The popular psychic chat site based out of the UK has been using the same integrated chat system for years...

It has now gone down and they have to work out a new system.

With perhaps hundreds of psychics involved, why did none of them see this coming?

My point? You ask...?

Psychics are right sometimes and they play those times up tremendously, pretending the frequent wrong reads don't exist.

Convenient no?

http://www.psychics.co.uk/chat.html

yes but...

being able to see some thing in the future is not the same as being all-knowing. Psychis don't usually claim they know what the littlest sparrow is up to.

The thing I found funny was the head psychic guy I think his name is Greg or something recently had a picture put up with him around huts and those fruity drinks. Makes me think that he sure is cashing in on a nice expensive vacation with his profits..... Members of his site pay money for readings and all sorts of things plus him and his wife are in the lime light cashing in so to speak.

Once again I'm reminded of the warning from ES that any contact with the afterlife is full of danger mainly because of the unreliability of those with whom you come in contact.

ES states that it's not the higher developed spirit entities that are the easiest to contact.  Instead it's those in the lower realms.

So IMHO I would stay away from psychics, ouija boards, etc etc.  Same warning, btw, applies to channeled entities.

R

I am not "a psychic", I don't do it for a living.  But I am psychic.  And being psychic and having psychic ability and using psychic ability doesn't have to only be about contacting dead people or being in contact with lower realms or beings. 

Typically, psychic ability is about every-day, typical, boring things.  It's about paying attention to something coming into your awareness...we are human beings and cannot be aware of every single thing out there.  We have a natural filtering system too.  Being a good psychic is learning how to focus your attention and awareness on something and perceive and interpret.  It doesn't mean being an open radar to every thoughts, feeling, frequency, or event that is happening around the world and at every given moment in time in the future. 

And if you want to get more philosophical about it, why would a person who is psychic not be a good psychic just for not knowing about a particular event in one's life?  Surely there must be bigger-picture reasons for why some things in life come easy and some don't.  Aren't we here to experience, learn, and evolve? 

Vicky wrote on Mar 21^st, 2012 at 8:07pm:

Typically, psychic ability is about every-day, typical, boring things.  It's about paying attention to something coming into your awareness...we are human beings and cannot be aware of every single thing out there.  We have a natural filtering system too.  Being a good psychic is learning how to focus your attention and awareness on something and perceive and interpret.  It doesn't mean being an open radar to every thoughts, feeling, frequency, or event that is happening around the world and at every given moment in time in the future.

  Generally speaking, i agree Vicky.  One of the things that have been suggested to me though, is a sort of question, "what if a human being becomes fully open and attuned to PUL in a permanent sense?

  If PUL expands perception, then becoming PUL, a pure vessel of same, might mean that we can be aware of anything and everything that has been created and co-created. 

  We still wouldn't be able to accurately predict all events, because such manifestations depend on the freewill use of individuals and/or the collective, and that's something that can change even on a dime at times. 

  Perhaps becoming a completely open and clear channel of PUL would begin to even change ones "body", so that in a sense, they wouldn't really be "human" anymore in the normal sense of it. 

   Perhaps related is an experience a friend and i had.  I became friends with a lady with open minded spiritual beliefs on another forum years back.  Anyways, during the course of our first online friendship (we later met up), i sent her a pic of myself.  She wrote back in a rather dramatic fashion, and jokingly said, "were you trying to give me a heart attack?!" 

   I had no idea what she meant and was confused.  She explained, and said that some years before, well before she ever knew i existed, one time she was relaxing by herself and someone materialized in the room with her, and then briefly after left. 

  She said with certainty that this person looked exactly like and felt like me.  I of course didn't remember doing this at all, and in fact, for years forgot about this whole thing until very recently.  It got brought up during a guidance message of sorts, and after a lot of personal revelations about self and the role i've chosen and been chosen for in this life. 

   I realized that future me, went back in time (who needs the Dolorian when you got Love!), and manifested to her for a reason.  I believe that future me will be able to have this and other abilities because future me will be very attuned to Love.  I guess it could be argued that maybe she just saw me psychically and i wasn't there "physically", but she seemed to think i was pretty solid even though we didn't touch. 

   It's amazing what a human can do if one opens up more fully to and becomes a completely clear channel for real PUL.   Perhaps it melts away so many of our limiting barriers of perception and abilities?  Perhaps we become like Source (God)?   

rondele wrote on Mar 21^st, 2012 at 12:47pm:

ES states that it's not the higher developed spirit entities that are the easiest to contact.  Instead it's those in the lower realms. R

  While i generally agree, it's not so black and white.  Everything in the nonphysical, and to a lesser extent the physical--but especially the physical connecting with the nonphysical and vice versa, operates according to a Universal Law which has been described as Like attracts, begets, and resonates with Like. 

   Plus there is the principle of assistance, or spoken of in the Bible, "Ask and you shall receive". 

   This is why, when i meditate and seek info or help from the nonphysical, i specifically ask and sincerely so, "I deeply desire and ask for the help and guidance of ONLY the MOST Source and Christ attuned consciousnesses. 

Then to strengthen that connection and to better able to perceive communication from such sources, i practice Bruce's "remembering the feeling of Love" technique in conjunction with the above.  I may also do some "toning" as well, to help things out a bit too. 

    Anyways, this is as working in harmony with the Law of Like attracts, begets, and resonates with Like, and with the principle of "ask and you shall receive". 

  If i'm seeking info from a psychic, i apply similar principles.  I look for more spiritually mature psychics and i look for ones whose abilities come well recommended. 

  Then, before and during the 'reading', i do likewise as i do in meditation, except that this time, i picture White Light around both of us, and i ask Expanded Guidance that only the most spiritually helpful information for myself and the Whole come through.   I tune into the remembrance of the feelings of Love and/or Gratitude and feel that in relation to the sensitive.   Then, just like in my own meditations, i "blank my mind" and have no preconceptions and expectations of what may or may not come through. 

  These are ways and methods of boosting accuracy, how "high" they reach, and the spiritual helpfulness of the info coming through.  But, it really helps to have a more Love attuned and balanced sensitive to begin with who practices certain affirmations and who has certain ideals, intentions and desires.  The more mature and Love attuned, the higher they tend to reach.

  One sensitive i got a reading from, when she found out it was my birthday, she did the reading for free.  She is just that kind of person, a giving and kind  and truly service type. 

  It's interesting to me though, that you would make it so black and white of an issue, when there are definite shades of gray involved.  I do agree with the Ouija board though, because it has such a history of immaturity, idle curiosity, lack of respect and understanding of spiritual Laws, etc, etc. involved.  I mean, heck, it started off as a game of entertainment and as someone trying to make money of selling a product.   

  In a sense, it's built up a rather limiting thought form pattern around it, which inherently tends to create connections to limiting and/or hindering influences. 

  Generally speaking, more mature and developed humans do not seek to get info from such materialistic, shallow, and sensationalist mediums as Ouija boards.  Hence why it has a long history of attracting (like attracts, begets, and resonates with like) the attention of mischievous, immature, and sometimes downright harmful and hindering consciousnesses. 

Hi Justin,

I don't see the point in talking about what-ifs.  I look at what I know at this point in time in my life.  On this site there's a group of guys who beat everything to death with theories, what they've read, who should read what book or their opinions don't count, what stands as real proof and what doesn't...you get my point. 

I speak for what I know from my own experience.  My ex always ignored what I WAS psychically correct about and instead focused on "but you haven't yet gotten us the winning lotto numbers", or he'd make me feel stupid for not knowing something bad that happened to him.  My point is, no matter how much I don't know or how much I get wrong, it doesn't change what I am right about.  Perception is what it is, it's the person doing the perceiving who makes things more complicated or misguided than it needs to be.  That's the point I was trying to make because it seems like every thread on this site is about why fakes are fakes and why no one knows how to do anything real because they aren't an adept of perfection.   

I will continue to expand my psychic abilities and other spiritual areas as well.  That's my intention and goal.  If I'm right about something as meaningless as my Sprint bill over charging me, which bank teller I'm going to get, or the answers to Clue before the game even begins, so what?  I will (and am) finding ways to branch out and expand my perception to bigger and better things.  It doesn't have anything to do with PUL or expanding myself to know all for the greater good.  I am not here for the other 7 billion people in the world.  I'm here to figure out what I'm here for and whatever course that takes, I guess that's the way it is.  Sure, I have immense love inside me for all the wonderful things in the world to happen, but that hardly seems reasonable to have a goal in mind to be that pure 100% of the time.  Not here, not in this physical world. 

Now I know how negative that's going to sound to some of you, especially coming from me.  But let me ask you this.  What's the point of talking about belief in an afterlife or a beforelife and then act like we are supposed to make THIS life BE all that we aspire for the greater good of all what PUL stands for.  What's the point of making a God-like life here?  That reminds me of when I was little and wanted to wear one of my pretty dresses in my closet and then go out and play.  But my mom told me if I choose to wear the pretty dress, I have to stay inside and just do something quiet so that I don't get dirty or mess up my dress.  Well I thought about all that I'd miss out on outside.  I'd miss what the boys were doing.  I'd miss playing on the tire swing out back.  I wouldn't get to ride my bike down the street.  So I put on my shorts and t-shirt and went and had fun. 

I'm not condoning not being loving, not being of service, and being a bad-ass.  I'm just saying that it's not a goal of mine to try to attain God-like status.  If I had to try to be that pure, good, and perfect I'd miss out on a lot of life's experiences, lessons, and opportunities to grow. 

The reason I say this?  I have a very good sense of my relationship with my higher self, my Guidance, my whatever it is out there that guides, loves, helps, and protects me.  I don't take it for granted, but on the other hand I don't need to understand and be all that it is in this lifetime in order for me to be doing good and doing what I came here to do and learn.  I also have a good conscience, I'm an honest and trustworthy person, and I already know right from wrong automatically inside me.  That's just me.  Sure, it is a wonderful sentiment to want to be a pure channel of the highest whatever, but not being so doesn't mean I'm in league with channeling low-level spirits. 

My mom didn't say, "You have to wear the dress and not get dirty, that's what I expect of you."  She just said "it's your choice".  I think we are here to have our choices, and there's no punishment for what we choose, not the kind of punishment that God-fearing religious believers live in fear of.  Life isn't just black or white, good or evil.  So why bother turning normal every-day life into "what if it there was a perfect way to be, all the time, 100%, wouldn't you want that?"  Well sure, I want a lot of things, but that's hardly reasonable to waste my time on.  Sometimes things just work out perfectly the way they are meant to even with lots of crap happening along the way.  Why?  Because we have the conscious ability to make our choices, to decide where to focus our energy, thoughts, and attention at any point in time.  And yet, we still end up getting what we need, learning what we came here to learn. 

Maybe sitting on the couch all day in my pretty dress, not getting dirty nor getting into things sounds like a perfect way for a little girl to be the best and most pure and God-like.  But is it really?  Somehow I went outside and did things and got into situations that wasn't quite so wonderful for me, but I had something watching over me, guiding me, giving me nudges.  Even as a little girl I knew I had "something out there" who told me the important things I really needed and at just the right moments, and yet I still was able to have all the fun I found.  So what I'm saying is, I'm all for good intentions and all that, and yes there are phony fakes out there who put on for show when deep inside they're as insecure as the rest of us, but I myself know that I'm learning at my own pace and being guided to exactly what I need.  And as I grow and change, my guidance is still there with me.  Wherever I'm focused, my Guidance is aware of me.  I don't know every bad thing that's going to happen or how to prevent it, I don't know the winning lotto numbers, and I don't know a lot of things.  But that doesn't dis-prove the things I do know. 

For those reading who believe that psychic ability comes from a being, and beings are either low level or high level...I haven't yet experienced my information coming from a being.  At least that's not how I perceive or interpret it.  I call it my Guidance because that's just what I believe my higher self is.  I don't have dead people or other wordly disincarnate beings talking to me.  Why is that such a focus here on this site?  Why is that the only conversation that any thread turns into?  Personally I'm much more interested in what I do know about my own experiences, than all the what-ifs and arguments about what we DON'T know.  Sure, I'd love to post that I've achieved perfection in all that exists in the universe, but that's not realistic.  It's much more interesting to discuss and share what I have experienced, what it taught me, and the growth I've noticed in myself.  I'd love to hear that from other people too.  But striving to be God-like?  Striving to be ES?  Give me a break.  I already know I have Love inside me, guiding me.  I don't have to be someone else. 

And why I'm not "a psychic"?  Because the general public wants to come to a psychic to hear if they should stay with their boyfriend, or if they will get the job they want, or if they'll get enough money from their divorce settlement or not.  No matter how much PUL is put into the psychic reading, is that really how a psychic wants to spend her time?  Not me. 

Believe me, I try every day to attain the best and most important information from my Guidance.  I ask the best, most self-less questions.  I have so much PUL inside me to put into it.  Do I get all the answers I want?  No of course not.  That's not how things work, and there's a reason for that.  Things seem to happen in the best way possible, things seem to just magically align just at the right time, and life has a way of giving us what we need when we need it.  So I try not to waste my time wondering about what I don't know.  I appreciate what I do know, and the more I unwrap that present again and again, the more I get from that gift.  Gifts don't open just once. 

  I understand Vicky.. and i understand that this life is hard and sometimes it's hard enough just to be a decent person in this crazy and imbalanced world. 

  Yet, the only difference between us and "He/She" is how we choose.  We can become like him if we choose to.  Since all incarnations here are ultimately about consciousness growth, and all interactions here are about consciousness growth..

and since we are all connected within a reality of Oneness, then why not choose like He chose?  Why delay our ultimate destiny and birth right?   Why not help and speed up the process of the Whole healing itself, so that we can end suffering for all? 

  Again, the only thing that separates us from him, his experience, his happiness and joy, is lack of desire, passiveness, and limited use of our freewill.  Don't we all seek that same illusive goal, happiness and joy which is not affected by anything outside of us?  What do you think brings and creates that?  It's not psychic abilities, nonphysical experiences, but attuning to Love. 

