Hey, well i read in another thread that DocM, is in fact a doctor. So ok, i thought we could discuss the power of suggestion in general heatlh issues.
This is partly because i am just about done reading the nature of personal reality by seth, and docm has read some seth as well.
... currently im overflowing at the seams as i correlate these thoughts from this book into my own understanding.
I have been quite not myself lately also, which is a sign to me that i am proccessing the ideas from this book and that i am changing also, in the proccess.
I am challenging just about everything, and in some ways i am now challenging the beliefs and suggestions concerning our state of personal health in medicine.
and from suggestions that are limiting in potential of what i can and cant do in general.
But , for starters i thought we start with the power of suggestion.

this book by seth is full of ideas that challenge medicine, for the better, imo.
From Seth:

"Even in primitive societies, witch doctors and other natural therapists have understood that the point of power is within the present, and they have utilized natural hypnosis as a method of helping other individuals to concentrate their own energy. All of the gestures, dances, and other procedures are shock treatments, startling the subject out of habitual reactions so that he or she is forced to focus upon the present moment. The resulting disorientation simply shakes current beliefs and dislodges set frameworks. The hypnotist, or witch doctor, or therapist, then immediately inserts the beliefs he thinks the subject needs.

Within this context, subsidiary groupings will be included that involve the therapists own ideas. In your society regression is often involved; the patient will remember and relive a traumatic experience from the past. This will then appear to be the cause of the present difficulty. If hypnotist and subject both accept this, then at that level there will be progress.

If the cultural concepts include voodoo or witchcraft, then the therapeutic situation will be seen in that context, and a curse uncovered; which, using the power point of the present, the doctor will then reverse.

Quite without the context of formal hypnosis, however, the same issues apply. With the greatest understanding and compassion, let me mention that Western medicine is in its way one of the most uncivilized hypnotic devices. The most educated Western doctors will look with utter dismay and horror at the thought of a chicken being sacrificed in a primitive witch doctors hut, and yet will consider it quite scientific and inevitable that a woman sacrifice two breasts to cancer. The doctors will simply see no other way out, and unfortunately either will the patient.

A modern Western physician(granted, with the greatest discomfiture) will inform his patient that he is about to die, impressing upon him that his situation is hopeless, and yet will react with scorn and loathing when he reads that a voodoo practitioner has put a curse upon some innocent victim.

In your time, medicinal men, again with great superiority, look at primitive cultures and harshly judge the villagers they think are held in the sway of witch doctors or voodooism; and yet through advertisement and organization, your doctors impress upon the individual in your culture that you must have a physical examination every six months or you will get cancer; that you must have medical insurance because you will become ill.

In many instances, therefore, modern physicians are inadequate witch doctors who have forgotten their craft--hypnotists who no longer believe in the power of healing, and whose suggestions bring about other diseases which are diagnosed in advance.

You are told what to look for; you are as cursed--far more---as any native in a tiny village, only you lose breasts, appendixes, and other portions of your anatomy. The doctors follow their own ideas, of course, and in that system they see themselves as completely justified---as humane.

In the medical field, as in no other, you are faced directly with the full impact of your beliefs, for doctors are not the healthiest, but the least healthy. They fall prey to the belefs to which they so heartily subscribe. Their concentration is upon disease, not health."



so, i poen the thread to any thoughts you may have about this.

Keep in mind, Seth also says that the state of body does follow emotions and feelings, which themselves follow our beliefs.

So maybe we can also talk about a diagnosis of illness originating in an individuals beliefs. not neccesarily originating in the body, so to say.

Good post Matthew. I wish all doctors were as open to being enlightened as you. I do believe that it is coming though as more and more people 'wake up.'   I wish you were practicing medicine here. It's very back-woodsy here. We do have a clinic 8 miles away with a doctor and a P.A.  It's 100 miles to Spokane so in a real emergency when a helicopter is needed to transport someone to a hospital, it takes 45 minutes for it to arrive. As you might well understand, people have died before the helicopter gets here. There is a hospital 60 miles away that some people go to by ambulance. But when time is a factor, forget it.    So there are tradeoffs for living here.  Nice quiet, beautiful mountains, river, lakes, trees, Wal*Mart 60 miles away. LOL

Love, Mairlyn

Spitfire,

Your generalizations are reprehnsible, but do fit in with your chosen name.

I have met good physicians and bad; they run the gamut as they are only people and only human.

There is much that the scientific method has proven to be valid beyond doubt.  If a cholesterol or blood pressure abnormality is ignored, you can be sure that cardiovascular disease, stroke or kidney failure will result. 

I have seen certain religious people refuse treatment for their children with bacterial meningitis.  And the child in question died.   If you are afflicted with a defined medical syndrome, and you believe you will be cured without treatment, barring a miracle it will not happen.

If you inject the meningococcus bacteria into the spinal fluid of any animal and do not give it antibiotics, death will result 100% of the time.  Tell me, Spitfire would you refuse the antibiotics? 

I believe in the ability of the conscious mind to heal, but I do not believe in disregarding laws and facts in our common physical world. 

Should physicians be more caring?  Give more hope?  Yes.  And I know many who do now.  More need to.  In the U.S. medical-legal worries, lawyers and other issues often get in the way of being the kind of doctor you would like.  Still we try and strive on.

