Great postings everyone! Very interesting.

I recently bore witness to "2" first hand accounts of NDEs that I thought I'd share. One was from a discussion with a man, wherein he was talking with me about how he had gotten into a severe motorcycle accident and was pronounced clinically dead in the hospital for roughly 2 min. At which time I openly questioned what he had experienced during those roughly 2 min. of clinical death. He kindly told me that he would discuss it with me later in the day when there were fewer people around; to which he held up his promise. He opened his discussion with a brief disclaimer stating that he does not talk about this experience with very many people beings there are alot of people who aren't opened to such ideas or experiences; often times labeling one as insane or psychotic. With that, he began his story:

"I remember accelerating my motorcycle to speeds of approx. 90 mph, at which point I had lost control of my motorcycle; veering into oncoming traffic. I slammed into the oncoming car with tremendous force, severing my leg... All went blank. I was told that there was a man gardening outside of his house who ran up to the crash scene and tied a ternicate around my now severed leg; stopping me from bleeding to death, as the blood was pumping out uncontrollably from the leg opening. My next memory is of being in a hospital bed hooked up to various machines and medical devices. Then, I heard the doctor say: "Hurry, we're losing him!". My next experience was of looking down at my own physical body lying there in the hospital bed with the doctors around it, working frantically to save it. I don't recall any emotion at this point, other than that of serentity, well-being, and calmness. I remember hearing a sound that reminded me of the pictures that you see of a baby on an ultrasound monitor; kind of a "wooshing/slushing" sound. I was also aware of being surrounded by the deepest black that one could ever imagine. It was tangible; it was like you could feel it. It was at that point that I was aware of a speck of light in the distance of the blackness. Mind you, this was not a light like that of a flashlight... this was a light like a light that I have never seen before nor since... it was alive... it was love, its illuminosity was unimaginable. < (Talking about this still makes the hairs on my neck stand up!) > I was then traveling towards this light at a speed that seemed well beyond that of the speed of light. It was what seemed to me to be millions upon millions of miles per hour... Beyond human comprehension. However, as I was traveling towards this light, I became distinctly aware of the message that there were still things that I had left to do (in my physical life). It wasn't that I was forced per say, back into my physical life/body. I had a distinct knowing that it was my choice/my free-will, and I chose to come back."

It is worth noting that he had no label for describing this light other than that of immense love, intelligence, and indescribable illuminosity; also, that he was drawn to it at a tremendous speed through the blackness.

Case #2:

The next story is that of a random moving man whom was helping me to move some electronic equipment into my home. The conversation came about as a result of me bringing up the fact that at one point in my life I use to move heavy equipment much as he did, but that my back could not take the strain anymore due to a car wreck that I had been in a few years prior. He stated that he could relate, as his leg had been permanently damaged due to a motorcycle accident that he had been in when he was younger. I asked him what had happened, and he kindly and openly told me the entire story:

"I was riding my motorcyle towards an off-ramp and miscalculated the angle of the turn, colliding into the guard rail; my leg impailed via a metal protrusion attatched to the anchors. The bones of my leg shot out from the skin and were scattered about the road. I remember excrutiating burning pain in my leg. By the time I had arrived at the hospital I had lost a critical amount of blood. The doctors and nurses wheeled me into the operating room, at which time I blacked out."

I then asked if he had experienced anything while pronounced "clinically dead"; to which he replied:

"I've told this to very few people, my wife included (whom by the way, thinks that this was all of the Devil.)"

I replied back, saying that I'm a very open-minded individual and that there's not much that he could say regarding his experience that would surprise me, or that I would be judgemental of.

So he graciously proceeded:

"My next recollection was that of hovering about 8 ft. above my physical body. I remember being aware of everything that was going on in the hospital room. Then the next thing that I was aware of was travelling at a tremendous speed towards the most brilliant, indescribably bright light that I could ever imagine. The definition of "perfection" does not even come close to desribing the nature of this light. <(Talking about this gives me goosebumps!)> I could have stayed in that light, in that place FOREVER. Just think about the gravity of that statement. It's hard for me to put this into words that anybody can understand that would do the experience any real justice. I just can't find the words. I will say this though... I had a fiance at the time, and despite that fact, I did not want to leave the newly acquired state that I had found myself in. However, I had a knowing that it wasn't really my time to go yet. I had a choice to make. To stay or to go back. I knew that there were still things in my Earthly body that I still had yet to do; to accomplish. I made the decision to come back. It was the hardest decision that I've ever had to make, even to this day."

