I'm hoping we can start a collection of links, or a verbal discussion, of whatever illustrations we find of afterlife forms described by Moen, Monroe, or encountered in our own explorations.

To start it off, TheArtofSamuelFarrand is on FB and on Etsy.com. (Sorry, I'm unable to drag the live links over.) Particularly striking to me is the image he created called Psychezoa Luminosum. It looks like the Disk!  I don't think the artist has ever mentioned Moen; he uses ayhuesca(sic) instead.

Recent news about similarly formed sea creatures having no brains also relates to the Disk, it seems. On Earth our brains store information for getting through our physical incarnations, but if we didn't need to deal with that, like the Disk or a go-with-the-flow sea creature, then perhaps more spirit is stored up there. ?

Hope you'll check out the image. (I'm not on commission.(-:)

2bets

https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/736x/dc/c8/1e/dcc81efc5c8a5214457546154a479646.jpg

http://s12.postimg.org/cz5xg2j0d/oversoul.jpg

Ambivalent, that second picture is impressive. Did you make it or someone else?

That is like how oversouls look. There is variation though, of course.

And that is an objective view. There are other aspects too, from within it looking down and out, and within and up, and looking down and up the cords from within them from top or bottom. And there is its energetic anatomy and physiology. And there is a more extensive view that takes in further nodes and connections above and below it that go on indefinitely.   

I wish I knew how to make computer pictures. I would have made one like that, and others. And moving pictures too.

There are also subjective qualitative/energetic and functional/purposeful views which I think in future might be able to be simulated through computer virtual reality set ups that would effect upon the bodily senses and effect impressions on bodily awareness/consciousness.

We already have our own natural and perfect subjective simulations and objective replications of the relationship between our self and the oversoul in the relationships between our brain consciousness and the consciousness of our hands, feet, organs and physical senses; for the energetic anatomy and functioning of our bodily consciousness is actually a lesser simulation or replication of our greater oversoul consciousness.    

I have said, probably too many times, that we live in a fractal existence where everything is replicated in form, quality and function, above and below itself to the extent that dimensions and the nature of the matter and energies of those dimensions enables. But I shouldn't repeat myself too often.

We are like pseudopods. We are also like puppets - freewilled puppets, if you can imagine that.

Here is Paul Muriat's orchestra playing Puppet on a String.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6YfjbiwcPjc

And here is a beautiful old original with Sandie Shaw and puppets.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qhLlXvkm65Y

1796, someone else made the picture. Here's another:

http://s9.postimg.org/qvuz27kzj/oversouls.jpg

There are several options to make computer pictures in terms of pen digitizers + software (and a computer with a decent cpu and ram). I've started painting digitally recently, and will use the ipad pro + their apple pencil, along with Procreate, a drawing/painting program made by an Australian company.

Another option is watercolour and taking a photograph afterwards to have a digital copy. I like the simple techniques of this fellow: http://tinyurl.com/oghb4vz

I see that picture has the cords continuing up above the oversouls, which is how it goes. And through layers too, with distant higher souls.


Here is a picture from a Chinese book on breathing and meditation called The secret of the golden flower. I have not read the book, but have read several similar old chinese books on the related subjects. Although it has the cord connecting the meditating man to the figure above the head, the figure above the head probably does not represent the oversoul but the individual's conscious soul departing the body through the crown during meditation.
    
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/3/39/GoldFlwr3.gif

wrote on Nov 25^th, 2015 at 10:54am:

There are several options to make computer pictures in terms of pen digitizers + software (and a computer with a decent cpu and ram). I've started painting digitally recently, and will use the ipad pro + their apple pencil, along with Procreate, a drawing/painting program made by an Australian company. Another option is watercolour and taking a photograph afterwards to have a digital copy. I like the simple techniques of this fellow: http://tinyurl.com/oghb4vz

Thanks for that information. I will make some enquiries and educate myself about how computer art is done.

The painter Steven Cronin is very good, and quick too. I like his style too. 

I have been thinking of taking up painting lately, and I especially like water colours. I will have some spare time soon and amongst many things on my list I intend to squeeze some painting in. Its in the genes so I shouldn't have too much trouble picking it up. 

1796, regarding the computer route, here's a suggestion for a short, free (or pay what you want) tutorial that shows some basic techniques and possibilities with Adobe Photoshop: http://tinyurl.com/p9o9zaq

Paintstorm Studio is a cheaper alternative to Photoshop: http://tinyurl.com/pdvowxp

As for watercolor and different styles coming together: http://tinyurl.com/mdubs8a

Ambivalent, thank you for those links.

