just trying to make a rough summation so far; it appears to me, from viewing my retrievals mostly, that spiritual growth is equivalent to an open mind, or thinking outside the box of our collective rumifying.
(is that a word?)

Everytime I found someone to retrieve, I had to do my Jesus thing. I had to forgive them their errors, or sins, which produced a PUL generation, not from me, my part was just to get their attention, somebody was there, hey, I'm here. what's up? sort of like that, to say, you're in a boxed in area, come with me, if you don't like it, you can come back here as your free will is still yours. The act of understanding a stuck person is to accept them where they are right now, which is a place of being enclosed within their own view, maybe their confused, maybe someone killed them, maybe they did suicide, maybe their boat turned over on them and they were not quite prepared to meet their maker, had not conjectured there was a place to belong in the afterlife for them.
but everybody has a place to go, everybody belongs somewhere where they continue to evolve and learn who they are.

PUL is like declaring to those, you are a living being, you are in the universe, no matter where your head is, you have a right to be here. then this PUL thing, which is belonging to us all, and what I call God because it is good, then this PUL EXPANDS the mind, as well expands the senses so that they can be aware the helper is there, then the others can move this person to a better place to grow at.
usually with their own group or disc, as the disc members know what to say and do for the person.
the retriever just breaks through, the jail that certain beliefs and feelings associated with it, can get the human locked down, here or there.

there comes a time in our spiritual development when we need each other, and so we step up our growth pattern by asking to be used for the highest good to occur.
there's a certain period, it used to called to pray without ceasing. Nobody likes to pray anymore, so we can also call it to seek without stopping, the truth of who and what we are and what are our intentions on this planet?

If you find yourself always asking to be of service to life, is when things start rolling quicker for you.
what I do when I'm confused is so simple..but it works.

if I'm confused about anything I ask to be able to see it differently. (ACIM)

invaribably, it works, to see it differently is to walk in another's shoes. just one mile. then that's compassion and it changes the world.
Ian, God is All Of Us acting as one, for the best interests of all, beyond the ego which thinks it can do something.  Yet God is more than all of us. we don't know anything about God. when we admit this, then we have an open mind which drinks from the waters of life everlasting, our divine heritage.

Dead Preacher just popped up again. what a rascal! love to you all, keep your eye on the sparrow.

note later: yes thanks R, good thread so far. come back soon.

Ian: said: Just like quantum particles they presumably pop into existence with intention, and drop back to pure potential or void once 'nobody is looking'.
_____

this is a cool description of physics Ian. it says more about who we are than people can grasp.

I wish Dave was here again. I hope he's all right. He knows a lot about physics. Just to enhance from my perspective what you just said, let me try. it might be fun.

ok. hmm. how to say...do u remember or is this same experiment scientists did to split a molecule in half, or gee whiz, was it a proton?
anyway, whatever it was, we are made of this stuff within our cells which is people examining life force in cells.

Dave would probably say aggregate which aggravates me!  as I don't really know some of the words he uses.

moving right along, Einstein wanna be here....they took this miniscule thing only can be seen with a microscope and divided it. hard to do, as it kept wiggling I imagine.

  now there was one thing, and now it was two. they isolated each part to observe what was the reaction of each part to being split.

they found by observing one part, which direction it moved depended on WHO was observing it.
neither part reacted the same way, so the mind of the observer acted upon the molecule, according to the expectation of the individual?
anyway they got all excited that this thing responded to a human, but never in precisely the same way that the previous observer had observed.

then to top it off, the two halves "sensed" what each half was reacting to and moved according to how it's former "partner" had moved.

so if I can relate this, to the human mind, how we react to each other automatically sometimes without thinking about it, as we share this mirror capacity as human nature. it goes along with the mental collective areas we all share, as we are all so busy becoming our own person, yet we could all just be like one big cloud of humanity, and when we get back to our original starting place, we see and find our oneness, and how we broke apart, so to become more of ourselves.

ok, enough thinking! love, alysia

The understanding I have based on various experiences and various messages I received, for the most part spirits move on to a level that matches how much they are able to open up to love. Sometimes beliefs can intefere with such an opening.

One time this was revealed to me. Some of it isn't different than what people have heard/read before, some of it might be new.

1. Things are arranged in the spirit World so that for the most part a spirit will go to the place that matches its overall state of mind and energetic.

2. Once there, a spirit isn't able to leave until it seeks to progress to a higher level.

3. Sometimes such spirits will make an energetic connection to a person in the physical World when a person plays around with ouija boards, black magic etc.

4. These spirits need energy just as any spirit needs energy. Higher levels of existence send them energy that has a rejuvenating and cleansing effect according to what they can handle.  This can take place without a spirit realizing that the energy it receives has such an effect. This cleansing process can happen quite quickly.

5. Because a spirit no longer occupies a body, it no longer has direct contact with attributes such as sex drive, food drive, self defense instinct, hormones such as tetosterone which can cause a person to be aggresive,  the peptides which cause negative emotions to be created, and the limitations that a nervous system and body impose. Therefore, it'll be a matter of a spirit's habitual way of being and belief systems working against the effects of the cleansing energy that is fed to them, without the bodily influences we experience while physical being a factor.

