Conversation Board - Something which SHOULD be a no-brainer...

B-dawg

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Something which SHOULD be a no-brainer...
Dec 8^th, 2005 at 10:48pm

About religious warfare.
I haven't read the Koran, but I'm sure there is
a parallel claim to the Biblical one which states
that you can literally make mountains move, if
you have the "faith of a mustard seed..."
Well, apparently nobody has had the faith of
a mustard seed even ONCE over the past 2000
years, in either Christianity or Islam.
Why?
Well, look at the war in Iraq. George W.'s "crusade"
versus Zarkawi and Bin Laden's "Jihad."
It is being fought with BULLETS and BOMBS. What's
going on here?
If EITHER of these religions be more than childish, idiotic, wishful fantasies... why the hell are SOLDIERS necessary? The (Christian) chaplains and the (Muslim) clerics ought to be having it out with thunderbolt duels, invoking Yahweh (or Allah) and hurling thunder and lighning at each other with their right hands, while clutching their Bibles (or Korans) in their left. I mean, both religions believe in MAGIC, why can't they produce any???
REAL religious war: BO-RING. I mean, you don't even have legions of undead skeletons, wraiths and mummies (appropriate for the desert setting, no?) to add some... COLOR to the action. (Wouldn't undead legions look cool on the T.V. news?)
Hell, in the world of Dungeons and Dragons, clerics actually can do USEFUL things, like levitate, turn fallen enemies into undead minions, turn sticks into snakes (ANOTHER religious "miracle" that nobody can seem to do anymore!) and even fly. But in the real world, clergy/clerics are little more than money-grubbing parasites.
Why don't most people see this? That organized religion (ESPECIALLY ABRAHAMIC RELIGION) is a SCAM? It's a no-brainer! (Or is it that most PEOPLE no-brainers..? If so, how can people be so dumb, and FUNCTION normally? That one's always blown my mind!)
People are SO afraid of death, they will come up with the SILLIEST notions to stave off that fear, that there's some "Big Daddy" promising them pie-in-the-sky-when-they-die. But isn't that a STUPID reason to go to war???
I'll leave that one to your judgement(s)...

B-man

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Rob_Roy Super Member Offline Posts: 539 New Hampshire, USA Gender:	Re: Something which SHOULD be a no-brainer... Reply #1 - Dec 8^th, 2005 at 10:54pm Oh please! I never took you for a simpleton. You can't possibly be this shallow and fallacious. Come on! Bob
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B-dawg Super Member Offline Afterlife Knowledge Member Posts: 596 Missoula, Montana Gender:	Re: Something which SHOULD be a no-brainer... Reply #2 - Dec 8^th, 2005 at 10:59pm Why is it shallow and fallacious to satirize stupidity, Bob? Maybe more people should lampune (sic) the claims of religious leaders, instead of following them like a herd of mentally-challenged sheep... B-man
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Berserk

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Re: Something which SHOULD be a no-brainer...
Reply #3 - Dec 8^th, 2005 at 11:29pm

Nancy Dorner, "Do you Want Mountain-Moving Faith?" in "God's Vitamin C for the Spirit," pp. 55-56

"A small congregation in the foothills of the Great Smokies built a new sanctuary on a piece of land willed to them by a church member. Ten days before the new church was to open, the local building inspector informed the pastor that the parking lot was inadequate for the size of the building. Until the church doubled the size of the parking lot, they would be unable to use the new sanctuary."

"Unfortunately, the church...had used every inch of their land except for the mountain against which it had been built. In order to build more parking spaces, the would have to move the mountain out of the back yard. Undaunted, the pastor announced the next Sunday morning that he would meet that evening with all members who had `mountain moving faith.' They would hold a prayer session asking God to remove the mountain from the back yard and to somehow provide enough money to have it paved and painted before the scheduled opening dedication service the following week."

"At the appointed time, two dozen of the congregation's 300 members assembled for prayer. They prayed for nearly three hours. At ten o'clock the pastor said the final `Amen.' `We'll open next Sunday as scheduled,' he assured everyone.' . . ."

"The next morning as he was working in his study, there came a loud knock at his door. When he called `come in,' a rough-looking construction foreman appeared, removing his hard hat as he entered. `Excuse me, Reverend, I'm from Acme Construction Company over in the next county. We're building a huge new shopping mall over there and we need some fill dirt. Would you be willing to sell us a chunk of that mountain behind the church? We'll pay you for the dirt we remove and pave all the exposed area free of charge, if we can have it right away. We can't do anything else until we get the dirt in and allow it to settle properly.'"

"The little church was dedicated the next Sunday as originally planned and there were far more members with `mountain-moving faith' on opening Sunday than there had been the previous week!"

