I have, as many of you know, been puzzling over a series of dreams and graphical images I received the other night, and someone brought up the prospect that the meaning could be a springboard toward a divine revelation.  This led me to wonder, what is divine revelation and to whom is it granted?  Throughout history, we have heard of prophets, visionaries who have been privy to contacts with the divine, but how has their searches been different than the everyday person trying to put it all together?  Afterall, there are few like Moses, or even Swedenborg for that matter who commune with the divine, and feel that they have a direct revelation from God.  Why, for instance was the atheist Howard Storm chosen in a NDE to have an in depth conversation with JC, after first being cast into a hellish plane?  Was he the only sinner to start praying for mercy after finding himself such?

On the one hand, multiple sources tell us to look not without ourselves, but within.  On the otherhand, it seems that certain people are chosen, specifically for revelation.  In the old testament, it seemed clear that Moses was chosen, and that he was not replaceable with another Israelite.  Throughout the old testament, the founders of Israel were given divine revelation from God through direct contact or angelic visitation.  Prophets also seem to have been specifically chosen in the past.  Yet how is the choice/revelation made?  More specifically, divine revelation almost seems to be driven by an external divine plan in many instances - this goes against New Age dogma which states that we are all equal and contine the divine within us.  The New Age idea is that we are all God in hiding.  What then, is behind divine revelation over the centuries that enables a handful of prophets and visionaries to be given direct access to God and heaven?

I would like to hear from those on the board about this before giving my full impression.  I believe, to some extent that one must be open to the divine, by letting go of hindering belief systems or blocks.  I also believe that one has to be open to it, and by this I mean with the use of deferential intent.  Willful intent to commune with God, is different than an open invitation with respect, and deference. (Chumley will hate me for saying that).  

There is a notion, I believe of "grace," which is likely a prerequisite for reception of revelation.  Being receptive, open, losing hindering prior belief systems seem to be prerequisites to revelation.  

I would love to hear the input of others on this...


Matthew

I believe it is possible for many people to receive divine revelations.  It just so happens that some people who receive divine revelations end up playing a famous historical role, while others don't.

I believe that sincerity of purpose has something to do with it. If a person really wants to serve the divine cause in whatever manner is required of her (or him), rather than what benefits her personally, beings who represent  the light will respond to her accordingly.

It seems to me that a person like Howard Storm was humble enough to want to serve after his experience, rather than become the next super guru. He was provided with the experience he was provided with because the divine powers that be were able to see how he would probably respond. There are some exceptions. Some people have a divine experience, allow their ego to take credit, and the next thing you know you have the next super guru.

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  Now that you said it, I remember that I did feel a pumping action at the back of my head as well. I also forgot to mention that I experienced timelessness in an atmosphere where anything could spontaneously occur.

Sincerely,
Ralph

Greetings,

Besides our sincere intent to reach 'up' , would we also have to feel worthy
of receiving a response?  That might account for why some OT leaders received revelations and some New Agers do not. (Then too, some 'new agers' might have had true revelations but not had the inclination to publish them.)

I suppose the heavenly forces can read auric colors or in some other way
gauge who is ready for revelation by our energy patterns.

Does the energy accompanying the revelation help to authenticate it? For ex., Doc knew his fire scene was not just a story of camping outdoorsmen--how?

I am very very happy for you, Don, recoverer, and Ralph, and others who have received such a blessing!

Bets

The notion of divine revelation brings up an important distinction regarding God and the universe between what is called New Age thought, and conventional judeo-christian thought; that is the notion of an intelligence and purpose of God and the divine separate from ourselves.  This, I believe is Brendan's worst nightmare, for it is the concept that there may be a divine or cosmic thought process that transcends what we currently understand, but has within it its own intent.  So, Moses, the prophets, and others were given revelations by the word of God or angels.  If they are to be believed, this sets up a hierchical order and an intelligence in God and heaven (again, Chum's worst nightmare). 

The idea of a comsic intelligence or purpose is often in contrast to the notions of many New Age thinkers.  Some New Agers will say (as we have heard) - "there is no right or wrong, only experience and point of view."  Or, "we are not here on earth to learn, just to experience being alive." Or still, "we are all God, and since there is nothing external to us, there is no revelation to be given that we don't already know."   I think Don and I pretty much debunked this myth in our discussions on evil and PUL.  Namely, that if PUL is the ultimate driving force of God and the universe, it implies a "right" course of action (that which moves us toward PUL).  So a dichotomy is set up by proxy in the physical word; i.e. there must be a "wrong course of action."

