Hey Alysia,
I rather liked your above reply, especially the overall spirit of it.
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glad to see u here once more Justin. I have always felt our connections run deeper than our surface chatter.
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there is no way to measure a person's spiritual level
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Justin:
There are ways to generally gauge the general and most consistently predominant spiritual "level" of others. Is that important to do so though?
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not to me is it important to guage levels, but perhaps to guage intentions of a person. that would be called discernment of spirits in olden days. u can do that by picking up certain words that are connected to emotions.
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Justin says:
Not usually i believe. But when there arise those that would be leaders and teachers to others, particularly of spiritual truth and when you ask others OR yourself to accept them as such
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those that are "considered" leaders or teachers are perhaps not your own leaders or teachers; but they are always somebody's temporary leader. theres two ways to look at it: either a poster is sharing, or a poster is projecting guilty behavior unto another party. it is important to be able to tell the difference before responding to a post.
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Justin:
then yes i believe it's important to use one's discrimination and to at least generally gauge the general "level" of such a one if only for oneself.
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judging the general level of another, falls into the category of perception and interpretation functions of the mind, which is unique to each of us, in that we are not all in agreement, because of duality world where opposition exists. discrimination, like the observer function needs to be nurtured within experience of physicality. we are all teachers in truth, in the way that whenever we open our mouths to say something, we are teaching another who we are, or who we "think" we are, even who we might wish to be.
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Justin says:
It seems too many too oft become over attached to such outer sources or teachers, and then oft of course ego reactive arguments oft ensue when someone doesn't believe as we believe and especially when they challenge those beliefs.
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Yes, I agree attachment issues are important to look at. Ideally, we can aspire to be unattached to teachers eventually, and I see this happen where the student must move unto either another teacher, or enter a stage of listening to their own inner teacher consistently enough so that going to outer teachers is no longer necessary, but rather at that point the student becomes the teacher. To aspire to a place of non-reactive temperament would seem to be something every human eventually must master, as oppositional factors will exist in a world where those opposite polarities themselves are part of the ELS and built into it. it would not mean to do nothing, nor express nothing, it would mean your expressions now would be without projection of guilt unto yourself or others, therefore anger would turn to self-determination which is very creative.
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Justin is giving us something now: thank you for this:
One way to gauge the temporary "level" of spiritual development is easy and consistently accurate, though of course people having freewill are oft variable in tendencies and so may not always be completely consistent, some if ever in this life.
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you're right Justin, we are basically not consistent in our levels of awareness but fluctuate until that consistency is nurtured and desirable and focused.
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Justin describes color discernment:
The spiritual or energetic color emanations do not lie, and various sources talk about a similar concept, the core Soul colors of a person, which is somewhat beyond the generalized talk of "auras". Auras is a bit more complicated of an indication and have many levels in them which are more directly connected to the physical energies, to the most spiritualized Spirit emanations of a being.
The core Soul colors is more simple, and generally less variable in one life.
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In general, I don't hear much talk about colors in the aura, or soul colors, and I think we could do well to study what u r talking about.
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Justin continues:
Sure, to some extent one's own overall development and momentary clarity does influence the depth and accuracy of perception of this level, but most people can perceive the basic hue of such indications.
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the basic hue you speak of, may be a special gift you have of discernment. I find we all have different gifts. for some of us work more with different types of intuitional processes; such as dream work, obe-ing, meditation, which results unravel in linear time, immediate perception of a person's hue, or color, or as I call it, their intentions, for me, cannot be ascertained at a glance by using my interpretation facility. but if I set aside my first reaction or interpretation and take a second look at a person, or their post, for example, I pick up a different message entirely, and the 2nd interpretation seems to come from a different radio station dial, so to speak. the first voice of interpretation seems to come from my ego, which would be desiring to assert itself first; that would be reactive circumstance, and not PUL. it's actually only my job to ascertain my own motives and intentions, in that regard and the poster's intentions would be secondary to comment on.
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Justin:
In a respect, these indications are
seemingly "linear" in nature, as in the nature of a rainbow, they go from the slower vibratory rates, to the faster (not truly linear because it is more like a connected circle than a straight line). Basic red being very slow vibrating and violet/magenta being fastest of colors. Course it's not limited to this by any means.