  Psychic abilities and nonphysical experiences don't mean shite, btw. Not important at all in the grand scheme of things.  It only matters who much we attune to Love.  My earlier point to you was that if we choose to attune fully to Love, it tends to automatically expand our perceptual capacity, and can do so to the nth degree depending on the degree of attunement to Love. 

  Real teachers challenge us Vicky, challenge us to do better, to expand, to get out of our comfort zones, to realize our full and ultimate potential.   

  In some ways, but in a different direction, like Rondele you want a simplified reality, a more cut and dry reality, wherein guidance is always guidance and from higher self and never anything else (this is probably true for some rare people). 

   You want the Universal, impersonal Law of Like attracts, begets, and resonates with Like to disappear and not exist, for it makes a reality of a many shades of gray, and such realities are hard to figure out, let alone face--especially the knowledge that there are very lacking in Love, but strong forces out there that seek to keep us limited and suffering (not speaking from "theory" btw, but repeated guidance and experience).
 
What we want, what we prefer, and what really is, is not necessarily the same thing. 

   The sooner we stop trying to mold reality to our wants, wishes, and preconceptions, the sooner and closer we come to becoming joyful and at peace beings. 

  You are further along the path of Love than many, you take for granted your natural abilities and connections that many others don't have, you are projecting your experience out onto others and saying for others that their suffering and challenges don't exist.   Please go up to someone contemplating suicide and tell them, "there's no such thing as negative entities who seek to mislead and harm others through psychic means." 

   Or those who live in countries oppressed by those who are quite influenced by negative and hindering consciousnesses.

  Your view of reality is narrow and self focused currently, which is why you continue to experience intensely, at times, the bitter fruits of same.  Yet, you are a mature and Loving consciousness at your core, and you will come into your own and become more collective minded, more impersonal, more focused on the needs of the Whole when others will need your developing strength, centeredness, and clear insight.  During a time of tribulation and much challenge.

  What do you think your guidance is leading you to after all?   ;)  To become a pure and clear vessel of Love, by and through losing self in service to others and the Whole.

Wow Justin, am I ever shocked at your assumptions and attitude!  You sound righteous and preachy.  Was your last post directed at me? 

My posts were about psychic ability.  You turned the conversation into something else.  I'm standing up for what I know and believe about my own experiences, and I don't feel sorry for myself that I'm not some higher achieving being who lives in a pure state of joy.

A lot of the things you assumed I said, I never said.  You've greatly misinterpreted many things and turned them into assumptions about topics that I wasn't even talking about.  I guess we hear what we want to hear.  I'm talking about one thing, and you're applying it to something else.

Your idea of being a joyful being is different from mine. 

The most important thing you can do at any given moment, Justin, is to put yourself into the state of being of the FEELING of what you most truly desire to feel.  Then live your day from that state.  No matter what life throws at you, the best way to be is living, feeling, and making decisions from that state of being.  It's not always easy to do, but it's the best that you can do.  We are each responsible for that within ourselves, no matter what life throws at us.

I'm not even going to bother commenting on most of the things either of your posts to me said, because you're off in some other place with what you want to be discussing.  I was talking about being myself in the moment, knowing and learning from my own experiences, and not bothering to focus my attention on trying to achieve to be like what someone else believes is what is meant to be for all of us. 

Whatever my spirit and soul and being are most desiring to learn and experience, I have every confidence that that's what's going to happen one way or another.  I don't waste my time thinking that I'm not doing the right thing at the moment.  Every moment counts.  If you want your pure perfection and peace, then just imagine it and feel it, and allow whatever emotions, thoughts, and anything else to flow through you.  Then, like everyone else, you eventually have to mow the lawn, make dinner, drive your car, etc. 

Life still happens.  Reality is still the same as it always was.  The only thing that really changes is how we are feeling, what we become aware of, how that makes us feel, and the thoughts, feelings, and decisions we make based on that cycle.  Sometimes we pray and get exactly what we prayed for.  Sometimes we pray and don't get it.  What's the difference?  There are lessons hidden in all that we do, feel, and experience. 

Again, I see that what you're discussing is completely different from what I'm discussing.  That's ok, it happens.  I'm not judging you or upset.  I'm just not interested in what you're talking about. 

We hear a lot about 'unfriendly beings' on this forum. If we define an unfriendly being/source as something  which hinders spiritual growth/evolution is'nt there a danger in promoting a 'one size fits all' mentality with this talk of unfriendly beings ? By this I mean that if we accept we are on different spiritual journeys or at least different points on a journey does'nt it follow that we need different guides/teachers/influences at those different points ? Or to put it another way may not one person's 'unfriendly being' be another's 'friendly being' ? Further, was'nt Monroe told that as an immortal being he had nothing to fear from any influence ?!

heisenberg69 wrote on Mar 22^nd, 2012 at 6:52am:

We hear a lot about 'unfriendly beings' on this forum. If we define an unfriendly being/source as something  which hinders spiritual growth/evolution is'nt there a danger in promoting a 'one size fits all' mentality with this talk of unfriendly beings ? By this I mean that if we accept we are on different spiritual journeys or at least different points on a journey does'nt it follow that we need different guides/teachers/influences at those different points ? Or to put it another way may not one person's 'unfriendly being' be another's 'friendly being' ? Further, was'nt Monroe told that as an immortal being he had nothing to fear from any influence ?!

  Monroe was essentially told that he was getting to the point in his growth and maturity, that he needed to get over his fear of hindering influences (which, then,  he had recently directly become aware of) and that he had reached enough maturity and awareness that he was safe from being influenced anymore.  He was told that many of his other experiences and selves had been influenced, and by E.T.'s with an agenda more specifically.

  Having awareness of unfriendly influences, is quite a different matter than having fear of same, isn't it?

   How can one stop from being influenced, if one isn't even consciously aware of being influenced to begin with or that there are forces which seek to do same!???

  As i said to Vicky,  tell those folks on the border of suicide, or those folks who live under oppressive rulers and regimes, or those being possessed and influenced greatly, that there is no need to be consciously aware of or concerned with hindering influences.   I am SOOO sick of people's narrow, self focused concerns and attidudes.  It's not just about YOU.  It's about suffering of the Whole.  You may be mature enough to not be influenced, but what about your brother, what about your sister, do you have any concern and awareness for THEM?!!   >:(

  What is most needed in this world today, is a greater awareness of Love and the importance of same (this is always the case), a more conscious awareness of the most powerful and affecting hindering influences, and an awareness  the coming changes. 

   These are preparations, and part of "the Plan" that Monroe was given by He/She despite that Monroe did not go in depth about same--except for both hinting at the earth changes.  The combination of the 3 is what will eventually lead to the very positive and happy future possibility that Monroe saw for humanity for some 1500 years from now wherein every human alive is at the He/She like level in their maturity and expression. 

We are not going to magically get there--it will require a lot of effort, a lot of awareness, and we must break free, as a species, from those forces which have been influencing the world for a very long time now. 

  When in doubt, seek direct guidance under the most ideal conditions to find out for self the truth of the matter.  To be frank Dave--i hear so little about your experiences, insight, and seeking in this area, but i hear/see a lot of intellectual theorizing and other exercises of the intellect.

  You can't figure these things out via the intellect alone, nor from reading outside sources.  It's necessary to go within and under the more ideal circumstances. 

  Hi Vicky, on forums, i sometimes am 'preachy'.  I'm an open channel much of the time when i write, and i let it flow.  I am what i am, and you can either accept me for how i am, or not.  What i say, is not personal and not meant to be taken personally.  If one finds themselves becoming "offended" by what i say, then perhaps one needs to get to the root of those reactions.

   Just recently, on another forum, i got booted because the moderator of same, well i really stirred up his shadow and he only could see red in relation to me.  He had to get rid of me, and there was rejoicing at this site.  Yet, i mostly just pointed to higher ways and methods in an impersonal sense, and never once tried to personally attack, name call, nor ever got upset towards any poster there. 

  I am aware that later on, i will be murdered for living and preaching this same way, without fear and without social concern.  Becky has received some 3 messages now, preparing her for my early death.  I am one who has decided to lay it all on the line for the needs of the Whole when the time comes--except that in the future, i will be able to demonstrate materially and undeniably that attunement to Love.  Those who do so, are rarely treated well or liked in this world.  Often they are despised, hated, and mis-treated by the majority around them.  Their pungent truth and examples stir up the shadow in others, and those shadow aspects become afraid and/or reactive towards them.  People quickly become "intolerant" of them.

   I know what i know, and i speak as i'm guided to.  As i said earlier, real teachers challenge us to grow and to get outside of our comfort zone and belief system boxes.  The realest teachers are rarely appreciated or wanted by the majority, when they are still around.  Look what happened to the Teacher of teachers.

  Real teachers seek to fully liberate themselves.  Lesser teachers, give up in this life and teach life is a vacation and say there are no such thing as strong and effective hindering influences.  Lesser teachers are being influenced by those same hindering forces to some extent, though much less than most. 

wrote on Mar 22^nd, 2012 at 10:07am:

[quote author=5E535F45535854534451000F360 link=1332283769/11#11 date=1332413535]   Having awareness of unfriendly influences, is quite a different matter than having fear of same, isn't it?    How can one stop from being influenced, if one isn't even consciously aware of being influenced to begin with or that there are forces which seek to do same!???   As i said to Vicky,  tell those folks on the border of suicide, or those folks who live under oppressive rulers and regimes, or those being possessed and influenced greatly, that there is no need to be consciously aware of or concerned with hindering influences.   I am SOOO sick of people's narrow, self focused concerns and attidudes.  It's not just about YOU.  It's about suffering of the Whole.  You may be mature enough to not be influenced, but what about your brother, what about your sister, do you have any concern and awareness for THEM?!!   >:(

Justin,  you're entitled to your beliefs and what you share.  No problem.  But you seem to have a problem with something I said or the fact that I didn't automatically agree with you.  I'll try to respond to what you said and not try to get confusing and go off topic....

You are on a mission to influence with your beliefs.  That's fine.  But my posts about psychic ability weren't talking about that.  It would be refreshing if a topic on this site actually stayed about that topic.  I merely responded to what you wrote me. 

About what you wrote me....If there are people suffering in the world who don't know they are under oppression, can't change it, and don't know how to even if they had a momentary wish that they could, it doesn't mean that I don't care.  It doesn't mean that I can do anything.  Yes, I can sit here for 20 minutes sending Love nonphysically to that person.  Will it help?  I don't know, probably in some way it will, but I won't see it.  It's not like I'll get a letter in the mail that says "Thanks!"  So what's your point Justin?  That just because my post was about my own life, it must mean that I'm selfish and non-caring about people who suffer in the world? 

All I said was that I don't experience my psychic ability as coming from this guide or that guide, or this being or that being.  I experience it all the same way, one way, to my perception.  That's what I see, that's what I know.  If I'm wrong, well then heck I'm wrong.  I don't really care.  All I know is what I know at the moment.  Just because I'm not getting psychic information that tells me how to save lives and find murders and bad guys, doesn't mean that I'm being influenced by low-level beings.  And it doesn't mean that I'm not aspiring to use Love in all that I do. 

I know, trust, and learn from my own experiences, psychic, spiritual, and otherwise.  It's the best that I know how to do.  I grow and learn and live and be at my own pace. 

Now, as far as poor people suffering in the world who ARE being badly influenced and they don't know it and don't know what to do about it...again, what does that have to do with me and what I posted?  I do give love.  I do have good intentions.  I do care about people.  If I walk down the street and see someone in need of help, if I feel compelled to help I will.  But if my Guidance is giving me a nudge that says "Don't fall for it, it's a set-up, you will get mugged".  Then guess what?  I'm going to listen to my Guidance.  Does that mean I should let go of my fear and use the power of Love to change that would-be mugger and his evil-doing ways?  Heck no.  I'm taking care of myself.  I don't have to be responsible for reforming a bad guy into a good person at my own risk. 

Can I help all those oppressed people in the world you're talking about?  Not at the moment.  I could try to sell all my belongings, change my life, and move there and try to talk to them and help them, but is that what I want to do?  No.  Does that make me a bad person?  No.  Will it help if I pray for them?  Probably.  Will I necessarily see the results, see how it helped and changed their lives?  I don't know. 

Having awareness of love is great.  Spreading love and being loving are great.  Does it mean that when I'm not using, feeling, or being all-encompessed in love it must mean that I'm not living up to my potential?  Who cares!  I don't go around telling other people that they are wasting their time and that they should be doing more.  I believe in allowing people to be themselves, live and learn at their own pace.  Yes I pray for peace, for change, for lots of things.  But I don't control anyone.  I don't have all the answers as to why there is sickness, why there is oppression, why bad things happen.  I do believe we are here to learn, to experience, and to grow.  Yes I feel sorry that some poor sick child is born in an oppressive country and then dies before they got the chance to really live.  But that's just life.  If I could magically change it, of course I would.  But there's a reason we aren't able to magically control and change everything.  What is the point of being here if it's wrong to live our lives and enjoy and grow and experience what we want to do and have and be?  Just because I'm not moving to a poor country to hold the hand of a dying child doesn't mean I don't care.  And it doesn't make me narrow-minded. 

Justin, your beliefs are good intentions.  But you don't speak practically, not to me anyway.  Yes, in a perfect-thought world, we could change the world with Love.  And who is to say that that's not what is already taking place?  Just because you see suffering, does it mean that people are doing something wrong, not opening up and aspiring to Love as much as they should at the moment? 

Whatever anyone's beliefs are, the general belief is that "God" has a plan and a purpose and that things work out in the end.  Yes, along the way we have the conscious awareness to make change, to help, to be of service, and that's generally what the world does.  Life repeats itself.  History repeats itself.  I can look at a teenager and see myself in them, how I used to be, how unaware that person is.  But does it mean that that person will or will not grow into the loving being they should be?  Time will tell.  They have the chance and the right to grow and be what they choose.  We can help, we can influence, we can give advice, we can pray, but ultimately that young person's life is their own responsiblity.  Sometimes you just can't do much but have good intentions for people and situations. 

