Conversation Board - Where do WINNERS come from..?

B-dawg

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Re: Where do WINNERS come from..?
Reply #15 - Feb 23^rd, 2006 at 9:50pm

what seperates winners from loosers, it's a good question chum.

winner = never give up attitude.
loser = sits there moaning, then dies.

simple as that, you can apply it to every situation in life.
*****************
I couldn't agree more, Spit.
But how to clean up/set right things that are PAST..? Except by doing them AGAIN (as many times as it takes to do 'em right...)
If that's impossible, what good comes for the AIDS orphan, or the retard, or the promising guy who goes schizo at the age of 20??? their Earth experience (if they only get ONE) was a TOTAL WASTE.
I was just using my OWN experience, to set off and illustrate a point. Fact is, if you're born dirt-poor or disabled (neither of which decribes me) you're gonna have a heck of a higher climb than someone who isn't...
Now I know from your posts, Spit, that you overcame some nasty sh!t when you were younger, and I respect you for that. (You have a justifiable right to PRIDE in that, WAY the hell more than if you'd let the situation cripple you or defeat you, in which case you'd have no right to anything but SHAME.) But the fact is, for every story like yours, there are a thousand less edifying ones, shall we say.
Unless suffering has inherent value (and I say it doesn't) - either we can come back to this world and get it RIGHT if we wish... or a lot of us are going to have memories of FAILURE, and FOOLISH MISTAKES with NO CORRECTION gnawing at our guts for billions, trillions of years. Only a sadistic "God" would sentence anyone to THAT...
Right?

B-man

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B-dawg

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Re: Where do WINNERS come from..?
Reply #16 - Feb 23^rd, 2006 at 10:07pm

Hi Ive always believed no matter what life throws at you all you can do is keep trying.Ithink there will always be winners and losers and whatever we are all of us have moaned about something in our lives. My grandmother told me that we all have to suffer at some stage in our lives some more than others bit thats how it is and always will be . The trouble with this world is there is to much greed selfishness and violence and not enough love. And its getting worse all the time . I dread to think what its going to be like by the time my grandchildren grow up.All this world needs is more love surrounding it then we would all be alright. God bless you
*****************
That's why I won't accept anything less than reincarnation, Juditha. If it's not allowed, give
me obliteration instead.
Why?
Because I WANT to keep trying. I WANT to keep
repeating what I got wrong, or what went wrong. If "you only go around once" then you'll have to
accept leaving certain "unfinished business"
UNFINISHED. That's not my style.
I always finish what I start. Even if it takes me a LONG time... That's an ideal I mean
to keep holding myself to, even at the cost of
"Hell" if I have to...
And DON'T accuse me of "whining". I'm NOT. What
I'm doing, is "refusing to accept." (I think even Spit would honor that sentiment...)

B-man

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pratekya

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Re: Where do WINNERS come from..?
Reply #17 - Feb 23^rd, 2006 at 11:56pm

I have always thought the massive amount of injustice in the world is an argument for an afterlife, whether that includes reincarnation, a life review, or placement on different spiritual planes after death (or all of the above). I cannot accept a materialist position because of the suffering of millions / billions. If this is all there is than life is a sick joke to many, many people.

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RyanParis

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Re: Where do WINNERS come from..?
Reply #18 - Feb 24^th, 2006 at 4:15am

In my opinion, spirits incarnate knowing full-well what lessons they want to learn on the Earth. Rather that lesson is of love, overcoming shyness, war, ect, only the spirit knows.

A spirit can incarnate into the physical body of a boy in hell-hole Nigeria. Just because Nigeria is a worthless hell-hole that should be nuked, doesn't mean a spirit wouldn't incarnate there and learn the lessons it wants to learn on the Earth.

As far as the winners, like Bill Gates and George W. Bush, they may be learning Earth lessons vastly different from a little boy in hell-hole Nigeria. Sure, they may be greedy because of all their money and fame, but they could be learning love lessons or overcoming shyness on the Earth to advance their spirits, for example. Only the spirit and God knows. If Mr. Bush died tommorow, then it's my opinion that his spirit planned that incarnation, president stuff, that death and him going back to the spirit world on that day.

When dreaming or lucid dreaming, there is no time on the astral plane of existence. In my opinion spirits know full-well the future and what they're in for when incarnating on the Earth. This doesn't include ants, bugs, or insects. It includes any living creature that has a spirit or astral body.

If a little boy in Iraq dies, or bitches about getting shot at, it's no one fault except his own. If he doesn't like getting shot at, or like living in a hell-hole in Nigera, then he should be smarter next time and incarnate on the Earth in the future as a rich White Man like Bill Gates in America.

It's true.

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mattb1000 Full Member Offline Afterlife Knowledge Member Posts: 152 Gender:	Re: Where do WINNERS come from..? Reply #19 - Feb 24^th, 2006 at 6:02am What is your personal definition of winning then Chumley? If we pretend life was a board game, what would be be your end tile?.
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B-dawg

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Re: Where do WINNERS come from..?
Reply #20 - Feb 24^th, 2006 at 8:57am

What is your personal definition of winning then Chumley?

