Related to the below, I once had an experience where a negative minded spirit tried to make contact with another spirit through like an energetic portal. This portal had to be used because the two spirits weren't on the same energetic level. The non negative spirit's self will was out of reach of the negative minded spirit. The only way in which the negative minded spirit could get to the other spirits will is if the other spirit chose to open the energetic portal. Therefore, I would say that the spirit Dave had contact with decided to "play" the role of demon because it chose to do so, not because it had to do so.

I've also had a couple of experiences which showed me that light beings look out for earthbound spirits and make certain that they aren't forced into anything. If they do something negative it is because they chose to do so.


[quote author=dave_a_mbs link=1160687858/30#31 date=1161022207]
Having cleared the air I asked,"How long have you been doing this?" The entity responded, "Long time." "How did you get into this kind of thing?" It responded that a spirit had told it that if were to be a demon and torture people then it would never die, so long as it was able to keep on being a demonic entity. "Look inside of yourself and you'll see a point of light. ... Let that light expand, snce that's what you're made of. " Soon the entity had more or less become "illuminated"  and seemed astounded. "I'm made of light."

Recoverer-
As far as I have been able to understand it, you are 100% correct in every respect. And, in addition, the same logic seems to carry over into this life.

When I get ticked off at my wife, it is always because I CHOOSE to be angry, and NEVER because she is a bad person. Because I am impatient, or fearful, or nervous, or otherwise upset, I get to be a demon for her - but fortunately, she knows how to exorcize me.

Afterwards, I get to be remarkably regretful in the face of her love. Were it the unendurable intensity of love from God, I'd doubtless wither away, or crawl under the nearest flat rock. Hostility I can stand against, but love overwhelms everything.

PUL
dave

I agree with your posts Recoverer;  nicely said.  So, really it boils down to 'free-will'. Self-choices, self-responsibility and accountability on a small scale and on a large scale.  The smaller choices affect personally (like Dave's example) the larger choices affect universally (like the mindest of Star Trek)

The source and corner stone of the choice is the deciding factor. Here I think of the San.  The San Shamen, in trance, access God through a Silver Rope which their spirits travelling upon to reach God and their ancestors. 

When not in trance, the Shamen see ropes travelling upon the earth.  One rope is green and the other rope is red.  The green rope leads them to food, water and all that is good.  The red rope leads them to danger and things that are not that good.

It is because they are Shamen that they have access to the silver rope and see the green and red ropes.

Looking at this; there is only one rope to God.  But there are two ropes upon earth and it is up to self to choose which one.

Also; if we look at free-will it is a huge gift given to us - it is given to us out of respect and love.  God doesn't want us to climb the silver rope kicking and screaming in resentment to join him, climbing the silver rope is because we want to with all our heart and spirit.

Regarding my above post; it is prophecy written in the bible.  Visions seen by the Apostles describing what had not even been invented yet.  Maybe though because it is given as visions it is a warning for us to understand and prevent or do you think prophecy must be fullfilled?

Caryn:

I never heard of the shaman thing before. Not surprising, since I haven't taken the time to research it. I believe that the first paragraph below is "very" true (the paragraph that you wrote).  The way has so much more to do with love and joy   than obedience  .

Regarding the second paragraph, I definitely believe that God and the beings of light he works with have a divine plan. However, I don't believe this divine plan will be limited according to the various ways mankind has described it to be. I believe some flexibility is required. Sometimes needs change according to how we carry out our part of it. The important thing is that it is carried out. The other day I was wondering about some teachings that seemed false. They concerned me. Suddenly I was looking down at the top of a piano (symbol for the creative aspect of being in the physical World) from high in the sky. Along with this vision I got the feeling that the World of spirit knows what goes on down here, and it is doing its part to help insure that the creative process down here is carried out according to the divine plan. I don't know if the above symbology comes through clear. It did when I saw it because it was accompanied by the feeling I described.


augoeideian wrote on Oct 19^th, 2006 at 5:12am:

Hi Shirley and Recoverer and everyone

The Shamen is wonderful literature.  I agree with you Recoverer; the Divine Plan.  That was a lovely insight you had there.  And to answer my own question; yes prophecy will be fulfilled.  I opened my book and my eye fell right on this passage:

"Go thy way, Daniel: for the words are closed up and sealed till the time of the end" Daniel 12:9.