6. Once a spirit makes it to such a realm, if it doesn't already know, it doesn't take long for it to realize that it no longer occupies a physical body and what it now experiences is based upon the state of mind it developed while physical. How it chooses to move on can vary.

7. Spirits find that they don't have the power that they had while physical. They can no longer murder, abuse,  and rape others. Dictators can't lead. They can't steal from others because what could they steal that another spirit couldn't create for itself? This will sound different than what Bruce wrote, but because thoughts aren't hidden as they are while physical, it isn't easy for spirits to con each other. Drug pushers can't push drugs.  Alcoholics can't drink alchohol and drug addicts can't take drugs. Some people might refute this later point. If so, would they claim that the spirits of people who were addicts and alcoholics sometimes energetically attach to addicts and alcoholics who are physical? Why would spirits do such a thing if they can consume drugs and alcohol while in the astral? I believe it is overestimated when people describe body based activities that take place within astral realms.  I've found that my body based activities during dreams and OBEs are never as physical as physical body experiences.  On the rare occasions I've felt physical sensations during dreams and OBEs, the physical body I have was used for such sensations.

8. Helpers try to help spirits who abide in lower realms. Spirits from a higher level look out for spirits in lower realms and make certain that other spirits don't impose upon their free will. I know this sounds different than what other people say, but I trust it because it has been shown to me during several experiences.  For example, one time me and a spirit helper moved through a lower realm, and we were making certain that some spirits weren't being messed with by other spirits.  

I won't claim that what I've found is absolute truth.  I've noticed that sincere and honest people don't always come up with the same answers.  I do believe that what I have found makes sense, because it shows that things are set up so that spirits who make mistakes while physical are able to progress quickly.

Love jabbering about this stuff, thanks for the lead R.   especially like your reference to PUL gradations referring to levels as I see PUL as an expansive energy permeating all mental constructs.

My opinion is there is the continuation of a virtual reality of eat and drink, and a simulation of sexuality also on the belief system territories; "if desired."

why would we want a house, or a car, or a horse, or to eat? because this what we are used to, this is all we know until we know something else. all my sister knew was horses. she ended up taking care of abused horses, nurturing life in that way.
I believe you are a guardian spirit out there from your descriptions. I think everyone is a certain type of retriever.  helpfulness is a type of PUL function and speeds up the shift in consciousness.

  I'm currently studying the 7 bodies of man on up to the monad. some of these bodies are expendable or sluffed off as we make our way back to source.

It may be distasteful to read about attachments but these things happen because we are energetic beings which like attracts like. for instance, misery loves company. generate enough misery and one will attract certain same type attachments in agreement with you which reinforce negative thoughts.

Kyo could help us on the attachments scene; he's an expert.

this was amazing, in chat the other day this kid asked me if when he gets on the other side could he create a human? I'd say well, you can create a thought form and imbue it with life! I didn't know what to say at the time. Virtual reality is the new thing on the market right now.

about addictions. my husband died of alcoholism and I ventured to his place in obe afterwards.
I was sure he would be clean. I saw him in a house that he helped create.   he came out a room and set what looked like a glass of liquor down on the coffee table.

I immediately dismissed he had done that, until recently, because here or there we have this capacity to see only what we want to see. I didn't want to think he still had this habit,  I thought surely he'd realize he no longer needed it? many folks are under the assumption that some kind of instant enlightenment occurs when you die. he was still my sweetie, but not enlightened, but he was learning something, thats what counts.

I had asked for a glimpse of his future, there were two guides/friends who entered the room to explain how they wanted him to enter a project of soul growth, that it would be good for him, and bring him more into an extroverted person rather than introvert, he was basically antisocial.  it sounded really good and I left enthused about his future. so I'm thinking he may have dropped the habit by now. I know for sure all of us continue to evolve and become and everything is familiar once we return. I never knew how those 2 guides found Mike. they just showed up and I got the hint they had been working him as he was the wary type. I think guides are assigned to certain people, they would be resonating in similar vibes, so that he would get on with them, so to speak.

regarding the sense of touch:
while retrieving Cami, I touched her leg and it was solid flesh. once you touch flesh out there, you cannot communicate to another that you did this thing. its personal, but u can ask to have the same type of experience, along the lines of "how can I bridge the gap between what is solid reality here, and what seems real out there, but I'm not really sure? your wish is granted according what you ask for.

as regards PUL, that tends to make it more real for sure, without PUL nothing gets done to my satisfaction, I never explore unless I can do something that seems absolutely necessary for my well being or another's both at the same time. so then it seems involuntary, out of my hands. knowledge comes later sometimes, what happened, and why.

but our physical senses are limited. I think doing explorations is what acts to extend our five senses into these areas, and then by sharing what we are now. it's exciting to be a pioneer in this era, writing about these explorations and reading other's accounts for similarities. TMI calls it nonphysical senses, but I like to think of it as extensions of the 5 senses we already possess.


thanks again for the great lead in R. I see you got a full summer coming up..way to go!!!