Beautiful images! Much appreciation, Ambivalent.

(How can you be ambivalent when you find many different sources showing the same previously unrevealed truths?)

Also thank you and 1796 for the conversation on what means are available for such image-making.

Some readers might find this interesting.

One night many years ago while out of body I was taken by an escort up amongst the higher planes, not of the Earth's higher planes but of the Solar System's. There I saw a great oversoul which had a peculiar energy about it. It was largely unreserved or unguarded and I could quite easily read this great oversoul, that is, read its energy, mindset and character. I could also read its history and to some extent see its past journey across the universes with its many experiences up to now. I saw that it was currently visiting our planet Earth.

It was spherical and had many tentacles coming out from all around it. I saw the tentacles were silver cords going down to Earth with a person at the end of every cord.

I looked down the cords towards the planet and saw all the people at the end of its cords
were mongoloid/down syndrome. I was surprised to see that all down syndrome people shared the same great oversoul, and that in a sense they were a type of race of their own, and their
shared character traits and temperament are due to them all being extensions of the same oversoul with its peculiar character.

Thank you for the pictures. They say that a picture is worth a thousand words, and these are images of "self" which many people have likely not contemplated.

I can say that I have read the books related to this site and listened to and used the cds. I have not studied the lessons intensely and am no expert. It is not necessary to be an "expert" to be an explorer.

However, I did "see" something similar to a tentacled thing to which I was connected in a meditation years ago. It could have been suggestion, from something I read, of course. As I remember it, there were colors there. It was not colorless by any means. Also, there was a great feeling of joy within that being. Or, rather, a great feeling of joy within me upon discovering myself there.

Bets, I am who I am, including being ambivalent, yet there is more to I am.

1796, interesting read about the retreads. You mentioned variations of oversouls earlier in the thread, have you seen other variations?

More pictures, the sun glyph in astrology, as seen from above and through an oversoul with one extension in the middle.

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/4/49/Planets_in_astrology_glyphs.jpg

Mirror of the soul.

http://i448.photobucket.com/albums/qq207/waterdrago19/CS4%20Eyes/BrownEye.jpg

Interesting.


1796 wrote on Dec 1^st, 2015 at 5:45am:

Some readers might find this interesting. One night many years ago while out of body I was taken by an escort up amongst the higher planes, not of the Earth's higher planes but of the Solar System's. There I saw a great oversoul which had a peculiar energy about it. It was largely unreserved or unguarded and I could quite easily read this great oversoul, that is, read its energy, mindset and character. I could also read its history and to some extent see its past journey across the universes with its many experiences up to now. I saw that it was currently visiting our planet Earth. It was spherical and had many tentacles coming out from all around it. I saw the tentacles were silver cords going down to Earth with a person at the end of every cord. I looked down the cords towards the planet and saw all the people at the end of its cords were mongoloid/down syndrome. I was surprised to see that all down syndrome people shared the same great oversoul, and that in a sense they were a type of race of their own, and their shared character traits and temperament are due to them all being extensions of the same oversoul with its peculiar character.

I can't say I ever saw my Over soul in at tentacle kind of way. A number of years ago I had an OBE with the effects, I set the intent to go to my Over Soul/Soul Group, and I flew loops around clusters of stars that seemed to be Soul Groups.

Next I found myself within a beautiful lagoon that was surrounded by green cliffs. I got the sense this was a past alien life. I bring this up because within the water were Jellyfish like creatures, sort of like the images below, except that each creature was a single color (but each had a different color such as red or green). I can't say I know what this experience meant, but it is interesting that I first flew around clusters of stars, and then saw Jellyfish like creatures within water.

The Seagull is right, we don't need to be experts to be explorers.

Ambivalent, thanks for putting up the photo of the eye, and the symbols. They are most relevant here for assisting our comprehension and understanding.   

We live in a fractal existence where everything is replicated in form, quality and function, above and below itself to the extent that dimensions and the nature of the matter and energies of those dimensions enables. (repeating myself again) And that is how symbolism works.

There are four essential types or categories of symbols. Firstly assigned symbols, that have their meaning assigned to them, for example, the letters of the alphabet with which we write. Secondly, intellectual symbols, e.g. an arrow, which by the convergence of its lines draws and directs the intellect in a particular direction. Thirdly, imprinted symbols, that result from something in a higher or more complex dimension imprinting into into a lesser dimension eg, a man's footprint in the sand is an imprinted symbol of the man. And fourthly, living actual symbols, which are that fractional part of great multidimensional things, beings and forces, that exist within this dimension which we can see and know, e.g. the two dimensional flat world creature cannot see us with our height but can see the imprint of our footsteps and the sole of the foot which made the imprint.

