Tempestinateapot wrote on Feb 24^th, 2007 at 9:29pm:

Alright, thanks for the information and what not!

I see I have meditated before and had some results.. Just communication is all not visible or anything like that..

Thanks and peace

I think the big reason why most people dont want to believe in reincarnation,is becauce of the possible rejection of there children,if it is proven to be true.People will say we dont want any children becauce The child could be the spirit of a killer or something like that.What are your thoughts on this.George

B-dawg wrote on Feb 25^th, 2007 at 8:57am:

True that ! Interesting points I will look into that once I get the choice to what I please.

BTW, we don't reincarnate into infinity.  Not on this earth.  Anybody who has studied science will know this, even if they don't believe in God or reincarnation.  It's not possbile.  This earth will eventually burn up when our sun becomes a red giant, and the sun itself will disappear eventually after becoming a white dwarf.   The entire universe is finite.  Looks like you'll need a plan B.   
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If certain quantum physicists are correct about there being an infinite
number of parallel universes - and this "multiverse" has no beginning or
end, it is the true "eternity" - then we can expect Earth to recur an infinite number of times... perhaps even WE OURSELVES recur an infinite number of times.
Such could be expected, in a "Totality" consisting of finite, non-eternal universes which were eternally arising from the "quantum vacuum" - the only truly eternal, unchanging reality there was! (I'm not pulling this out of my a$$, by the way - many respectable physicists have come to a similar conclusion about the nature of reality, such as Max Tegmark, Rupert Sheldrake, ect.)
Presumably, no two recurrences would be the same. My next recurrence,
might be as a guy with super business skills, who gets to be a millionaire at the age of 19... COOL!!!!!
And is this view, not more believable than "God" with "Heaven" and "Hell?" (After all, "God" is INFINITELY complex, rather than just unimaginably complex, as the "multiverse" would be. Therefore, "God", being infinitely complex, is infinitely more unlikely!)
It is a pretty cool possibility, really... infinite parallel universes with infinite recurrences! Beats having to settle for ONE life, as a loser (which would be most people, if there is no reincarnation! AND being officially losers after they die, when it is to late to change... they would have to lick the boots of the earthly winners -who, after all, had proven themselves worthy - in "heaven" for the rest of eternity...)  Sounds
like a DOG to me, with bad breath and muddy feet. What I don't understand is, most people seem to WANT it..!

B-man

P.S. WHAT goodies? Choir practice? Celibacy? "Purity" and "Holiness" (just what IS so great about those concepts, anyway?) A really nice
room in the Heavenly Monastery maybe? Or, floating around disembodied like a cloud of flatus..?

Hi all...just peeking in again..and reading through some threads...and I'm sure as I go back and read this one,I'll see many answers that are similar to my idea(s)...but simply, I'm one of those that truly believes in reincarnation...I really do...I'm also someone who struggles with depression on a grand scale..lol...and for some reason, besides things that I have read,debating wether there is choice or not (actually, anything quality I think I've ever read have thought we have a choice) I really think it is a choice...and at times I am horrified at the thought, b/c I am one that has considered suicide more than once...though it is that same innate understanding that tells me this is a less desirable way to get into the afterlife, to put it very simply....but in the same way I know this...I sometimes get comfort from the very idea that I chose this...and that time as we know it is so different in the afterlife, that at the time, before birth, I must have felt like, "wow, lifetimes are truly like a blink of an eye....look at how much I could learn and how quickly, during these lifetimes...I guess I'll go back and "try it again".." And then I've thought that I must be as passionate about spiritual principles and truth(s) there as here, so that I wanted to immediately practice what I recall, or learned on the "other side"..and somehow human lifetimes are ways of amplifying or speeding up the learning process....

That's my humble two cents...and it's funny to see this,my mom was just arguing with me, in a good natured fashion, that she just didn't "want" to believe in reincarnation...b/c the thought was crazy to her as to why she would have chosen to come back to this sometimes very painful life on earth...lol...I feel that..and have thought so countless times....but I really think we can choose how we evolve or if....free will seems central to so much in life...

