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Message started by Dodgerzdad on Jun 14th, 2021 at 5:39am

Title: The Perceiver and the Interpreter
Post by Dodgerzdad on Jun 14th, 2021 at 5:39am
Hi. I posted this topic in the "Afterlife Knowledge Guidebook" forum but I see it doesn't get much traffic, so I'm posting here if that's OK. the question arose because I'm presently reading the book and have read all the "Voyager" books many years ago.

One thing I found to be very insightful is the concept of the Perceiver and the Interpreter. It's something I've often thought about, but never too deeply. In looking over my dream journal I notice there are some characters that are people I know, past or present, and some that I don't. Even in OBEs, there is occasionally someone that I know in the picture. I always wonder if the character I encounter is really that person or is the closest thing the Interpreter can match to what the Perceiver is seeing. I'm very curious as to how I would discern afterward if the characters are really who I think they are or just the interpretation. Also, if the characters are just an interpretation of the closest thing I know, why is it that some characters are unrecognizable and also not interpreted as the closest thing I know? Any thoughts? Thanks      

Title: Re: The Perceiver and the Interpreter
Post by Recoverer 2 on Jun 15th, 2021 at 6:31pm
Hello Dodgerzdad:

Going by my experiences, the people that appear in my dreams are symbolic representations of a personality trait or traits that my higher self is trying to emphasize during a dream or OBE. I don't mean to say that this is the case all of the time.

Title: Re: The Perceiver and the Interpreter
Post by Vicky on Jun 16th, 2021 at 11:11pm
Hi Dodgerzdad,

Welcome to the Conversation Board.  I apologize for not seeing your first post in the Guidebook section!  For the record, if this thread begins discussing more in depth about Bruceís Guidebook and ends up being more appropriate for that forum than this one then Iíll move the thread there.  For now, though, this topic is fine to leave here in this forum.  Iíll also leave your post thatís there in case someone wants to reply there.

As far as Iíve always understood about how the Perceiver and Interpreter works, is to think of it in a larger picture perspective rather than piece by piece.  Whether itís physical reality, nonphysical reality, a dream, OBE, etc, the Perceiver is the part of your awareness that is perceiving and receiving something.  The Interpreter is the part of you that is trying to make sense of what is being perceived.  And the only way it can do that is to relate it to what it already knows.  Sometimes itíll be pretty accurate and sometimes it tries its best but doesnít come quite close.  Dreams are a lot like that, with lots of symbology showing the picture of the story thatís trying to be told. 

If you have a full functioning story that you were consciously aware of and remember, then itís not really necessary to worry or wonder if someone wasnít who they appeared to be.  The point is, you have a fully story of what you experienced.

The way P&I comes into play, really, is if you were having an experience that had many plot holes, and blackouts, and missing information.  These are click-outs where itís likely that the Interpreter ran on and on too long making associations and carrying your attention away from what was actually being perceived.  Itís still possible to go back and focus on that area of consciousness to regain awareness (memory) of more of the story.  But sometimes we just have pieces with lots of missing parts that doesnít make sense to us. 

So the Perceiver is giving you real information, and the Interpreter is just presenting it to you in a way it thinks makes the most sense to you.  Itís like someone trying to use charades to communicate with you.  They are doing their best, but it may not be very good or accurate.  I think our dream life has a lot of this nonsense because the holes are getting filled in with filler material so that we have what looks like a complete story. 

As for nonphysical exploration, OBEs, retrievals, and the like, sometimes the same kind of thing needs to happen, but itís not because we are being tricked or that what we are perceiving isnít realÖitís just that it can be difficult to balance Perceiver and Interpreter, so sometimes we get distracted by associations that mess up the storyline.   

So when it comes to your questions about how to discern people we experience, I agree with what Recoverer 2 said.  Most of the time for me dream people are just symbolic.  If I dream or have an OBE of someone and I feel their presence and my own conscious awareness believes it was really them, their spirit or higher self, then thatís what I go with and believe.  However, most normal dreams are just symbolic. 

Maybe for you the reason some characters are unrecognizable is because thereís no need for them to be identified as someone specific.  Maybe the lesson is able to be understood without more information. 

Last nightís dream made me basically ask myself the same kinds of questions youíre asking here because I dreamed that my landlord from several years ago was helping me with something, being very generous.  Dreaming of him came out of nowhere, and we also were not on good terms when I left, so why would I dream about him being so nice to me?   My first thought was to wonder if he had died and maybe his spirit was trying to make amends with me.  I do sometimes think about or dream about someone who has just died (before I find out about their death).  Anyway, so if there was no real reason for me to be dreaming about actually really him, then I wonder what he meant in my dream?  What was symbolic about him and why?  What was the dream really about?  I donít know the answers yetÖ.but is this the kind of thing youíre talking about?

