Ah, well, I never claim to be perfect.  I fail to see how your post is helpful to Dark Knight, which is what this thread is about.

Thanks, Stacy.  I don't feel bad.  And, I certainly don't feel hostile.  I'm hoping people will expand their minds to take in some knowledge that they might not be aware of.  And, pure unconditional love consists of allowing everyone their expression, even at the expense of peace.  PUL means that everything is ok, just as it is.  IMO, PUL does not mean that the emotion of human love must be maintained at all costs.  As a friend of mine likes to say, if everyone were to believe exactly the same thing, and express it in exactly the same way...this world would be milk toast, and as fun as watching paint peel.   

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Uh boy, this gets really complicated.  Human love is an illusion.  It is based on an ego drive, and is conditional.  I will love you if you love me.  Love is withheld when someone doesn't get what they want.  It can be really subtle, unconscious, and appear to be unconditional love, when in truth, it's not.  It's temporary, and easily changes.  It's what most people feel when they talk about love.  Even spiritual people.  It's very seductive, and I don't mean in a sexual way.  It draws you in, gets you hooked, and then can be taken away in a moment when someone doesn't act in a way that we think is appropriate.

I would rather use the words "unconditional acceptance" when talking about the Source/God.  It never changes, it never judges.  It just Is.  Agape is a better word than love, if you have to use that word.  Humans, in this plane of existence, are really not completely capable of this.  Our love is always faulty and conditional, even if we don't think it is.  There is always a selfish motive lurking in there.  Even if you give all your money away, live in service to others, you still get the selfish payback of being able to feel good about yourself.  The unconditional love of Source accepts everything and anything.  Even evil.  No judgement, no taking away of Agape for any reason.

Tempestinateapot,

I must respectfuly disagree with you here. I won't elaborate more because I don't want to impose my beliefs on you. We are equally intitled to our own belief system and thats the way it should be.

PUL, Stacy

Hi,
I have here in short what I have got personally about the afterlife (still living, so it might be totally different, but maybe not). Maybe Dark Knight and Patty find something good and trustworthy in it; you could also read some of my old posts and of course the many interesting others here.

I started to explore with the system of RA Monroe, TMI, and Bruce, and that's what I more or less use still, enriched of course with personal experiences. I think a spiritual/belief system colors the experiences in explorations, but probably there is something behind it, only seen through different glasses. I must admit, I have no absolute proof whether this is true, but hints.

The "near" physical area:
I've found people in scenes which looked just like the physical, but then I noticed other people move through them. An elderly woman who I contacted thought it was because she couldn't perceive very good because of her age and interpreted it as hallucinations, she wasn't aware that she hadn't a physical body anymore.
Other people seem to be aware of that but still sticking around the physical.
Again others are not really "in" the physical, but very focused on it, as if they would watch tv from a distance.
Also I saw sometimes the physical with many colored streams and fluctuating rays, just like lsd consumers tell frequently, showing connections and activities of many kinds.
I had also two "classic" OBEs, totally unaware of my physical body, but my surrounding looked nearly exactly like the physical (my bedroom), though it wasn't as solid as physical matter, and the light was slightly different.
When I once was on a "higher level" (space is not really space, but we need words and concepts, you know) I asked what happens when someone dies in the physical. I then headed down very fastly, and in front of me were white light spheres, moving zic-zac over a city, and came to person who obviously had just died and made a puzzled impression to me, and then one of the light spheres caught his attraction, he went in and the sphere moved away abpruptly.

Focus 23:
To me this appears as the area of thought-form duplicates of physical surroundings of people, who have physically died, but are not aware of it. Mostly the inhabitats live in their own bubbles, but it may be that there are also interactions between some people who share a personal area. These little personal worlds can be very different: Often I saw old people in their appartments, watching tv, sitting in a rockin chair or something, some waiting that finally someone would come visit them, but no one comes. Mostly it needs only one little spark to break the routine of their dwelling there, you know, "just a little trip, it's not far, you can go back anytime if you like". Others are in shock, frozen in the moment of their death, or having replays of it. Some there might be also not entire persons, but aspects.
In a place which felt like to be near this area I came across a lawn, or a park, where people seem to have some fun with sex games.