That which is called divine revelation, if true, leads one to believe in a universe that is intelligent and has a purpose/intent to be revealed.  It follows then that right action would be to understand the purpose and work toward it.  Divine revelations thus support our need for action in the physical and spiritual planes.  At the same time, these revelations refuse to deny right and wrong action (or good and evil) exactly because there is intent and purpose in a thinking universe. 


Matthew

Very thought provoking Matthew !

Matthew22:14 For many are called, but few are chosen.

I believe that both are correct that some are called from past lives as mystics , visionaries , prophets and so have a predilection to awareness but that all can chose with freewill to remove blockages and open to clairience . I think Grace come with service , love and light . By service we grow .

My peers and I have divine revelation in circle as mystics we have worked in countless lives before this one together . We continue to find capable new peers who seem ordinary but have profound contacts in NDE , dreams and visions with Christ and Buddha and other members of the Godhead of Earth .

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Jesus closed the parable of the wedding feast with this apocalyptic statement that comes from the Old Testament.  

The meaning in Greek is that the “many” and the “few” encompass everyone.  Everyone is called (invited) but only a few accept (receive) the invitation, therefore they are the ones chosen (selected) The Greek word for chosen also denotes (church) in the New Testament and seems to be related to the gospels not only having been given for the Jews, but for the Gentiles as well.  This then encompasses everyone (all of mankind) to receive that which comes from God.

The meaning of revelation is to “unveil” or to remove that which is covering something that has been concealed.  Humankind has covered the true essence of our spiritual nature and all that this encompasses.  This corresponds with what is called “original sin” which is the forgetting of who we really are.  Salvation is the remembrance or the revelation that we are spiritual beings brought forth from and by God in his likeness or that which we are inwardly drawn towards, which is love, goodness, peace, charity, service and etc.  The likeness of God is the harmony that is revealed within each of us.  This then is the very ground of our being and the essence from which we are made that is revealed.  The more we inwardly recognize the Divine essence within us, the more we are able to express outwardly the sacred divinity that we are.  

Love, Kathy

Hi all 

I love what you wrote Kathy; it is so true.

Matthew; I was thinking quite a bit about your vision and I believe Don named it so correctly.  I was thinking you may have experienced this special Divine Revelation in reality; it happened to you - you did not watch it - you experienced it and the nonburning fire washed over your body in the Spirit encompassing your whole body. 

I believe a Divine Revelation (of this order) is the Holy Grail.  It is the Holy Grail we all seek for and is personal to each one seeking for it according to : as you say Matthew 'Willful intent to commune with God'.  God tells us he will meet us when we are ready to meet him.

Just my further thoughts.

Caryn

Hi Matthew-
You ask good questions!

From my personal experience, we go through  a series of transitions. (These check out one for one with Swami Satchitananda's book on the [sychic states of development. You can find the similarity in Tibetan material, but it's more obscure and hidden under jargon.) At birth we're ignorant, and learnof the world of people and things. Then we learn of the values that transcend ego and selfishness, such as caring for others, not taking ourselves too seriously, not craving after everything, telling the truth etc, and we stop creating negative karma. Yogis call this satchitananda - it turns out to be a logical approach to life and not at all mysterious. To get there we simply stop imposing on others, and we take responsibility for making life work.

Next we focus as we learn to meditate more deeply, and we discover that the entire universe is a single "thing" in the sense that it all works as a collective unit. The governing organizational principle to that organization is often called "the Cosmic Consciousnes".  As we encounter it it gives us the sense of being part of the big collectivity, all questions answered, all negations removed, but also a sense that we are a part, and still not the One. This is sarvastarka samadhi (no opposition or separation), also called sarvakalpa samadhi.

With further meditation we reach a state in which there are no qualifying conditions. There is just Beingness without attribution. (Thisis not actually describable, because our language is limited, but this is sufficient to recognize it.).In this state we have abandoned all distinctions and separations, and all there is is Oneness. This is nirvastarka samadhi also called nirvakalpa samadhi (negation of sttributes). It is reached by abandonment of all the attachments that bind out awareness to the physical world.

The next phase is to go on living in the world with the realization that everything is One, yet it is projected as Many so that we can work with it to find our way as we "chop wood and carry water". As compared to the feelings at the start, no longer do we identify with a title, a job, with possessions or anything else. We just "are", and instead of being the one who is owning and being owned by them,  we have access to various tools that are attached to us by externals, with which we do whatever is appropriate.