To be able to understand symbolism, firstly notice and contemplate the symbols around you, and study which category of symbols they belong to, the assigned, intellectual, imprinted or actual. Practice this regularly and gently. Look and ponder. Learn to differentiate them. many symbols are mixtures, but don't worry about that, notice and contemplate the main categories. These categories of symbols, in the order they are here presented are stepping stones to immense comprehension, understanding, and even the opening of the vision to things previously unfathomable. For where the mind goes the eyes may follow.   

Everything is a symbol. Even we are symbols, along with every organ and its function in our body. That is what made in the image of God means. The planet, moon, sun and stars are symbols. Everything in nature is symbol. I am repeating myself from many previous post, I know, but I am hoping that the great picture to which I am pointing is beginning to be glimpsed.            

wrote on Dec 1^st, 2015 at 10:08am:

You mentioned variations of oversouls earlier in the thread, have you seen other variations?

Yes, I have. I have seen isolated ones, like the down's oversoul above, and also banks of them, packed closely together, with ranks above and below, and the connections that run through them which is interesting. And how their energies flow, and what the relationship is between the consciousness of the oversoul and the consciousness of the extension below, and of the next oversoul above, which is interesting too.
 
In a sense this overseeing spirit is a type of oversoul:
https://lacecurtain.wordpress.com/2014/11/18/bogged/

I have met, conversed with and had many lessons from a particular overseer of nature spirits of a forest. He became a sort of "friend". He taught me things about second sight - how to see through the veil between dimensions, for it is only like a lace curtain. 

Dogs, cats and horses, and most other animals have shared oversouls.

Within one's own consciousness are stations of consciousness that can be staged/mounted, like steps going within and upward. I might describe them one day, perhaps on this thread. I can't rush though because its subtle and I have to get the words right and make it as clear and simple as I can, so that people can easily understand and explore if they are interested. So when I have some time. But also, I must get clarification of what I can reveal regarding that matter. The Monroe stages or focus levels are pretty fuzzy and indistinct compared to the ones I might describe, which are fewer, more distinctly marked, go higher, and one can learn to slide up and down them and connect them, and venture up them. They are not mine by the way, they belong to God and Nature as they come together within our self at the natural stages. And they are well known too, and have been well known for centuries, and everyone is so close to them but few notice them. Like people don't notice their own eyes until they get something in their eye, even though they are using them and looking at things with them all day. So too, people don't notice their own consciousness.    

There are two main ways of spiritual progress/realisation. One way is through one's own soul, that is, coming to know and understand ones own conscious soul, and how deep and far back, in and up it goes, up through the layers of oversoul, and further oversoul,... back along the branches of the great tree of life, all the way back to Eden, for we each are like a leaf on the tree of life. The other way is via a short cut without going through our soul. Can you imagine that? - a way of full spiritual realisation that even short cuts our own soul! Well, that short cut exists.

1796: very interesting. I ran across this last week:

http://www.astralpulse.com/frankkepple.html

You've probably seen it, but he gives an intriguing model of the wider reality, similar to Monroe but different. Curious as to what you think about it.


Quote:

back along the branches of the great tree of life, all the way back to Eden, for we each are like a leaf on the tree of life.

Do you see Eden as a metaphor? If so, what does the Eden/creation story mean to you?

doodad wrote on Dec 2^nd, 2015 at 10:58am:

1796: very interesting. I ran across this last week: http://www.astralpulse.com/frankkepple.html You've probably seen it, but he gives an intriguing model of the wider reality, similar to Monroe but different. Curious as to what you think about it. Quote: back along the branches of the great tree of life, all the way back to Eden, for we each are like a leaf on the tree of life. Do you see Eden as a metaphor? If so, what does the Eden/creation story mean to you?

I have previously seen the name Frank Kepple mentioned on this site but have never read any of his writings.I have put the link in favourites and will peruse it when I get time.

The biblical creation story, Eden, the serpent, the temptation, the fruit, the tree of knowledge, and of life, the animal skins, ...everything in it is true. Yes it is metaphorical, and it is accurate too. Things like that are best described and survived in metaphorical or symbolic stories. A picture tells a thousand words, a symbol even more.

