we're on the same wave length dude, but hold on, don't get ahead of yourself
yes, all is allusion here or there in that theres nothing solid or substantial here, its all in a state of vibrational flux.  not only that but time is temporary illusion. and things break here. the heavens have objects that don't break, because they are not situated in frozen time zones where decay is the nature of renewal.

by the way, A Course in Miracles supports Ickes projections. the Course says whats left of a life when it ends is just this love which are composed of. we are stardust. yet I wish to say I'm certain if one wishes they may keep their present individuality or put it in a drawer..lol...
you will hear many new age people wishing to discredit reincarnation premises. I've read another book which settled for myself the question of its necessity to return and clean up one's act (karma) or just for the adventure.
I'm inclined towards the adventure part after studying my life. we are chips off the block of god, because we can recreate ourselves in C1. undergo transformations if u will.

the reason we don't know its an allusion is because if we knew it was an illusion, it wouldn't be real to us and we wouldn't take anything seriously. we had to make a veil over it, for the gain. Now, someone out there reading this might say, what gain?
I perceive no gain to coming back to this hell hole! but wait a minute..read Monroe..he said the graduates possessed something they didn't have when they began their life.
its more like, dude, you can't explain it, thats why you had to be there, to live it.

I read Cozzolino's book, the Path. the layers of consciousness are there, only because we all decided to be in agreement that the layers were there (afterlife stations and BST's)  the magic of agreeing that the world is flat or round is what I'm talking about.
we created it all. it didn't just appear or explode into being, we created it because we wanted it that way. we are all one in that sense expressing individually. on the 7th level, some have referred to as 7th heaven, is connected to the crown chakra. on that level, if you gravitate there, you can remain for eons for what is eons? simply a part of infinity, but you can't even break up infinity because that is beyond comprehension. ok, got sidetracked..lol...darn words!  on the 7th you may remain individualized as to know yourself that way. Cozzolini was told by his mentor and this makes sense to me, if for one nanosecond an individual unit of consciousness entertains a thought of becoming involved in some activity, drama, life circumstance, has a desire, he or she is teleported into an area with former associates or new friends, to make a new plan and dive into another world...doesn't have to be this planet either.

but love makes the world turn..no sooner do our loved one depart than we are wailing you left me here by myself!!   sorrow will hone the soul to return to remembrance of who and what they are. as we are trying to establish love is the thing we all need to understand to cease the killing. this here planet has a bad reputation for killing!

thousand years of peace anyone?  

I've been other people, and not all of them nice, but most of them wish to impart a service and that is the single premise. but after doing my life review I saw I always made the choice to come back, sometimes for a person I needed to retrieve or just to express love. its all been worthwhile, although I know its not fun here sometimes, its still worthwhile and there is gain.
Ickes is right on. you should read The Path Dude. I had to read it 3 times.
then I started to see how we create reality as co-creators. you surprised me today. you've only 18 arent you? I told this board we got some star children coming in during the shift! lol! watch out! the kids are the future.

you're right. need that contrast. always in the sun wouldn't know what the dark is.
Ickes feels trapped maybe? he might be talking about the cycle we get in..I can see us on the other side raising a toddy and saying "One more time for old time's sake!"

its addictive, or can be addictive from one's perspective, they can say, hey, we are gophers, we are pawns, we are trapped...but really, you don't want to believe everything you read do you? just throw out whats not useful and take what rings true from all materials.  if it falls so flat I feel a thud sound in my solar plexes I'm out of there so fast its like I was never there. love, alysia

Greetings,

Agreed!   Agreed with all three of you, and Ickes.

Maybe another way of saying it is that we, the little specks/wavelets, just get bored with all that big harmonious infinity, and our lives on planets are just our own variations to the big Infinity Wave.

Such boredom could be seen as breaking the big Wave's harmonious flow and therefore wrong, so It lets us out to go clink and clank around awhile, bouncing off each other in the chaos of our motives. And that's often not as much fun as we thought, but we can't rejoin the Big Wave until we're readjusted our vibrations to Its own.

That sounds childish next to yours. I think I'll go write a children's book! 

Betson

I forgot to mention one part of Ickes theory.  He also says that there is in fact time in the focus levels of the afterlife.  He says the illusion of time is not just in the physical plane, but in all of the focus levels as well.  He says that it is just a different system of time, it is not the same time we experience here. This kinda makes sense when you think about it. For example, our higher selves are waiting for us to rejoin. If there is no time, there is no such thing as waiting, because waiting is a term relative to time.  If there was truely no time, our higher selves would not be waiting for us, our loved ones would not be waiting for us, we would not do things in sequential order in the afterlife, because all of these are relative to time. It may just be a different kind of time that we experience after this life on earth. I believe that time exists in some way, shape, or form,  until we become part of the Whole again.