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Touching Souls Super Member Offline LOVE IS ALL, SHINE YOUR LIGHT THAT OTHERS MAY SEE Posts: 1966 Metaline Falls, WA Gender:	Re: Something which SHOULD be a no-brainer... Reply #4 - Dec 8^th, 2005 at 11:36pm Now this gave me energy running through me Don. I love the way spirit works. LOL Namaste, Mairlyn
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B-dawg

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Interesting story Don...
Reply #5 - Dec 9^th, 2005 at 3:24am

But it has an urban-legend sound to it...
"Acme" Construction Company? Isn't that
the name of the outfit where Wile E. Coyote buys
all his Roadrunner-catching gadgets???
Otherwise, I's say it's a fitting companion to my
post... as a rebuke to "fire n' brimstone" fundamentalists and
literalists.
Religion ISN'T worth fighting wars over. 'Nuff
said...
(AND you must admit that the war in Iraq HAS
taken on the dimensions of a religious war...
just listen to some of Bush's team on T.V. or
some of Karl Rove's rantings..! He makes me ashamed to be over one-half Norwegian.)
Suffice it to say, I support the soldiers but NOT
the pols in this one... bring 'em all home, I
say. (And maybe send all the pols to Iraq to
"stay the course?")

B-man

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Tim F. Ex Member	Re: Something which SHOULD be a no-brainer... Reply #6 - Dec 9^th, 2005 at 7:57pm Why do I love this thread so much? I gotta say Chums, I often don't see things the same way you do but I do love your spirit! You consistantly make me laugh, i am grateful to you for that. It's also fun for me to see the war mentioned at this site, something i think about a lot... Love y'all, Tim
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B-dawg

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Re: Something which SHOULD be a no-brainer...
Reply #7 - Dec 10^th, 2005 at 2:02am

As you like it,Tim...
And you know, the name "Acme" in any story
I hear (referring to ANY company except for
the boot manufacturer) really should arouse
skepticism, wouldn't you agree? (Maybe if
Mr. Coyote would order from another firm, he
wouldn't keep blowing himself up and falling
off of cliffs..?)
Maybe that's a lesson for us all.

B-man

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Cricket Senior Member Offline Afterlife Knowledge Member Posts: 351 Gender:	Re: Something which SHOULD be a no-brainer... Reply #8 - Dec 10^th, 2005 at 9:31am Snopes says urban legend, first on the list if you search "move mountain".
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Touching Souls Super Member Offline LOVE IS ALL, SHINE YOUR LIGHT THAT OTHERS MAY SEE Posts: 1966 Metaline Falls, WA Gender:	Re: Something which SHOULD be a no-brainer... Reply #9 - Dec 10^th, 2005 at 12:04pm I don't trust Snopes anymore. There's a lot of things I've checked out that are true and they say are urban legends. One must use their own discernment with everything. Love, Mairlyn
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Berserk

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Re: Something which SHOULD be a no-brainer...
Reply #10 - Dec 10^th, 2005 at 3:04pm

Dear B-man,

Look up 'Acme" in any urban phone book, and you'll see that it is as commonplace a logo as it gets. It is therefore irrelevant to the truth or falsity of Nancy Dorner's story, which I found in a collection of investigated inspirational stories. The real issue is this: what if it were true? Would that make you reconsider your skepticism about spiritual guidance? Is your own materialist position even in principle falsifiable? Because if it is not, it is meaningless. In any case, I've encountered modern miracles far more impressive than this mountain-moving account. These modern miracles make it easier for me to believe the key biblical miracles.

B-man, I've always admired your past candor about your close-mindedness. But my question to you is this: can you honestly say that well-attested modern miracles and verified astral exploration might potentially convince you that there is a loving God? Why engage in this dialogue year after year if you are not at least unconsciously seeking spiritiual truth?

Actually, I have a confession. I just told that TRUE story to push your buttons. Most of the -posters on this board are nice people. Me? Well, I'm just not very "nice." I enjoy tormenting you. 8)

Let me share what I should have said about your allusion to "mountain moving" faith:

[JC] "I assure you, even if you had faith as small as a mustard seed, you could say to this mountain, `Move from here to there,' and it would move. Nothing would be impossible (Matthew 18:20).

Jesus is well aware that most people assent to spiritual teaching with a very low level of consciousness. So he uses a contemporary rhetorical device--Semitic hyperbole--to shock his audience into meditating more deeply on what he is really teaching. His disciples have generally been unable to duplicate His healings and imagine that what they need is more faith. Jesus is pointing out that their perception of "lack" already creates doubt and sabotages their healing efforts. The mustard seed was the smallest known seed in popular Jewish imagination. Jesus is using this image to warn that it is self-defeating to obsess about how much faith one has. Faith needs to be childlike and children do not get bogged down with depressing introspection. One must instead boldly act on the assumption that one has all the faith one needs. With practice and meditation, the unnoticed seed of faith can germinate into the flower of healing. The mountain is merely a Jewish metaphor for self-imposed limits to the potential of empowering faith. This is only one principle in Jesus' elaborate prayer technology.