If you sense violets, blue purples, golden hues and especially the more pure and vibrant White Light in relation to the core Soul colors, then know that these sources and teachers can be trusted. Even then, it does not profit people to get overly attached to these teachers or sources.
I wouldn't listen deeply to or follow a supposed "guide" whose core Soul color was say a leaden red hue, for there is so much selfishness indicated in such a emanation that there would be much twisting of the path in such hanging on or over absorption into..
And yet to be sure, there have been plenty "teachers" who have arose, who through their own turning away from Source in consciousness, have misled others whether they know it or not ( they often probably don't).
To perceive this, does not necessarily mean to "judge". You can perceive without judging, and sometimes discrimination is quite an important attribute to develop.
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right. to perceive is not the judgment. the judgment would be if you somehow made someone else wrong by expressing that their color is a dark hue; if the intention is to teach, to assist along positives, the positive must be accentuated over the negative aspects of the person you would assist. the problem in expressing a basic negative without balancing it with the positive, is that it automatically produces in the other a reaction of defense. this in turn makes a war condition.
whereas, say for example, you noticed the basic reddish hue, but you also noticed some gold shafts slowly filtering into the total red hue, then you would mention this positive aspect and not arouse their reactionary defense mechanism of the ego. then you would be assisting, if they were a thoughtful person, they would pick up also your intentions to assist their growth, rather than judging them. there is also a thing called killing with kindness. I don't think you yourself would have that problem Justin!
is why I mention balancing the negative with the positive statement and re-reading our posts to one another to make sure we are not being judgmental.
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Justin:
Personally, some of the teachers that some promote here, i don't get particularly spiritualized vibes from when i look at their pics, read their stuff, or generally research them or when i go within and feel them out. Is that something to concentrate or focus on, no, and doing so probably just facilitates more separation in this world and in self. But to initially discriminate that can be helpful.
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Some of these teachers will attract only the students that best suit that pathway. I think when we speak of teachers here, we eventually stop speaking of them, because we are aware truth will come from within, as you seem to know that quite well, and we promote self exploration more than what is taught by various parties. Yet even if it's a case, in the final analysis of the blind leading the blind, we can approach all pathways and teachings with an open mind to weigh what is being said. It could be certain teachers have only partial truths to offer, in that case, a mere aha moment to a student, who will move unto another teacher and gain more aha moments somewhere else.
I think in this type of board environment, freedom to share what we've learned from others, as well as personal experiences, is what this board is about. Some spiritual ideas are beyond our grasp, and so it is necessary to write it down, as you never know but what the thread will provide a missing link in our thought system, through someone's sharing what is important to them. In the end, it is PUL that we offer each other freedom to express themselves fully as possible, without inferring there is something wrong with them, therefore it seems like a judgment and makes them feel "less than" the poster who concentrated on a negative statement to put forth. we are basically all equal, and the roles we play now, we will shuck off at some point. as well regarding teachers one and all, well known or not, within all is the spark of God and their deeds and words will be corrected sooner or later by forces outside our direct control. these forces of good are upon us all these days.
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Justin:
And yet i was drawn here because of a more truly humble teacher, one Bruce Moen.
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Yes, Bruce's colors are great. I think it has to do with his PUL and if you read his books, he's even teaching the aliens about PUL!
he's nonjudgmental, but even Bruce told me once, he is still learning and that is believable to me, that as long as we exist in body, we will be learners, and no one who thinks they are enlightened, and says so, I do not think that these are truly enlightened, but wish they were. that is the ego talking again. so all we can do is share our experiences from our heart space, for we can only change our perspective, our attitude in that regard, and we cannot expect to change the other person, nor even the world. but by working on our selves, to come from the heart, we are effecting the world.
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Justin continues:
Notice how Bruce doesn't call himself an Avatar, doesn't call himself enlightened, doesn't put himself on any kind of special pedestal. Notice he hasn't been accused by anyone of sexual molestation, greedily taking in others money and resources, etc., etc. many of these being fairly common in both dogmatic Christian churches and the guru game of India.