After reading Ickes books, I am pretty sure he does not think the universe was created by satan. In fact, from what I remember I believe he says that we created the universe, but that there are other forces in power now that control it, that are against us "finding our way back to love".  He says the universes is an illusion, but he also realises that is is made of energy and frequencies and vibrations.  What he means is that it is an illusion in the way we percieve it.  We do not see the universe in terms of its true form, its energy, but the way our brains process everything we sense puts a mask over the universe in its true form.

One more thing, regarding the below, the universe is not controlled by dark forces, it is watched over by beings of love and light. When it comes to the World of spirit, beings who are caught up in their own self created darkness, are too cut off from the source to control things. A being has to be willing to connect to love before its vibrational rate will increase to an extent to where it has the power to do anything, and then it'll want to act only according to divine love and wisdom. You can't judge the state of the universe by happens on the 5 o'clock news.

[quote author=OutOfBodyDude link=1165704035/0#9 date=1165858598] In fact, from what I remember I believe he says that we created the universe, but that there are other forces in power now that control it, that are against us "finding our way back to love".  

Quote:


Icke has stated this over and over again throughout most of his books. He knows why we came here, and what happens we we die. As do most of us. However sometimes our spirits do not go "home", they get caught in belief systems and such.  This is the problem that Icke discusses in his books.  Only he gives specific reasons why we get caught up in these belief systems, he points the finger at specific people and entities. Whether he is right or wrong we do not know, only he knows this.  But you can't say he has it wrong if you are not even familiar with his materials.

Quote:


Once again, Icke does not think Satan created the world. He says that we created the world. We as in the whole, and each separate part of the whole residing on earth helps to create and change it every day. In fact, Icke does not even mention Satan as being a real entity. The only thing he discusses is satan worshipers. Not satan himself, there is no such thing as satan and he knows this.

Quote:


Actually both the "physical world" and the "spirit world" basically consist of the same thing... vibrational energy, what makes them different is the frequency of the vibrations. We think the universe is solid because our brains percieve it that way. however this illusion our brain creates obviously dissipates when we no longer have a physical body. I can float through anything on earth when Im out of my body... not much solid going on there is there?

You say Icke is dissillusioned and does not have his facts straight, but I can bet that you havent even read 3 paragraphs of his work. Hmmm looks like someone else doesnt have their facts straight.

Outofbody dude:

I've really been around the block when it comes to spiritual teachings. After a while it becomes easy to spot the questionable ones.

You're young. Either you can do like people such as myself have done and learn the hard way, or you can be smarter than people such as myself and understand early on that there are many people who fool people with their spiritual theories.

David Icke says one thing, A says another thing, B says another thing, C says another thing; each is considered to be the "it" teacher by the people who follow them, yet their teachings disagree about some very key points.

It's up to you man.

I'm not a follower of anyone but myself. I simply brought of a few of his theories to the table, and the ones that make sense I stated that I agreed with. Because they do in fact make sense.  You said that you did not like him because of his theories of satan, a topic that I actually mostly skipped over while reading his books because I too think he goes a little into the deep end with this topic.  I do not believe in the whole satan deal, the aspects of his work that I found to coincide with myself and my experiences I took with me and the rest I left behind.  I'm smarter than putting total faith into something someone writes or believes. Even Monroe and Moen, I did not praise them for the information they gave. It took me a little while of exploring for myself to realise that their theories were the real deal. It may have seemed like I was coming to Ickes defense, only because you and juditha seemed to be distorting his message a little bit. That does not mean I agreed with him, I just don't think he deserves to be criticised for somthing he did not write or believe.

I'm sure you're correct Dude, that you don't take anything said here personally. but it took me a long time to be as big as you seem to be about it all and I'm sure Albert has only your highest interests at heart. I would like to see just what reading material you Albert do approve of..as I've heard no reports about what to read, only what you don't want to read.

thanks, alysia

Outofbodydude:

Great to hear that you have some perspective on Icke. I became concerned, because sometimes people do go too far when it comes to accepting everything a source of information has to say. My guess is that you can think of some examples.