If we pretend life was a board game, what would be be your end tile?.
******************
End tile, eh? Are we talking about Scrabble here..?
If so, my "end tile"/"winning word" would be...
either "satisfaction" or "personalfreedom" (yeah
I know that's TWO words, but STILL...)

B-man

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mattb1000

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Re: Where do WINNERS come from..?
Reply #21 - Feb 24^th, 2006 at 9:11am

Quote:

What is your personal definition of winning then Chumley?

If we pretend life was a board game, what would be be your end tile?.
******************
End tile, eh? Are we talking about Scrabble here..?
If so, my "end tile"/"winning word" would be...
either "satisfaction" or "personalfreedom" (yeah
I know that's TWO words, but STILL...)

B-man

Do you think money or political power is a must for either of those?

I suppose it depends on peoples perception of satisfaction and freedom.
Would being constantly satisfied become unsatisfying?

Would absolute freedom ever be achieved? freedom from what? Social institutions?, political government?,physical matter?,

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The Road goes ever on and on&& Down from the door where it began....&&Where many paths and errands meet.&& And whither then? I cannot say.&&&&&&

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Spitfire

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Re: Where do WINNERS come from..?
Reply #22 - Feb 24^th, 2006 at 12:01pm

Quote:

what seperates winners from loosers, it's a good question chum.

winner = never give up attitude.
loser = sits there moaning, then dies.

simple as that, you can apply it to every situation in life.
*****************
I couldn't agree more, Spit.
But how to clean up/set right things that are PAST..? Except by doing them AGAIN (as many times as it takes to do 'em right...)
If that's impossible, what good comes for the AIDS orphan, or the retard, or the promising guy who goes schizo at the age of 20??? their Earth experience (if they only get ONE) was a TOTAL WASTE.
I was just using my OWN experience, to set off and illustrate a point. Fact is, if you're born dirt-poor or disabled (neither of which decribes me) you're gonna have a heck of a higher climb than someone who isn't...
Now I know from your posts, Spit, that you overcame some nasty sh!t when you were younger, and I respect you for that. (You have a justifiable right to PRIDE in that, WAY the hell more than if you'd let the situation cripple you or defeat you, in which case you'd have no right to anything but SHAME.) But the fact is, for every story like yours, there are a thousand less edifying ones, shall we say.
Unless suffering has inherent value (and I say it doesn't) - either we can come back to this world and get it RIGHT if we wish... or a lot of us are going to have memories of FAILURE, and FOOLISH MISTAKES with NO CORRECTION gnawing at our guts for billions, trillions of years. Only a sadistic "God" would sentence anyone to THAT...
Right?

B-man

If we only get 1 go around at life, i totally agree, that alot seem like a total waste.

but, if we do go somewhere when we die - i would think that we would probley choose a life, which will give us the most brownie points, for when we die.

it's like taking a crap job, you hate every minute of it. but in 1 years time - you will get your massive house, 10 cars - and totally non argumentative wife.

while the guy, who takes an easy job he likes, he ends up living in his run down shack forever.

but since, we cant prove things work that way - it's very frustrating, thinking that shit happens for no reason and worst of all for no reward.

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PhoenixRa

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Re: Where do WINNERS come from..?
Reply #23 - Feb 24^th, 2006 at 12:08pm

Quote:

Ah .. suffering on Earth must be one of the most complex issues that is misunderstood.

My thoughts are ..

First of all there is Karma and indeed we choose this particular life to resolve our (not Gods) Karmic issues so eventually we learn to break out of the wheel of Karma and therefore not need to come back to Earths classroom.

There are levels of suffering; it may be a Karmic working out but I believe that the things that hurt us, confuse us, make us sick and suffering, are sent with love from our higher souls. These trials make us go deep inside ourselves to search for the reason why and although we still may not understand why, we are seeking and our spirits are growing strong.

If nothing hurt us we would become complacent and stagnant and even our spirits would be forgotten for awhile.

It is human nature that our spirits grow strong through pain. Pain is a strong lesson.

These souls that choose the path of hardship and suffering are evolved and are serious about advancing their spirits therefore one could say that they are in fact the WINNERS.

They knew it would not be easy from the start, sometimes it can be so painful it cuts like a hot knife and it can last a lifetime, but if it is understood that it is sent with love for spiritual growth one can surrender trying to fight the negativity and in saying thank you for my burdens I am not forgotten but loved, the spirit will soar and the burdens will not seem as a negative attack on the person but as from a parent who loves their child.

This does not mean to say that if a soul does not suffer it is not growing or advancing; there are many paths, mansions and dimensions.

We mustnt 'blame God' for we are to become like God. We create our own reality and we judge ourselves. Our spiritual growth on this Earth plane determines what we have to live with; that is live with ourselves; in the spiritual realm once we pass over. The Spirit does not advance in the spirit world until the Karmic wheel is broken and that is why we come back to Earth. The thing is to remember why we came back and where we are from, matter clouds our memory, and hence suffering and hence being at this site right now!