Just because you don't see the world as complete and perfect as you are aspiring, doesn't mean that anything is going wrong.  Our perspective and view of "the World and Reality as a Whole" is pretty limited, but it doesn't mean that anything is wrong.  An ant might think, "God dang it, all I see all day long is nothing but dirt.  This world we live in sucks!"  Well, that poor little ant has no idea what lies beyond his vantage point.  But he lives his life, doing what he can, building, loving, reproducing.  And somehow it all has little meaning and great meaning all at the same time!

Isn't life a wonderful place?  So much to think about, argue about, and be happy and sad about.  Maybe I'm just more of an optimist than you are, but I'm pretty confident that the World as a Whole is doing "ok".  If we all die from the Sun exploding or the Earth's core dying, well I know that I for one lived my life with my own intergrity.  No amount of worry about celestial catastrophe is really going to change anything if the world is ultimately headed toward planetary destruction.  But if you want to believe that prayer will stop such a catastrophe, go ahead.  How you live your life is your choice.  I don't feel bad for what I am, what I know, what I think, feel, or believe.  I learn as I go in this life.  I'd love to end all the pain and suffering, and in the moments when I imagine that perfection, it does feel good.  Does it make a change?  I don't know.  I'm just being practical.  I believe there are a lot of things going on that I don't know about...much like how I'm using my computer at the moment, I'm just doing what I am doing at the moment, but there are background programs running that are doing all SORTS of things that I am unaware of.  And that's ok.  I don't need to know how to build a computer in order to enjoy using one. 

  Hi Vicky,

No, there is no problem, though there is a differing in perceptions and beliefs.  I accept you and Love you and care for you.  I would like to see you and everyone grow to their fullest potential and would like to see everyone fully and completely happy and at peace finally.  That fullest potential is to become like He/She. 

   I really want this world to heal, i feel the suffering so much and it's not something i can be non nonchalant and Yin about. 

  Here is full disclosure about me, what i know, why i came here this time around.  If you read it with an open mind and open heart, you will better understand where i am coming from and why i speak about the things that i speak of. 

  I know that most think me very strange, unbalanced, egotistical, arrogant, deluded, and the like.   They thought and said the same things to my Teacher. 

  Anyways, here is The Plan and the glad tidings that have been given to me, to share with all of you.  This future is not writ in stone, but it is probable.  For it to become more probable, we have to become more consciously aware of hindering forces and their influence, their plans, their intentions, their methods.  More of us have to speak out about our awareness and "retrieve" others influenced by them. 

  Anyways, here is the link to what i wrote about The Plan and the Glad tidings:

http://afterlife-knowledge.com/cgi-bin/yabb/YaBB.cgi?num=1332440078/0#0

Dang it Justin! You did that ex-member thing again and now we aren't going to be able to edit. :)

I don't know, but I doubt divine will has it in mind that everybody has to ascend to a he/she level in order for this World to be a better place.  I believe it is fine to try to inspire others, but we can't force anything.  For the most part each soul manifests according to its inner yearning.

I get what Vicky is saying when she states this World wouldn't serve the purpose it serves if everybody was at Christ Consciousness level. The diversity that leads to learning wouldn't exist.

On the other hand, I believe there is way more suffering than the divine plan intended. Too many people and other beings have strayed from what their higher selves have in mind. Such a result is an unfortunate consequence of having free will.

I have family members who aren't interested in spirituality, but they're good people. Therefore, they aren't a part of this World's problems. Without being consciously spiritual they make more of a positive contribution rather than a negative contribution. Soul evolution wouldn't work as well as it eventually does if the process didn't allow for the possibility that it will take a lot souls a while before they rejoin the Oneness they came from.

When it comes to people who grow to an extent where they really help the World's overall vibrational state, as I suggested before, for the most part this urge has to come from within. People who have this potential will be inspired by inspiring words. Such words can be direct, but I don't believe they need to be accompanied by angst.

'As i said to Vicky,  tell those folks on the border of suicide, or those folks who live under oppressive rulers and regimes, or those being possessed and influenced greatly, that there is no need to be consciously aware of or concerned with hindering influences.   I am SOOO sick of people's narrow, self focused concerns and attidudes.  It's not just about YOU.  It's about suffering of the Whole.  You may be mature enough to not be influenced, but what about your brother, what about your sister, do you have any concern and awareness for THEM?!! '

Yes Justin I do, enough concern to allow people to follow their own path and not to think I know best for them. To use an analogy : lets say I'm a traveller on the way to New York. On the road I meet a fellow traveller who goes off in the other direction. I  run after  and berate him- he's going completely the wrong way he'll never get to New York like that !  The man's confused, his destination is Washington and I never bothered to ask him where he wanted to go. Before offering directions it is wise to ask someone their intended destination ...


'When in doubt, seek direct guidance under the most ideal conditions to find out for self the truth of the matter.  To be frank Dave--i hear so little about your experiences, insight, and seeking in this area, but i hear/see a lot of intellectual theorizing and other exercises of the intellect.'

You are right, it is not simply an intellectual exercise which is why I enjoy reading and not denigrating anyone else's experiences or influences. But one cannot simply adopt someone else's experiences as one's own.Further, your guidance is not my guidance and my guidance is not your guidance. There is no problem with posting insights or experiences but there is  a problem when those insights or experiences are proclaimed to be better or override other people's.

I think Justin is right, the world does need to heal. I mean, Emerald Weapon and Ruby Weapon were literally started by the planet to stop us from continuing to convert the lifestream into Mako energy to power our electronics.

It's time for a change!

heisenberg69 wrote on Mar 22^nd, 2012 at 4:38pm:

Yes Justin I do, enough concern to allow people to follow their own path and not to think I know best for them. To use an analogy : lets say I'm a traveller on the way to New York. On the road I meet a fellow traveller who goes off in the other direction. I  run after  and berate him- he's going completely the wrong way he'll never get to New York like that !  The man's confused, his destination is Washington and I never bothered to ask him where he wanted to go. Before offering directions it is wise to ask someone their intended destination ... 'When in doubt, seek direct guidance under the most ideal conditions to find out for self the truth of the matter.  To be frank Dave--i hear so little about your experiences, insight, and seeking in this area, but i hear/see a lot of intellectual theorizing and other exercises of the intellect.' You are right, it is not simply an intellectual exercise which is why I enjoy reading and not denigrating anyone else's experiences or influences. But one cannot simply adopt someone else's experiences as one's own.Further, your guidance is not my guidance and my guidance is not your guidance. There is no problem with posting insights or experiences but there is  a problem when those insights or experiences are proclaimed to be better or override other people's.

   "Berate", "Denigrate", hmmm these are rather strong words.  I tried to neither personally denigrate nor berate you David. 

  I stated a long time observation that i rarely, if ever, have seen you talk about personal psychic or nonphysical experiences, guidance messages, etc here, which this site and it's purpose was originally founded on.  This was stated in a rather matter of fact and calm manner.   Why did i state this observation?  Because you were downplaying the issue of outside hindering forces.  I was saying, you can't figure this out with your intellect.  I was trying to show you, how wrapped up in the intellect you tend to be. 

  My intention was not to hurt or harm you by pointing this out, but rather indicating to both you and the collective here, that when one is speaking from limited insight and experience with such a crucial issue for humanity, one is indirectly helping those hindering forces with their plans and intentions.  I know that this is not your intention, but this is the possible effect.

  If you were a child in body or in Consciousness, or in a temporarily fragile emotional state, i would have spoke to you in a different way, in a much more gentle, Yin, and indirect way.  But because you are not a child in body or Consciousness, and you are more centered than the average, i spoke to you in a more direct, blunt, and Yang way. 

  If you want to see a real example of berating, check out Yeshua's actions and words in the Temple with those corrupt opportunists selling animals and changing money in same.  Now that was intense, that was Fiery and passionate, that was more true "berating".  He physically flipped their tables over, spoke to them in anger and drove them out of there in a forceful manner. 

   As regards my other words, and feeling and using more emotion, i was speaking in a general, collective sense and speaking from real emotion about this larger issue.  I'm quite aware that you care about people David--you are a good guy, mature, caring, you do your best or near best as do most.   I was trying to "make a larger point". Who of us couldn't care more about others in a more impersonal, universal, and unconditional sense?   What's lacking in this world?

  If you could feel like i feel David, you would understand where i am coming from, but you are more centered in your intellect than i.  In a sense, i'm more like a "woman"--more Yin.

  If humanity, could somehow take these invisible claws of the hindering forces out of our collective back, we would find ourselves expanding much more rapidly in our collective consciousness growth.  We could begin to heal this world in earnest.  Right now, my small part is talking about these issues openly to people like you--people with more open minds, people with the capacity to tune into more expanded guidance, people with less fear than the average.   

  My hope is that at least some of you will try to seek to tune into expanded guidance and ask them directly about these issues.  I know if you do, that some of you will be told as i've been told, for truth is truth and higher truth is not as relative.  Then my hope is that you will spread the word to those potentially open and ready for it.  With more people practicing the right techniques, methods, and with more conscious awareness, then less and less of us will be influenced by these.  Eventually, a snowballing effect could happen.

   Most of the helping on part of humans that goes on in this world, is on the material level.  While it's important to help and serve there, what's ultimately more important is to transform and retrieve those stuck in limiting belief systems.  It's these limiting belief systems, and lack of conscious awareness of important factors, that lead to all the material effects that we try to patch with little glue patches in a boat that is riddled with holes. 

Because that boat is riddled with holes and is in the process of sinking, trying to affect change on just the material level is ultimately a losing battle.  We must get to the root of the causes.  The two main roots of the causes of suffering in this world, is lack of attunement to and awareness of the importance of Love and the influence of strong, concentrated, collective hindering forces that most of us are unconscious to their influence on us personally and their general influence in the world. 

  You brought up Monroe.  Monroe was a somewhat unusually aware and mature man.  There are not a ton of Monroe's in this world, and even Monroe got fooled by these hindering forces at times.  Apparently, according to one source (a man that use to post here, Tim Griffin), Monroe was into and sort of promoted ACIM.

   When even the "heroes" , the unusually mature and aware, and the pioneers of exploring are getting fooled to some extent, then we can begin to understand that we are up against some extremely intelligent, clever, manipulative, very psychic, and good at their jobs forces. 

   Perhaps you have read Rosalind McKnight's book Cosmic Journey?   If so, you might be aware that she saw that to help in the process of the healing and consciousness growth of humanity and the Earth, that some highly evolved, very Love attuned and very aware E.T. groups were going to send in some of their energy directly to incarnate as humans to help out in this process. 

This is how critical this situation is, that some of these very intune/harmonious/aware, non humans were taking a definite sacrificial plunge into this Malay, this cacophony, risking the possibility that they themselves might get stuck in this human process, in order to help humans become more aware of some of these critical issues, like that hindering E.T. group that Recoverer, i, McKnight, Cayce, and others have referenced to. 

   My sense is that if you have had the experiences i have had, had the guidance messages i have had, that you might, like me, feel a sense of urgency and concern about things if, like me, you really cared about humanity in a universal, and deeply empathic way. 

  I have outlined a number of times, a very effective method to attune more directly to the most expanded levels of Guidance there are.   I really, truly wish that you and others would at least try to more directly seek info about this issue, because I DO KNOW that you will not, nor should, just take my word for it.    

Justin aka vaysra/Justin/Life,

How do we know that you aren't being influenced by negative beings at this present time?

And, if we ask our guidance how do we know that it won't be coming from negative beings also?

This is a serious question by the way.

Andy

Andy:

One thing we don't want to do is make the mistake of not trying to make contact with friendly beings because are afraid that we might be fooled. When we do so we pretty much fail without even giving it a try. I don't mean to suggest that everybody needs to make such contact.

There are a number of ways in which I have tried to gain certainty about the kind of beings I communicate with:

1. What it feels like when I am in contact with such beings. Since they feel like love, a really nice feeling of peace, divinity and expansiveness, they are probably okay.

2. The nature of the messages that are received.  They almost always seem to serve a positive purpose. I say "almost" because there are times when unfriendly beings have tried to communicate with me. Usually I am able to feel that there is something off about such beings and the nature of their messages tend to be negative.

3. Related to number 2, the manner in which information is presented. It is consistently presented in a manner that respects my freedom of choice. It also understands that self-reliance also plays a key role in spiritual growth. It is a matter of finding the right balance which could vary for different people.

4. The results of the assistance that is received. It has helped me let go of limiting thought patterns, open up to love (to an extent where my heart chakra has expanded significantly) and other positive qualities such as humility, integrity, grattitude and loyalty to that which is divine.

5. The fact of how after communicating a lot with such guidance I still have freedom of choice. In fact, I've found that I've become more aware of my freedom of choice.




Andy B wrote on Mar 24^th, 2012 at 4:51pm:

Justin aka vaysra/Justin/Life, How do we know that you aren't being influenced by negative beings at this present time? And, if we ask our guidance how do we know that it won't be coming from negative beings also? This is a serious question by the way. Andy

Andy B wrote on Mar 24^th, 2012 at 4:51pm:

Justin aka vaysra/Justin/Life, How do we know that you aren't being influenced by negative beings at this present time?

   I would say seek guidance from the most expanded levels of same by and through that specific intention and desire, and by and through practicing Bruce's "Remembering the feeling of Love" method or similar ones, then getting very quiet and still within self and by listening. 

   But, btw, i wouldn't say that i'm 100 percent completely free from such influence ALL the time.  Because i'm not fully "enLightened", or rather, i'm not completely and permanently attuned to PUL yet, this means i have "dark" aspects within self.  These dark aspects can be connected to by similarly dark aspects without, for Like attracts, begets, and resonates with Like ever.