I guess it is possible for a source of information to be a mixed bag of tricks. But I wouldn't go too far with this.  Going by my experience with higer self/guidance, they aren't going to provide me with information unless they are really certain about what they are communicating to me. Therefore, if a source of information starts saying a bunch of false things, it makes me wonder how they came up with the things they say that are true.

I've also found that even if I don't consciously accept what somebody has to say, sometimes a bit of information that comes from them becomes a part of my memory banks. Such memory will unconsciously combine with similar belief systems/thought structures that don't do me any good. As a result I have to do some house cleaning that otherwise wouldn't be necessary. Our minds are a combination of various aspects that don't always operate according to what we are consciously aware of.

 

Rec said: Such memory will unconsciously combine with similar belief systems/thought structures that don't do me any good.
_____

from my viewpoint the opposite is also true, that reading whatever will do you good, but its a balancing thing that goes on in the mind, what to keep, what to file away, what gets pushed down for retrieval later, and what causes alarm bells to sound in us that it is a lie, or the opposite is a great truth.
for me what was a lie previously, unacceptable, becomes acceptable later as someone else's truth, but not my choice anymore, been there, done that, outgrowing clothes is part of our journey, but someone's trash, is still someone elses treasure.
I compare the human mentality (not emotions, just mental speaking of here)
to our computer system and we need to get new software now and then or the computer just doesn't move fast enough to keep up with the others who are enjoying the newest advances in technology.

yet these changes that move so swiftly though our internet system we are connected to can get quite irritating once we are comfortable in our programs and know how the older program works. its like just when we find it, somebody moves it!
so an alarm sounds in the mind, a big X in our error system if we get too comfortable with what used to work and too attached to the older system.
So in essence you are totally correct, its all about gathering experience here by gaining the new software; then a new forum will spring from the new software as bugs are reported and so then goes the story of humanity.

each of us reporting the new bugs and how to improve the test program which they failed to tell you that it was a test program. you thought it was already tested, but no, you too are part of the test program and so it becomes your obligation in a sense, to help the others by reporting the bugs that you found.

lol. u can tell where my head has been at lately. back to experience gathering, which is what probes, probing minds do here. knowledge can only be gained by the living of the experience. and so thats true, and we all have our favorite authors.

reading can also induce paranormal experiences. If I had not read Monroe I would never have been curious enough to have attained my first retrieval experience and I wouldn't be here, this great place to talk about it. I read to the very last page even though I got bogged down frequently with trying to understand what he was saying. so I accepted what I could understand and thought someday I can read it again and understand more.
to make my long posts a little shorter is one of my intentions  this boards health that it remains a place for all to connect with where they cannot speak of these things, hopes, aspirations, PUL, whats in the heart, the afterlife, the spirit, dreams, projections, guides, all the things we speak of are seldom things we can talk of on the street or in the workplace. so it is valuable webspace right now for many.

there are many who will not post here as they are not sure they will be accepted as a part of the gang and they may think we have an exclusive club going on, when we don't, except we may be laboring under that allusion.
the way I see it, when we get the newbies in here, no matter what their experience level is, we should applaud their courage to go public with their thoughts and confidences and sharings of what they have discovered to inspire them. they are trying to give us a gift of themselves. we should let them.
we should see what their gift is by looking underneath their words.
yes I know I'm empathic but its easy to look at a person's intentions behind their words..its easy to find it and respond from their good hearted intentions which in most cases if not all, those good intentions are there.

then it doesn't matter whether we disagree or agree, we are establishing a community or group consciousness and all are welcome.

I worry that the younger ones, who are smarter than the older ones (my pov) will get shut down and not return to the community. that is why I would admonish everyone to preface your posts with first a thought of love, and then go on to whatever you wish to say, and then end it with a thought of love..this way we can make this community a more welcoming place for all.
people are very sensitive to love or a lack of love, so this is all I'm thinking that we never had moderation here before and even someone has to moderate the peer moderators to make sure we don't throw anybody away here just because of their beliefs.

I don't know, maybe I've been here far too long..  but I do love all the people here very much and this is a great board, much better than it used to be.

ok I'll shut up.

Hi outofbodydude I dont always get it right i admit that,but the way i feel at the moment i dont care,as far as im concerned ive got enough things going on in my life so if im wrong im wrong,it wont be the first time and it wont be the last and satan can go to hell for all i care,whether he exists or not i dont care anymore.    Satan can go swivel. 

Love and God bless    Love Juditha

Alysia:

THE WHOLE WORLD READS THIS SITE?!!!!!?

I take back half of what I written since I've been visiting it. I don't know which half yet though. I'll let you know. 

