Copyrighted Logo

css menu by Css3Menu.com


 

Bruce's 5th book, a Home Study Course, is now available.
Books & Tapes by Bruce Moen
    Bruce's Blog now at http://www.afterlife-knowledge.com/blog....

  HomeHelpSearchLoginRegister  
 
Page Index Toggle Pages: 1
Send Topic Print
Kurt Leland's book, "Otherwhere" (Read 7597 times)
Bruce Moen
YaBB Administrator
*****
Offline



Posts: 587
YaBB Admin Land
Kurt Leland's book, "Otherwhere"
Mar 25th, 2007 at 12:18pm
 
On the advice of a friend I recently read, "Otherwhere, A Field Guide to Nonphysical Reality for the Out-of-body Traveler," by Kurt Leland.  It was a great piece of advice.

Leland describes how he developed his OBE ability and then goes on to describe, in great detail, many of the areas of nonphysical reality he has explored using this technique.  The level of detail in his descriptions is extraordinary.  But the thing I found most interesting and useful for those interested in exploring nonphysical realites was insight gained into the nature of our perception.

In my own attempts to teach others about exploring such places I've stressed the role of what I call "the Interpreter" as a component of our consciousness.  In my own jargon the Interpreter is the component of our consciousness that "translates" input from our nonphysical senses into the images, thoughts, ideas, sounds, etc. that we consciously perceive.  This translation is always done by translating what our nonphysical senses perceive into  the "nearest similar things" stored within our individual pre-existing memory.  The translation always introduces "Interpreter Overlay" errors.  We never directly perceive what is actually there, we only perceive the nearest similar things previously stored in our memory.  So, two people observing the same nonphysical "thing" will almost never "see it" in identical forms.  I've also stressed that the Interpreter's  translation is always done within the context of our beliefs and language.

Leland's desriptions of his OBE experiences and observations do a marvelous job of more deeply explaining what I mean by Interpreter Overlay from a perspective that is different than mine.  After all, I don't do OBE.

For those of you interested in learning about and understanding more about how your perception actuallly works Leland's book is a gold mine.  And, his descriptions of exploring many of the same places I written about give far more fine detail in an entertaining and eye-opening book.

Try it, you'll like it.

Bruce
Back to top
 
WWW  
IP Logged
 
augoeideian
Super Member
*****
Offline


Afterlife Knowledge Member

Posts: 958
South Africa
Gender: female
Re: Kurt Leland's book, "Otherwhere"
Reply #1 - Mar 26th, 2007 at 5:38am
 
Hi Bruce,

Hope you are well. Kurt Leland's book does sound interesting together with your knowledge of perception. I agree very much with what you say 'the Interpreter's translation is done within context of our beliefs and language'.

Interpreter Overlay is a good phrase.  In the context of material substances (organic or non-organic) my understanding of this phrase and subject is:

The material substance exists (because we can see it) however, the perception of the material substance is individual according to personal experience and understanding of the material substance seen. In the physical an object is perceived outside of oneself and this perception of information is taken inwardly and now resides in ones memory together with the emotions attached to the object at that particular time of perception.  Therefore the emotion we relate to the object might be the base of our perception. 

This is also saying belief is similar to emotion; emotion is perception; perception is belief; belief is dimension.

Now, if we had to reverse this into our perception of the spiritual world - once we there - the object is recalled from within us to with outside of us together with the corresponding emotion we felt at the time.

Further with this concept; the object is unchanging as it has been created into solid form it is our emotions which are subject to change. Therefore perception may be viewed as fluctuant while in we are in physical- once we are in spiritual - the recall is subject to our existing perception of emotion.

I think the same principle in the physical may apply in OBE  i.e. perceiving outside and taking in with emotion.  Recalling inward perception to outward may apply to conscious phasing projections, dreams and after physical life.

Well, my perception of the topic!

Regards
Caryn
Back to top
 

&&
 
IP Logged
 
Bruce Moen
YaBB Administrator
*****
Offline



Posts: 587
YaBB Admin Land
Re: Kurt Leland's book, "Otherwhere"
Reply #2 - Mar 26th, 2007 at 11:13am
 
augoeideian wrote on Mar 26th, 2007 at 5:38am:
The material substance exists (because we can see it) however, the perception of the material substance is individual according to personal experience and understanding of the material substance seen.


