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killing your self (Read 23829 times)
nomad
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killing your self
Jul 15th, 2005 at 7:44pm
 
is it wrong?? or could it be end of life end of suffering??
44 now still someway to go
shit, sorry did i ask for it??
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hiorta
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Posts: 102
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Re: killing your self
Reply #1 - Jul 16th, 2005 at 1:28am
 
'Killing' yourself is impossible.
All you will achieve is transferring your life to another level, which, because of your action, is very likely to make matters even more difficult for you.
The original set of problems will still be with you, only they will be much harder to deal with.
No matter whatever the situation, it is always best to try to resolve the problems - growing as you try.

There is no other way.
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Brendan
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Re: killing your self
Reply #2 - Jul 16th, 2005 at 1:40am
 
A philosophical divergence on this one...
What if a guy killed himself because he had
been, say, horribly burned in a fire and was so
disfigured and disabled, he faced a life of
involuntary celibacy???
I mean, suppose he was a real gigolo mack before
the fire, and seducing women had been his life?
O.K., he kills himself. How would his problem carry
over into the afterlife, considering that the
afterlife IS, BY DEFINITION, a no-sex zone?

B-man
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dave_a_mbs
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Re: killing your self
Reply #3 - Jul 16th, 2005 at 11:48am
 
Hi Nomad-

Somehow the words come to mind, "Nomad is an island." (Pun intended by my inner self.)

Not only can you not kill yourself in order to save yourself, but the act embodies your life force intp projecting the very situation that you are attempting to flee, which brings you back into the same place that you left off for asnother lifetime. I've done many repair sessions with people who suicided and found themselves back in the same state.

The poet Lamartine put it nicely, "La sortie plus vite est par." That is, "The fastest way out is through."

If you life is fecal today, it's because yesterday you wanted to teach yourself a lesson and have made it so. SO, learn it, and go on. Admittedly, this can be a prolem. As someone put it, "When you're up to your ass in alligators it may be hard to remember that the initial plan was to drain the swamp."

Before you check out permanently, find someone who can regress you back to your last few lives to understand what
inspired you to to set yourself up like this. That understanding can make things instantly brighter.

dave
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life is too short to drink sour wine
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alysia
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Re: killing your self
Reply #4 - Jul 16th, 2005 at 11:07pm
 
Brendon said: considering that the  
afterlife IS, BY DEFINITION, a no-sex zone?
_______

I don't know where you get this idea Brendon but it's simply not true; you can have all the sex you want over there but you might get bored with it after awhile. I had a few energy exchanges on the other side, it's nothing like physical sex, it's much better, it's very loving and spiritual and one of the differences is that babies are not produced there from the act of union.
Brendon, you crack me up.
you will attract to you on this side or that side, the type of woman that matches your energy vibration, so go enjoy yourself and stop worrying about it.

love, alysia
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blink
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Re: killing your self
Reply #5 - Jul 17th, 2005 at 10:22am
 
Hello Nomad,

I like your name.  It expresses our condition here doesn't it? 

You say that at 44 you have a long way to go.  You are on a long hike and suffering up a hill and thinking, wow, this is going to take forever.  Up at the top you are hoping to enjoy the beautiful view and breeze on your face. 

The problem is, you don't really know where the top of that hill is.  Your mind is playing tricks on you.  The top of the hill may be 40 years from now or it may be one hour from now.

You always have freedom of choice and no one can take that away from you.  But there are others along on your walk. 

Sometimes we listen to your stories.  Sometimes we help you along.  Sometimes you have helped us.  Sometimes we sing a silly song or argue.

No matter what is occurring at the moment, losing one of us is a loss to us all.  So just keep on walking, if you can. 

We are all in this together.  There is surely someone who can help, maybe just around the bend. 

And it really is okay to sit down and rest for a while.  No one is left behind.  That is an illusion. 

love, blink
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alysia
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Re: killing your self
Reply #6 - Jul 17th, 2005 at 11:51am
 
Quote:
is it wrong?? or could it be end of life end of suffering??
44 now still someway to go
shit, sorry did i ask for it??