Regarding Bruce Moen's books, it seems like I was guided to his and Rosalind Mcknight's books plus Robert Monroe's third book. Things fell in place in interesting ways.

First I bought Robert Monroe's third book. The pages where he speaks about meeting his I-there were missing. This turned out to be a good thing because when I bought a copy that had the pages,  the timing was perfect.  If I would've had access to these pages after I bought the first copy,  I don't believe they would've meant as much to me. After receiving the pages, it didn't take too long before I made contact with my own I-there (disc).

The name Bruce Moen ran in my head for a while. None of the local bookstores I checked had his books. One day I was on my way to a book store in San Francisco, and then all of a sudden I got the urge to forget about it, got off the freeway, and ate at a restaurant that was nearby. A few weeks later I went to the store mentioned above, the store just happened to have one copy of a Bruce Moen's fifth book, I bought it, and the timing seemed perfect.

Next I ordered the rest of Bruce's books plus Rosalind Mcknight's books from Amazon.com. I received an email stating that all books have been sent. Nevertheless, I only received Rosalind's "Soul Journeys" first. It hit the spot quite well. Later in the evening, on the same day I received Soul Journey's, I heard a voice say, "you'll get what you're looking for next week." The next week I received the rest of the books all at once. The timing was just right for me. I wonder why the order got seperated as it did.

well Juditha I like your attitude. I am going to be saying go swivel it now all the time!
hey Bert can I call you Bert? u are becoming so familiar.  listen, the other day I was just googling different words on the net, people's names, and up pops posts from this board...it quite amazed me that the internet links up this way and all our messages are floating around in cyberspace, what I call the grid. thats what I meant by the whole world reads this forum, even though the number of registered members is what? 2 to 3 thousand and growing. haven't looked lately to see.
so, lol, yea, be careful what you say here, it follows you and echoes down the line.

its so fun just to punch in whatever and see what comes up, I imagine others do this too. yes I see meaning in the way that materials come to us as I don't believe in coincidences.  they say when the student is ready the teacher arrives.

this happened to me once; a voice said "I am with you now."  I had been asking for a guide for weeks. I was a little taken aback as I didn't believe I was worthy to get one anyway. had a low opinion of myself I suppose.
none of us need to think we are unworthy but we sometimes think this way.
as for reading materials, they do appear at the right time.
all my life I wondered what a miracle was and if I could have one, or two, or three. one day if you reach the bottom for some circumstance, one may stop thinking about getting a miracle and decide either consciously or unconsciously to die.
I was conscious in this case that I feared not death. I asked for something to appear in my life which could change my mind about the death I proceeded towards and thats when A Course in Miracles book arrived, at precisely when I was open to receive a new way of looking at life. I remember the conversation which occurred in my head just before it arrived which I know you've read before but maybe some others would like to read about it.
it went something like this, and it had to be some sort of guiding influence there.
as far as my emotional nature at the time I was angry. the guidance said making decisions when you're angry is not a good idea.

Me: I'm checking out. life sucks.
Voice: don't be rash. think it over.
Me: u think I'm making the wrong decision?
Voice: You could defeat this problem if you want.
Me: I need something, I don't know where to turn. I'm stuck. Is there anything you can do for me before I leave?
Voice: give me a little time. I'll find what u need and take u there. put your thoughts on hold regarding death thoughts for now. when the answer appears you will just have a knowing you got what you asked for. you'll get a signal on your body this is it. it will come through the crown chakra. I'll be standing right behind you.
Me: ok I'm going to go forget for awhile and I'll wait for this to show, but I can't wait much longer before I leave here, I am so disgusted.
Voice: just trust me. I know what I'm doing.

and it all happened exactly the way the voice said when I came upon ACIM where it said a miracle was a change of mind. it put me in touch with a state of blissfulness from time to time. then it worked me over to a state of emptiness where I became nothing; the knowing that I was nothing unless I could conceive of being something.
sometimes it hurts to have no ego, to be nothing, it involves the belief system crashing around you as you go into the void.
however the other side of crashing is where the miracles are.
u know the saying somebody up there loves me?
its true. somebody up there loves all of us so much, they would give us the freedom to descend into the hell hole where death seems real to us. but death is not real in that we are annhiliated. we can continue to become more of ourselves because we are a part of something which had no beginning and has no end.

love, alysia

Well Dude, I must be ill red.  I’ve never red Ickes books.  But I will go get my eyes checked.   In the meantime I am looking forward to your next transformation.  I may not be able to notice it if I get new glasses. - Rob