God, no God?
Reply #1 - Oct 17th, 2008 at 1:12am
 
I agree, but it will sound like I don't.

I think Creator is the Ultimate. But there may be tiers of life in the spiritual realms, and some of these tiers may have God - attributes.
But humans would rarely interact with these higher tiers. In general we are much too bound up in our personal lives.

Does that fit what you're saying at all?

Betson
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There are more things in heaven and earth, Horatio,
Than are dreamt of in your philosophy.
Shakespeare
 
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hawkeye
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Re: God, no God?
Reply #2 - Oct 17th, 2008 at 12:24pm
 
Very much so. "God ..attributes" is an excellent way of putting it. When other parts of myself evolve throughout my existence, parts of me will, and have most likely, become advanced enough to have some attributes with a god like overture. That by no means means I think of myself as a God. Only that parts of myself are preparing to return to my creator and have learned enough through physical life existence to bring home whats necessary of me. The God I am looking to compleat is of myself. Not of an organised religion. That, in my view, is what these organised religions are attempting to replicate. Parts that are missing of ourselves. Processes we have not completed and lessons not yet understood or learned. Good ,bad, effect, cause, yeng, yang, give, take, sacrifice, etc., you get the idea. Once we have learned what is needed in order to be whole, that is to say the sum of ourselves, we will move on to become a part of our creator. Only once all the parts are home will a real transformation take place. And then again repeated upon the return to the creator for that part to become whole. There is much work to be done and if Bob is correct, less than a thousand some odd years in which to compleat it.
Joe
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recoverer
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Re: God, no God?
Reply #3 - Oct 17th, 2008 at 5:34pm
 
What Robert wrote is fine, but don't count your chickens before they hatch. Until people/spirits reach their spiritual goal, life can be quite tough.

Lower realms don't exist because a higher level being passes judgement. They exist because some people develop a mindset that causes them to end up in a lower realm.
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LaffingRain
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Re: God, no God?
Reply #4 - Oct 20th, 2008 at 7:17pm
 
I'm re-reading Ultimate Journey myself right now. found it coincidental? Joe is commenting on this book. I'll have more to add later I'm sure.

I'm not quite finished with Robert's biography, but from it I got a glimpse at Robert's difficulties during the process of producing hemisync and TMI. lot of relationship trials therein. just like the rest of us. it only makes me respect his work more.
Monroe in no way implies life is either tough or easy, to take this journey of exploration of consciousness is one of the toughest jobs that I  know of because such a small percentage of the overall population even give credence to this type of exploration.
so he had to do most the work by himself, with the aide of his I/there urging him on when they could help.

In this book we see Bob discussing with his I/there that we have a great mix of beings here in ELS. some with no previous ELS experience. these might possible gravitate to religious areas as stepping stones, while others, well seasoned in ELS would be inclined away from religious constraints, having been there, done that.

it also appears we are very creative with mind stuff. We can quite efficiently create our own hellish life stations, and carry over these mind locales into the afterlife, because mind particles, stuff, is compliant to free will determination, and that is why we have something new now to concentrate on, doing retrievals.

that is where certain retrievers are trained to enter the hells and attempt  getting the attention of the residents, essentially breaking them loose of their self created surroundings. not forcing them to take a look at focus 27, however, just giving that option.

I used to go into the hells, but now my I/there told me I don't have to go there anymore. there's other retrievals I'm more suited for, to my relief. I have met some retrievers who are more suited for that climate, and I'm happy that retrievals are going on steadily at this time in the century.

love to you all, good post. I should be back. I think Monroe is taking an active interest in the board once more. Smiley
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hawkeye
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Re: God, no God?
Reply #5 - Oct 21st, 2008 at 12:36pm
 
I also think Bob's looking in. (At least a part of him.)  With the dung possibly about to hit the fan, a few loose ends need to be hauled in and secured, I would imagine. As it would seem that world tensions are on the increase yet again with fuel and food production, along with global warming at the forefront, making sure your spiritual beingness is in as good of order as possible I believe is important. Completing as many retrievals as possible can insure that more parts of yourself are getting freed up and moving. At the same time assisting others in moving forward also. When Bob speak of the future some 1000 years further on from now, there are far less bodies to use than we currently have at this point. Getting their best use while we have this time and this experience is important. Clear intention to recover other of your disk group is the order of my days. That includes my wife and family. That is connected family and those of my spiritual family. If by me projecting beliefs that release others, I love, from the burden of being possibly stuck in a BST then I feel it is important to do that. This is why in part I have brought up my concerns to some organised religions. (not all bad, not all good) By opening up others of my personal disk group to the possibility of more than religious doctrine could be of assistance in more freedom to them once they have passed over. It is important also to note that higher realms of the BST are better than some of the lower areas of the BST. So in my thoughts, it is far better to have a part of my group believing in a religious doctrine than that he/she would be stuck in some ideological hell. Freedom though love and openness.
I love Bob's and Bruce's book and re-read them time and time again. Each time getting more than the last.
Joe
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LaffingRain
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Re: God, no God?
Reply #6 - Oct 23rd, 2008 at 3:48pm
 
Hi Joe. I'm totally aligned with you in your philosophy and thank you for dropping into my email once to tell me it wasn't perhaps the right time for me to leave. you were right after all.
seems I've committed suicide through various natural and unnatural causes of death and enjoy doing disappearing acts here in ELS time after time, just because I have free will.
____

Quote from Monroe, page 222 Ultimate Journey: "even if it all can be replicated eventually, I would like to meet the Original Designer. Once.
____

me too. I'm in the same spot as Monroe. He did go home. He found what he called the Basic.
Having this basic premise, caused a major step up in his earthly endeavors, as well a joyfulness included, such joyful endeavor did not mean there would not be angst and problem solving to do the rest of his life here.
___

religion sucks, but like we've been discussing, religious concepts, those along the lines of dogmatism, they can be remodeled more into what true brotherhood means. when we were kids, we were taught Now I lay me down to sleep, I pray the Lord my soul to keep.."

amazingly enough, I still find myself praying the Lord will keep my soul. and so I will never attempt to change anyone's beliefs but my own. for I wouldn't want to take their prayer away from them and they would have nothing to believe in. I would be cruel to do so, and I love children. they are so much fresher than me!
_____

In Ultimate Journey, Monroe explains when he went after the basic, he came to the park area and experienced everything in a tangible, physical way, utilizing all 5 senses..he touched, sniffed, felt, seen and heard, all exactly as it is when in the body.
He then realized we humans had created this other level with our minds. this was part of the basic.

then I correlated this with an experience I'd had at 18. The problem is to move the mind away from imaging God (the original designer) away  from the image of a Fatherly figure sitting on a throne, bestowing either wrath or favors unto his children.) a tall order, but we are up to it. (with patience) anyhoo, I was driving along one day in my green 55 Plymouth, sort of whistling under my breath, that all was well, and that surely God loved me, one day in my 18th year.
I'd just secured a nice apt, and this car. I'd finally passed my drivers license. lol. a voice of wisdom was speaking softly to ruin my happiness mood. It said only this: God is not a kind fatherly figure in the sky..you're all on your own kiddo."

I started crying as I knew, this was my life, and I was certainly on my own and couldn't remember my prayers which consoled me as a child. although I was throwing out former past life conceptions of a God, I wondered of this voice, that would help me grow up and out of blind faith in God. I suspected I was now a brand new consciousness and life would either break me or make me.

I'm somewhere between the breaking and making part.  Smiley

I am so happy to read of Monroe's Journey who is so like a kindred spirit, that I must meet him someday and shake his hand.  Smiley
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... Who takes away death's sting deprives life of bitterness
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