Hamlet's Mill turns slowly but steadily marking the time.

Heya Shirley hope you are well;
Yes, the Bible was manmade - the authors were men and women receiving the message of God through them. The Apostles (the 12 disciples of Christ) are like Shamen even more so because they were given great visions.

Yes, 2000 years is a relatively a short period of time (25 odd generations) but then this is called an Age (2,125 odd years) and this Age marks Christ in the Age of Pisces. The returning of Christ happened 3 days after He was crucified.

I am sorry you do not feel a spiritual connection with the Bible and cannot see through the dogma that has been placed upon this sacred book.  Here are some writings I post here so as maybe you may see my perspective on the Bible:

The Bible relates the creation of the world. Whoever accepts it as a description of outer events, knows only half of it.

Everything in the Bible acquires a profoundly symbolic meaning when seen from this point of view. Philo becomes the interpreter of this symbolic meaning. He reads the Bible as the story of the soul.

We read the account of creation, and find in it not only a narrative of outward events, but a representation of the ways which the soul must take to reach the divine. Thus as a microcosm, the soul must repeat in itself the ways of God, and its mystical striving for wisdom can take only this form. The drama of the universe must be enacted in every soul. The soul life of the mystic is the fulfillment of the prototype given in the account of creation. Moses wrote not only to recount historical facts, but to represent pictorially the ways the soul must take if it desires to find God.

All this, in Philo's conception of the world, is contained within the human spirit. Man experiences within himself what God has experienced in the world. The Word of God, the Logos, becomes an experience of the soul. God led the Jews out of Egypt into the Promised Land; He made them undergo trials and privations before bestowing the Promised Land upon them. This is the outward event. Let us experience it inwardly. From the land of Egypt, the transitory world, passing through privations which lead to the suppression of sensuous experience and into the promised land of the soul, we reach the eternal. With Philo all this is an inner process. The God Who was poured out into the world, celebrates His resurrection in the soul, if His creative word is understood and re-created in the soul. Then within himself, man has given spiritual birth to God, to the Spirit of God that became Man, to the Logos, to Christ. In this sense, cognition, for Philo and those who thought like him, was a birth of Christ within the world of spirit.
*

Reading and understanding the Bible is a life-time's work and we read in Revelations 10:9
"And he said to me Take it, and eat: it will be bitter to your stomach but sweet in your mouth like honey.”

However, Shirley I copy this from the first paragraph:
"the ways the soul must take if it desires to find God."

If there is no desire then saying the above is really pointless.

All my love
Caryn

Hi Caryn. it sounds like you have studied more than the bible. can you give us one or two book titles which will discuss the daemon, either in reference to what we are talking about here or in reference to the symbolic language in the bible? You said it was a Greek word right? thanks if you can. love, alysia

In support of what Shirley wrote:

I believe it breaks God and Jesus' hearts that people actually believe that they are so unloving and unwise that they would set things up so that billions of souls end up burning in hell for all of eternity.  

It probably break their hearts even more that people are so willing to accept such a way of looking at things.

If I were in heaven, I don't believe I could be happy no matter how glorius it is, if I knew that billions of souls were suffering in hell for all of eternity.

I'm certain that God and Jesus understand why people make mistakes. I'm able to understand, and I'm not close to being as smart and loving as they are.

Please, please, make God happy, and wish the best for all of his blessed children, no matter how lost and confused they get for a while.

If a passage in the Bible doesn't speak of God and Jesus as beings of infinite love and wisdom, then it doesn't represent them. It must've been inserted by a man who had something else in mind, and that didn't understand what God and Jesus are all about.


[quote author=Shirley link=1160687858/45#57 date=1161378004]Hi Caryn..thank you for that thought out post.


To follow along with the rapture/return of Jesus theory, then one must also follow along that some, in fact the majority, of the human race is going to be burning for eternity in a lake of fire for not following what is written within.