My suggestion about working with dreams is to program your mind before going to sleep what it is you really want to know, ask, or experience.  Repeating it like a mantra until you fall asleep will let it sink into your subconscious, and with practice and persistence you will get results.  A simple way is to say, ďI want to know more about such-and-such.Ē  Or, ďI want to visit with so-and-soĒ.   Be specific in your request.   

However you phrase it is up to you.  My go-to method is to have the idea or concept of what I wish for in my mind, and then program myself to ďdream with conscious awarenessĒ so that I can be consciously aware nonphysically.  This also helps with making myself  have an OBE and/or remember the experience when I wake up. 


Title: Re: The Perceiver and the Interpreter
Post by Dodgerzdad on Jun 25th, 2021 at 8:22am
Thanks for the replies. I wonder why I didn't get a notification? I thought for sure I checked off the notify box. Yes, I do sometimes think some of the characters are an aspect of myself. I twice had an entity/character try to pull me out of my body, once when I was in bed and once sleeping in a chair. This happened a little after my mother's death. On both occasions, I turned the tables and knocked them/it out and even once apologized and said, "Sorry, I don't know who you are". I spent years wondering if they were a prankster, my Mom, or just a negative aspect of myself that I was dealing with.

But that was in a conscious OBE. I think dreams also can be OBEs without realizing it until you wake up. I have another experience that I'll save for a future post that explains my reasoning. It does seem like some dream characters are more lifelike than others. Some are dead-eyed and don't seem to be very interactive and I'm guessing those are the manufactured characters that are probably an aspect of myself. Others feel like they are just someone that reminds me of someone I know. But when it really is someone I know, which is very rare, I know absolutely for sure that it is the person I know. But that surety usually comes in a conscious OBE and rarely in dreams where I don't know I'm dreaming.

I have completed "Afterlife Knowledge Guidebook" and looking forward to using the CDs. I've had these things since 2008 and don't know why I just got around to it. I think it's because of the negative things I experienced that year. I also did use the first CD about using intention and I was sent to my mother's condo after she died and I was in the kitchen while my mother was in the living room surrounded by a crowd of people, including my grandmother. For some reason, I could not move past the kitchen. I now think it's because I was trying to do a retrieval but there was no need because there were so many other people there consoling her and my help was not needed. And shortly after, I had the experience of the two times when someone/something was trying to pull me out of body.

Another reason I may have procrastinated with the retrieval attempts could have been disbelief. My life experience of OBEs was the sleep paralysis, vibration state, and separation experience. My aforementioned retrieval attempt was more like remote viewing and I remember thinking that Bruce's story of retrievals of victims of the OKC bombing while sitting in a restaurant was not believable. But now, after reading "Afterlife Knowledge Guidebook", I'm less skeptical that you can go out of body without waking into sleep paralysis. It's actually good news because the sleep method is always hit or miss and very uncomfortable and seems I have very little control once I'm out. So I'm looking forward to resuming where I started 13 years ago.

Title: Re: The Perceiver and the Interpreter
Post by Recoverer 2 on Jun 26th, 2021 at 10:58am

Relating to what you said about dreams, years ago I used to have OBEs with all the effects. Now I instead have regular dreams and lucid dreams. Also, there are occasions when I will be meditating, and then I'll experience myself some place, without experiencing myself move out of my body.

If I remember correctly, Robert Monroe said that he experienced himself leave his body for years during his OBEs, until he realized it wasn't necessary to experience such movement. It is more of a matter of shifting focus.

I have found that many of my dreams are created by my higher self. When I say higher self, I mean this in a Disk/I-there/Oversoul kind of way. I figure I am just one small part of my Soul.

In many instances it is better for my dreams to not become lucid, because if they do, then my higher self loses some of its ability to create according to how it wants to create, and as a result I can't experience what I need to experience.

Dreams are the main way I receive spirit messages. I also receive them while awake, but this is more confusing, because sometimes unfriendly spirits try to send me information, so I always need to use my discrimination when I receive information this way. Dreams on the other hand, always seem to have a friendly source. I can't say what is true for everybody. Going by what numerous people have said, they also receive messages during their dreams from friendly beings.

I have never experienced that dead eye thing you spoke of, during a dream.

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