_________________

Nomad, read Blink. that was true. we care or why bother to respond?
but your question is honest and is one we all ask where you say sheeet, did I ask for this? (ha, this board turned that word into feces word, lol)

used to ask myself all the time about that awful karma word. what a rotten childhood I had...my mother didn't even know I was in the room, much less love me. so later I see what the plan was...how bad things can happen to good people. then if I could see the good, if I could find it somehow, I could maybe create the good, I could rise above it and choose what is in the moment to be happy about...might be feces moment but u can see what's under the feces, might be something worth saving, might be like Blink said, a breath of fresh air within the next hour. I'd say that you gotta be the first one to care though, then others care about you; it's what you put out you get back. people make a difference here in your life if you let them. did I choose all this? well I suppose I did and then forgot I did. I cannot believe that karma is entrapment though, or designed by someone in charge. life is too much an experiment for me to believe that way. think about the things you love, not the things you hate because it's going to be over in the blink of an eye; no use killing yourself for some pointless nirvana experience you think is on the other side. you must know you're going thru a shift in consciousness just like the rest of us. just ask yourself how and why you choose to come here and the answers should show up sooner or later if you're persistent. I'm sure you have an internal guide in there to make your way easier. keep in mind all of us are working on getting you less pessimistic about it all but you're in charge of what you accept here. I think it's pretty neat that you are asking questions. anytime I ask a question I notice it leads to another question, then this process of asking speeds up and I rest for awhile; then it starts all over again. I call this the shift in consciousness; the speeding up process of your frequency. thanks for being open with us and letting us respond to you because all viewpoints are important here. love, alysia...
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Kardec
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Re: killing your self
Reply #7 - Jul 19th, 2005 at 7:16am
 
Brendan,

As I'm kind of technical guy my opinions are better conveyed by examples…

You mentioned Sex: (let’s go to a Sex based example)

Let’s suppose that for several lifetimes you haven’t been able to reach neither real happiness nor peace because sex was always the driving force in your live but you were unable to use this force as a way to exchange good LOVE energy with the others, to you (the guy in the example) sex was only pleasure without taking in account what was the other person feeling and in order to experience more and more you would be able to do any thing. So several times you have deeply hurt someone’s heart (or even your own heart) to obtain the sex you were looking for.
This way each time you reached your place in the afterlife you couldn`t enjoy the wonderful condition of being in afterlife once your mind was full of bad feelings and you were so used to have that kind of sex that the only way to obtain it would be moving for a place were people live almost only for such purpose, what a hell isn’t it?

So what you could do for you to avoid the circle of continuing for thousands of years?

For instance, you decide to go through an experience were you wouldn’t be able to have sex in the way you was used to. Once time pass you suddenly met a grill and she felt in love to you even knowing about your problem due to such love both of you have deployed a new( love based) form of getting deeply in touch with each other.

So in this “simple” or maybe silly example you would finish that lifetime with an energetic totally different and this time your experience at the afterlife would be by far better than the previous ones. Did you get that?

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My hope is to get there whatever does "there" mean...
Kardec  
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alysia
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Re: killing your self
Reply #8 - Jul 19th, 2005 at 10:01am
 
Kardec, this post looks full of wisdom to me, is my viewpoint too, you seem to have a way with words so thats cool. I'll take the same example as no reason not to talk about sex: no denying it's a sexual planet of polarity energy. religion has made it a bad thing to be too attached to the experience of satisfaction of it, and the pleasure of it, but as you say if you are thinking of the beloved, to care for them, it turns into a very spiritual thing can help mankind evolve into better, more rounded out and less selfish human beings. yes, after the death, according to Monroe's book you can gravitate over to the sex pile and jump in and become like this sensual addictive thing seeking gratification and remaining stuck there to not ever get it; like the song was so popular "I can't get no satisfaction."
first hand I observed people doing this. I worked in a place which published ads looking for other sexual addictives because I needed to make money; but on the other hand I learned to cast aside my judgments although I never understand why the ads were all the same...they were all measuring their tool. I'm sorry if I shock anyone here; don't mean to, but as I said, it is definetely a sexual planet and there are reasons for that and we need to start making sexuality addiction something to look at closely and examine but not to say that it's just bad, bad, bad. it's a journey only. Monroe tried to pull one out of the sex pile but he slithered back in; the retrieval does not always work, but at least he tried and maybe someday we help each other and it will work. so glad he took that journey and gave me something to examine in my own head, to try and understand the various journies we take here. I think it would be a type of hell to be in such a pile of others and with no objective to obtain but to be satisfied, and yet never achieve that. so all the more reason if you have someone beside you, to learn to love them, not try to get something from them, sexually or otherwise, but to give them something, whether it be wisdom or your heart, and be glad you have someone, because not everybody does and not everybody can hold the beloved for longer than it takes to have an orgasm. this is kindergarten world. just wait until you explore other realities. Sex pales. love to all and thanks again Kardec, love technical people! Alysia
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mystic_dreamer
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Re: killing your self
Reply #9 - Jul 20th, 2005 at 12:44am
 