I mentioned the four categories of symbols. There are also different types, such as singular symbols and complex ones. An example of complex ones are metaphorical or allegorical stories, as in the creation story and others in the old testament, the parables of Jesus, the mystic/gnostic writings of John, and some of Paul's writings. These metaphorical and allegorical stories fall into the four categories described in the post above.

After metaphors and verbal and written allegories, there are dynamic symbols, such as ceremony and ritual, and these too fall into the four categories described above. And these are most potent symbols. Those with a knowledge of the physics of music, sound and vibration will appreciate that potency. Consider that this potency works with all four categories or levels of symbolism, and that we our self, our soul and everything in existence under God, and even God, is all part of existence and of the symbolic network. 

There will come a time when symbolism is recognised as being as much a universal language as music and mathematics, and as much a science as physics. At present we have little or no realisation of the existence of the science of symbolism; we are like the Australian Aborigine prior to white settlement with no realisation of the existence of mathematics and of what mathematics can enable. As the Aborigine could only count one, two, many and many-many, so too, we are as primitive in our understanding and use of symbols. The science of symbolism and all that it will enable, is hopefully ahead of us.

1796:

I don't want to derail the topic of disks and jellyfish, sorry.  :)

I would though, be very interested in exactly how you see this. I have a very difficult time getting my mind around how Genesis can be true and accurate as you say, and at the same time be metaphorical. As I have said before, I grew up fundamentalist and taught to take the Bible literally. Literal 6 day creation. Literal Eden. Literal Ark, etc. Deep down I had questions about my church and questions about how these things could be. I just didn't think about them. This all fell apart for me over several years as I was forced to confront my personal doubts in church matters as well as inescapable scientific fact of a very old universe and human evolution.

I read a book awhile ago, "The afterlife teaching of Stephen the Martyr" It was very interesting:

http://whitecrowbooks.com/books/page/afterlife_teaching_from_stephen_the_martyr/

You seem to be insinuating many of the same things as "Stephen". Trouble is, it simply doesn't make sense to me. Not saying you're wrong at all, just that my small mind has no framework to put it all together. Its just too vague for me. To my way of thinking, if one says that the Eden story is literally true, they are wrong because it is demonstrable that it is not. If one says that it is a metaphor, I ask what does it mean? In it not being literal, you have taken away the premise of the salvation by Jesus Christ. If humanity never actually "sinned" what do we need a Saviour for? Its all just a story. I have heard of different takes on the metaphorical side, such as it being the "Hero's Journey" etc. It just seems to me to be wanting to shoehorn our comfortable Christian culture and traditions into reality, keeping the trappings but not expecting any vital meaning.. Now I realize that obviously you are way beyond this type of thinking, which is why I'd like you to perhaps flesh this out a bit when you have the time.

The Genesis story is symbolic. Just because something is symbolic does not mean it is not real.

There exist great multidimensional realities which cannot be fathomed by the current average human mind. But for the individual who wishes to both simplify lofty realities and stretch the mind, then symbols provide a way. 

Symbols don't only simplify lofty realities, they expand mind too, and facilitate the bringing together of mind and great realities. Or, in other words: In one direction symbols funnel down great realities into the mind. And from the other direction symbols expand the mind to encompass great realities.

You might find it beneficial to gently ponder on and identify the four categories or stages of symbols listed in the post above. At their lower stages (category 1) symbols are mental tools to help the mind fathom. At their higher stages (category 4) symbols are the reality being fathomed. Between these exists the gradient of mental expansion facilitated by the symbols as they become less representative of reality and more actual reality. Symbols bring mind and great realities together.   

Put another way, the categories or stages of symbols run into each other, progressively, from leading the mind and the mental vision, through to opening the mind and the mental vision to fathom greater realities that cannot normally be seen. Symbols are portals.