One of the more interesting concepts Leland's experience points to, and my own experience seems to verify, is that there really isn't any "material substance" that exists.  There is only something we could describe using the wornout term, "energy."  And that each individual, "physical human", nonphysical humaun, alien, etc. perceives this energy within the context of their individual perspective, including previously stored memories, beliefs, expectation. etc.  What we call physical reality is then only a perspective within which we perceive "energies" that to us human "physicals" appear to be "solid" and therefore real.  But to an "nonphysical" human (an OBEer for example) or "alien" these objects no longer appear "solid" and in fact they can be passed through as easily as physicals walk through air or water.

A really interesting example from Leland's book takes place while he joins a group of "aliens" touring one of the human "hells."  To call this place a "hell" is actually incorrect, but from Leland's perspective it's descriptive of the activities he perceives there.  

Leland witnesses a newly deceased person going through a process that is "purging" certain experiential energies taken on during that person's lifetime.  Leland perceives this as a fire-breathing dragon carrying out this (what appears to him to be a) horrendous process.  The aliens on the tour perceive the same process but in a completely different way.  Viewed side-by-side, so to speak, Leland's and the Alien's descriptions of their perceptions says volumes about how instantaneously, all-pervasively, and undetectably our own Interpreters operate to color and distort our perception.

augoeideian wrote on Mar 26th, 2007 at 5:38am:
In the physical an object is perceived outside of oneself and this perception of information is taken inwardly and now resides in ones memory together with the emotions attached to the object at that particular time of perception.  Therefore the emotion we relate to the object might be the base of our perception.  

This is also saying belief is similar to emotion; emotion is perception; perception is belief; belief is dimension.


Yup, I agree completely.  The thing that fascinates me in Leland's accounts of examples of this is how well he gets across the point that this process goes on so seamlessly in our experience that most of us never realize it is happening at all.  Instead, we will spend endless hours arguing over what, if anything, actually exists beyond physical reality based on the fact that different physical humans perceive those things in entirely different forms.  So, we have endlesss, meaningless and pointless arguments over whether Monroe has it right or Swedenborg has it right or someone else has it right.  All these arguments seem to come out of the assumption that if (metaphorically) one of these guys perceives an angel where the other guy perceives a demon, one of the guys must be right and the other must  wrong.  I find such meaningless arguments tiresome.  If we attempt to find the Truth by comparing the experiences of others, we will get nowhere (in my opinion) until we realize that each individual's person's perception is colored and distorted (including our own) in unique ways to give unique results.  This is why I keep saying, don't believe a word I say, have our own direct experience and come to our own conclusions.  In my view this gives the best chance that an individual we begin to see the inconsistencies and internal conflicts within their own perception.  And in the struggle to make sense of those inconsistencies perhaps understanding more about how our perception works will rise within awareness.

augoeideian wrote on Mar 26th, 2007 at 5:38am:
I think the same principle in the physical may apply in OBE  i.e. perceiving outside and taking in with emotion.  Recalling inward perception to outward may apply to conscious phasing projections, dreams and after physical life.


I would go just a little further and say the same principle applies within every reality that exists, but then, that is just my own distorted perception   Cool

I encourge anyone with the means to get hold of a copy of Leland's book, wade through the first few chapters of background material, and then devour the real meat of his story.

Bruce
Back to top
 
WWW  
IP Logged
 
Rob Calkins
Senior Member
****
Offline



Posts: 260
Denver
Re: Kurt Leland's book, "Otherwhere"
Reply #3 - Mar 27th, 2007 at 12:34pm
 
I read Leland’s book about a month ago.  It’s good, well written and worth reading for the reasons you’ve indicated.  I’m glad you’ve offered your comments on it, Bruce.  Your insights certainly added to the book.  I’m going to have to read it again at some point.

Different peoples' experiences and observations always add to our understanding.  That's why this Board is great!  That said, one thing that detracted that detracted a little from the book for me was Leland’s VA center.  It seemed a bit closed ended, although it’s clear that he’s describing how he perceived and interpreted his experiences at that particular time.

For me, though, your approach and perspective were more helpful.  I found your descriptions outstanding and I strongly identified with the skepticism that you overcame.  I look forward to your next book.
Back to top
 
 
IP Logged
 
LaffingRain
Super Member
*****
Offline


Choose this Day

Posts: 5249
Arizona
Gender: female
Re: Kurt Leland's book, "Otherwhere"
Reply #4 - Mar 27th, 2007 at 4:44pm
 
hi there everybody..I strong endorse Kurt Leland's book "Otherwhere" also. I just finished reading it last month or so and it clarified a great deal the "interpretor" Bruce talks about, how it's different perception for each of us, according to our unique belief systems.