M

I should mention here, that when the placebo effect has been studied in controlled experiments, only about 25% of people getting a placebo tablet and told that it would help their condition improved. 

Now while everything present in the physical may have its origin in thought, the interactions are complex.  Thus, one can not dismiss medicine and say "cure yourselves,"  for every disease.  For instance, gluttony and insecurities may cause someone to be 80 lbs overweight.

We know with the high blood pressure, diabetes and high cholesterol that accompany this state of overweight that there are awful complications.  So in essence, the person should work through their spiritual weakness which has caused the gluttony, but if it took them years to find a solution, they should also treat their pressure, high sugar and cholesterol.  If you take that patient 80 lbs overweight and let her sugar remain three times normal, with high cholesterol and blood pressure, she may have a heart attack while wrestling with her inner spiritual conflicts that caused the overeating. 

So let's not through out the baby with the bathwater.  As I said, I believe in incorporating positive thingking, affirmations and visualizations in with the standard treatment.  Its easy to be reactionary against Western medicine, but this will forgo many proven advantages.

M

hmm, good diagnosis...err good points.  every situation is unique, and im not saying to just say the heck with western medicine to someone who needs it

One of the funny things about reading seth is that his suggestions and ideas are basically 30-40 years old. and they may take another 30 -40 years before its officially accepted that we have more potential then we realize. And have certain abilities.
but i think its actually corrrect what he's saying.
Elias has suggested we can grow a new tooth, or heal a gash in our arm with our own 'power'. for example.
The challenge is actually accepting that though. We are so programmed we are victims and have no power to heal ourselves...its confusing at times.

For instance, last summer i was working on installing an electrical fixture and cut my thumb, when i did it, i rushed to the hospital to get 6 stitches and they gave me shots. It cost me 1200 dollars. but anyway, i wasnt thinking at the time even in the slightest that i could heal that cut 'before my own eyes', like a magic trick.

See what i mean. I dont even trust that i could do something like that ...heh without the doctors help, anyway.
Though, i somehow believe that it is an ability that can be accessed in some way...Thats its possible.
And that would prove to be an advantage over western medicine...and a little cheaper

At TMI I met an emergency room doctor who carries a bag, but it doesn't have the standard things in it that a doctor's bag has. He has loads of crystal, wands, spheres, divining rods, etc. I was amazed and impressed. 

He is/was a diabetic. He had been having some pain in his pancreas and asked 3 of us if we'd heal him. Now I hadn't taken any Reiki yet, so told him that I wanted to be a healer, but had never tried. He told me that was fine, he could feel the healing energy I had.

So he laid on a massage table with one person holding his feet, one person at his head, and I was to his left side holding my crystals towards him and sending healing energy to him.  We all 3 saw his pancreas rise (non-physically) and we all shot healing energy at it. When it was over, he said he'd really felt my energy.  Then he checked his blood sugar and it was perfect and he didn't need to take his insulin. He still didn't need to take his insulin by the end of the program but I haven't heard any more of him so don't know if this lasted. I would like to think that it did. 

Love, Mairlyn

And it's all energy, yes.

Quote:


Doctors protect doctors, therefore none of them deserve mercy. they are a product of the same teaching, just like i dont like muslims who are part of extremist groups, same teaching, which often results in the pain of others.

while i agree with doctors being able to diagnose things quite well, still they can hardly do anything about it.

Yes sir you have bowl cancer.....do something for you? sorry we cant we only like to tell you wants wrong.

religous people are almost as bad as doctors, but at least most of there teachings include compassion. Im not suprised they dont trust doctors though, i saw a baby with meningitus and the doctor took the babys hands and feet off. that doctor took away that kids future with a few hours on a table. parents, had no choice but to trust the butcher. i would have honestly said, i would consider letting the kid die, for a life without feet/hands is no life at all.

i dont know any american doctors, although they look far more positive then british ones.

i'll tell you what doctors have done for me.

By age 6, i was told i would never walk normally again, i spent 4 months in hospital, i had students performing tests on me, stabbing me to death with needles, which they were useless at doing. Yet no one bothers to listen to a 6 year old, so they pinned me down, and kept on stabbing me with needles.

they came to the conclusion that they would need to operate on me, yet it still would not be normal, i would be in hospital for another 6 months in constant pain. i utterly refused treatment by this point.

i went through 2 years of agony, with no sleep each night, to find out i am perfrectly fine, i can run faster then a road runner.

by age 9, i had another problem i had to go see a doctor about, i was stuck on a test for 9 weeks doing the exact thing which made me ill, just so they could have the results for there stinking medical papers.

after that, i found out it was in curable, i had things stuck down my neck, up my arse 3 times, it got stuck once, and i was in there for 10 hours, fully conscious, they never even bothered to put me out.

at a young age, the stuff i heard doctors say, almost destroyed me, i was nothing more then an object, a 6 year old kid who understood nothing. But if i had listened to them, i would be highly imobile, would be in constant agony, and constantly depressed, all thanks to some fool making decisions based on infomation, any sane person would deem in-accurate.

When you hold someones life in your hand, then that trust should be handled carefully, with dignity and with respect, simple concepts which doctors care nothing for.