Conversation Board - Re: Christianity should be banned!!

blink

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Re: Christianity should be banned!!
Reply #15 - Jan 29^th, 2007 at 9:25am

"Man must be secretly diseased to be an atheist"

I pulled this quote directly from the page you directed Black Panther to visit, Augo. This kind of statement, taken out of context, can cause certain people to immediately discard any illumination they might find there.

I don't know any more about Steiner than I read on Wikepedia, but his style of writing may be a little difficult for an average lay person to understand and accept. However, I do understand the basic thrust of the page I read, and much of it does make sense to me when I view it a certain way.

What I received from the page you referenced is a description of wholeness...of feeling the depth and richness of life itself without separation. This feeling of wholeness is one which creates in a human being such gratitude that the person cannot contain it....the person feels the presence of God, or simply of something much vaster than themselves...a person experiences an order and beauty and naturalness to creation...and is able to embrace it.

However, I would also like to hear more about your understanding of this "fragmentation" of which you spoke. I have never heard of this historical process you describe, and I would like to hear an explanation which considers that I may not be able to take simply on faith the idea that the "light" that so many describe "is" the historical Jesus.

love, blink

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« Last Edit: Jan 29^th, 2007 at 2:05pm by N/A »

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augoeideian

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Re: Christianity should be banned!!
Reply #16 - Jan 29^th, 2007 at 10:55am

Hi Blink and Irene (again)

To understand the point we get up to with the coming of the Christian Era one needs to research before this and briefly the prior era’s up to this time are;

The Planetary Incarnations of
Saturn
Sun
Moon
Earth
Atlantis
The end of Atlantis
Ancient Indian Civilization
Ancient Persian Civilization
Egypto-Chaldean Civilization
Greco-Latin Civilization
The Christian Era
And further
Cosmic and Human evolution now and in the future.

All the above are in a historical spiritual content.

So, responding to your question is taking it out content and it is good to study the above to have a clearer understanding but briefly The Mystery of Golgotha; The Christ Event on Earth.

We learn the spiritual world does not only comprise of Man; in the spiritual worlds we have Man (incarnate, disincarnate) Angels and the Luciferic (illusional state) and Ahrimanic (materialistic state) influences.

Now, before Christ came Man’s spirits where (and still are) in the clutches of the Luciferic and Ahrimanic influences in the Spirit world.

As human beings increasingly turned their interests toward the physical world of senses, during the post-Atlantean period, it became more possible for Ahriman to work his way into their souls during earthly life and then retain this power beyond death.

During life on Earth, Ahriman’s power makes us see physical, sense-perceptible existence as the only one and blocks our view into the spiritual world. In the spiritual world, this power makes us completely isolated and focuses all our interests on ourselves.

On the other hand Luciferic powers influence a dreamy state upon us while on Earth and when in the spiritual world this influence relates to images of imagination which come before us.

When the Christ had undergone death on the cross, He appeared in the world where soul’s lingered after death and set limits on the Ahriman and Luciferic powers, illuminating the regions that the Greeks had called ‘the kingdom of shades’ with a spiritual bolt of lightning that showed its inhabitants that the light was meant to enter it again. This is what was accomplished on behalf of the physical world through Christ’s death on the Cross casting His light into the spiritual world.

The myth of Osiris being cut into a thousand pieces by his brother Set and put together by his wife Isis is a ‘forerunner prophecy’ of this event.

I hope I've explained it well enough - it is a piece out of the whole and also it must be understood the Luciferic and Ahrimanic influences do have a part in Creation.

I enjoyed what you wrote Blink about the wholeness ... lovely.

C.

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recoverer

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Re: Christianity should be banned!!
Reply #17 - Jan 29^th, 2007 at 12:45pm

Sure there are some negative things that have been done in the name of Christianity, but don't blame that on God, Jesus and all of the wonderful Christians that have lived. The Christians I know are good people. Partly because of their faith they won't end up in a hell like realm when they die.

If a person insists on focusing on the negativity that has occurred, how are they going to see the positive?