You can find the same kind of message in most of the deeper writings. For example, Jesus told people to "take up your cross and follow me ... I am the way..." In terms of yoga this means, abandon your egoistic connections that define you as thus and such a person, as a title and noble rank, as different or superior and all the othere things that cause us to be distinct and distinguished - we thus become "no-thing" and "no-body"  in the sense of no longer having a fixed definition - we live only in the dynamic present. (It's scary for those who fail to realize that there is something besides the physical world.) In this state of freedom, we become identical with the human aspects of Jesus and all the other advanced souls, rishis, gurus, yogis , saints etc who have discovered God. (Jesus the man is not the same as the idea of the Christ. as the Christ is a name for the projected nature of God - and of course we are all ultimately That, although we generally are afraid to realize it.) Then, being like Jesus, we have "followed him and "he is the way", because that's the only door, and everyone who goes through it is the same in the sense of having abandoned distinctions.

When yogis go through that door, they too are not different from Jesus. However, they focus on other explanations. Put backwards, Jesus went through by adopting the principles of yoga.

The time from Start to God realization, according to Swami Satchitananda. is about 6 months for a dedicated student.

In this sequence we progressively come more and more into unity with the "Cosmic Consciousness" - the manifestation of the logic that runs things. (I personally identify it with the manifestation of the Holy Ghost, but that's a personal perspective based on my personal background.) More and more we become sensitive to this overlying logical reality, and it fills information into our awareness that more or less replaces all the ego stuff that was previously there. Life in general presents an ongoing divine scenario and message.

To the degree that we focus on exotic experiences and blinking lights etc, we lose contact with the ultimate.  It's like the guy who has a small perfect diamond but drops it when he sees a big piece of broken glass glinting in the sun. This sidetripping can go on for several ifetimes. Then, when we get back on track it feels as if we are discovering a divine message or some such. In addition, prayer becomes more effective, so if you ask, you get an answer that tells you what you need to know. (It might be disguised in a different form, but it's there.)

Hope this is helpful-
PUL
dave

Beautiful post Dave, we can see east meeting west here 

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Hi Dave.
   I agree that prayer is effective, just so long as you receive an answer. I don't pray very often; but when I do I usually get some form of an answer. Ever since I have achieved a mental balance, I have been receiving divine messages. The blinking lights of the mind machine aren't exotic or mesmerizing. They work in the same manner as binaural beeps for entrainment of consciousness. It's only a tool for meditational assistance. The blue light from the sun that I saw was probably just a physical reaction of the eye. The light, however, acted as a means of focus that enabled me to put to good use while entering altered states of thought. I use whatever helpful tools that I can for reaching higher states of consciousness. Nothing lost, but much to be gained. I can tell when I'm on the right track to gaining useful knowledge in my quest for wisdom.

Sincerely,
Ralph

Ralph-
You're paying the proper attention to the proper blinking lights. Keep doing it. One of my few really deep pleasures is watching the growth and development of some of the people on this forum, and sharing the experiences of others as they move step by step into the "Ultimate Unity". 

I agree with Alyssia, you got a miracle - but in the end, it's all a miracle. So keep doing it.

The blinking lights that are thwe problem are the ones that accompany a strong dose of hallucinogenic stuff, or the equivalent,  and that lead us into chasing after more "fun experiences".  It's like the difference between the hippie who is into "recreational experiences" and spends the evening making his head tight and acting stupid, and the yogi, who is smoking the same thing, but who regards it as a sacrament sacred to Shiva, the Hindu name for the Creator of the universe, and who uses the experience to gain insight. The hippie can keep on doing his thing forever and never get anywhere, he just keeps on watching the spectacular stuff and acting stupid, but the sincere yogi (or whatever you want to call a true seeker) will bend any means whatsoever to serve the one ultimate end.

There's a saying that the right means for the wrong person gives the wrong result, whereas the wrong means for the right person leads to God.

What I was trying to express to Matthew is that the essence of the "divine revelation" or the "spiritual message" or whatever, is not so much because there appears a "Divine Speaker", but rather, that as we focus and abandon the interfering things we do to stay attached to the everyday world, then we become the "Divine Listener", and the messages that already are everywhere around us start to pour in.

Maybe what I need to do is to learn to be more concise!



d