I also agree emotions are tied to belief systems and following an emotion can open up inner vistas to see what it is we do believe, or hold valuable to believe. I found Leland's book an enjoyable read overall and I too deal a lot with symbolism within obe or dream and I was impressed his symbols are much more dramatic than mine. He does inspire one to explore on their own also.
I also agree perceptions are just perceptions and not the whole truth to be accepting in absolute terms. I think an open mind when reading or learning new things is a great aid to afterlife exploration.

thank you Bruce for mentioning Leland, it's good to see you here now and then!!
love, alysia
Back to top
 

... Who takes away death's sting deprives life of bitterness
WWW http://www.facebook.com/LaughingRain2  
IP Logged
 
Vicky
YaBB Administrator
*****
Offline


Afterlife Knowledge Member

Posts: 2170
Colorado
Gender: female
Re: Kurt Leland's book, "Otherwhere"
Reply #5 - Mar 27th, 2007 at 9:03pm
 
Bruce,

Are Interpreter Overlay "errors" more of a hindrance in nonphysical perception, or not necessarily so?  I'm sure even in a lot of cases, some overlay doesn't actually even alter the experience by much, as the same benefit or learning opportunity results anyway.

You've written about the need to play along into someone's reality during retrieval to gently bring that person up to speed on their current situation and once this happens, their perception raises.  I have learned from my own OBEs that one person in the experience can be at an "advantage" over another by perceiving from a higher perspective (or higher vibration level).  So, applying this "playing along" concept to OBEs, I've noticed that many times I will, at first, believe that the experience is physical reality.  But another person in my OBE will play along, gently allowing me to realize the situation for what it really is.   Once I get that "a-ha" moment and realize it is not the physical world, then my perception raises considerably.  Once my perception raises, the scenery of the experience sort of just melts away, as it is no longer necessary information.  I've discovered that all that scenery was was just a framework (created by belief, emotion, expectation, etc) necessary for the conduction of the experience.  Once not needed, that framework dissolves, kind of like throwing away a security blanket when it's been outgrown. 

It seems that perhaps there is another component to the nature of interpreter overlay...to provide a framework within which we can operate until the perception of that information is no longer necessary.  As long as we take advantage of opportunities for clearer perception, we will continue to raise our awareness to new levels. 

Is there ever an end to the layers of perception interpretation?  At higher levels is there less room for interpreter overlay?

Love,
Vicky





Back to top
 

Author of Persephone's Journey (Amazon.com)

http://www.vickyshort.blogspot.com/
WWW 198267046870499  
IP Logged
 
Bruce Moen
YaBB Administrator
*****
Offline



Posts: 587
YaBB Admin Land
Re: Kurt Leland's book, "Otherwhere"
Reply #6 - Apr 1st, 2007 at 11:45am
 
Hey Vicky,

I am finally getting to answering your post!

Vicky wrote on Mar 27th, 2007 at 9:03pm:
Are Interpreter Overlay "errors" more of a hindrance in nonphysical perception, or not necessarily so?  I'm sure even in a lot of cases, some overlay doesn't actually even alter the experience by much, as the same benefit or learning opportunity results anyway.

The Overlay seems to serve to "channel" or focus the experience into the context of previous experience, beliefs, expectations, etc.  So, I guess I'd say the Overlay doesn't alter the context in which learning takes place, it sort of forces the learning to be "only" within that context.  Benefit is then only within the context of the pre-existing experience memories, beliefs, expectations, etc. of the experiencer.  But that does leave a "downside."  In order to gain benefit from the experience beyond the Overlay we have to, most often, resort to trying to interpret what we call the "symbology" of the experience.  Gaining understanding beyond our Interpreter's Overlay then becomes close kin to dream interpretation.  

We are limited to trying to decifer our Overlay's "symbols" to gain understanding beyond our present limited understanding.  A sort of Catch-22.  The hard part is that most of us don't even realize that what we are perceiving in any given moment are only symbols that represent what we are perceiving.  So for example someone perceives a hideous dragon, breathing fire on a soul, and reducing that soul to mere ashes, and believes that is what they have actually encountered.  Then the perceiver gets all twitterpated about dealing with the implications of encountering such a fire-breathing dragon that is "destroying souls" in the afterlife.  (BTW: this dragon example is in Leland's book)

Whole religons could be then built up around the fear of souls being destroyed by fire-breathing dragon's after death.  Millions of people throughout centuries of time could alter the course of their lives because some fool believed his or her encounter was with such a soul destroying, fire-breathing dragon.  But, the dragon was only and Interpreter Overlay, a dream symbol if you will, for an afterdeath process Danion Brinkley calls the "panoramic life review."  Just a process in which the deceased relives life experiences from the perspective of the people interacted with during their physical lifetime to gain understanding and release (or burn away) false understandings of those experiences.