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Berserk

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Re: Christianity should be banned!!
Reply #18 - Jan 29^th, 2007 at 1:29pm

To all open-minded site members:

Tomorrow (Tuesday) will be my last day of posting here. But the obnoxious anti-Christan ravings of Chumley and Dude deserve a detailed refutation. After some initial clarifying discussion, I have refrained from a more comprehensive refutation out of respect for the purpose of this section of Bruce's site. So far Chumley and Dude have understandably refused to accept my challenge and shift this debate to the Off Topic section out of respect for those who would prefer this section to be devoted to afterlife issues. It is my assumption that most of you would prefer that the subject be dropped and I want to respect that wish. However, I may be wrong: many of you may want me to refute their arguments on the Off Topic thread. Frankly, I'd rather not bother, given the dogmatism, close-mindedness, and innocent naivite of Chumley and Dude. But if my assumption is wrong, let me know by PM. Otherwise, tomorrow will be my last day of posting for a few months.

Don

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recoverer Super Member Offline Afterlife Knowledge Member Posts: 5027 Gender:	Re: Christianity should be banned!! Reply #19 - Jan 29^th, 2007 at 1:35pm Don: Chumley and Dude aren't the only people who read this forum, so don't leave on their account. Also, sometimes it takes time for seeds to sprout. If they are good seeds, they are bound to sprout. Sometimes in a different field than you expect.
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Berserk

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Re: Christianity should be banned!!
Reply #20 - Jan 29^th, 2007 at 1:57pm

recoverer,

I want to get back to my practice with my Gateway CDs. I have achieved the state "mind awake/ body asleep." The toxic personalities of Chumley, Dude, and others here puts my mind in a polemical mode which does not seem conducive to the inner harmony needed for such exploration. Still, I would engage them polemically if I thought they were intellectually honest, open-minded, and willing to consider other perspectives. Sadly, that does not seem to be the case.

Don

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DocM

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Re: Christianity should be banned!!
Reply #21 - Jan 29^th, 2007 at 2:03pm

I heard on the news recently of a speaker on the Holocaust, who, when confronted with statements about the Holocaust being a myth while she was speaking, shouted out "your grandmother was a criminal!" to the heckler. Each time the heckler shouted, she shouted this phrase back. Finally, the heckler went quiet, puzzled, not understanding how this speaker could have known his grandmother or what she had done, and not being able to prove the contrary anyway. The speaker waited, then she then pointed out, that when you have someone giving a ridiculous argument in a way that can not be proved, there is nothing you can say to that will support the truth without doubt. Holocaust deniers are like this, as are those who throw slander about (note - she was doing this to make a point).

One can pull segments from the bible out of context of violence, carnage, incest, and all the rest. This certainly does not mean that either the old or new testament teach those who read it to go by these examples. So, I have not answered Brendan's challenge to me about dashing children's heads on a rock and rejoicing in the Psalm he mentioned. I don't pretend to know how each historical instance or quote got into either testament. No one believes that the entire texts are not written by men. Therefore, no one should be impressed if unusual verses come out of it in a violent way.

As to your rebutting them in a thread, Don.....why bother? A few examples on the meaning of ancient texts, and how taking things out of context changes the meaning are enough for me. I am just not sure why you need to take your leave. Your topics were well received, and you fulfilled one of the main objectives of those who wish to express PUL, which is giving assistance and showing the way. Lets not forget the posting here is not just for our own private searching, but our thoughts may assist others (and their thoughts may assist us).

Pesonally, I am for deleting any antichristian threads, and moving on with you still on board, Don.

Matthew

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blink

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Re: Christianity should be banned!!
Reply #22 - Jan 29^th, 2007 at 2:44pm

Don, I think that if you are beginning to feel that your private work with the Gateway tapes is important to you and that frequent debating is limiting you, then you should trust your intuition about that.

I am very interested in whatever you feel comfortable sharing about your meditation experiences of this kind, and I'm sure many others will be also, if you choose to share some of them.

Of course, you might consider staying and simply debate less frequently or less strenuously if that is your choice, and if it helps you to continue the exploration you are doing.

I have quite a bit of appreciation for you, and you are missed by many when you are away.

I agree with Matthew that your recent threads have received many responses and appear to be very much enjoyed by some. I have not read some of the sources you have cited yet but I now feel the need to make a comprehensive list of reading I would like to do, and I will include a few of the works you have mentioned, of course.

