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Message started by Brendan on Jan 1st, 2005 at 10:46pm

Title: "Seth" books - disturbing implication...
Post by Brendan on Jan 1st, 2005 at 10:46pm
I was looking at some old posts (from November) and one poster ("Roger" I think) mentioned that in the "Seth" book(s) (not sure what they are, haven't read 'em) that one cannot reincarnate in the same time frame as the last incarnation.
I find this VERY disturbing.
I liked the late 20th century - it is the absolute GLORY age for the entire existence of the human race, past and future.
I wouldn't want to incarnate in the past - slavery, disease, back-breaking miserable labor, and so forth.
The future will be even worse than the past, as we will run out of oil and return to the freaking MIDDLE AGES by 2025. We dawdled on the development of new sources of energy, and now it is TOO LATE. Since there will be no way to generate energy, we will slowly slip back into a Stone Age world, and will stay there for the rest of our species' existence. This is an absolute, hopeless, unavoidable certainty - do a search on "Duncan+Olduvai Theory" to see what I mean.
For me - I'm not a good conformist. This era (late 20th-early 21st centuries) is the ONLY time that people who are not mindless conformists can have a good life - past and future ages were and will be dominated by superstition and tribalism, which punishes those who don't fit into the herd.
Therefore, if the "Seth" books are true, I'm on the highway to Hell.
UNLESS I can dictate terms of my own reincarnation, including the era I get to live in.
No stop signs, no speed limits...

Resident Skeptic ???

Title: Re: "Seth" books - disturbing implicatio
Post by Dora on Jan 1st, 2005 at 10:56pm

that one cannot reincarnate in the same time frame as the last incarnation.

Your understanding is incorrect
Seth never said that....

Title: Re: "Seth" books - disturbing implicatio
Post by Sasuke on Jan 2nd, 2005 at 11:19am


Fossil fuels are gonna run out, but we know that already. Which is why we HAVE wind power, and we HAVE hydro power, and are working on electric power.

The end of oil is not the end of us. Even if it is, maybe we will slip back into more primative technology, but why the stone age? They didn't use oil in the 16th century, they managed to get along okay. And besides - maybe our technology would go back that way, but we'd have hundreds of years of mental development on those guys, years and years of knowledge that we could use even without that technology. (Taking baths, anyone?)

Trust me, man. Humans are more resourceful than that.

Title: Re: "Seth" books - disturbing implicatio
Post by Steve_ED on Jan 2nd, 2005 at 12:29pm
Gas would not be a problem if only our government would stop being persuaded by the oil industry and start promoting Hydrogen Fuel cells.  This fuel can be maunfactured.  Type "Hydrogen Fuel" in google and check it out.

Everyone let's all start endorsoing alternative, clean fuels.

Title: Seth indeed said that!
Post by Roger B on Jan 2nd, 2005 at 1:12pm
Here is the reference:  page 161 of Seth Speaks.  Seth is discussing the after death experience, specifically about our reviewing of the life we just had.

"If you find severe errors of judgment, you may then correct them.  You may perfect, in other words, but you cannot enter again into that frame of reference as a completely participating consciousness......."

It is clear from that reference and from the context of the chapter that you cannot reincarnate into the same timeframe, such as the late 20th century.  

There are certain ways you can "manipulate" the events of the life you just had, but that's a psychic exercise as opposed to coming back as what Seth calls a participating consciousness.

You might want to read this book, it's easy and cheap to obtain via amazon.

Title: Re: "Seth" books - disturbing implicatio
Post by Dora on Jan 2nd, 2005 at 3:45pm

It is clear from that reference and from the context of the chapter that you cannot reincarnate into the same timeframe, such as the late 20th century.

We do NOT reaincarnate BACK... to any time frame, or incarnate to the future because everything is simultaneous.... Past, present, future is NOW

only in this physical dimension we created the linear time what we all as one of our physical blue print agreed on, and experiencing as psychical reality....

This  might be a helpful analog, to visualize what is the focuses/lives and the *YOU*..

Elias: I have offered an analogy previously that I shall offer to you that may express a visual, that you may be understanding more of the vastness of yourselves, although this analogy is also quite limited.

In this, I express you to view yourselves as being a room. Your physical self is a room, and within this room there are hundreds of televisions, and each of these televisions holds one channel, one picture, one play, one scenario, and each of them are different, but they are all contained within this one room.

Each of the screens are a focus of you. They are all a creation of you, an aspect of you, and they are all contained within you. You are one of these television screens. You are one focus of attention of essence, just as within your physical body you may focus your attention upon several different areas of your physical form simultaneously. You may be aware of your vision, of your hearing, of your finger tapping, of stimulation of side of your body, of a throbbing toe, all simultaneously. In like manner, your essence is aware and interactive with all of these focuses of attention simultaneously, and viewing all of these television screens at once.