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Begging your pardon But Bruce has come under attack like all of us, I think he handles it as best he can. if Bruce is not complaining about all that is said here and allows this board to talk about whatever, then we should not try to make a problem where there is none. He will move in to remove a thread to the proper room sometimes. what I think you need to do is not get emotionally attached to Bruce where it seems as if you are stepping in to defend him. He deserves much more credit for his work than he gets, but I think basically he's in good spirits and enjoying what he does and whenever we can we should thank him for paying for cyberspace for us, when basically we are just a bunch of chatterboxes...although some good has come of this forum and more daily does come.
He has told you he is an ordinary man, an engineer by profession. We have no reason to think that he is lying about being just like us, thus still learning, teaching and growing; like we all are doing. He does have quite a knack for the way he can show us how to do our own explorations.
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Justin said:
It's ok to let oneself get absorbed into a not so truly spiritually awakened teacher or source, because there will eventually come a point when a person will realize how they are limiting themselves (and perhaps having a limiting influence on others) and i believe it will work out in the end for most, if not all.
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I just heard the Buddha himself did not ascend in that life as the Buddha, but had one more life to go..so all this talk we do of different gurus, it has become moot point for me. I think the problem in a cult situation or becoming absorbed in untruth is a worldwide situation, not just the student/guru climate, it's again a duality world where contrast and oppositional factors are natural impediments. you're right, it does work out in the end, yet I wonder, and this is funny, why hindsight is 20/20? I think it has to do with our navigating thru illusions, as well relying too much on one single source of information concerning spirituality. not to speak of language difficulties and various interpretations of the same object.
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Justin: But, personally i see merit in a speedier recovery, if only it's from a limited perspective. The more of us that truly awake, the more it speeds it up, and the momentum builds and healing for ALL is that much closer.
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I agree totally. I believe and I've found this in certain literature and experience that a thought of love gathers more momentum than does a thought of lack of love linked to a fearful conjecture or a scarcity projection.
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Justin: i see merit in that, and not being overly passive and blase about it all. Why else are so many real guides constantly trying to reach and facilitate us moving in the right directions? So yes, why not use our discrimination and use and balance our right brain/heart side with our left brain/mind side?
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I think what u r saying is you "saw" something and wished to bring it to a poster's attention, and that u wish to not be a passive, nor blase in attitude. you are not passive nor blase, so don't worry about that! yes, I think we do that here, or at least we try to express the principles behind the hemi-sync model.
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Justin: P.S., yes i believe one can take the oneness concept too far, if you stop seeing the trees for the forest, just as it's limiting to not see the forest by overly concentrating on the trees. Both have to be perfectly balanced for the full truth to be perceived, known, and lived, imo.
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let me explain a little bit about what I said about Ultra and Recoverer. they have a relationship. the one on one relationship where there is energetic connection. in this sense, their relationship is One thing.
In their relationship they may find oneness if they are able to conclude something.
if one person makes a statement of absolutism, and another disagrees, you then have oppositional factors engaged to produce, ideally a joining and enhancement of each other: call it the product would be PUL. PUL is a mind expansion thing, as well as a heart thing.
when I said they seem like the same person posting under different names, it was a brief flash of intuition operating. I will probably never know for sure if that perception is true as you notice, neither one is responding to my statement. you did, so thanks!
nothing is feeling quite as sad as not getting any response to something that came in as intuition, thus seemingly from outside of self. however, I released it in self expression. that was all I was supposed to do. we share ourselves here, what we are really thinking and feeling, without judging any as less than another person.
then we have perfect balanced situation, and I really don't care if anyone responds to my posts, as it's more important to express ourselves sometimes if you feel the nudge to communicate with others at all. for as you know Justin, there are times when we don't want to reach out to others at all, for we are ALL misunderstood as we go along towards whatever waking up means to us individually.
thank you, sorry for the book length post. I'll probably take a long 2 day break now! loved your post on JC's travels btw.
very interesting indeed! alysia
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CASTING STONES? a response to recoverer (Read 2296 times)