Love and Freedom

Nicely put augoeideian, btw welcome to the site and nice to meet ya.

Peace

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Spitfire

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Re: Where do WINNERS come from..?
Reply #24 - Feb 24^th, 2006 at 12:15pm

Quote:

Is it, really?

Winner is the one who has the happy day.

never giving up attitude is too ..too..keen...this is just life..what is there to be soo keen on?
peace and happiness?
Winner is the one who is peaceful and happy then. ..and what is needed for peace and happiness? Wink

**edit**it is this world, it is the dynamics in this world pushing you to that idea..never give up! fight and struggle no matter what. never give up!..be strong! get up and fight! it is this maddening survival need, that is pushing you this idea.. but is it the truth, really?

because in this idea you need to "struggle with something" for your own survival..my mind comes to a "stop sign" at this very point and it writes on it "go back and think over again". what says yours?

peace and happyness, is a high price for one that has no pride - for if we do die and we do be judged, the short period of happyness, will come to and end with you feeling like crap.

i aint keen on life, alot of the time myself - aggrovates the hells out of me. but, pride lasts a lifetime. it's a constant buzz - all you have to do is think about a time when you have achieved something you really did'nt want to do. instant high.

you make it sound like a bodily instinct, but i see the never give up attitude as quite the opposite. the body crys out for us to take the easiest path in life, you see someone being mugged - your body's telling you, it's going to be a hassle - and it would rather walk past and get some fuel into itself - but if you push yourself to help out, it's just you conqouring a small part of your physical self.

it's a constant battle between want the body wants, and want your mind wants. the more times you beat the body, the more control over it you gain.

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blink

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Re: Where do WINNERS come from..?
Reply #25 - Feb 24^th, 2006 at 1:20pm

Spitfire,

I find myself in agreement with you on this point. This is a transcendent kind of happiness. Compassion, and also passionate living, require that we see through the veil of our "Self" and find our connection to a greater Source so that we can co-create a new Reality, and this can feel very uncomfortable at times. It can be excruciating, but the reward is great.

love, blink

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B-dawg

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An excellent point...
Reply #26 - Feb 25^th, 2006 at 12:58am

MY take on what you said, Spit...
*****************
If we only get 1 go around at life, i totally agree, that alot seem like a total waste.

but, if we do go somewhere when we die - i would think that we would probley choose a life, which will give us the most brownie points, for when we die.
*****************
There we have my basic problem, boiled down to
the kernel.
I've never been into accumulating "brownie points!" Just like I've never been willing to kiss the necessary a$$es which would have given me promotions at work... to the extent brown-nosing is required for earthly success, success will continue to elude me I suppose. (It's not something I've ever felt the desire to learn to do effectively.)
But is "getting brownie points" required for POSTMORTEM success? (Assuming that's not an oxymoron.) If SO...
WHAT A LAME THING "REALITY" IS!
So there we have it (or a big part of it anyway.)
But if life is all about "accumulating brownie points"...
This is a pretty STUPID universe we live in, no? (Ruled by a REALLY stupid "deity" assuming there is a "God.")
No reincarnation, then, would mean that HIGH SCHOOL (that delightful Prussian-inspired institution) is a good representation of Universal Reality! (With "Yahweh" presumably being "superintendent of schools.") Spit, I have about as much respect for (American, can't speak for teaching systems elsewhere) public school-system teachers, as you have for doctors. (And school administrators are generally TOTAL wastes of flesh.) What kind of universe would THIS scenario make for..?
So - thanks again, Spit. More ammunition for
my "anti-Yahwism gun."

B-man

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Berserk

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Re: Where do WINNERS come from..?
Reply #27 - Feb 25^th, 2006 at 2:14am

Brendan, once again, you operate with a mistaken caricature of the positions you attack. In Christianity salvation has nothing to do with accumulating merit or (as you and Spit put it) "collecting brownie points." I will be demonstrating this in detail in my response to Spit's agenda question #4 on my thread, "Spitfire's Theological Issues."

Don

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DocM

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Re: Where do WINNERS come from..?
Reply #28 - Feb 25^th, 2006 at 9:14am

Quite right, Don.

I think Brendan as most of us is used to defining success by the standards of others/society. In heaven, what a surprise to know that we each are judging ourselves! We want to progress spiritually, and while there may be a general path to walk (the golden rule), the judgement of action is a personal one.

So, a spiritual "winner," is very different than a "winner" in western society that Brendan describes.

Matthew

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juditha

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Re: Where do WINNERS come from..?
Reply #29 - Feb 25^th, 2006 at 3:52pm

Hi Chumley I always have took people at face value. The reason im unsure in my head about reincarnation for me personally is the fact that it is better in the spirit world than it is here.The spirit world is full of peace and love. I dont want to die for a long while yet but i will be glad to be in that world one day. I know that when im reunited with dad i wont want to come away from him again. Its not a good world we live in at all but i just keep trying because its all you can do. I mean when i go to spirit i probably will reincarnate one day but i feel at the moment that i would never want to and i dont think your whinening chumley yor like the rest of us you have your own thoughts on certain things. God bless juditha

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