Well....I agree with what has been said here: checking out early to end an unhappy life will not work, as your suffering just follows you into the afterlife.
There was a time in my life when all I wanted to do was to 'check out'.....to end my own personal and horrible suffering. And towards the end of my suffering, I had several spiritual encounters...by guides or angels, who literally took me by the hand and led me thru my trials.
Once away from my 'hell'....I was able to open up to who I really was and what my purpose here really was. Alot of soul searching took place on my part....at some point I came to realize that my hell was actually lessons in gaining many traits that I was lacking in: inner strength, endurance and so on. My hell originated for me because I wasn't learning. Thus, hell is created.
So then once the point of the lessons were realized by me, I was able to move on to a new stage...and that was 'forgiveness' towards the person that I viewed as causing my hell to begin with.
How outraged at myself I was to find myself forgiving that person! How could I?? Just yesterday I hated, despised, loathed that person....and then today, I am singing happy tunes and feeling nothing but forgiveness for him. Oh I was mad! How could I do that to myself?!
However.....it felt so darn good to not be carrying that burden of hate around with me...and it felt like heaven to feel so free of it all.
So I accepted these new feelings. And in doing that, I was able to move on to the next stage....and that was, learing how to put my new self together...and once I had that going, I could finally get back to the inborn ability that we all have, and that is to tune in to the all that life is, the universe as a whole....who we are, our place in the realms of afterlife...the ability to understand all that surrounds us. Sounds strange I guess...I don't know how to word it. I guess connecting with all life that surrounds us...and you can actually understand the birds....the water...the rain....the wind.....you become a part of it....because we are actually, but now you are connecting with it...
And...once I was back in this natural state of ability...that I had lost touch with for so many years, I understood one thing quite clearly...and that was: I would have taken my hell with me if I had checked out when I had earlier wanted to.
Why? Because it is your spirit leaving this world and going to a higher up....you remain who you are...and you take with you all that you have within you at the time you leave here.
So....in all this, my point is from my perspective...is you can leave your tv behind when you go....but you can't leave behind your 'self'.
Does this make any sense?  Tongue
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Brendan
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Re: killing your self
Reply #10 - Jul 21st, 2005 at 12:55am
 
Well, M.D.,
What if the suffering is largely due to a physical
cause (such as horrible burn scars, for instance)
or stems from a disability of some kind (including
such things as schizophrenia, or non-characterological depression?) And the person in question commits suicide to escape one or more of these things...
How would such problems follow one into any putative afterlife
where you lack any form of body and exist as a
ghostly "shade" or "shadow" of your former self
(as it were...)
And if you do possess some kind of tangible body
in another dimension, as it were, how could that
be said to be a "non-physical" existence?

B-man
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Brendan
Ex Member


Re: killing your self
Reply #11 - Jul 21st, 2005 at 1:15am
 
Hmmm, Kardec...
You are positing a situation where the horribly burned
guy found a girl who "looked past" his problems, so
to speak.
But you gave a poor analogy. These things only happen
in fairy tales and cheesy romance novels, as a rule... severely f***-ed up men generally are finished, as far as "finding someone" goes...
Much like my Dad's associate who was severely burned in a house fire about 6 years ago when some gunpowder he kept
for reloading exploded, nearly leveling his house, killing his son, and leaving him hideously scarred, one eye gone and the other irretrievably, legally blind... and with one arm amputated and his other hand a useless, fingerless paddle (he DOES have half a thumb though.) Unsurprisingly, his wife gave him the old heave-ho and he can't support himself financially, he's depressed beyond all hope and he's on five different looney medications that don't do him any good. He now sits, stares off into space with his one "good" eye (hey, he knows when it's day and when it's night, anyway) and languishes (more like rots) in a nursing home at the age of 43...
He's a statistic.
The above example is a more TYPICAL outcome of the scenario you envisioned... as a learning experience, it stinks... What lesson could the poor bastard be learning here? And when he finally dies (O sweet release) what will he have gained of value from this experience?
Nothing, I daresay...