This man also did not label the light as being anything other than indescribably perfect in ways unimaginable.

Just thought I'd share these first-hand experiences that I bore witness to recently. They were very interesting, and very sincere.

PUL,
Cosmic_Ambitions

Thanks CA for sharing this.  Both my mother and husband had NDE during surgery and both described about the same things as you mention in these cases.  They both made the choice to come back because they knew they weren't finished yet.

What's interesting is my husband's case.  The surgery was taking much longer than what I'd been told and I wanted to see what was going on so I went into a meditative state.  We both saw pretty much the same things going on in the operating room except he saw more than I did.  I also saw his mom and grandmother plus two other beings in attendance.  He told me that he did not see them and that he was alone during his whole experience.  I'm not sure why he couldn't see them except that maybe they knew he wouldn't make the choice to leave and didn't want to interfere.

Love, Kathy

Berserk wrote on Apr 16^th, 2007 at 12:54am:


 About "past lives", Don have you considered that maybe what Swedenborg experienced was similar to what Monroe and Moen have talked about, as well as Rosiland McKnight's guides, that we all are essentially one immense Light being (a Disc, I-there, Total self, etc.), but that this Light being projects many different, and completely unique selves into space/time, and that these are both one with the Light being and each other, but also distinct beings at the same time?  

  This is kind of a microcosmic enactment of what the Creator itself did with us and these various Light beings to begin with.

 So, judging from the above perspective, in a sense Swedenborg is right.  Lifetimes are illusions of the Soul, Radiant Lady (a seeming ascended master) of Rosiland's 2nd book , Soul Journeys states this rather plainly saying that other lifetimes are ultimately an illusion of the Soul and that the only real reality is that of Spirit, but yet that other lifetimes are a necessary part of the Soul's experience in remembering pure Spirit again.  

  For example, my brother once did a pendulum question asking about me and another lifetime  which i consider i'm part of.   He specifically asked something like, "Is Justin so and so reincarnated?"   The answer was no.  

 Later on, i asked a rather intune and otherwise accurate sensitive if i had been this person, and her guides said, "yes, but not in the way you understand or have believed"    Interestingly, this around the same time i was just starting to change my views of other lives and started contemplating Moen's model vs the more traditional model which you seem to argue against.

 This means that i am not the reincarnation of so and so, but rather we are different and unique beings connected (and One) at a greater/more expanded level of being.  He exists eternally as so and so, and so do i, but yet our lives are still interwined energetically and there is a co-influence which i have seen so many times in so many ways its been quite convincing to me.   Perhaps this is something similar to what Swedenburg also perceived?

 Why does it have to be either--or?   Why can't it be both?   Meanwhile, there are well written books and research by various psychologists which all clearly outline the beneficial and oft very fast (as compared to traditional therapy) healing effects that "past life" regressions can often have on a personality.   Have you ever read, "Children's past lives" or any of Brian Weiss's books?  And ontrary to popular belief, its actually rare that someone claims a famous or well known about lifetime.

  But yes, i do ultimately believe that other lives are part of the illusion of our stuckness and immersion in space/time.    Interestingly, Rosiland's guides outline a very similar concept as found in the Cayce readings, the trinity of body, mind/soul, and spirit.   The body according to Rosiland's guides (specifically Radiant Lady) is said to be completely temporal and ultimately completely "unreal", the Soul contains both reality and unreality or no time and time, and Spirit which alone is said to be completely real and eternal.  

 And one seems to be the reflection of each, from the most real down.   Meaning that the Soul is a reflection of Spirit, and in turn the body is a reflection of Soul.  When reasoning from the perspective of Spirit, other lifetimes are seen as an illusion, when reasoning from the perspective of Soul (which is involved with physical) they seem real but as unique parts connected to a larger Whole, and from more physical-Soul perspective they seem "linear" and completely real as if we had actually been that person rather than as just parts connected to a greater whole.  

  Shades of gray, it seems.  Nor is any one person who is not completed or at Spirit level, completely accurate and correct in all things, even Swedenborg, Moen, Cayce, McKnight, etc.   Material consciousness has a tendency to distort info, its the very "level" of distortion.

Regarding what Cosmic Ambitions wrote, several times, about a year ago, while doing something such as laying in bed reading, I would click out for a moment and see a bright golden light far away in space. It was far away and close and the same time. It was hard to look at it because of its brightness. It had a divine feeling. Remembering the feeling of the light as I meditated helped me with my meditation.