Just as a coincidence, I picked up a book I had on a shelf yesterday while reorganizing and found that I hadn't finished it in my flurry of hasty reading on astral travel a year and a half ago. To my surprise the title of the chapter, which was marked as my stopping place, was the beginning of a name just recently adopted by a returning member, AhSo. Maybe you recognize it.

love, blink

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Da_Bears_1_fan

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Re: Christianity should be banned!!
Reply #23 - Jan 29^th, 2007 at 3:20pm

recoverer wrote on Jan 29^th, 2007 at 12:45pm:

Sure there are some negative things that have been done in the name of Christianity, but don't blame that on God, Jesus and all of the wonderful Christians that have lived. The Christians I know are good people. Partly because of their faith they won't end up in a hell like realm when they die.

If a person insists on focusing on the negativity that has occurred, how are they going to see the positive?

I'm not blaming God! Or Jesus they are not the problem. The man has swayed people into lies about God and damnation! I know there are great Christians out there!! I just don't like what some of them got to say about God and hell... The only other Christian group I agree with is the Universalist! But they are considered heretics !! Which is laughable if you ask me.. Just because their doctrine of hell is only temporary!! I am a New age person and damn proud of it! But you don't see me go around and cram my beliefs down people's throats!

You know why I got such beef with Christianity? Because people who think they are going to hell of fire and brimstone end up getting that for a brief period time.. Since, we create our own heaven or hell ! Who preaches that ??? Christians! Because they tell people who don't go to church or don't pray every day or weren't baptized are going to burn in hell.. Once you get that told to you so many times you start to doubt!

I wasn't going to add on to this, but for some reason I get told to delete my first topic, which I did delete.. But others who are against me get to add on for some reason?? So, there's my two cents! I was going to stop and I already said I was sorry but there you have it!

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If, you want to communicate with your loved ones on the otherside. Please check out this psychic Melanie Moore Ph. D.! She is the best in the business! IMO her site is http://psychic-guidance.net/ .. 30 dollars for 30 minute readings..

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Da_Bears_1_fan

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Re: Christianity should be banned!!
Reply #24 - Jan 29^th, 2007 at 3:32pm

Berserk wrote on Jan 29^th, 2007 at 1:29pm:

To all open-minded site members:

Tomorrow (Tuesday) will be my last day of posting here. But the obnoxious anti-Christan ravings of Chumley and Dude deserve a detailed refutation. After some initial clarifying discussion, I have refrained from a more comprehensive refutation out of respect for the purpose of this section of Bruce's site. So far Chumley and Dude have understandably refused to accept my challenge and shift this debate to the Off Topic section out of respect for those who would prefer this section to be devoted to afterlife issues. It is my assumption that most of you would prefer that the subject be dropped and I want to respect that wish. However, I may be wrong: many of you may want me to refute their arguments on the Off Topic thread. Frankly, I'd rather not bother, given the dogmatism, close-mindedness, and innocent naivite of Chumley and Dude. But if my assumption is wrong, let me know by PM. Otherwise, tomorrow will be my last day of posting for a few months.

Don

Yo, I wanted to stop this debate! That's why I deleted my first post! I am a newbie here so I didn't no this wasn't the right place to post it at... I am done with this debate because it will just turn into a pissing contest! I just wanted to get this off my chest! I didn't want to start a big fuss! I am just worried about my cousin who commited suicide last April! Because what if she thought she was going to hell of fire and brimstone! And we all know who preaches about a hell like that and about a sadistic God! Unfortuanately, if she thought that she would get that horrible place... From what I understand from reading this site and other new age sites and from talking to well rounded psychics! Also, from studying about the holographic universe..
And also an ungodly amount of time on near-death.com!

I'm sorry again! I Just needed to vent my anger out, since this is the only place I can have people know what I'm talking about... BTW I have Christian friends and I just dislike what most of them got up their sleeves about preaching stuff down people's throats!!

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If, you want to communicate with your loved ones on the otherside. Please check out this psychic Melanie Moore Ph. D.! She is the best in the business! IMO her site is http://psychic-guidance.net/ .. 30 dollars for 30 minute readings..

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recoverer

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Re: Christianity should be banned!!
Reply #25 - Jan 29^th, 2007 at 3:37pm

Alex:

I don't like fire and brimstone and eternal damnation talk either. When it comes to Don, he tends to post verses which state that eternal damnation isn't true.

My feeling is that people are more likely to end up in a hell like realm because they have become unloving people, rather than because of what they believe. For example, if a man goes through his whole life believing he's going to go to heaven for being a child molester because he's only sharing love, his way of being will determine where he's going rather than his delusional belief.