Title: Re: "Seth" books - disturbing implicatio
Post by Harrry Hoose on Jan 2nd, 2005 at 4:53pm
Hello Brendan, I agree with  Dora's statements that we don't reincarnate backward in time  since things occur  simultaneously.  However, from what I understand of Seth's statements made in many books  and in the ESP class sessions at Jane Roberts apartment in Elmira, other aspects  of ourselves, i.e.  our reincarnational  selves are still alive in other centuries and countries. They are simultaneously there just as we are here in whatever century.  One doesn't have to reincarnate, we have free will - as others  on this forum have stated.  My understanding of  this reincarnation business  is that only those who foul up terribly, and do much damage in society have a reqirement to come into another life on earth. But, this is not the person who has died and needs to pay back debts.  The Higher Self sends back a new  fragment with the same memories to live that life over again, and the original fragment , with free will, remains in the "hereafter."  Harry

Title: Brendan's Question
Post by Roger B on Jan 2nd, 2005 at 5:27pm
Hi Dora-

Let's go back and focus on Brendan's question.  He wanted to know if he could experience another incarnation in the late 20th century.

The fact is, Seth DID say exactly what I had indicated, namely that an individual cannot re-experience, in physical form, more than one lifetime in the same timeframe.

When you say that is incorrect, and that Seth never said that, it is clear from the quotation I referenced that he did in fact say exactly that.  

I understand about linear vs. simultaneous time, and that everything really is happening at once.  And that is why Seth is correct, not incorrect.  

In other words, Seth is saying what you are saying, but in a different way.  Seth is saying a person cannot have another incarnation in the same frame of reference (meaning, for instance, in the late 20th century).  Why?  Because all time is one time.

You are correct in what you say about time, but you are incorrect in saying Seth never said the quotation that I previously provided.

Bottom line is, this is not good news for Brendan.


Title: Re: "Seth" books - disturbing implicatio
Post by Dora on Jan 2nd, 2005 at 9:58pm

I did not stated  that  Seth didn't said what you quoted, but incorrect in understanding..  the explanation from Seth  mean,  Brendan cannot go back where he already IS

Don't matter how many *linear* lifetime he  have, since all of them is in the now his soul in Seth term, - based on Seth material, - always was, is,  will  experience  that  time period long as he  physically manifested... in any given timeframe even 200  or a 1000 years from now.

That is the reason why Seth expressing that "if you find severe errors of judgment you may correct them" because even though from this physical dimension it seems like the past personality died, therefore that is closed, done, and gone... but it is not... that is not a closed circle, it is because all of the lives simultaneous Brendan was, is and will experience his favorite timeframe....
So  maybe  not that bad news for him.... :D


Title: Re: Confused
Post by Sydnei on Jan 2nd, 2005 at 10:17pm
Dear Friends ~

It was my understanding that when we leave this physical world and enter the afterlife, we can then choose what we will do, including experiencing another physical life.  How does this fit with what has been discussed in this thread?

Many thanks and love, Sydnei

Title: Re: Seth indeed said that!
Post by Glen on Jan 2nd, 2005 at 11:24pm
Hi Roger,

I think your interpretation of what Seth said is quite creative, but doesn't reflect what he intended.

When he said, "you cannot enter again into that frame of reference as a completely participating consciousness," he meant that you cannot re-enter the life just lived in order to go back and make changes in that life. There's absolutely nothing in the context of that statement that would imply that an oversoul couldn't have more than one soul living at the same time. In fact, if you follow to the end of that sentence you'll see he refers to "the applied consciousness of your self and your 'contemporaries.'" He was just talking about that particular life of one person. He wasn't excluding the possibility of the same oversoul having other lives at the same time (which is how he describes reincarnation). BTW, for people who have an early edition of the book, we're looking at the first paragraph that starts near the top of page 169 (session 538, after 10:07 pm).

Also, you said to Dora:

The fact is, Seth DID say exactly what I had indicated, namely that an individual cannot re-experience, in physical form, more than one lifetime in the same timeframe.

Seth never says that a person experiences more than one lifetime, anyway. What he does say is that each soul/person/lifetime is a part of their greater oversoul, so individual people themselves don't have multiple lives, just memories of other lives/persons which share the same oversoul.

I hope this clears up some of the confusion.


Title: Re: Confused
Post by Glen on Jan 2nd, 2005 at 11:36pm
Hi Sydnei,

As you can see, it's often difficult for people to have a shared understanding of these things, especially when we're not in agreement about what the word "you" refers to. As individual human beings enjoying particular lifetimes, the only decisions we make are those pertaining to our present lives. Our oversouls, however, which include all our various reincarnational lives, decide where to insert souls into this space-time reality in order to fulfill its own purposes. If you can understand and accept the idea that all time is simultaneous, from the point of view of the oversoul, then there's no deciding "when we leave this physical world and enter the afterlife," since such decisions exist outside of time.

I hope this helps.