If i'm not conscious enough to certain "stray", negative thoughts, feelings, or desires, or don't consciously ignore or redirect to more positive ones, i can be temporarily and briefly influenced.   However, because i have specifically asked for very specific help from certain very powerful and Love attuned Consciousnesses, i tend to be less influenced than most.  Having also dedicated my life to growing in Love, to teh service of the Whole, and sacrificing in certain ways or using my Will constructively more than not, also helps to not

  For example, i have dropped many hindering habits like eating unhealthy or fear filled foods (like pork and beef especially), not exercising enough, looking at porn, drinking alcohol immoderately, doing drugs, etc, etc.

    When one's intentions (especially) and one's feeling states are more positive and Love oriented, and the more one is balanced between the physical, emotional-mental, and spiritual levels of self, the more one will connect to more creative, constructive, Loving, spiritually aware and helpful forces. 

  When one's intentions and feeling states are more negative and further away from PUL, or the more imbalanced one is between the physical, emotional-mental, and spiritual levels of self, the more one will tend to connect to

  It is mighty hard, unless one is super psychic and very clear oneself, to fully and clearly accurately read the intentions of others via typed words and messages on forums like these.  Even us more psychic and clear types occasionally get things wrong or are off about others.

    But through hooking up to expanded guidance, particularly during meditation, one can more easily and clearly see another's intentions, etc. 

A very good and recent example of this.  For a very brief time, i was suspicious of the poster Wonderer and mostly because of the out of the blue interaction between the two newbie posters Andrew and Wonderer, and Andrew speaking so highly about ACIM. 

  I realized that my suspicions about Wonderer could be wrong or off, so I took it to expanded guidance during meditation.   I also had my wife seek information on him, his intentions in general and towards me specifically.  I didn't tell her anything about him, except for his tag name Wonderer and that this person said they had previously been here awhile back.   

    Both of us were told that he was a fine man, with good intentions in both areas.  I was told more specifically that he was a rather older Soul.   Becky, my wife, picked up some very accurate information about his looks, his character, his mental tendencies, etc. which Wonderer verified by sharing information.  She did get a couple things off.

  This is why it's so important to appeal to higher forces than self.  It's a kind of humility and knowing that the conscious, personality self doesn't always know what is right or correct.


Quote:

And, if we ask our guidance how do we know that it won't be coming from negative beings also? This is a serious question by the way. Andy

  Oh yes, Andy, it is a very serious question and a good one to ask.  To simplify things a bit, if you understand the univeral Law of Like attracts, begets, and resonates with Like--a type of higher physics understanding, if you will, then if you work WITH that Law in a harmonious manner, it will help one to better connect to only the more helpful, creative, constructive forces. 

  See above quote of yours and my reply to same for a more in depth look. 

    Plus, there is a common teaching in many works and teachings that there is a principle of assistance involved.   This principle works on specific requests.  It works on specific requests, because more expanded and Love attuned Consciousnesses, respect freewill.   We may get help without specific requests, often we do, but it's with specific requests and intentions, that we get specific help. 

  If you create an affirmation or prayer like, "I deeply desire, and ask for the guidance of only the most PUL attuned and spiritually constructive/helpful sources there are" and you say that with real feeling and sincerity and if it's for helpful intentions, then you will get help from these.

  The question or issue then becomes, will you be able to consciously perceive such info and communication?   This is where Bruce's "Remembering the Feeling of Love" method comes in quite handy. 

  As Bruce has found in his experience, i in mine, Albert in his, and many others, bringing up those positive feelings and thoughts of Love, automatically and greatly tend to expand our perceptual capacity. 

   Tuning into those feelings and thoughts, tunes you into the "wavelengths" that those super Expanded/Aware and Constructive/Helpful Consciousnesses "live" on or at.  You then can more easily perceive communication from them, once you have asked for that kind of help. 

   Have you read Bruce's experience with the Planning Intelligence?   It took a period of adjustment, wherein the Planning Intelligence had to help adjust Bruce's receptors, in order for him to more clearly and accurately perceive that communication.   I bet Bruce was feeling and tuning into a lot of Love around then. 

  You can also ask those above sources with specific help in opening up more clearly to such communication. 

  Contact during meditation, etc. with very PUL attuned and very mature Consciousnesses often are accompanied by feelings of immense Love, deep peace, expansiveness, and the like.  Not to say they are never firm or direct about lacks or things you need to work on, for they can be, but you can still feel the Love there behind the strong 'words'. 

Justin -

I have no ill will toward you (I hope my last post did'nt give that impression !) and maybe we should simply agree that we see the world in slightly different ways, not better not worse, just different. For example I believe that, in the main, evil actions come not from any evil force but from a twisted or limited sense of doing good.

For example Hitler's evil attempt to destroy the Jewish people, gypsies, disabled,gay etc. came about because he was attempting the 'good' of establishing the perfect German nation state aka 'The Third Reich' and those people got in the way of this ideal. It seems to me that many of history's evils come from such poorly judged attempts at doing good. In order to do these 'goods' the perpetrators believe that they need to impose their will on others often 'for their own good'. Without such an imposition  - warfare, torture and all the other human-inflicted miseries would be impossible.The one thing that characterises tyrants is their readiness to impose their will. For this reason I am totally in agreement with Recoverer that evolved beings give information 'consistently presented in a manner that respects my freedom of choice. It also understands that self-reliance also plays a key role in spiritual growth'. No imposition of will here.

The downside of no will imposition is that people are free to continue to mess up and cause pain to themselves and others. But this is, I would argue, is  how it is meant to be and what growth is all about. Because of this I have never been impressed by the Athiest argument that the fact that bad things happen is proof of no God.There can be no growth in a dictatorship.

Of course all of this does'nt mean that we can't care for others, councel and advise (when asked for) but does mean no imposition on people's free will and that includes the free will to screw up !

D

   Very well said David, and I do agree with you (though i see more subtleties and relative aspects of it).  This is why i have attended rallies on issues in my country and state wherein others were trying to literally force their beliefs via legislative means onto others. 

  To me, such forcing is quite wrong.   However, debating on forums and pointing out "synchronicities" and similarities between many reputable psychic type sources and one's own guidance, and imploring others to really check this out during meditation under more ideal circumstances. Or pointing out holes in the holistic logic of others belief systems.

  I can't relate that to forcing.  It is more "Yang" though.  But, this was sometimes the method of my Teacher.  He was not always gentle, passive, Yin, and/or laid back.  He was not like Bruce Moen or Bob Monroe.  He debated with the "spiritual experts" around him, he pointed out the holes in their beliefs and perceptions, and he even occasionally used strong words and actions to make a point. 

  He was and could be more Yang, though he was basically a gentle, very kind, caring and Loving person.  Love in the PUL sense is not always "soft".  There is the Yang side of Love which we could call "tough Love", which is more intense and "in your face". 

  Are you aware of Tom Campbell and his work?  One of the interesting things that T.C. talks about is his knowledge and experience with a Consciousness he humorously calls the "Big Cheese".  The B.C. is kind of a mysterious character, but from what T.C. says, he clearly states that he perceives this Consciousness as a "he".  This Consciousness is extremely spiritually evolved, very aware, and is kind of the "head honcho" in and director of this area of Consciousness--especially of the nonphysical part.   According to T.C., this Being even has the "authority" and power to dismantle particularly extremely and consistently negative Consciousnesses who just won't and don't choose to grow, but keep trying to negatively affect those around them. 

   Without writing a small novel about the differences and connections between Yin and Yang--it's interesting that T.C. clearly perceives the B.C. as more "male" than female, or rather more Yang than Yin.   One of the fundamental differences between Yang and Yin is that Yang is active, outpouring and more concentrated, intense, or directive flow, use and quality of consciousness. 

  Yin is more receptive, still, passive, soft and diffuse flow, use and quality of consciousness. 

   I spent a long time being unusually Yin for a consciousness in a male body.  I've started to become more Yang in certain areas, and it's something that i've been directed to do. 

  I'm most Yang on forums like these, because if someone doesn't like my words, what i "say", etc., it's much easier for them to ignore, pass over, or refute my words.  It's also a much more impersonal and detached medium and way of communicating, but one that reaches to many more people than talking in person. 

  In person, and you can ask Bruce Moen, Albert, or others that have met me in person, i'm much more the quiet, listening, and go with the flow type.  I sat there and nodded politely when Bruce was telling Becky and i that our spider experiences probably weren't anything to do with any negative beings, because in his words, "I've never had any experience with anything that i had to really worry about."

  I politely listened to what he had to say, and I didn't turn it into a debate, though i could have easily and could have ripped apart his belief system and perceptions, telling him that Bob Monroe, Rosalind McKnight, Edgar Cayce, Courtney Brown, Becky, i and others HAVE had such experiences or insights contradicting his beliefs, experiences, and perceptions.  I could have been more forceful and intense. 

  There is a reason why the difference between my manner in person and on forums.  I don't like boxing others into a uncomfortable corner like that, and it's not a good way of "retrieving" people from stuck and limited belief systems.  People tend to really get on the defensive in situations like that, or they just get quite emotional, and in any case, they stop listening to you and then what's the point--in that case, you're just wasting your own breath. 

   But yes, we should have the freewill to screw up.  However, if we made a habit of connecting to Expanded Guidance and choosing Love, not only will we become more happy and fulfilled ourselves, we would take part in speeding up the healing of the Whole.  This is to be greatly desired. 

  This is the message, the communication, the whole meaning and reason for why spiritual teachers come into the Earth. 

   This is why Krishna, Buddha, Yeshua and other have incarnated here, and this was their essential message and example here.  They were, in essence, trying to speed up the healing of the Whole.  They were being slightly more Yang than Yin in this process. 

Otherwise, they wouldn't have come in the first place, for they didn't need to come for themselves.  They didn't need this Earth school for their own growth necessarily.  (especially speaking about Yeshua). 

  I would say, humorously, "Be thou likewise like the Big Cheese". 

  The Big Cheese, He/She and Yeshua don't think this life is about a personal vacation.  They think and know it's about Consciousness growth, and a process of the stuck aspects of the Whole healing and retrieving themselves, and they were and are trying to speed up the process because they can literally feel the suffering of others and the Whole much more keenly than less expanded consciousnesses. 

   It all goes back to ones intent, and not so much the surface actions.  One person can do something that seems right, correct, or loving in nature but if their hidden intent or motivation is non constructive in nature, it will not bring consciousness growth to them.

Conversely, someone can do something that seems wrong, off, or what not in the eyes of others, but if their INTENT is positive in nature, then it will bring consciousness growth.

  Most people, deep down, know on some level, what they choose in relation to others is either more constructive or non constructive in nature.  Hitler knew on some level that murdering, torturing, and forcing others against their will was wrong, but he and others were so far gone down their lack of attunement to Love, and in their corruption from such material power to change.

  What makes something MOST constructive, is that done with the intent for the best of ALL.  It has to be Universal in nature for it to be fully creative. Hitler was not considering the Whole, he was considering Germany and "Aryans".  Hence not constructive and could not be constructive. 

  In the above sense, then, Yeshua speaking strong words to the Pharisees, Sadducees', Scribes, etc because he was concerned about them teaching and/or forcing limited and non-constructive beliefs onto others, would affect the Whole adversely.  It was not "personal" for him.  He had no personal need or desire to debate with them for his little self.  He was only concerned for the Big, Universal Self. 

  Likewise am i concerned about the Biggest self (and it's not about my little self) and why i have and will debate with you and others here if you promote limiting beliefs or indirectly support the efforts, plans, and intentions of those hindering forces.  I choose to be more Yang than Yin in this process. 

  Those hindering forces want you and others to speak against what Albert and i say, because we're trying to expose them and they cannot do what they want if they are brought into the Light.  They like and work in the shadows, and they love when people make their job easier for them.  In some cases, they even focus and concentrate on psychically sending certain thoughts and feelings to people in order to "help" them along with this.   

  To think that self is completely free of such subtle influence, is perhaps naive, when and if self knows that self is not fully "enLightened" or only ever attuned to PUL. 

 
 

Our own personal experiences are tailored to what we, as individuals, need at the time.  And we are the ones creating that.  For you to judge someone else as needing retrieval from their own limited belief system isn't your place.  Yes you can have the intention and caring, but it's still not up to you to change or convince anyone of what they should be thinking, feeling, doing, or believing. 

The best way to be and the best kind of use of PUL is to really have no will over anyone else.  I don't think that's the kind of ideology that you have, Justin.  The very fact that you get so heated about debating this stuff over and over, whether on the Board or in person, should be a red flag to you that you're trying too hard.  I see that you perceive yourself as a teacher who was sent here to die for his beliefs, as you have stated that you will be murdered for this. 

My humble belief is that we are all teachers in one way or another.  We're all "holding hands" through this together, and we each play a different role for many reasons, most of which we'll never really know why or how the system works the way it does. 

Lucy wrote on Mar 21^st, 2012 at 4:21am:

yes but... being able to see some thing in the future is not the same as being all-knowing. Psychis don't usually claim they know what the littlest sparrow is up to.

Hi Lucy, you are right there are psychics and there are psychics, most of them are money making frauds. A true psychic might know if a tree falls unobserved if he knew that he/she should concentrate on it.A psychic at best sees through a glass darkly

Love

Alan

Vicky wrote on Mar 25^th, 2012 at 8:20pm:

Our own personal experiences are tailored to what we, as individuals, need at the time.

   True, and our personal experiences include interactions with others, even with those rare folks who are expanded guidance in the flesh. 

Quote:

And we are the ones creating that.

 

  Oh no, we are "co-creating" that and doing so with Source, Christ, and others within a Oneness.  It's a big process with many involved.  Our Disk level of awareness gets the most choice and influence usually, but even that part of us must abide by certain collective events and happenings, like the Earth changes or the rare "insertion" of expanded guidance in the flesh. 

Quote:

For you to judge someone else as needing retrieval from their own limited belief system isn't your place.

  Have you ever partaken in a "retrieval" before?  Why is that "ok" in that situation, but not in-physical with fellow in-physicals?  If one can get past regular old, limiting judging that is so ego and selfish based, and expand via PUL, one comes to "judge" in a very different and helpful manner. 