The "Belief System Territories":
Imagine all beliefs regarding the afterlife, all is there. In difference to Focus 27 with "The Park", the territories there have in common, and I felt it several times, a very rigid framework of mind. There are various places: Religious communities, cults, very simple environments like a desert, but also places in which the daily routine work seems like a religion to them. Also I came across political communities who continue to fight for their ideas, and also a sort of technical science-fiction place, as well as a motorcycle gang world.

The Belief Systems near Focus 27:
A specialty to me are the places which, in my navigation system (not really) are relatively "high", near Focus 27. I saw a few who were absolutely impressive, heavenly places. At least one of this was a bit open to Focus 27 and has a sort of cooperation with some shiny folks of F27, it was a group of people who obviously developed one of the big religions further, it was about the future, from my view. Other places were absolutely beautiful, but again, there were very rigid rules of living. They could see me in two systems (as it seems their awareness span is greater than in the lower regions of the BST), and they were not overly cheerful to see me there, cause I was not really singing their song of purity and everytime worshipping some entities.

Between the BST and Focus 27:
Located there as far as I could recognize, there were big white glowing foggy figures. They appeared to be very experienced in human life and go to, or have come from, their last physical existence.

Focus 27: A place for people who are open enough, have creative power, who like beauty of people and places, are curious about who and what they are, who are able to feel love. Who have a minimum of trust in love, being loved of something greater than of an individual human being, who have a desire to go home, and trust enough that they can. It sounds maybe like "Oh, all this hoo-hoo  good and precious and genius-like people", but I have the impression you don't have to be glorious to go to F 27, only that little light is enough.
There is a entry area, with the park, many facilities of all kind, hospitals, rest and recreation, restaurants etc... Also, private places with no limitation of space. Personal guidance and councelling, schools of many kinds. Then areas for special communities or individuals with special tasks, mostly on the way to a greater understanding of it all, leaving soon the more or less earth-style world of space, time and form.
There are also possibilities of traveling to other "levels", "down", or "up".

The higher self:
I always see myself as part of something greater, without I couldn't exist. Most often called "higher self" or similar terms. I cannot really say where this is in the Focus Level terminology. It is easier to contact it the more familiar one is with different consciousness states/"places". But, on the other hand, it is not required to have a particular system at hand to reach it. I find it the easiest to come closer to my higher self in Focus 15, Focus 21, and Focus 27, as well as what I guess must be Focus 33/34.

Focus 21:
I experienced this place as if energies are transformed. As if it is a gigantic transmitter station for high energy being transformed to other, more dense energies. As well I found there a way to travel to other worlds using tunnels. There is also coming foreign-feeling influences from somewhere to here. I saw strange creatures there. As well as keeping our etheric (or so) bodies in shape. There is the entrance and the border for incarnations. It seems not really a place to stay longer for an average human being, but it is interesting nonetheless. I had my first higher self experience there.

Focus 15:
A place which feels still, quiet, and personal. I find good conditions to move back from there in earlier times of my life, as well as to earlier lives, I had my first glimpse on what felt like another life of mine there. There is a library with a librarian, he is somehow connected to me.

The database:
There seems to be a database accessable which has, well, much information in it. I see it as a regular field of glowing spheres, which re-arranges, or my position in it is re-arranged when I ask for a specific info, then one or more spheres are blinking and I can go to them and have a look, sometimes it' like tv, sometimes I'm in it, sometimes only shades of something, or way too fast scenes. But I have gotten some infos through it that have been verified.

Focus 33/34:
I had some experiences there, some were, like suggested, "the Gathering"-style, with objects which could have been spaceships, or absolute foreign beings, one gave me to understand (or I interpreted so) that it is a probe of a planets' surface which is one living entity. Another object had entities in it. But also, sometimes I saw a great cluster of something like soap-bubbles, which was a way to view my higher self, and there were others similar like it. As well sometimes it is a plain white world, or maybe with fog, the impression was that there were concepts and ideas, that were ready to be channeled downwards to be manifested.


I expect when I die I will go into the light, which is my higher self, or members of it. Maybe I will have some time relaxing in a sort of earth-like environment in F27, but maybe I will melt back into my higher self. I had some experiences where I felt very much expanded to all sides, and connected to everything. It is not really to describe, I was still an "I", but also everywhere, somehow. So I expect it will be something of this kind what awaits me, but I'm not sure, at least this is what I'm thinking about.