B-man
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mystic_dreamer
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Re: killing your self
Reply #12 - Jul 21st, 2005 at 1:26am
 
Hi Brendan....I'm not sure how to answer this...I'm just learning myself you know!  Wink
What I was trying to explain in my way above, was that our pent up emotions, whether negative or positive, will carry on with us. If we cross over a somewhat happy person with a light heart....that is how we will feel over there.
But if we cross over with alot of anger, hate and negative feelings, that will carry on with us too.
So, if one decides to commit suicide because his or her life is such a hell here....and do so in an effort to get rid of such feelings, then it isn't going to work....because those feelings follow us thru.
As for having disabilities or physical scarring on our bodies here....I don't believe that we carry that with us when we cross over.....from what I have learned....we resume back to our beautiful selves.....and I will add to that, that it isn't our physical bodies we will have there...it is our spirit selves....which I believe takes us back to whether we will be happy or still in pain......our feelings follow us, our bodies don't.
So....I think I would recommend mending what emotionally ailes a person before that monent of death comes.....wouldn't you think?   Undecided
Maybe someone else here can answer this better than I can.........
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mystic_dreamer
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Re: killing your self
Reply #13 - Jul 21st, 2005 at 2:15am
 
ok....let's try this again...lol...it's nearly 2am and I should be sleeping....but instead, here I am!  Tongue
We have no control over the cards that life deals us.....but we do have the control of how to deal with them. And in the end, that is what matters.
I have always believed that things happen for a reason....
You know...you talk about the ones who have all these different physical and mental health problems to deal with...and what about them...do they have a right to be angry now? and why should they be burdened for their disability in the afterlife?...or will they be burdened with these things?
I don't believe they will have these problems in the next life....I already said that....I could be wrong.....but I hope not!
I think we have to accept what we are given in this life and move on in life with a healthy happy heart....
There are thousands and thousands of people in the world who have all kinds of disabilities.....missing arms, legs.....lost their minds, burned beyond belief....paralyzed, patially or completely.....and for most of them, they live as happily as they can and go about their daily business as if nothing was different. There are artists who are paralyzed from the neck down...yet learned how to paint with their mouths....and they are happy!
I for one, can't imagine what it must be like to live life like that....but they overcame what ugly card they were dealt and they moved on.
I have a daughter who is bi-polar.....a neice that was diagnosed with MS at age 25.....and myself, I have enough scars on my body (thanks to someone @**^#$) and, I have survived breast cancer, minus a piece of a part......I would think that we all have a right to be angry.....to go around feeling miserable, question why we were given these problems....and have a hate on for life in this world....
However...good things always come out of the bad...but you have to open yourself up to find that goodness. If all that a person allows himself to feel is hate...then he will never be able to find the goodness.
Someone might be so badly burned....yet, he may find himself to be the luckiest man alive....because he may have the best woman who has the most ever love to give him...no matter how burned and scarred he was. Think about that.
I might have to worry about cancer returning...and take the rest of my rack away.....yet, I am the luckiest woman alive because I have such a beautiful, smart and loving granddaughter.
My neice...now 27.....has relapses every couple of months...each time, she is worse off for it...some days she can't see....can't walk...can't hold a cup...and has had to quit working because of it....is she bitter? angry? noooooooo.....she knows that there is something for her in all of this that will be good for her...and for others around her...
It's all in how you choose to view life and the good and bad stuff that comes out of it.
Now.....maybe I can get to sleep!!!!   Grin
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mystic_dreamer
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Re: killing your self
Reply #14 - Jul 21st, 2005 at 2:20am
 
Brendan....btw....the man that you spoke of....being burned.....that is really awful what has happened to him......and it is obvious that his wife wasn't in for the long haul...so to speak. But not all women are like that......and that is the truth. There are just as many good women out there as there are men.....true love never leaves, not even when a tradgedy like that hits home....and that is the truth about that.
If you had a wife..and that happened to her, would you leave her?  Wink
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