  Case in point are "Life reviews", which take place with not just an individual's "Disk", but with numerous Elder, Completed Beings who help that individual "judge" their life in various ways.  These are Expanded Guidance, they are "past" most of our "Disk" level of awareness even.  When they take on human form, to some extent they bumble along, make mistakes, etc., but eventually they can become and example PUL in the flesh.  PUL is not always soft, gentle, nurturing and Yin. 

  It can be Yang, as you recently shared how you were with your Leo born daughter.  That was firm, that was the more Yang and tough Love side of PUL.  Was your intention negative?  No, but you "told her what was up with her reality", did you not?   It applies to teens, but never to adults?  Physical age isn't always the most important factor.


Quote:

Yes you can have the intention and caring, but it's still not up to you to change or convince anyone of what they should be thinking, feeling, doing, or believing.

  LOL, yes, yes, and yes.  Which is why i have asked and implored others to connect to expanded guidance re: this issue, and have given very effective techniques and methods and understandings to do so. But, apparently, most won't even try. 


Quote:

The best way to be and the best kind of use of PUL is to really have no will over anyone else.  I don't think that's the kind of ideology that you have, Justin.

 

   Often it is, but sometimes it's not.  Look at Yeshua's life and example to REALLY understand this.   He was MUCH more intune than your Bruce Moen.  See below link to a very holistic thread about Beliefs and Retrievals relating to this above issue and why sometimes Yangness is more helpful than your usual Yin way and attunement.

http://afterlife-knowledge.com/cgi-bin/yabb/YaBB.cgi?num=1332726271



Quote:

The very fact that you get so heated about debating this stuff over and over, whether on the Board or in person, should be a red flag to you that you're trying too hard.

 

    Actually, i don't tend to "get so heated" about this, and it's mostly only recently that i've started to become much more focused and Yang about this subject.  This happened with a recent experience involving Bruce Moen and two dream messages in relation to this.   

  One dream message was quite upsetting, because i was in and observed a possible future wherein a hindering, very clever and influencing E.T. group got what they wanted.  There was a lot of suffering in that future, possible Earth, and it was very upsetting for me.  In that dream, i did become quite angry and i remember specifically yelling at that E.T. group that i would do everything in my power to prevent this from happening. 

   You have not received the repeated and clear guidance that Becky, i, and other sources have, and so you talk from a lack of knowledge and experience about this subject and do not understand my motivation, feelings, and intensity about this issue.  The fact that so few people here talk about this, the fact that Bruce Moen himself is quite unconscious to this issue, is quite a "clue" to me that people with awareness of this issue, like people like Albert and I, do need to talk about and try to raise awareness. 

  Have you sought to hook up to expanded guidance under the ideal circumstances and asked the above specifically about this issue?   

  But, perhaps i am trying too hard.  I will think about and go within about that some and see what i get. 

Seems to me that you are trying to convert my beliefs, from more limited ones, to more free and expanded ones.  Hey now, hold your horses, is that not what you are chiding me for doing?  ;)   What gives you the right to tell me what's up with my reality and my belief systems?   Why is it ok for you to do with me, but not me with others?

Bit of a quandary, no?  It's ok, i actually don't mind you doing the above, because I KNOW your intent is more positive than not. 


Quote:

I see that you perceive yourself as a teacher who was sent here to die for his beliefs, as you have stated that you will be murdered for this.

  Yes, apparently i'm to follow in my Teachers footsteps some.  It won't be the first time for me, truth be told.  Just, this time, like Linn, Carolene, others, and my own guidance messages have said, i can get it all right this time, like my Teacher. 


Quote:

My humble belief is that we are all teachers in one way or another.  We're all "holding hands" through this together, and we each play a different role for many reasons, most of which we'll never really know why or how the system works the way it does.

  I agree, and i have teachers and sometimes am the student, especially yet.  I am not yet "enLightened" and never claimed to be that yet.  However, my point to you earlier, still quite applies to what you are saying in the above.   

The more we open up and attune to PUL more clearly and consistently, the more it will expand our perception.  We can reach "He/She" level in the flesh, and if we do, our perceptual capacity becomes so broad, so accurate, so expanded, truly do we begin to understand and experience, "Universal Consciousness". 

  We are all at different points in our journey to that "ultimate".  Some are further along than others.  Those who are further along than most, can rightly and truly be called "teachers, helpers, guides," or whatever one's preferences.   Personally, lately, i'm leaning to thinking of it as just being "a channel". 

  I might change my tag name to "a channel", lol, but not delete my account as that no editing thing is quite annoying. 

   If Like attracts, begets, resonates, perceives, and likes Like, what happens with unlike interacting with unlike?  What happens, especially in more extreme cases with more difference between the vibratory rates, is what happened to The Teacher.  Banishment, death, and the height of intolerance, dislike and shadow reactions.   

  One of my "jobs", is to stir up people's shadows, and apparently i'm good at this job as my last recent forum experience showed quite strongly.  If they had had stones and could throw them at me, it might have happened.  Stirring people's shadows up, at the expense of self, is a way to do "retrieval", because sometimes there is enough self wisdom on part of an individual going through that, to wonder "why am i feeling this way in relation to this person, is it just them, or is there a lesson here for me too?" 

   Which is why i was born under the Sun Sign of Capricorn, the Sign associated with personal sacrifice to the larger world and society around them.  That is why my Teacher was born under this sign (though not at Christmas, but later in January), and why people like Dr. Martin Luther King Jr. was born under it, or others with it strong.  Some of these, had foreknowledge of their death at the hands of others.

   It's a "sign", an indication relating to the outer material life pattern.  Also, more specifically, Capricorn Sun is also when the Earth comes closest to the Sun and when the Sun seems to be "reborn" for those in the Northern Hemisphere.  Plus, our Sun is aligning with the Galactic Center plane during the time, cycle, and beginning of Winter Solstice, the start of Tropical Capricorn.   That's a whole lot of powerful symbolism for the Capricorn Sun period. 

  This major Galactic-Solar event, started, btw, in the same year of my birth, 1980. 

Boy was I confused.  I first wondered who this new person was talking to me this way, and then I realized that "A Channel" is you again, Justin. 

"My Bruce Moen?"  Seriously?????

I'm sorry, but I'm not interested in this weirdness from you anymore.  You want to have the soapbox and the last word, well go ahead.  We obviously can't have a decent coversation about anything I care to talk about since you turn everything around to the same old thing you keep repeating.  You're going off the deepend and attacking anything and everything I say.  I'm not falling for your holier-than-thou persona.  It's just too weird for me.  I'll leave this thread to the others who want to partake in it.

Vicky

Vicky wrote on Mar 26^th, 2012 at 1:01am:

Boy was I confused.  I first wondered who this new person was talking to me this way, and then I realized that "A Channel" is you again, Justin.  "My Bruce Moen?"  Seriously????? I'm sorry, but I'm not interested in this weirdness from you anymore.  You want to have the soapbox and the last word, well go ahead.  We obviously can't have a decent coversation about anything I care to talk about since you turn everything around to the same old thing you keep repeating.  You're going off the deepend and attacking anything and everything I say.  I'm not falling for your holier-than-thou persona.  It's just too weird for me.  I'll leave this thread to the others who want to partake in it. Vicky

  Hence the well known saying, "Hell hath no fury like a woman scorned" 

   There was not one iota of me "attacking" you or what you were saying.  There was a lot of explaining and outlining of holistic logic, and it's plain that i'm stirring up your shadow when you have to say really extreme and negative things like the above about and towards me.

  You don't have to completely understand my intents, motivations, or me, to Love and accept me Vicky.  Perhaps, you forget the U, the Unconditional in PUL?

 



   

Justin, I'm with Vicky on this.  You seem to feel the need to take over every thread and conversation on this forum to go on at great length about your views, the fact of your being a chosen one, yada, yada, yada.  I seldom read your repetitive preachy posts any more.  It is so much calmer when you leave for awhile and other people can write calmly and explore topics without your telling us all how it really is, according to you, and how inadequate and misguided we all are.  Maybe you should leave for an extended time and write your book.  Then you can tell us where to get it (or not) and those who are interested in what you have to say can read it there.

Pat E. wrote on Mar 26^th, 2012 at 1:51am:

Justin, I'm with Vicky on this.  You seem to feel the need to take over every thread and conversation on this forum to go on at great length about your views, the fact of your being a chosen one, yada, yada, yada.  I seldom read your repetitive preachy posts any more.  It is so much calmer when you leave for awhile and other people can write calmly and explore topics without your telling us all how it really is, according to you, and how inadequate and misguided we all are.  Maybe you should leave for an extended time and write your book.  Then you can tell us where to get it (or not) and those who are interested in what you have to say can read it there.

   Pat, i originally got involved with this thread based on Vicky talking about psychic perception in a certain way, and i pointed out that our perception can expand much more beyond what is considered normally human, if we attune to PUL. 

   My reply was relatively short.  She wrote a long, "preachy" reply to mine. 

  Then i started writing long preachy replies in return.  Meanwhile, David "implied" i was berating and denigrating.  I tried to explain what i was really doing and where i was coming from.   A whole lot of preaching going on on all sides, and still yet.   ;)      

  Alas, i don't think most people here will understand where i'm coming from, and choose to only see ego, etc here.   Vicky just "Excommunicated" me officially after being friends, (having my tele #, email, etc) for some 7 years (hey, a full cycle...).

  Surely, your PUL sides are showing so strongly and wisely, and never would i or will i become so intolerant of any of you. 

  I will debate with you, point out where i agree and disagree, but i will not attach, negative, fixed labels to you, nor use manipulation tactics, nor tell any of you basically, "i can't stand you anymore, so get out of my (our) face." 

  If you feel so strongly about this, you, Vicky, David, and others can pass around the collection plates, go to Bruce and have me permanently banished.  Perhaps Bruce will be sympathetic to your gripes and complaints, after all, i have spoke on some of his limited beliefs as well. 

  It's only the truth, in communication, which hurts or bothers. 

   I've considered that perhaps i have focused too much on the subject of hindering forces, and too intensely so, here lately. 

   I've also considered that perhaps it was a mistake to go into the awareness of my role in the plan, and to talk openly of that.  Not because it's not true, but because it's only natural that others would think me egotistical, unbalanced or the like for such perceptions, and thus not listen to my deeper messages which are more important. 

  However, i have an ironic observation along these lines.  Someone else besides me has come to you and has repeatedly tried to raise awareness regarding hindering forces.  This person has not made any claims for self, except that he communicates with very expanded, aware, and Love attuned levels of Consciousness. 

   This has not changed the fact that the majority here don't listen to him, oft have debated or argued with him, and occasionally take personal pot shots at him when he only ever tries to keep it impersonal and about the data. 

   He also has asked people to go within and try to hook up to expanded guidance to get info directly about it.
I've seen plenty of instances of downright anger and intolerance of him on part of some of you in the past, and yet no high or unusual claims about self. 

  I guess this leads me to consider, it's partially about automatic and unconscious reactions in relation to fundamental interaction.   

Living in this physical World is different than living in the spirit World. In the spirit World the nature of another being becomes quite apparent. A being of light will radiate lots of love. Therefore, it is apparent that such a being is worth listening to.

Trying to figure out what somebody is like while reading what he (or she) said either in a book or on a forum is quite a different thing.  A lot of people get away with presenting themselves in a way that doesn't accurately reflect what they are about. Unfortunately many people make the mistake of turning such misleading people into authority figures.

Because of the above I believe it is best to not set ourselves up as an authority figure. Just say what we have to say and if people like it then they do, if not, then they don't.

Being commited to the greater good doesn't mean that we have to go to extremes in order to get others to understand what we are tyring to share. Because this physical World isn't like the spirit World we have to find an approach that works.  This World requires an approach that includes moderation, partly because overzealous false teachers have made people weary of overzealous people. Plus, if a person has the inner yearning, a willigness to become aware of something, a moderate approach to reaching out to such a perrson will probably work. An overzealous approach might turn him off.

I don't mean to suggest that all overzealous people have bad intentions. It is more of a matter of their not understanding how to manifest their good intentions in an effective way that will work for whoever is interested.

Thanks for taking the time to reply Recoverer and Justin, I can make more sense of it now.

Andy

You're welcome.


Andy B wrote on Mar 26^th, 2012 at 2:16pm:

Thanks for taking the time to reply Recoverer and Justin, I can make more sense of it now. Andy

recoverer wrote on Mar 26^th, 2012 at 1:44pm:

Living in this physical World is different than living in the spirit World. In the spirit World the nature of another being becomes quite apparent. A being of light will radiate lots of love. Therefore, it is apparent that such a being is worth listening to. Trying to figure out what somebody is like while reading what he (or she) said either in a book or on a forum is quite a different thing.  A lot of people get away with presenting themselves in a way that doesn't accurately reflect what they are about. Unfortunately many people make the mistake of turning such misleading people into authority figures. Because of the above I believe it is best to not set ourselves up as an authority figure. Just say what we have to say and if people like it then they do, if not, then they don't. Being commited to the greater good doesn't mean that we have to go to extremes in order to get others to understand what we are tyring to share. Because this physical World isn't like the spirit World we have to find an approach that works.  This World requires an approach that includes moderation, partly because overzealous false teachers have made people weary of overzealous people. Plus, if a person has the inner yearning, a willigness to become aware of something, a moderate approach to reaching out to such a perrson will probably work. An overzealous approach might turn him off. I don't mean to suggest that all overzealous people have bad intentions. It is more of a matter of their not understanding how to manifest their good intentions in an effective way that will work for whoever is interested.

   Albert, i agree that moderation and balance is often preferable, and for many of the same reasons you listed above, but the whole situation is far more broad and complex than just the above. 

  We now have a "moderate" President, one who gives off a certain appearance, who talks in a calm, clear, rational manner.  Does this make him "positive", does this make him for the people?   No, he is a puppet who plays his manipulating role well to fool others.

  I would prefer a real President, one not concerned with presenting a certain IMAGE to manipulate others with, someone who can get fiery and worked up about the problems of the world.  Someone actually REAL.  I will NOT play the politician.  We have had far too much fakeness in both the political and New age arenas. 