Oh yes, what Bruce and others here often say, love is a sort of fuel for everything good. It is not easy to define though, but in my experience it can be like a flow of fresh energy, makes you see, makes you wide, serene and fully awake; it can be small (but powerful) and subtle like somehow being touched by a flower or an insect. Or it's a smile and you ask yourself "How comes that one smile makes me so happy?"
Everyone is free to give it another name, or definition, or say "Duh, how boring", but it is the force that glues you and the world mentally together, so I'd rather stick with it. As to whether it's real or not, I also don't know in which way my computer keyboard is real or not. It's not about "truth" or "reality", but sufficent evidence.

Spooky

I don't think DK is going to post, because no one seems to be able to answer her question.  I talked to her.  Spooky came the closest, but unfortunately, I don't think DK is familiar with the focus levels, so it looks a little confusing.  I enjoyed reading your experiences, thanks, but then, I understand what you are talking about. 

So, everyone might as well derail the thread all you want.    

I don't want to get into a battle of beliefs here, because that ends up in circles with no one listening to anyone else.  But, I would like to address this quote with something that is merely called my opinion.  And, please note that I am using the universal "you", this is not directed at any one person:  Quote:
The point is to accept people for what they are in this moment.  Looking for faults in others, and most importantly, yourself, is an excellent way to progress.  When you see a fault in another, that is almost always a reflection of your own faults.  The things that irk us the most, are usually the things we need to work on the most.  Hiding your head in the sand and seeing only the goodness in others is a very, very temporary fix.  It just doesn't last.  As soon as they irk you to the point that you can't stand it any longer, something is bound to blow.  If it doesn't, you are most likely a repressed person, and have a whole other set of issues. 

The goal is to first find the fault in yourself.  Become aware, stare it in the face, feel the humiliation that you aren't as good as you think.  It's like walking through fire.  When you come out the other side, you are able to laugh at yourself and see just how silly your ego really is.  Look at other people's faults, including mine.  They can be a good indicator of what it is you still need to work on.  Recognize that no one is perfect.  No one can really even stand up to the measure of being "good".  And, please don't tell me about Mother Theresa.  You, nor anyone else, actually knows what was in her head.  My guess (and this is only a guess) is that she knew her faults and accepted them in herself and others.  Because, that is the final goal.  Look the bad stuff in the face, accept it, then let go of the need to judge it.  Recognize that everyone and everything is perfect, just as it is.  No judgement, just pure unconditional acceptance....that's the real love.  And, it's the only one that lasts.

I'd also like to clear something up.  I am not a psychologist.  I have a degree.  Not a big deal.  It doesn't mean anything.  Anything of importance I've learned has been through the hard knocks in life.  And, it doesn't take education or intelligence to do that.  It takes a willingness to look at things as they really are, and not some fancy dream of what they should be.  Because there is nothing they "should" be.  PUL = Unconditional Acceptance.

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No, I said Spooky was closest to actually offering some real help to DK.  As to being the closest to the bliss of being God, it's not a competition.  There is no one who is closer or less close.  We are all equal when it comes to being close to God.  Some have just figured out how to recognize it better.  And, transcendental experiences, or even just phasing experineces to the different focus levels doesn't make one closer to God.  I know plenty of people who are expert OBE'ers who would actually be classified as atheists.  It's a universal experience, and doesn't require any kind of belief whatsoever.

As to my degrees, and I have several, they have nothing to do with self-esteem.  I only bring them up if it's pertinent to the subject.  From what I've seen, a lot of highly educated people are just searching to find a way to make themselves feel better and worthy.  Or, they use their education as a way to try to impress others and stroke their own ego.  So, I'm neither impressed with myself nor with anyone else with higher education.  There isn't a single person on this planet who is better than any other.  All are equal in the eyes of the Source.  And, all will eventually become enlightened.  A college degree doesn't get you there.  It's kind of funny that Dave would recommend I go see a past life regressionist.  That's what I specialize in.     What makes me a good hypnotherapist is that I recognize me in every one of my clients, and honor that wherever they are in their awareness, they are my equal on a soul level.