Title: Re: "Seth" books - disturbing implicatio
Post by Axel on Jan 3rd, 2005 at 2:38am
Hi Sidney!That is so great that some people question things,unlike those who think that they know everything.
I agree with Dora on this.My understanding is that there are no past of future lives,there is just the NOW.Everything is occuring now...then your past of future lives are occuring now...Who created the linear time that we know here?Us of course... ;)

Title: Re: "Seth" books - disturbing implicatio
Post by Sydnei on Jan 3rd, 2005 at 12:00pm
Dear Glen and Axel ~

Thank you both for sharing your thoughts and addressing my question.  Now I have another!  I have read books by both Dr. Brian Weiss and Michael Newton...I'm sure you are familiar with them.  They have regressed (and progressed) hundreds of patients, and have uncovered very similar experiences of the time between lives, including the preparation to 'return' here for another physical life.  How can we reconcile their findings with what has been discussed here?  Thank you once again for your help!

Love, Sydnei

Title: Re: "Seth" books - disturbing implicatio
Post by Roger B on Jan 3rd, 2005 at 12:22pm
Hi Glen-

I was trying to look at it in terms of the question Brendan originally asked.  He really liked the latter part of the 20th century ("he", meaning the aspect of his Oversoul known as Brendan) and would very much like to live another physical incarnation in that same timeframe.

Yes, I know that Seth didn't say an Oversoul couldn't have multiple personalities existing at the same "time."  I think we are mixing apples and oranges here a bit.

Although Brendan's Oversoul might indeed have several incarnations during the last part of the 20th century, the point Seth was making was that the personality of Brendan was not able to re-enter that particular timeframe other than to make some psychic adjustments to it in order to maybe do certain things a different (ie "better") way.  To clean up his act, so to speak.

Yeah, this stuff can get complicated at times, but Brendan just wanted to be Brendan again during a certain historical period that he especially liked.

Hey if we really want to get complicated, let's talk about all of Brendan's probable personalities and lifetimes, which he spun off each time he was faced with certain major decisions, such as should I marry Sarah or Lisa!  Now THAT makes his original question something of a piece of cake.

(hey Brendan, jump in here and join the fun!)

Title: between lives
Post by Glen on Jan 3rd, 2005 at 1:38pm
Hi Sydnei,

I'm not very knowledgable in this area, and haven't read anything by Dr. Brian Weiss or Michael Newton.  I did read Dr. Helen Wambach's Life Before Life however (many years ago), and also Mass Dreams of the Future by Chet Snow.  Helen Wambach reports in her book on the past life memories of numerous people whom she regressed, and had begun doing 'progressions' when she died, leaving it to Chet Snow to continue that work and write about it.  They too found patterns of similarities, but what exactly is your question?

Best wishes,

Title: Re: "Seth" books - disturbing implicatio
Post by Sydnei on Jan 4th, 2005 at 1:45pm
Hi, Glen ~

I guess I am trying to reconcile the findings of such peopel as Brian Weiss and Michael Newton -- that souls do in fact select additional lifetimes on Earth (if they so choose) with the suggestion that all our lifetimes are simultaneous and once we return to the Afterlife, we are there to stay.  Or perhaps the inference was that we do incarnate again, but just not into the exact same life???

Thank you for your help!  Love, Sydnei

Title: Re: "Seth" books - disturbing implicatio
Post by Lights of Love on Jan 4th, 2005 at 3:59pm
Hi Sydnei,

Simultaneous time is so hard for us to understand because right now we exist in linier time so we tend to try to explain things according to that experience.  If I understand your question correctly try picturing the Oversoul who is able to see all life experiences in each time frame of incarnation.  The Oversoul has all memory of all lives lived as the various personalities.  

Then picture each individual personality incarnated in the various time frames.  From each personality point of view as described in Newtonís regressions, even though all is happening simultaneously, they have no other way to explain it except to use terms that we understand in linier time.  The person regressing views each personality in chronological order because that is the only way they know how to describe the experience using words.  Something that I think is confusing is the person after each incarnation going through a life review and then discussing their next incarnation and what is needed, etc.  I see this also as a way to explain the process of the Oversoul mind, which is each and every personality who has been incarnated.  In other words, the person regressing taps into Oversoul mind because they are all ONE and is able to relate each personality experience, but only in linier terms.  

I donít know if Iím making any sense or not.  This is so difficult to explain in words.  LOL :-)

Love, Kathy   :-)  

Title: Re: "Seth" books - disturbing implicatio
Post by Sydnei on Jan 4th, 2005 at 7:01pm
Dear Kathy ~

Hi!  ANd thank you for trying to did a great job!  I do understand what you have said, it helps clarify the concept of linear versus simultaneous time.  This being said, I still have a feeling that there is something more to what is revealed by Newton, Weiss, and others like them...and I just cannot get myself wrapped around it enough to explain it.  Perhaps I will be able to do this at some point.  But thank you so much for the added understanding you brought me!

Love, Sydnei

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