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Steve_Σd

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Re: Christianity should be banned!!
Reply #26 - Jan 29^th, 2007 at 3:44pm

Interesting ideas and as I have subtlely mentioned, I have had my Christian ideas archived for a while and was kind of upset over all of the misrepresentation of many divine ideas but Berserk and Augo really helped me begin to make my peace with my past upbringing. What I really want is to become proficent in seeing the gems that truly did come from heaven and putting the "thou shall not or you will suffer for eternity" behind me.

Given the frequency that Jesus-related artifacts pop up in physical life away from home, things get interesting. I will continue to listen in on the conversation; This should add some very helpful assisstance to my afterlife explorations.

My desire to be 100% original has been getting in the way of my learning lately. Undecided

Steve_Σd

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blink

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Re: Christianity should be banned!!
Reply #27 - Jan 29^th, 2007 at 3:47pm

augoeideian wrote on Jan 29^th, 2007 at 10:55am:

Hi Blink and Irene (again)

When the Christ had undergone death on the cross, He appeared in the world where soul’s lingered after death and set limits on the Ahriman and Luciferic powers, illuminating the regions that the Greeks had called ‘the kingdom of shades’ with a spiritual bolt of lightning that showed its inhabitants that the light was meant to enter it again. This is what was accomplished on behalf of the physical world through Christ’s death on the Cross casting His light into the spiritual world.

The myth of Osiris being cut into a thousand pieces by his brother Set and put together by his wife Isis is a ‘forerunner prophecy’ of this event.

C.

C,

Thank you for your explanation. I find the above part very interesting to picture in my mind. And it brings up a puzzle of mine. A friend has been working (or not working) on a painting for 4 years for a friend who insisted on particular imagery in this piece. It had to be this way, down to the smallest details.

The painting shows a nude woman swimming under the sea in the lower center. A shark follows her on the left. She is swimming toward an underwater cavern to the right. Behind and to the left is a pyramid. From the dark clouds above the ocean a lightening bolt is striking the ocean and penetrating the depths, which are very dark and murky. The cavern and the pyramid appear illuminated, as well as the woman and the shark.

I don't understand the symbolism, but my friend would like to understand it and has had some difficulty completing the painting because he doesn't, I suspect. Maybe you or someone else here can help with that?

love, blink

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Da_Bears_1_fan

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Re: Christianity should be banned!!
Reply #28 - Jan 29^th, 2007 at 4:03pm

recoverer wrote on Jan 29^th, 2007 at 3:37pm:

Alex:

I don't like fire and brimstone and eternal damnation talk either. When it comes to Don, he tends to post verses which state that eternal damnation isn't true.

My feeling is that people are more likely to end up in a hell like realm because they have become unloving people, rather than because of what they believe. For example, if a man goes through his whole life believing he's going to go to heaven for being a child molester because he's only sharing love, his way of being will determine where he's going rather than his delusional belief.

True that! I should of made myself more clear.. I should of put the law of attraction in there too..

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If, you want to communicate with your loved ones on the otherside. Please check out this psychic Melanie Moore Ph. D.! She is the best in the business! IMO her site is http://psychic-guidance.net/ .. 30 dollars for 30 minute readings..

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Lights of Love

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Re: Christianity should be banned!!
Reply #29 - Jan 29^th, 2007 at 4:29pm

Alex,

Bruce Moen, this website's owner has posting guidelines that basically ask all of us to try to have respect for each other. I sure your intentions were as you say... not intending to cause a big fuss.

Many of us here came from religious backgrounds similar to the hellfire and brimstone philosophy. My grandfather, a minister was this type of preacher. When my brother died, my grandfather condemned him to hell from the pulpit both at his funeral and the next Sunday in front of the congregation. That was enough for me to leave the church.

I have learned much from Don. He does a very fine job of bringing new age thought and Biblical teachings together. We asked Don to be respectful of us and from what I have seen, he certainly has been. I would also ask for the rest of us to be respectful of him as well.

Don, I'm sorry to hear you're planning to leave. My time is short these days, but I had planned to respond to your post on the other ADC thread. I can PM you when I have more time though.

Kathy

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Tread softly through life with a tender heart and a gentle, understanding spirit.

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