Symbols are more real than reality as we know it, more alive than life as we know it, and more potent and multi-dimensional than any energy that we as a civilisation currently use. Symbols are power. Symbolism will one day be known to be every bit as real as physics and mathematics. Symbols are alive, just as everything is alive. Even numbers are alive with motion and energy of their own. For example, look at the so-called “irrational” number pi, it never stops moving. (In reality, pi is not irrational at all, just misunderstood.) Now look at all the cycles in nature; they turn around but never complete a circle but always a helix or a spiral overlapping the previous turn of the cycle, for nothing is the same or in the same place when it comes around again, but a little further forward every time. There are no circles, they do not exist. Circles and spheres that appear to exist are just the leading edge or point or cross sections of spirals and helixes, overlapping their selves and riding on each other. That is why pi is in perpetual motion. The same with all irrational numbers, they represent perpetual motions, infinite foldings, unfoldings, and generations. And other numbers do too, every one of them, represents a mighty happening or force of nature. There are all sorts of strange motions and unfoldings in the universe, and numbers correspond with these. Our numbers as we know them go in a straight line, but the universe moves in curves, helixes and spirals, and so our numbers misfit reality, and are out of order, only suitable to our locality. For instance, in the greater reality three is between one and two, and just below them. And most of our numbers are not real numbers at all, but fractions. Look at the primary shapes, a circle, a triangle, a square, a vertical line, horizontal line, two lines, a cross,…  each is a two dimensional representation or imprint of a multidimensional reality, or of a force of God and Nature, and of the relationship between them.  And there are not just three dimensions but numerous dimensions and numerous angles from which things can be viewed. From a certain angle, the soul in the human condition in its form, quality and function is exactly like the earth, moon, stars and sun, and the human eye is too, each of these a copy of the other, that resonated in harmony with each other. And the heart, brain, and every organ of the body, our shape, and psychology, are all copies and precipitations of greater things from which they come. Everything is greater than it seems, and has more to it than it appears. We only see a part of things as they pass by our narrow window of perception. And that partial view is a symbol of the greater, and is our access to the greater, if we know how to enter it. And time runs at a different rate in every dimension, some timelines run fast, some slow, and yet all rates of time run side by side, with none getting ahead or falling behind the others, so now is now in every rate of time, for different timelines do not run parallel but at right angles to each other, and also in spirals around each other, of which spirals of every different size correspond to every rate of time, and so time and dimension and motion makes a knitted multidimensional fabric in which all rates of time are side by side and now is now in all of them. Time corresponds with reality in which all cycles or spirals orbit around an axis which progresses in a helix too. All this and so much more can be seen by human vision. And symbols not only enable us to see and penetrate reality, symbols are the coming together of reality and mind. Symbols are the structures and forces of reality interpenetrating itself, penetrating through dimensions, imprinting, shaping, and representing itself, all within the laws of cosmic physics. The laws of physics are the laws of mind. They are one. And the mind that understands symbols can look into them and follow the patterns up to perceive the greater realities.       

One day symbols will power inter-dimensional spacecraft. Of course, few can currently see how that could be possible, just as a primitive man whose counting was limited to one, two, many and many-many, and whose physics was limited to shaping such things as spears and clubs and making a basic fire, could not see how mathematics, physics and fire would one day build and power a computer, a fighter jet or passenger plane or a submarine or mining drill and penetrate and transport men and information through dimensions that he could not even fathom. After the science of symbolism is discovered then the sciences of mathematics and physics will be combined with symbolism, and together they will be technologized and used to build, power and transport. Symbolism is inter-dimensional physics.

This has been a rather far out post. It will read as nonsense to some, and to others it may open the mind a little more, and make the mind wonder about the nature of symbols as portals and as power, and as great structures and forces of God and Nature interpenetrating every corner of reality, and drawing the mind towards fathoming greater things.

The next time you observe any of these wonderful structures, the forces and cycles of nature, the elements, any living thing, animal or vegetable, mineral or chemical, or listen to music, or to someone speaking, or consider numbers and mathematics, shapes and geometry, astronomy, engineering, physics, mind, human and animal anatomy and physiology, religious icons, ceremonies and ritual, allegorical stories, customs, courtesies, accounting, electronics, natural and human hierarchies, individuals, societies, governments, networks and interactions, - anything at all that you can observe - consider the possibility that what you are seeing is a representation, a reflection, an imprint, a tip, an effect, and a cross section of a greater reality, and that there is much more going on within, behind, over, around and beyond the scenes than your currently narrow scope of mind and vision can see. Then wonder some more. Wonder is in the heart, what curiosity is in the head. They are reciprocal conditions, each symbolic of the other, in accordance with the nature of their respective organs. Work them together, but let wonder power curiosity, for the heart is more powerful than mind. With wonder, every day, combine faith, prayer, love and thankfulness, and in time and to the extent your oversoul or your Father God in Heaven wills it to you, you will come to see and know reality. As Jesus said to every one of us, You shall come to know the truth, and the truth shall set you free.  (John 8:32)

THIS DISC NONSENSE DOES NOT EXIST
IT IS AN INVENTION FABRICATION OUT OF BRUCE MOEN DELUSIONAL MIND
SEEK THE TRUTH WHILE IT CAN STILL BE FOUND
THIS IS THE LAST PLACE YOU WILL FIND TRUTH

A discs diner plate? ;D.