Note : Not replying or addressing anyone in particular. Rather, commenting (in the style of "IMHO") adressing the ideas. Sharing of perspectives, and so on. If you don't agree with it or it doesn't feel right to you, it's your soul saying that it (or to be precise, what you interpreted it as, based on your own belief patterns, ideas, and your, as Byron Katie calls it "uninvestigated stories"), is not correct for you, at least not in the way you interpet or understand it. Then ignore it, and ask yourself what is *your* truth, what your feelings are teaching you about yourself, about your own truth. Clarify it, evolve the matter, share the light in a way as you best see fit.


Quote:


No, the goal is to experience physical incarnation (including especially the relationships within) and to allow meaningful benefit from this, evolve and assist others (ie. CosmoEthics) from one's willingness to work with and interact with, the experiences, the karma (karma is a pedagogical tool), the relationships (with others and therefore with oneself), and the personal growth or evolution.

Once the individual soul has evolved beyond the (pre-serenissimus) human level (or the 'level of man', regardless of Earth humans or extraterrestrials) to the Serenissimus (a non-dogmatic name, simply a useful descriptive nomenclature meaning "true serenity"; the 'next level' of evolution for human souls), then by virtue of the best way in which to function and to serve CosmoEthics and further evolution, would be largely (such a consciousness would be capable of operating simultaneously on many levels and dimensions) extraphysical, which might be loosely seen (but often crux of matter is still misunderstood) as "no longer physically incarnating". But it is *not* so much they are no longer physically incarnating, for they are very much a part of the physical world, universe and humanity, but are operating on multi-levels simultaneously within, across and beyond the physical.

To say the goal is to 'stop incarnating' is akin to saying the goal of any college education is the slip of paper (known as "certificate"), rather than the true learning, training and self-discovery that the syllabus (existential programs), modules (life-plans) and/or semesters (lifetimes) were designed to support.

A monk once asked his teacher, "Master, how many lifetimes more before I graduate from physical incarnation?". His teacher replied, "5 more lifetimes."

The monk was dissapointed, shook his head, and thought to himself, "This is not acceptable. I will study the religious books harder, I will do more good deeds, I will pray more, I will meditate more..."

After a few months of intensified efforts, he asked his teacher, "Master, how many lifetimes more before I graduate from physical incarnation?". His teacher replied, "15 more lifetimes."

The monk was shocked, and upset. "How can this be? I must have been slacking. I must work harder at the goal of no-longer-reincarnating! Study harder, do more good deeds, pray more, meditate more... uuggghhh..."

After several years of frantic efforts, he asked his teacher, "Master, how many lifetimes more before I graduate from physical incarnation?". His teacher replied, "50 more lifetimes."

You see, the poor monk was totally missing the point of physical incarnation - to experience, not to escape it. By seeking the end of incarnation, he was running away (in his mind, his heart, his experiences) from the very point, purpose and value of physical incarnation - to experience it (including especially all its valuable relationships it affords or catalyzes) as they are, as meaningful, as perfect.

You say perfection does not exist? We say everyone's perfect. You say God does not exist? We say everyone's God. You say that being in physical incarnation is somehow lousier than being 'no longer incarnated', We say we are *all* simultaneously physically incarnated *and* operating extraphysically. The beings that are intraphysically incarnated, are our intraphysical aspects. The beings that are extraphysical and/or no-longer-incarnating, are our extraphysical or no-longer-incarnating aspects. All are equally us. All *are* us.

I heard Kyo's story about the monk as it related to martial arts.  "Master, how long will it take me to learn Kung Fu?"    "Ten years." 
"But what if I practice day and night without fail - then how long?"   "Twenty years!"

"But what if I think of nothing else but my Kung Fu?"    "Fifty years!" said the master. 

"But why," the student asked, "does it take longer if I say that I will work harder to learn it?"

"With one eye on the clock trying to learn it quickly, you will only have one eye left to focus on and learn Kung fu," replied the master.