  Fake Gurus often put a false, spiritual smile on their faces and speak to others in a "spiritual manner" and act on the surface in order to hook and manipulate people, to get them to look past their rotten core.  I will NOT play the fake Guru. 

    Our Teacher was REAL--he did not have much concern for the conventions of society or any spiritual "image", and while he was often "moderate" and balanced in his approach with others, he also used, tapped into, and displayed Fire to make points.  Are you wiser than he and his example?

   We live in extreme times, a cycle of much change and transformation.  Related somewhat to our times, is an interesting excerpt from the Cayce work from Expanded Guidance on "Noah" and his times. 

"The deluge was not a myth (as many would have you believe) but a period when man had so belittled himself with the cares of the world, with the deceitfulness of his own knowledge and power, as to require that there be a return to his dependence wholly--physically and mentally--upon the Creative Forces.
    Will this entity see such again occur in the earth?  Will it be among those who may be given those directions as to how, where, the elect may be preserved for the replenishing of the earth?
  Remember, not by water--for it is mother of life in the earth--but rather by the elements, fire."  Reading 3653-1

   Does the above sound "moderate" and balanced to you?  Does it sound like the Creative Forces always are moderate and balanced in their dealings with Earth and with humans?  Sounds like a cleansing Fire is coming.

   And when will you actually, really believe the Creative Forces about the above?  Does it have to smack you in the face for you finally to really believe?  There are times to speak and act strongly, to be Fire, and this IS that time, for there is not much time left before the above unfolds.

   Speaking strongly, directly, and more dramatically impresses words/info more strongly on the minds and memories of others because emotion reaches people more than does intellect.  It's not about them "believing" in us or our words now, whose minds are we changing?  We can speak moderately, softly, till the cows come home, but most here and there will not HEAR us, unless their is enough openness within THEM to begin with.

  No, this is a preparation for later.  When people see these events unfold, then will they hearken to our words and remember the things we have told them about the hindering E.T.s, about examples coming forth, about the importance of Yeshua, etc.  This is why i have been directed to speak more plainly and strongly to others.  It is as emotional preparation for later and is necessary. 

  I speak on his authority, and his authority is greater than all of our authorities combined.   We have to turn over apple carts, make waves, speak strongly, impress our words into the minds and hearts of others. 

  Just as difficult, challenging, and extreme things and catalysts must and will happen in the outer world, so too must friction and challenge happen in interpersonal relationships, communication, and interactions.  It's one of the more effective ways to break through into the protected shadow aspects and levels of others.  It's a teasing of that junk, out into the Light of day, so that it can be worked on consciously. 

  Related to this very process.  In some ways, i was glad and proud that Vicky spoke to me the way she did, for despite that it partly being motivated by emotional uncenteredness, it's shows that she's growing and is taking the advice and preparation of her guidance.  Her guidance has been trying to get her out of her introverted shell.  She tends to care far too much about what others think of her and tends to act, or rather not act, from that space too often. 

She is in the process of integrating her own Yang and Fire side and her guidance is trying to push and nudge her in various different ways.  This is why i spoke to her as i did, despite that i knew how she would probably react and feel towards me and that there would be some temporary emotional turmoil involved.  I am proud that she spoke up so strongly and bluntly towards me, it shows progress on her path back to completion. 

   There are different kinds of growth Albert, and not just the surface ones of trying to convince others with moderate, INTELLECTUAL, balanced messages and sharing of "data". 

  But yes, we live in unusual and extreme times, and much is changing and much more will change.  Certain messages need to get out there and moreover they need to be impressed on the minds and especially hearts (emotional, emotions) of others as a preparation.  Nonphysical guidance tries to tell them things, but often when it comes to do with things people really emotionally DON"T WANT TO HEAR, they block out that info. 

  It is easy to block out nonphysical guidance at times.  Hence, sometimes expanded guidance has to "resort" to speaking through channels on the Earth whose voices and interaction cannot be so easily ignored. 

   Speaking of which, you are afraid of power.  You are afraid of the power within you especially. You are afraid of power because you have seen power so misused so often in this Earth and you really disagree with and dislike that.  Power is just that, power.  It is neither constructive, nor non-constructive in and of itself.  It's how you use it and especially your intent which matters the most. 

  Like you, i use to be afraid of power, because like you i've mostly only seen non-constructive examples wherein people misused power in relation to others and i really don't agree with or like that.  I was afraid of and repressed the power within myself, for fear of becoming like that. 

However, through focus and study on one of the few people in the Earth who tapped into much power and who always used it constructively, i've begun to understand that power in and of itself is not harmful intrinsically.  I've started to get over the fear of my own power and using same.  I'm in the process of not repressing it, but opening up to it. 

  Likewise, must you do similar, and i have full faith in you and that when you fully open up to the power within, you will channel it constructively and with positive intent.  That power is Fire in it's very essence, and Fire contains A LOT of energy potential and transformative power. 

   Real power, real authority is something we earn and which is handed to us from authority greater and higher than ourselves.  This is the meaning of that phrase and title, which means "anointed".  This is the meaning of the dove descending on Yeshua, and the voice which spoke, "this is my Son in whom i am well pleased with".  Once he got to a certain point in his growth and attunement to Love, he was 'chosen' by an authority greater than him, to be the mouthpiece in the Earth for that highest authority.

  Perhaps related.  Tom Campbell has written that the old Big Cheese has recently been replaced with a new Big Cheese.  Who puts a Big Cheese in that position to begin with, anyways?  Who invests such authority and power to an individual?   Why would an individual even be invested with such authority and power to begin with?   

   

Justin, et al,
I have been out of touch and have not been following this thread.  But allow me to say that from the outside, and just coming into this thread, it seems as if something has occurred to agitate you. I hope it is nothing too serious, but the vibe is really devisive. At least that's how it seems in a review of the entire thread. What's up?

Bardo wrote on Mar 27^th, 2012 at 12:19pm:

Justin, et al, I have been out of touch and have not been following this thread.  But allow me to say that from the outside, and just coming into this thread, it seems as if something has occurred to agitate you. I hope it is nothing too serious, but the vibe is really devisive. At least that's how it seems in a review of the entire thread. What's up?

  Hi Bardo, i felt pretty calm writing the above, intensely focused yes, but calm. 

   Regarding my earlier emotion on this thread, this was due to a recent dream experience i had in relation to interaction with Bruce Moen and my conscious wondering off and on, if i should go more into Becky and my experiences regarding a hindering E.T. group.   

  I've talked about this experience and dream a few times now.  It was one of the realest feeling and most vivid dreams i have ever have, so much so, i though i was in the current Earth and that i was "awake" in same. 

  A knowing came to me when i first thought that, and told me, no, this is a possible future reality on earth.  Then later, at the end of the dream, i understood that this was the future reality if enough people didn't wise up to the plans, efforts, and intentions of a hindering E.T. group and not enough people tried to counter balance them.   

   Becky and i were walking around and seeing a really screwed up Earth.  People seemed more like zombies than people in that they were extremely unconscious, only concerned about physical survival and most people were destructive and selfish in nature.   More over, there was just an overwhelming feeling of intense, collective suffering. 

  I became extremely upset in the dream, and the last scene that i remember in the dream, is me looking into the dark woods and up into the sky and quite literally screaming with all my force at that E.T. group and vowing that i will do everything i can to prevent that future possibility from unfolding.   

   Remember, i had this dream after specifically wondering if i should tell Bruce more about our experiences and perceptions about this E.T. group, their efforts, plans, etc. 

  I heard nothing back from him.  A day or two later, i had a dream wherein i was viewing Bruce and i together and we were sharing mutual positive, Love oriented energy with each other.  It was warm, affectionate feeling, but during this, Bruce fell asleep.  I didn't understand why he fell alseep and i tried to wake him.  He would not wake up. 

  I knew that the dream was telling me that Bruce was unconscious to this E.T. group and on some level didn't want to be.   

   I feel a sense of urgency about this issue because more or less expanded guidance has shown me that we are on a precipice in our collective growth cycle, where real crisis can unfold unless we who are aware and care, do our parts to try to facilitate conscious awareness of this issue. 

   Things will not just "magically work out" and we are not going to magically ascend into the 4th and 5th dimension like many New Age and channeled sources have said, and almost assured us.  Our growth to the future that Bob Monroe saw some 1500 years from now, will take work, effort on part of all of us more aware and who care about humanity in more universal and PUL kind of way. 

   There doesn't seem to be too many voices and sources of late, which are more credible, which are trying to raise awareness of the above issue.   Rosalind McKnight in her guidance sessions with Bob Monroe and Expanded Guidance, outlined a bit about this issue and that eventually there is going to be an out and out war with this group around the 2500 mark.

  But there is very much a war going on now, a spiritual and belief system war of influencing perceptions, to influence and create limiting belief systems.  Many New Age (and religious and other groups and) sources are being influenced by that above group, and the best way to spread false and limiting belief systems, is to use partial and half truths. 

  One of their favorite means is to promote belief systems and approaches that incline us to being too over Yin and passive.  Ah, you don't need to worry about this world or Consciousness growth, cause hey, this life is a personal vacation and you have all the time in eternity to get things right.  This is something even our own Bruce Moen here believes and promotes, and he doesn't realize that it's been whispered into his sensitive mind (and bought, hook line and sinker), not by "guidance" but by this very clever and very psychic hindering E.T. group. 

  And unfortunately, being in a position of authority and influence, being "Bruce Moen", people tend to take his perceptions and beliefs too much to heart without discernment or discrimination. 

  The Expanded Guidance that i communicate with, is concerned about humanity, these influences, and how things may go here.  They are Yang and active in trying to get out messages about this issue, but right now, there are too few channels to work with because there is so much potential fear involved with become aware of and speaking out about this issue. 

  This is where my earlier emotion came from, but it wasn't meant for any specific individual, just a temporary frustration with how this process is so far going.   I am human, i feel emotions, and i'm not going to pretend to be something i'm not.  Many "teachers" in this world put on an act and pretend to be more positive, aware, and loving than they really are, and they do this to hook people.  Me, i prefer to be real and sincere and to speak my heart and mind plainly and directly, especially when larger issues that affect everyone are at stake. 

   Also, i will quote a line from Yeshua, the Prince of Peace, "I come not to bring peace, but a sword." 

  If Yeshua said this or something like this, what do you think this might mean--especially coming from a person who lived and preached peace?

   Perhaps he knew ahead of time that his intense PUL would stir up the collective shadow of the world, which at first would result in chaos, fighting, destruction, but later bring true peace?  For that sword is truth and PUL and what does PUL do, it destroys illusions and all that which is based on or comes from illusions. 

  A sort of parable for the way i've been acting and speaking lately.  Rabble rousing for a definite, future reason, that will become clear when the times come.  You will better remember my words for this and remember my other messages when the Red skies begin to form. 

What would the Buddha say about this? Was/is he less a man of God than your teacher? How would you reconcile the two approaches?

wrote on Mar 27^th, 2012 at 1:04pm:

Also, i will quote a line from Yeshua, the Prince of Peace, "I come not to bring peace, but a sword."    If Yeshua said this or something like this, what do you think this might mean--especially coming from a person who lived and preached peace?

That he was an evil Alien?

Bardo wrote on Mar 27^th, 2012 at 2:58pm:

What would the Buddha say about this? Was/is he less a man of God than your teacher? How would you reconcile the two approaches?

  He would start singing Akoonah Ma-ta-tah?  ;D   More seriously, i'm not sure exactly what he would say... However, Expanded Guidance prompted you to say the above, though probably for a different reason than you may think. 

  One of the few outer sources that i've found which talks about this E.T. group and this war in a very lucid, more clear, and helpful way is one Courtney Brown Phd.   Brown allegedly communicated with Buddha and talked about these communications in both of his books. 

  His 2nd book, deals with this hindering E.T. group in depth.  Anyways, as regards Buddha, he finds out that Buddha is sort of a leader in what Brown labels the "Galactic Federation", which is made up of many E.T.'s who are evolving to Source Consciousness and generally much further along this path than humanity and most humans.  Apparently Buddha is on this council and plays an important role in relation to humanity.

   Brown finds out that Buddha is not such a passive guy--not one who sits around and meditates all day, and is very much involved with this battle and is concerned with how things may go, as are many in this Light attuned and relatively, but not completely enLightened group.

  Here is a link to download Brown's 2nd book for free:
http://www.courtneybrown.com/publications/explorers.html


   Re: your general question, it's best to hook up to expanded Guidance and ask about the similarities and differences between Yeshua and Buddha, but since you asked, i will give my perceptions on this, as i've asked expanded guidance about this very thing.  What i have found, is very similar to what Cayce's guidance has said re: this matter. 

  Before i state that, i figure that Buddha was a pretty wise, perceptive and Godly kind of guy and is brothers with Yeshua and that they work for the same cause.

  What Cayce's guidance said was essentially this--out of all the Teachers that have come into the Earth to help uplift humanity, only Yeshua completly overcame self and the world and fufilled the Whole Law of Love.

  (now my perceptions) Buddha did not "transfigure" his body physical, which is the last and ultimate test of all Initiates.  When this is completed within an inphysical lifetime, then does and will self know self or another to be fully "complete". 

  My sense is that Buddha reached fairly close to completion, but did not get as far as Yeshua did (full Source awareness and livingness).  This is not meant as any disrespect to Buddha or to those who follow same, but having use to think that Buddha was completely enLightened myself, and then being enlightened by my guidance on this issue, i no longer buy into the dogma of others.  I've taken all teachers but Yeshua off any pedestals.

  If Brown is correct, then Buddha plays a very important role as a Helper and should be considered in the category of "Expanded Guidance"--hence he has my deepest respect and appreciation.   I would ask him yourself about this issue though.  The very definition of "belief system" and dogma is believing something as true, just because others or a organized belief system say it's true and not going past the intlellect to figure it out. 

Justin-

'Becky and i were walking around and seeing a really screwed up Earth.  People seemed more like zombies than people in that they were extremely unconscious, only concerned about physical survival and most people were destructive and selfish in nature.   More over, there was just an overwhelming feeling of intense, collective suffering.'