Vicky wrote on Mar 27th, 2007 at 9:03pm:
You've written about the need to play along into someone's reality during retrieval to gently bring that person up to speed on their current situation and once this happens, their perception raises.  I have learned from my own OBEs that one person in the experience can be at an "advantage" over another by perceiving from a higher perspective (or higher vibration level).  So, applying this "playing along" concept to OBEs, I've noticed that many times I will, at first, believe that the experience is physical reality.  But another person in my OBE will play along, gently allowing me to realize the situation for what it really is.   Once I get that "a-ha" moment and realize it is not the physical world, then my perception raises considerably.  Once my perception raises, the scenery of the experience sort of just melts away, as it is no longer necessary information.  I've discovered that all that scenery was was just a framework (created by belief, emotion, expectation, etc) necessary for the conduction of the experience.  Once not needed, that framework dissolves, kind of like throwing away a security blanket when it's been outgrown.  

It seems that perhaps there is another component to the nature of interpreter overlay...to provide a framework within which we can operate until the perception of that information is no longer necessary.  As long as we take advantage of opportunities for clearer perception, we will continue to raise our awareness to new levels.



Yeah!  Couldn't have put it better myself!  Or said another way, once we realize, during the experience, that any "framework" is an overlay, that overlay can sort of dissolve and we might then get closer to more clearly perceiving beyond the Overlay.

Vicky wrote on Mar 27th, 2007 at 9:03pm:
Is there ever an end to the layers of perception interpretation?  At higher levels is there less room for interpreter overlay?

From my experience I'd say that there doesn't seem to  be an end to overlays, but that as we perceive from a munch larger "perspective"  the disuise that overlays impose upon perception become easier to "see beyond" and the meaning of our experiences becomes clearer and closer to the "Truth."

And, while there is a tendency to see overlays as "bad" if my (read that me as my Higher Self) mission/goal is to understand more about what it means to experience existence as a human being, knowledge of overlays and their effects are part of the "mission/goal."   Like someone said, to make an omlet you have to break some eggs.  If your mission is to make an omlet there is no sense complaining about all the empty egg shells cluttering up the landscape.

Love,

Bruce
Back to top
 
WWW  
IP Logged
 
LaffingRain
Super Member
*****
Offline


Choose this Day

Posts: 5249
Arizona
Gender: female
Re: Kurt Leland's book, "Otherwhere"
Reply #7 - Apr 1st, 2007 at 1:08pm
 
Bruce said: If your mission is to make an omlet there is no sense complaining about all the empty egg shells cluttering up the landscape.
  Cheesy

thats priceless analogy! haha!

Yes Bruce I experienced a twinge of anxiety to read Lelands symbology of the dragon and thought, man, that soul just got himself wasted and that could happen to me! Smiley but then I remembered the intense PUL experiences I've encountered, and like you, I reinterpreted these symbols from Leland's own guidance to the reader, that there is a level slightly beyond these overlay images where we can "break" through to more and greater lucidity to just knowing rather than all the deciphering we need to do here in C1 or dream landscape levels.

Vicky you do put things nicely. your book will be good guidance for us. I read it, but then I read your post through Bruce's eyes and was only then I understood it fully!

I did the same conclusion Bruce did with Leland's book. I do believe Kurt was explaining a belief system burn off. I often think of thought forms as having a life of their own. sometimes they have to be recycled into, or transmuted to another color, another level and this can be perceived as painful or look scarey when it's put in symbols.
and it's not scarey when understood he was talking about a process of natural means and he didn't stick around to see the good part of the movie...hahaha! there you go.


the main thing I carry with me now in my daily thoughts I got from Leland is that he gave me the inspiration I can one day, like Vicky mentioned, see the symbology dissolve as it won't be needed and this might be like phasing of Bob.  then it's like a bridge to cross.
perhaps a form of direct communication without the egg shells.

I don't mind the egg shells Bruce btw, I'm still a housecleaner in my heart. Smiley

nice thread.
Back to top
 

... Who takes away death's sting deprives life of bitterness
WWW http://www.facebook.com/LaughingRain2  
IP Logged
 
Page Index Toggle Pages: 1
Send Topic Print


This is a Peer Moderated Forum. You can report Posting Guideline violations.