Regarding what Ah so wrote about Emanuel Swedenborg,  my feeling is that the spirit beings we make contact with during OBEs and NDEs have some say on what we experience. They regulate experiences according to the messages that need to be communicated to the physical. They consider what people will be receptive to. Perhaps Emanuel wasn't told about things such as discs because people from his time period just weren't ready for this kind of message. Even today lots of people aren't ready for this kind of message.

[Matthew:] "In the Thai NDEs, the culture has a strong fear of death, and no concept as in the West of a wonderful afterlife experience.  There is a strong fear of Hell, and the underworld Lord Yama."
___________________________________________

Contrary to New Age bigotry, one of the gifts of Christianity to the secular West is a general optimism about one's prospects in the afterlife.  Far from being a local cultural reaction, the Thai aversion to an afterlife seems the more common cross-cultural reaction.  For example, consider the significant difference between American and Indian attitudes to their NDEs in Osis and Haraldsson's comparative study of 1,000 NDEs in the USA and India:

"Nearly all the American patients, and two-thirds of the Indian patients were ready to go after having seen otherworldly apparitions with a take-away purpose....However, on the basis of the pilot survey, we did not expect that one-third of our Indian patients would not consent to go ("At the Hour of Death," p. 187)."

In this study, the shared cross-cultural patterns (e. g. unexpected greetings by deceased relatives; no hint of reincarnation, even in the Indian cases) are even more striking.   This study illustrates a central issue that needs resolution: the question of why some NDEs seem influenced by preconceptions and others seem full of surprises (e. g. Jesus appearing as a Being of Light to a Jew and a Muslim).  Osis points to one explanation: "While most visions of surroundings depicted another world, a considerable number--one-third--were mere hallucinations of this-world places and objects (p. 188)."   In this respect, the danger of confusing lucid dreams or their equivalent with NDEs is as key as it is in detecting counterfeit OBEs.

Don

I have not had the time to start a thread about the Bardo Thodol (Tibetan Book of the Dead), but I think it bears mentioning here.  That for centuries, if not thousands of years, NDEs and mystical experiences identified different stages of the afterlife and beings of light who were called Devas and deities.  I have tried to bring cases to this thread such as the Thai cases, Azmina Suleman's book (which I have to obtain) where she reportedly met Mohammed, PMH Atwater's Egyptian Taxi driver and others.  I need to research the Bardo Thodol more thoroughly in order to ascertain how the light beings mentioned came to be known over the centuries.  We should not dismiss these encounters as we embrace Storm and Ritchie's well known publicized Western encounters. 


I am not a direct NDE researcher, as pointed out by Dr. Atwater.  As such, it is difficult for me to prove that the NDE of other cultures has other light beings who identify themselves.

Many NDEs do not have light beings.  It appears that far more people are met by family members and loved ones than by light beings.  Cultural expectations must play a big role, as no christian has reported being brought in front  of Lord Yama (the dread Thai Lord of the dead) for judgement, but most of the Thai cases I cited were.  By the way, those Thai cases had impressive verifications of events the NDE experiencer was told would take place that subsequently happened in the "real world." 

I applaud Don's effort for posing the questions, but I do not think the answers can be answered with certainty based on the cited evidence.

Jesus does seem to be overrepresented in Western NDEs, I do grant that observation.  With close to 4 billion christians and Muslims who consider JC to be an important part of their religion, perhaps it is not an overrepresantation.  Better studies and time will tell.


Matthew

I received the following communication from the IANDS, one of the largest near-death study groups.  It is interesting.  I will continue to post further followups I get from them:

Greetings, Matthew!

I don't know if you have received any other email replies to your interesting question. You may wish to look in the archive section of the IANDS website for past accounts.

Also, one of our board members wrote me the following:

As soon as I can get my laptop unpacked, I will look through some recent correspondence about Muslim NDEs to see if there's a mention.

For one thing, the being of light is not Jesus--the being of light is most typically referred to either as simply the Light or as God., not as Jesus.

Jesus is perceived as a person whom the experiencer identifies as Jesus (there is no presentation of business cards).  I don't offhand recall anyone's ever saying that the entity identified himself by name--anybody else remember such an account?

Secondly, Jesus is mentioned most frequently because most of our accounts come from Christians or (usually) secularists who don't know other names for who such a perceived person might be.

In an old JNDS (Journal of Near Death Studies) article about the NDEs of five Jewish sages,  there is mention of encounters with the Judges--I don't recall if they were identified singly or as a group. Will try to find that.If more information surfaces, I will forward it to you.

Nancy Clark, PhD, International Coordinator for IANDS


Matthew