What you seem to be describing seems to indicate a future ecosystem breakdown. I agree this is where we are heading but don't think there's any need to invoke 'unfriendly' forces for this future, just everyday human ignorance and greed. One does'nt need to be an eco-warrior to believe this-just look at our track record. For just one example  look at the fate of the poor old passenger pigeon (Ectopistes migratorius).

From wikipedia : ' The Passenger Pigeon or Wild Pigeon (Ectopistes migratorius) was a bird that existed in North America until the early 20th century when it went extinct due to hunting and habitat destruction. The species lived in enormous migratory flocks. One sighting in 1866 in southern Ontario was described as being 1 mile wide, 300 miles long, and taking 14 hours to pass a single point with number estimates in excess of 3.5 billion birds in the flock. That number, if accurate, would likely represent a large fraction of the entire population at the time.Some estimate that there were 3 billion to 5 billion Passenger Pigeons in the United States when Europeans arrived in North America.'.

Whether its making species extinct or polluting the planet (e.g Chernobyl,Bhopal) humans are the most destructive species the world has ever known. Its what we do.

heisenberg69 wrote on Mar 28^th, 2012 at 5:38am:

Justin- What you seem to be describing seems to indicate a future ecosystem breakdown. I agree this is where we are heading but don't think there's any need to invoke 'unfriendly' forces for this future, just everyday human ignorance and greed. One does'nt need to be an eco-warrior to believe this-just look at our track record. For just one example  look at the fate of the poor old passenger pigeon (Ectopistes migratorius)...

  Hi David,

   In a way, i wish it was as simple as the above.  Yes, plenty non constructive stuff happens here simply out of human ignorance and lack of concern for others or their environment.  Yet, both my wife and i have received repeating clear messages that humanity is "helped" with this by outside, interfering forces. 

  In that dream above, as i clearly stated before, i had a complete and sure knowing that a hindering E.T. group and their plans, efforts, and influence was partially responsible for this future possibility.   I also did not go into all the details of the dream.  In the dream it seemed like there was less humans than now (after the collapse) and that a number of people that were alive seemed to be experiencing "possession" and being more directly and strongly influenced by lacking in Light forces while in their physical bodies.   

If you check the link i gave to Bardo and read Brown's 2nd book, you will see that what he gets from his remote viewings and communicating with the constructive E.T.'s, is very similar to what i received in that dream and these Guidance forces are quite concerned about our fate as a species. 

   Bob Monroe also wrote in his 3rd book, Ultimate Journey, that there has been for a long time, hindering E.T. influence in this world, but unlike his Explorer Rosalind A. McKnight and her guidance, he did not go into much specifics at all.  McKnight clearly saw and plainly stated that a specific negative/hindering E.T. group has long been involved with Earth and that eventually (around 2500 a.d.), we would become involved with an out and out physical war with this same specific group.

   Edgar Cayce's guidance also seemed to reference to a battle taking place between hindering forces and the forces of Light.  Specifically they said about the future, "...And, as there is the wavering of those that would enter as emissaries, as teachers, from the throne of of life, the throne of light, the throne of immortality, and wage war in the air with those of darkness, then know ye the Armageddon is at hand.  For with the great numbers of the gathering of the hosts of those that have hindered and would make for man and his weaknesses stumbling blocks, they shall wage war* with the spirits of light that come into the earth for this awakening..."  excerpted from Reading 3976-15 *my use of bold, underline, and italics

  In other Cayce readings, there are clear and direct references to other "people's" coming to the Earth from other "worlds".  Then there are references to the "gods" being involved with the earth, which use to be the common reference of more ancient people's and cultures to E.T.'s. 

  Perhaps related, Courtney Brown's work indicates that the Gray's, are in the front lines of this battle trying to help humanity and that there are quite literal "space wars" going on at times between the Grays and "Reptilians".  According to Brown's work, the Grays had an original history of being influenced negatively by outside interference, which led to much trouble and stuckness for them for a long time, and it seems that they are defending us from the hindering, negatively intentioned E.T. group because they feel quite a sense of duty and responsibility to do so, despite that they are as pacifistic as any beings can be.   

   So, we have Rosalind McKnight, Bob Monroe, Edgar Cayce, Courtney Brown, Dr. John E. Mack, Albert, and i who all have received information or pieces of the puzzle about this these outside interferences relating to an E.T. group. 

Perhaps it's worth taking this to Expanded Guidance during meditation under the ideal conditions (asking for only Divine help and assistance, while feeling Love, Gratitude,, etc)?  Like i said earlier, this is not something you can figure out with just the intellect and with logical, deductive reasoning. 

  Have you tried this yet?

  P.S. the overwhelming sense of emotional suffering that i felt from others, the collective, in that dream was truly horrible and heart breaking. 

  It's why i became so upset and angry in this dream.  It's been extremely rare that i experienced this degree of anger before.

   I ask all of you, if you had had this experience and felt and knew these things, what would you do with this knowledge and this concern?   

  I truly would like to know how you all would handle it?

  I suppose it might just be easier to write me off as an unbalanced megalomaniac, ahole, or the like, but what about the fact that McKnight, Monroe, Cayce, Brown, Dr. John E. Mack, Mark Aubrey, Recoverer, and others beside myself have clearly addressed this issue to some degree or extent? 

Good question...If I had this experience and felt and knew these things -- and I was you -- I would have done precisely what you did.

But, for myself, speaking for myself, I may have shared some of it with others, but spent some time in healing myself from this traumatic memory first. I would have used the help of mentors which I knew I could trust, those whose meditation aids I knew would help me process this memory.

Because it is a memory, which is tangled up with the words of many others in your life, and woven into an experience which is very disturbing, or has been very disturbing, to you and others.

Rather than to reach out, for me, personally, I would have reached in, to heal myself. I realize now, that what I experience comes from within. How I see the world comes from within.

This does not mean that I always react calmly, or that I have reached some level of 'perfection'.

So, we know what we know, and we feel what we feel, and life goes on.

  Hi given,

  I understand what you are saying, but i don't associate a temporary experience and feeling of anger with needing to be healed.  My teacher, the Mentor of mentors, occasionally experienced and displayed a similar kind of anger and occasionally acted strongly out of same. 

   Remember him flipping over the money handlers/merchants tables and driving them out of the Temple? 

   Fire has it's place, as he clearly showed, and there has been no example as "perfect" as him, since then. He was "Emmanuel", God in the flesh.  We can become like him, if we choose and live like he did and does.   Even Buddha didn't quite attain to what he did.  Buddha was too Yin in his life and has been in the process of full integration and balancing since then in the nonphysical.  Because you are more Yin yourself, you gravitate more to Buddha and those like him, for ever Like attracts, begets, resonates with and likes Like. 

  More personally, or to the point: b2 come again...???

It is fine. You can take what I said with you, and use it as you wish. Your life is yours, to do as you please. Come what may. And I have no wish to take away your beliefs, or to convince you of anything. There is no need.

wrote on Mar 28^th, 2012 at 11:17am:

It is fine. You can take what I said with you, and use it as you wish. Your life is yours, to do as you please. Come what may. And I have no wish to take away your beliefs, or to convince you of anything. There is no need.

   Interesting take and position.  Yet, it would seem that every nonphysical Guide or Helper, is essentially in the "job" of helping in-physicals convert limiting beliefs and perceptions into more free and expanded ones. 

  There is no personal selfish "need" driving them to do this, no wish for others to have similar beliefs as them for the sake of that, but only a need to see their brothers and sisters get out of their suffering, expand and liberate themselves. 

  We are individual, but we are One, and those most attuned to PUL within and who are most free themselves, must help to liberate those who are stuck, but to do so with positive intentions and trying to be constructive.  It's a very "Yang" and active endeavor.  For when one is truly remembering their Oneness with Source and with the Whole, one truly begins to really deeply feel the suffering of others and it hurts self just as much as it hurts the others.

Things will not work out on their own or if it does, it will take quite an extremely, extremely, extremely long time, as stuckness is such an issue with some individual Disks and groups, and we all influence each other to some degree or another.   

  Rather, The Whole, is in the process of healing Itself and truly becoming Whole. 

  Yet, for some reason, you think and feel yourself wiser, more aware and enlightened than those who have clearly lived rather different lives and had different views than self. 

  One of the things that this hindering E.T. group does, is to "meditate" if you will, as a collective, on individual humans that are more psychically sensitive and mature in consciousness.  They put forth much effort to injecting limiting thoughts and feelings into that person's psyche, in order to not only have a limiting influence on that individual, but through that individuals influence or connection to the Whole, to have a limiting influence on others. 

  One method they particularly enjoy employing, for they have found it quite effective, is to use partial truths wrapped in the guise of "spiritual teachings".  "Spiritual teachings" that incline us to be over passive and Yin in this whole healing of the Whole endeavor. 

  This is why i would recommend to everyone here, to call on the highest Divine help and specifically ask to be shielded from any outside, negatively intentioned, interfering forces.  Our own "egos" are enough to deal with and handle, without having to deal with their interference. 

  I have asked for such help for self, and it has helped in my own awakening and attunement to PUL.  This is why i am so aware of factors that are unconscious to most.  PUL attunement automatically expands perception to include more and more of the Whole and Reality as is,  not as we would like it to be. 

  I am trying to liberate others from these outside interferences, having once been influenced myself and having become wise to their ways and methods through direct experience and direct guidance. 

  Please help my Teacher, the Creative Forces (including Buddha), and me, for we also need voices more gentle and Yin than my own, sometimes too strident and masculine voice.  I ask not for myself, but for the sake of the Whole, and especially for humanity.
 

It seems to me that listening is an art which you have not yet mastered. But, that is okay.

As I said, I have no need to convince you or to change your beliefs.

When a person asks a question, there is a choice whether to answer, or to hold silence.

I do love silence, and I make no apologies for that fact.

Goodbye, for now. I wish you wellness, and wholeness, and the freedom to choose your own path.

wrote on Mar 28^th, 2012 at 11:53am:

It seems to me that listening is an art which you have not yet mastered. But, that is okay. As I said, I have no need to convince you or to change your beliefs. When a person asks a question, there is a choice whether to answer, or to hold silence. I do love silence, and I make no apologies for that fact. Goodbye, for now. I wish you wellness, and wholeness, and the freedom to choose your own path.

  Have you mastered this art?  I have not mastered this art, but i have practiced much listening to voices far wiser and aware than self.  I have asked, time and time again in my meditations, "I deeply desire and ask to receive help and guidance from only the most Source and PUL attuned consciousnesses there are." 

   I have certainly not mastered the art to listening to voices and influences less aware and wise than these, for in that path lies limitation of self and through self's influence on others, the Whole.

   You seem to be asking me to listen to your voice on this, and give me a back handed insult when i don't take your advice because i choose to listen to voices far more aware and wise than both of us, more wise and aware than Bruce Moen, Bob Monroe, Tom Campbell and every other teacher here.  You also contradict your own words, by your actions.  Your actions are that of trying to convince me of your higher way of greater passiveness, yet is that not ironic and self contradictory in it's very essence???

  You can't have it "both ways", can you?  I can admit to self, "yes, i'm trying to influence others." because i know where i am coming from in this endeavor and it's not about my little self. 

   I ask you directly and plainly, do you think self wiser and more aware than Yeshua (Jesus)?  Did he not try to influence others to change their beliefs and ways?  Would you or most recognize another teacher like him, if he arose amongst you and challenged the limited beliefs and perceptions around him?

   Probably not, and like many in his day did with him, you would probably debate with and insult him. 

Such is the way of this world, until some 1,000 years from now when all will be like Yeshua. 



      

What a conundrum.  How to let others know about important issues that one has become aware of without stepping on toes.

One thing that has helped me feel more balanced on this is understanding that even though I can be helpful to others, they don't "absolutely" need my help. If they choose to find out about somethings another way or the hard way, that's their choice.

As Justin stated, I have received information about unfriendly influences being involved with this World and they are definitely a part of what is messing things up.  It isn't as if people have to listen to such influences, but a person is likely to do better if he is influenced only by positive influences. Consider people who become racists largely because their parents raised them to be racists.  There are many other examples that show that many of the souls who incarnate in this World aren't beyond being influenced in a negative way.

You are picking a fight, and that is obvious to anyone else who watches you. This is your pattern. That is why I choose not to answer your questions. You are the person who asked the question today, Justin. You initiated the conversation by asking what someone, anyone, everyone here would have done in your shoes. You asked the question. Remember? I answered it, in my own way, and you have proceeded to argue with me and to begin to belittle me by accusing me of various things which may or may not be true. I really don't care. I don't have time for this kind of conversation and I don't have the energy for it, and neither do other people. If you want to make this a personal argument, I refuse to participate in it. That is all I'm going to say, period.

This is the kind of conversation which causes me to reconsider joining this forum. There is no point in trying to calmly and pleasantly give a person their point of view if this kind of railroading behavior with numerous mishandled quotes from multitudes of other historical figures and living people result.

It is a waste of your time and mine. That is why I choose silence.

In fact, I think it is a good idea for me to leave this forum for good. There is no point to this. As much as I love the people here, it is probably a much wiser idea for me to simply leave.

I accept that this was my mistake, returning here, trying to answer questions in my own way. It would be better for me to leave you to your own wisdom, because there seems to be so very much of it.

