very articulate post to my opinion Ian. from my studies so far I would agree with you. I do believe in human evolvement, perhaps the Buddhic plane, sex is moot point, I mean in regards to the distortion around the word sex itself.

it seems a human passing here, perhaps the younger soul ages of us, have the greatest propensity to mess up the most beautiful things, and gilding a lily might be analgous to my statement. the polarities, of male/female do not appear to be confined to what gender we are occupying. Note a recent poster here who declared his polarity was opposite to his gender. He was a woman.
my point is we are energy beings, of dual polarity proclivity within our inner selves regardless what we look like on the outside.
these polarities or opposite energy factors attract each other, much the same as a magnet attracts metal.
we construe, these forces to be passions and learn to control them as we go along, century after century, thus the usefulness of celibate periods, as well, forgive me for quoting the bible, but it is said there, a man can attend to god's business much better without a wife, however, it goes on to say it is far better, and even for the priest, to take a wife, rather than "to burn."

it is not saying its good or bad to take a wife. its just saying its exceedingly difficult, according to this author anyhoo, to attend to godliness concerns while having passions he cannot think of anything else until satisfied.

what the bible is amiss in is that the spiritual and physical is cojoined, as are man and woman, the polarities, and both a religious life and with marriage can be also accomplished if the couple are both having the same intentions in that.
at present, and as always, we are witness to a division of the polarities, when we may as well progress into the Buddhic level where the division does not exist, because the pleasurable aspects of sex are something one chooses or chooses not, by a mere thought exchange and just an experience of PUL in the end prognosis.

maybe as a solution to rehabilitate sexual offenders Ian, we could pass a bill to teach them meditation...somehow it doesn't seem realistic right now..for instance, the justice system already has group counsel which does much good, at least the stories I've read about point out that just getting them to talk about their selves, gets some of the kinks out, so I'm hopeful.

I do not advocate even aspirin, so you would be talking to the wrong person on the use of chemicals other than herbs and those more naturally alchemical based products to produce or help a mental/emotional inbalance. Dave knows about all the drug related things and whether they are/were good to attain a spiritual outlook, or just a healthier outlook, and less aggression in the world.
If you would be talking about rapists..it has been noted already that it is not a sexual deviation so much as it is a violent, control issue. took me a long time to figure that one out. molesters of children are into lust; rapists can turn into killers easily because of the control/power issue.  its not easy to think of how to deal with them. I think it's a deep spiritual matter and god must be brought in, when dealing with this subject. sorry to bring up the word god, sometimes I can't think of a better word for "all knowing." generally, so I call it spirit. we're in a new age, I'm so aware of that point, but these problems of pillage, rape and murder began the moment the caveman set foot on Earth, and we're barely out of caveman mentality my opinion, as a whole. but I am seeing progress!
chin up old boy! We deal with it when it shows up in our own backyard.

its ok to ingest medicines and such, but they are temporary symptom removers, as long as you know this and don't expect a cure from the pill, its ok to go for short term relief, my opinion. but I do think our society is way too much into tranquilizers, when meditation would be far better stress reliever and gets to the core issue whats bugging you.
but u can lead a horse to water, you just can't dunk his head in there..the beast is stubborn!!

Greetings,

what I also think according to this topic, you cannot allow your body/ feelings everything. That is a matter of the ability to control feelings, needs and urges.

I for myself am very bored with the hyperbole around sex, as if it was the only thing in life. We had it before, apparently the important thing about body contact is offspring, and I feel confortable about seeing it like that.
But when really thinking about sex as an important aspect of a relationship, accompanied by a voice chanting, that a relationship without it is hardly possible, that makes me feel unconfortable.
What really makes me angry, that some people laugh me down for not having had sex, the only urge I feel is to really find a way of "loving", that makes sex looking humble.
So much has been said about PUL, and if the power of PUL is that strong, that it is referred to as being essential, I really ask myself why it always has to be sex, why is it freaking included everywhere?
As I learned that being connected with other people without meeting in the physical is possible, why shouldn't it be possible to find the transcendence of a relationship also via e.g. pe, meditation (obviously with the chosen partner!) To pass the gate of eden without taking the detour via tantra (obviously where tantra should lead one, not to find a lustbound connectedness, but the essence of female and male, but I rather tend to think, that travelling beyond the physical for finding this essence, is after all possible without a tantric approach).
Why should it be so hard to share love the right way, without the forced corporal loving, that is shoved down our throats way too much?
Why shouldn't it be possible to merge spiritually, according to the energy principle, without merging physically?
If sex is beautiful or not, lies within the eye of the beholder, fair enough?

Maybe it is a matter of narrow spiritual knowledge, but I believe that honest sharing of PUL as the base of a solid relationship, does more for spiritual growth, my pov.
I just fear that sex could have an influence on me, that I cannot handle, and that it might possibly lead to being numb.

If a higher awareness while having sex (not contact enrooted in lust) is needed to draw nearer to the divine, I will probably never really meet what I am searching for. The essence of all things.

yours sincerely

pulsar

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strangeme 
Spiritual intercourse would mean something more specific than universal charity. It would be special communion with the sexually complementary; something a man can have only with a woman and a woman only with a man. We are made complete by such union. The souls in heaven must still take on the aspects of male and female to make spiritual merging and the ecstasy of merging with another compatible soul joyful and glorious

The relationship need not be confined to one in Heaven. , monogamy is for earthly union.

The relationship may not extend to all persons of the opposite sex, at least not in the same way or degree. If it did extend to all, it would treat each differently simply because each is different-sexually as well as in other ways. I think there must be some special ``kindred souls'' in Heaven that we are designed to feel a special sexual love for. That would be the Heavenly solution to the earthly riddle of why in the world John falls for Mary, of all people, and not for Jane, and why romantic lovers feel their love is fated, ``in the stars'', ``made in Heaven''
But this would differ from romantic love on earth in that it would be free, not driven; from soul to body, not from body to soul. Nor would it feel apart from or opposed to the God-relationship, but a part of it or a consequence of it: His design, the wave of His baton. It would also be totally unself-conscious and unselfish: the ethical goodness of agape external, and without selfishness or animal drives.
.
We know Heaven by earthly clues. Let us try to read all the clues in earthly intercourse. It has three levels of meaning: the subhuman, or animal; the superhuman, or divine; and the specifically human. (All three levels exist in us humans.)

Specifically human reasons for intercourse include the desire to express personal love. As to the first, there is no marriage in Heaven. As there can be no wrong in heaven spiritual, union between souls like soul must happen.

I think there will probably be millions of more adequate ways to express love than the clumsy ecstasy of fitting two bodies together like pieces of a jigsaw puzzle.
This spiritual intercourse with God is the ecstasy hinted at in all earthly intercourse, physical or spiritual. It is the ultimate reason why sexual passion is so strong, so different from other passions, so heavy with suggestions of profound meanings that just elude our grasp. No mere practical needs account for it. No mere animal drive explains it. No animal falls in love, writes profound romantic poetry, or sees sex as a symbol of the ultimate meaning of life, sexuality is a foretaste of that self-giving, that losing and finding the self,. That is what we long for; that is why we tremble to stand outside ourselves in the other, to give our whole selves, body and soul: because we are images of God the sexual being. We love the other sex because God loves God.

In addition, this earthly love is so passionate because Heaven is full of passion, of energy and dynamism... Earthly sex is the shadow, and our lives are a process of thickening so that we can share in the substance, becoming Heavenly fire so that we can endure and rejoice in the Heavenly fire of eternal spiritual sexual union with any soul mate we desire.
Please I am not being dogmatic on this topic but just put it out there for discussion and dialogue.
Alan

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