But your main point was about war, wasn't it, B-man? Well, tomorrow I will address your point in a way that will break down your defenses and force your conversion. Being a tolerant sort, I'll leave it up to you whether you become a Baptist, a Presbyterian, or a member of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Buddhists. I'm giving you a day, so you can go out an buy a bottle of Scotch. My post tomorrow will best be read drunk! Undecided

Your beloved thorn in the flesh,
Don

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Justin2710

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Re: Something which SHOULD be a no-brainer...
Reply #11 - Dec 10^th, 2005 at 3:53pm

Quote:

Being a tolerant sort, I'll leave it up to you whether you become a Baptist, a Presbyterian, or a member of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Buddhists. I'm giving you a day, so you can go out an buy a bottle of Scotch. My post tomorrow will best be read drunk!

Hey that was pretty funny! Can't say that i agree with the war though, no matter what anyone says (i'm pretty closeminded, you betchya). Guess i'm just a bleeding heart liberal (with some conservative streaks)...

Yeah but anyways, isn't Sagittarius a great time to get expansive, joyous, and light hearted when used on the positive side? Especially after the experience of that dark, intense, hidden, repressed, and penetrating energy of Scorpio we just went through? I've feeling rather "loopy" lately too, and Sun in Sag is temporarily going through my 5th (Solar) House of spontaneous childlike joy, and expansiveness (Faith baby, faith), so the joy is doubled being both doubly Solar (and now trining my Ascend.) and with a Sagittarian background.

But, like all things except for Oneness (the One standard--the Absolute of lutes [or is it flutes?]) theres a positive and negative, and boy does Sagittarius energy sure like to exaggerate to the Nth degree and blow EVERYTHING out of balanced proportion....

Pretty soon we gotz Happy Cappy coming up to bring yet more balance to the previous sign, a time for reflection, balance, depth, and concentrated concentration, but unfortunately a bit over serious in some respects. For those very spiritually intune, its a great time for meditation and clearing because of the Solar Perihelion in early to early/mid Jan.

Then the "Water Spiller" hehehe of Aquarius (well not really, its the Water bearer), whos a bit like (well alot like) Sagittarius and Cappy roled together and equally balanced (very potentially speaking)...

Then Pisces, the combination of all, and a interesting time for both service, reflection, spiritual work, and yet expansive joyous socialness.

Poor Pisces (and those with Pisce/Jupiter/Neptune strong)... Dust bins of the Zodiac and karmic vacuum cleaners (though ultimately it is the Goat which is the true sacrifical animal, unfortunately for Solar goats, but these goats don't look at anything as "sacrifice" just doing their job).

Uh OH...i'm getting off topic here, and the Moderator Gods might taketh away! J/k Bruce old buddy, all in good humor really.

Namaste, Happy AhhOooMM, Father, Mother, Son (actually Mom came first both before the Father, and the ckicken Cheesy

), Base, Heart, and Crown balancing....and let the Mmmm shatter your AhhOhhh, then be reborn again in the Ohh of the Heart of centered balance.

What riddles doth this crazy mad man speaks? 6th Chakra/dimension riddles?

Isn't it so dualistic not to conform to exoteric standards of spirituality?

Synthesis, its all about synthesis, the knowledge of the Gods is there for the taking, but you can only go so far before you live Da principles, and there's an automatic governor, gov'nor...course there can always be some backlash when one becomes too mentally polarized and then BAM the Heart aches and seems to break, then you humble yourself again to the Balance, its always about Da Balance. But boy do i love to sleep though. Darn attached to sleep and dreaming.

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Rob_Roy

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Re: Something which SHOULD be a no-brainer...
Reply #12 - Dec 10^th, 2005 at 4:18pm

"Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Buddhists."

LOL!!!

You do know that by capitalizing the "D" in "Day" you are referring to the Reorganized Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints (RLDS), don't you? The Salt Lake City bunch uses a lower case "d". The Reorgs are in Independence, Missouri (they didn't follow Brigham Young) and they have since changed their name to Community of Christ, but anyway, a little piece of Mormon trivia for you. Roll Eyes

Bob

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Berserk Super Member Offline Afterlife Knowledge Member Posts: 979 Gender:	Re: Something which SHOULD be a no-brainer... Reply #13 - Dec 10^th, 2005 at 4:33pm Yes, Bob, and I deliberately capitalized "D" to give a needy soul like B-man more specific guidance. Don
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Rob_Roy Super Member Offline Posts: 539 New Hampshire, USA Gender:	Re: Something which SHOULD be a no-brainer... Reply #14 - Dec 10^th, 2005 at 4:47pm Sure. Are you also going to tell him how many wives he should have? Bob
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