Hey Alysia,
I have not thought of it as source of inspiration for spiritual growth, that is something I know nearly nothing about, just the point of view atheism vs. faith was the important thing in this case, to start a discussion what others think about a religious or nonreligious life, what brings more effort, or if it is just our need to please ourselves. I personally see religion not as a pleasing system for our incapability of bringing out evidence from where this world came and where it will go, I feel there is a connection to a "something more", but I am not in a state of being fully convinced about this relation, maybe my incapability to rely on something apart from facts.
Being in favour of nationalsocialism was one of the points critics relied on according to Nietzsche's way of thinking , but this "superhuman" idea has nothing to do with any kind of aryan ideals of the nationalsocialist movement (anyway, if it was sort of nazi-trash, i would not have had the intention even to read this, because I am strictly against politics, that discriminate and kill people because of their origin, honestly, furthermore, I would not dare to spread right wing propaganda, that would contradict my belief, that human rights belong to every humanbeing, not to a chosen few, I learned from the past, and that is the minimum of what can be done against facism, preventing your mind from being infected by facistoid thoughts, learning how much it is worth to be able to profit and learn from other cultures, learn to respect others like they are).
In fact Nietzsche's books were misused as propagandathing, as his sister was a nazi, and she used it according to what you just mentioned with the "pure race", mixing up Nietzsche's idea about a human only acting after his free will choice (yes, living according to and earth bound thinking) with the facist ideal of the aryan race. But only if the words sound similar, that makes their sense not similar, I think this one is the best example for it. He was never involved the nazi ideals. I have to say when I read his book, I immediately had the same impression, but it turned out, that it is not facistic at all. I had a hard time reading this book, because there was so much between the lines to figure out.
To overcome the "human" with its flaws (think we talked about..) is not bound to specific humanbeings, or racial issues, it is in his view the effort every humanbeing is able to make. Yes, of course there is a kind of two class system, the ones, who have his way of thinking, and the others, who don't. But I think with this idea of "my philosophy ownes them all" he is not alone in the world of philosophy.
Strangest folk I ever heard of....just remembering what he said about pity, pity in his view is useless, because if you feel pity, you do not take away the pain from anyone, but double it through suffering with someone who has problems (omg....). This point of refusing pity sounds surely right wing, but again, it has nothing to do with pityless killing everyone who is not aryan type of sh** (I hope aryan is the word you use for the type of human that the nazis wanted to create).
Having a life in this body, I agree with you, is a blast of an experience, with the possibility to grow, mostly in mind, and as sort of our goal, in the spiritual part of ourselves. I also have the same way of thinking like you, refusing his strictly view on the body, but this is what according to his view of the world turns out, what is right for him. He saw no (like we do) spiritual life, it was just a manmade illusion, he thought human would be strong, if he relies just on himself, wether he is ceased to exist after dying or not, the important part in his eyes was, that man creates the values, not a dictation by the divine (it something to argue about, thinking about moral life in my point of view belongs to the transcendent possibilities for humanity, so it could be sort of a divine plan), we just learned, that the divine in his eyes is just something to overcome, because it holds back the human growth, according to free will choices (that's what Nietzsche thought according to this point). So for him the body is the only true form of existence, and the time, when we are living conscious in this body, we should live life to the fullest, and it is in fact not suffering, what he wants to spread. Suffering only comes from just relying on the old way of thinking what classifies a humanbeing, failure, weakness, a need for faith and guidance.
So the joy comes after leaving behind the old human, stepping to the free-choice one, that only relies on his own thoughts and changes he is able to provide. In fact is not a belief of him that joy is misleading, but suffering comes in his eyes from e.g. faith, hating the body you live in and just reach out for the next world.
He was just a here and now type of guy. Joy for him is revealed through acceptance of the human boundaries, and living life to the fullest, according to free will choices, so there is no need to feel guilty over enjoying the life, human-based and human bound.
The health issue belongs to those, who hold strictly belief only in human made things, according to his theory, not in a social darwinistic way of leaving the sick and old behind, like humble creatures, more in a way "it is their problem if they want to rely on the old view of humanbeings". May be arrogant, but it is his point of view.
Sick and old, he used this images, just to show how human relies on his body, even if he is a believer. He said through Zarathustra, that he thinks that the old and sick are unthankful to the body, because he is the one who feeds their believes.
So to say, Nietzsche created some kind of existentialistic creatures, whose religion it is to believe in themselves, and their free will choices. Not my point of view.
For myself, I have to say, I suffer more from the uncertainty about death, than being able to enjoy life, but this point of view was something I thought I left behind after dipping my nose too deep in a black cold death at the end of the line, but what else is there to say, old habits reappear... .
I wish I could think that positive (I think I wrote it in some of my comments here, not especially on this topic) about life, as I first had the impression of being able to reach out. But sorry, even if I made some progress, I struggle with this imagination or not topic the more, I read about experiences that are similar to the ones I had. But this is about being sceptical, it is a need, to proof ourselves that we really believe in what we are doing, and there are only two ways, trying again, or leave it alone (I think I would sometimes not believe in heaven/ afterlife even if it would be served on a golden plate).
Sometimes I believe if I think, it is the worst thing I do (thinking if it not belongs to subjects in school or the practical training I am doing now) according to present something. Nietzsche was a failure...anyway, maybe there is still interest in discussing the thread that Alysia opened for us, atheism vs. faith in god.
I think I bored you with explanations, but I have to say again, that I am not tending to present facistic propaganda on this board, this board and the people posting here have deserved better things than right wing shi**. And again, any facistic type of thinking is not my point of view, I believe in liberal politics, in the fact that multiculturalism is the biggest chance to bring effort to humankind, only if we respect each other, there will be the possibility of a better life on this planet (strange, huh, even if I hate my life more than I love it, i believe in miracles....maybe the revelation of the something more...I don't know
)
Love,
pulsar
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A conversation of atheism versus belief in God (Read 2206 times)