Thank you for listening and allowing me to let you know how belittled and ridiculous I feel for joining this forum again. Goodbye.




wrote on Mar 28^th, 2012 at 12:08pm:

wrote on Mar 28th, 2012 at 11:53am: It seems to me that listening is an art which you have not yet mastered. But, that is okay. As I said, I have no need to convince you or to change your beliefs. When a person asks a question, there is a choice whether to answer, or to hold silence. I do love silence, and I make no apologies for that fact. Goodbye, for now. I wish you wellness, and wholeness, and the freedom to choose your own path.   Have you mastered this art?  I have not mastered this art, but i have practiced much listening to voices far wiser and aware than self.  I have asked, time and time again in my meditations, "I deeply desire and ask to receive help and guidance from only the most Source and PUL attuned consciousnesses there are."     I have certainly not mastered the art to listening to voices and influences less aware and wise than these, for in that path lies limitation of self and through self's influence on others, the Whole.    You seem to be asking me to listen to your voice on this, and give me a back handed insult when i don't take your advice because i choose to listen to voices far more aware and wise than both of us, more wise and aware than Bruce Moen, Bob Monroe, Tom Campbell and every other teacher here.  You also contradict your own words, by your actions.  Your actions are that of trying to convince me of your higher way of greater passiveness, yet is that not ironic and self contradictory in it's very essence???   You can't have it "both ways", can you?  I can admit to self, "yes, i'm trying to influence others." because i know where i am coming from in this endeavor and it's not about my little self.     I ask you directly and plainly, do you think self wiser and more aware than Yeshua (Jesus)?  Did he not try to influence others to change their beliefs and ways?  Would you or most recognize another teacher like him, if he arose amongst you and challenged the limited beliefs and perceptions around him?    Probably not, and like many in his day did with him, you would probably debate with and insult him.  Such is the way of this world, until some 1,000 years from now when all will be like Yeshua.

  Yes Albert, i agree with this, which is why in person, with individuals, i often keep my counsel to myself, or if i do speak, i speak more gently, briefly, and impersonally.  I rarely ever argue, or even debate with others in an individual or personal way, because it's usually not helpful to box people in like that.  Generally speaking, i'm a pretty quiet and soft spoken guy.  I spent about 20 years of my total 32 being so quiet and to myself as to seem quite autistic in nature.  I'm glad i'm more Yang and communicative, for i'm certainly much happier than i was when i was so silent and passive all the time. 

   Forums are a bit different than one on one interaction, these are typed words that the many read and will read.  These are lasting messages, and if people don't like them, it's easy to skip over and not read them.   When i write a reply to people on a forum, i rarely am writing to just that person in a purely individual way, but more universally to a collective.   

   I'm not saying i have attained a perfect balance, just that i understand that there is an important difference, in some ways, between personal and individual interaction with fellow humans in physical and over this much more detached, cerebral, impersonal and universal communication medium called "internet forums". 

  Maybe i should tone it down a bit on forums--like i told you via p.m., i will take this question to Expanded Guidance and see what i get.

   

wrote on Mar 28^th, 2012 at 1:32pm:

You are picking a fight, and that is obvious to anyone else who watches you. This is your pattern. That is why I choose not to answer your questions. You are the person who asked the question today, Justin. You initiated the conversation by asking what someone, anyone, everyone here would have done in your shoes. You asked the question. Remember? I answered it, in my own way, and you have proceeded to argue with me and to begin to belittle me by accusing me of various things which may or may not be true. I really don't care. I don't have time for this kind of conversation and I don't have the energy for it, and neither do other people. If you want to make this a personal argument, I refuse to participate in it. That is all I'm going to say, period. This is the kind of conversation which causes me to reconsider joining this forum. There is no point in trying to calmly and pleasantly give a person their point of view if this kind of railroading behavior with numerous mishandled quotes from multitudes of other historical figures and living people result. It is a waste of your time and mine. That is why I choose silence. In fact, I think it is a good idea for me to leave this forum for good. There is no point to this. As much as I love the people here, it is probably a much wiser idea for me to simply leave. I accept that this was my mistake, returning here, trying to answer questions in my own way. It would be better for me to leave you to your own wisdom, because there seems to be so very much of it. Thank you for listening and allowing me to let you know how belittled and ridiculous I feel for joining this forum again. Goodbye.

  given, others are not responsible for your emotions and how you feel just because they disagree with your beliefs and perceptions and impersonally state these for a higher reason.   

  Perhaps others will fall for this kind of emotional manipulation, but i won't.  I have lived with women with very strong Cancer in their birth charts and i know this tendency well.  I know you well, and i remember last time you canceled your account and it wasn't because of me, but because some dude A SPAMMER shared an offensive picture and you dramatically left in a huffy puff ranting about this forum and the degradation of women.

  You take things far to personal. 

  You know you only answered my question to try to "teach" me your way of greater passiveness.  I said i don't play that game and explained why, and i cited the example of the most intune and PUL attuned teacher to explain my reasoning.   

  And now you are boo hooing, throwing a tantrum, and trying to manipulate others of the group to take sides with you in your intolerance of me--my ways, my perceptions, etc. which are different than yours. 

The only difference between us, is that i'm not trying to shut you up, like you are indirectly doing with me.

I've noticed that this happens sometimes.

1. Person A will say something about Person B that person B doesn't believe is accurate and fair.

2. Person B speaks up for himself.

3. Person A accuses B of going on too much.

It's like entrapment. If person A doesn't want to see person B write too many posts, then perhaps person A shouldn't write posts that makes it so person B feels compelled to speak up for himself.

Or in other words, it isn't fair for person A to pounce on person B after he speaks up for himself, when person A is partly responsible for such an exchange taking place.

It doesn't seem reasonable for person A to speak as if he is beyond it all, when he is partly responsible for starting what he is supposedly beyond.

If person A feels defensive because he doesn't want to hear what person B has to say, perhaps this is person A's issue rather than person B's issue.

recoverer wrote on Mar 28^th, 2012 at 3:01pm:

I've noticed that this happens sometimes. 1. Person A will say something about Person B that person B doesn't believe is accurate and fair. 2. Person B speaks up for himself. 3. Person A accuses B of going on too much. It's like entrapment. If person A doesn't want to see person B write too many posts, then perhaps person A shouldn't write posts that makes it so person B feels compelled to speak up for himself. Or in other words, it isn't fair for person A to pounce on person B after he speaks up for himself, when person A is partly responsible for such an exchange taking place. It doesn't seem reasonable for person A to speak as if he is beyond it all, when he is partly responsible for starting what he is supposedly beyond. If person A feels defensive because he doesn't want to hear what person B has to say, perhaps this is person A's issue rather than person B's issue. For example, I used to stick my tongue out at people who speak of unfriendly alien influences, because I had the issue of not wanting to hear about such influences. It is a good thing that people who decided to speak up didn't check with me before doing so. They probably figured that I'm free to not read something if I'm not interested in it.

The edit feature isn't working so I updated my post by posting it again.

wrote on Mar 28^th, 2012 at 11:40am:

wrote on Mar 28th, 2012 at 11:17am: It is fine. You can take what I said with you, and use it as you wish. Your life is yours, to do as you please. Come what may. And I have no wish to take away your beliefs, or to convince you of anything. There is no need.    Interesting take and position.  Yet, it would seem that every nonphysical Guide or Helper, is essentially in the "job" of helping in-physicals convert limiting beliefs and perceptions into more free and expanded ones.    There is no personal selfish "need" driving them to do this, no wish for others to have similar beliefs as them for the sake of that, but only a need to see their brothers and sisters get out of their suffering, expand and liberate themselves.    We are individual, but we are One, and those most attuned to PUL within and who are most free themselves, must help to liberate those who are stuck, but to do so with positive intentions and trying to be constructive.  It's a very "Yang" and active endeavor.  For when one is truly remembering their Oneness with Source and with the Whole, one truly begins to really deeply feel the suffering of others and it hurts self just as much as it hurts the others. Things will not work out on their own or if it does, it will take quite an extremely, extremely, extremely long time, as stuckness is such an issue with some individual Disks and groups, and we all influence each other to some degree or another.      Rather, The Whole, is in the process of healing Itself and truly becoming Whole.    Yet, for some reason, you think and feel yourself wiser, more aware and enlightened than those who have clearly lived rather different lives and had different views than self.    One of the things that this hindering E.T. group does, is to "meditate" if you will, as a collective, on individual humans that are more psychically sensitive and mature in consciousness.  They put forth much effort to injecting limiting thoughts and feelings into that person's psyche, in order to not only have a limiting influence on that individual, but through that individuals influence or connection to the Whole, to have a limiting influence on others.    One method they particularly enjoy employing, for they have found it quite effective, is to use partial truths wrapped in the guise of "spiritual teachings".  "Spiritual teachings" that incline us to be over passive and Yin in this whole healing of the Whole endeavor.    This is why i would recommend to everyone here, to call on the highest Divine help and specifically ask to be shielded from any outside, negatively intentioned, interfering forces.  Our own "egos" are enough to deal with and handle, without having to deal with their interference.    I have asked for such help for self, and it has helped in my own awakening and attunement to PUL.  This is why i am so aware of factors that are unconscious to most.  PUL attunement automatically expands perception to include more and more of the Whole and Reality as is,  not as we would like it to be.    I am trying to liberate others from these outside interferences, having once been influenced myself and having become wise to their ways and methods through direct experience and direct guidance.    Please help my Teacher, the Creative Forces (including Buddha), and me, for we also need voices more gentle and Yin than my own, sometimes too strident and masculine voice.  I ask not for myself, but for the sake of the Whole, and especially for humanity.

@Justin:

"Please help my Teacher, the Creative Forces (including Buddha), and me, for we also need voices more gentle and Yin than my own, sometimes too strident and masculine voice.  I ask not for myself, but for the sake of the Whole, and especially for humanity."

Justin. Is your primary Teacher, the 'Teacher of the Angels', Jesus Christ?

wrote on Mar 28^th, 2012 at 1:39pm:

Maybe i should tone it down a bit on forums--like i told you via p.m., i will take this question to Expanded Guidance and see what i get.

Good idea, Justin, the toning it down.  Like letting others post without fear of your jumping in and pointing out at length how misguided and unenlightened they are, unlike yourself.  I'm really sorry you chased b2/given off this time; I have always enjoyed her posts and insights.  I'm also sorry that you have recently belittled and attacked Vicky.  Fortunately she isn't leaving; I value her posts--unlike the vast majority of yours and the negative and stifling effects they have on other forum members.

Pat E. wrote on Mar 29^th, 2012 at 1:47am:

[quote author=4779454E474848434A260 link=1332283769/54#54 date=1332956393]      I'm also sorry that you have recently belittled and attacked Vicky.  Fortunately she isn't leaving; I value her posts--

Pat, I just have to publically say thank you for this.  I very much appreciate it. 

And I won't leave.  I treasure and value Bruce and his work and all that I've learned from him and I'm happy to be here supporting his work and also feeling at home here sharing my own experiences and beliefs.  There are a lot of wonderful contributors to this site, and I try my best to help others feel welcome and comfortable learning and sharing here, on this site. 

Typically, arguing back and forth and/or causing others to be "called out" to come and argue is nothing short of the immaturity of pushing buttons for the sake of attention.  It's why I won't degrade Bruce's site by egging Justin on.  He would do well to create his own website based on his Teachings and his bestoyed Truths and Beliefs.  I'm sure he'd find a great many followers rather than the arguments that have swallowed up this thread, a thread in which I intially tried to carry to the type of conversation I'm interested in.  It's difficult to keep a conversation going in the direction you try, and difficult to keep a thread on one topic, but easy to do when you push people's buttons.  Conversations evolve, which is natural.  But I think it's obvious that Justin will continue his soapbox as long as he feels he has an audience.  I'm not part of that audience. 

But thank you Pat, and others who have privately supported me with their kindness on this issue.  My last words are still that I am here because of what I've learned from Bruce and his work and I still stand by the fact that I've learned a great deal from him, and others here, and for that I'm eternally grateful. 

Vicky

Conversations with some people who come to this board don't feel like exhaanges of ideas. The FEEL like interacting with someone described here:

"Narcissists are people who cover up feelings of shame and worthlessness inflicted during their own screwy childhoods by doing whatever it takes to maintain a false sense that they are very special and therefore not bound by ordinary rules. This requires them to surround themselves with people who will constantly pump them up by agreeing with them about everything. In narcissism talk this is called feeding their grandiosity.

Here is the short explanation for why they act like this: Narcissists essentially live in a world that is one person big because they never fully outgrow a phase of infantile behavioral development in which baby thinks he and Mommy are the same person. Therefore, when a brilliant, charming, elegant and grand narcissist honors you by allowing you entry into his or her very elite cadre, it is kind of like being annexed by an imperialist country. Your borders have now been erased. The subtext of all future interactions will be: What’s mine is mine and what’s yours is mine. Welcome to a world where there is no you! When you are with a narcissist, their needs must become your needs. Its not enough for a narcissist to be the center of his own world, he must also be the center of yours. Your job is to serve as admiring audience or vent for his anger, Fan Club President or Incompetent Maid. If you are not mirroring him or praising him, you are proving you are a separate person and thus a threat."

this is from
http://merrillmarkoe.com/enough-about-you-my-explanation-of-narcissism


i realize that I don't know anyone personally I've only met one person from here besides Bruce, so I can't say this is what it is, but I am saying that this is how some of the interactions make me feel. These is something going on beneath what is said, a dynamic that goes beyond what the words are.

I have an acquaintance who others say is bipolar. He is moody, but when he is on the "up" side, he will go on and on about certain topics. He sounds like the authority on those topics. It ca be politics or economics or health supplements. It is not a conversation. On the oher hand if you cross him when he is in a bad mood, he can go on and on about that too. Some of these conversations here FEEL like that to me. 

the way this board feels sometimes happens from time to time and I think we need a better way to address it.

I have separate ideas. I can agree to disagree but I cannot blindly follow. yes, where is the line between being balanced and strongly believing something and understanding that an opposite position may also have value, or believing your way is the only way and anyone who disagrees is wrong?

There is no reason to address someone personally in a disparaging way, or even make comments about what you perceive as their personal motivations.  If we have a point to make, we should be able to make it without hypothesizing about the influences on another poster or their life experiences - that makes it personal, and it doesn't have to go there.

That being said, we are not made of glass, and though I would hate for anyone to be chased off or offended by the meanderings on a conversation forum. 

I loved posts from B2 and another member, Blink a few years ago.  I would hate for anyone to leave because of a few conversations.

I also wouldn't ban someone from a forum unless they were personally disparaging in a flagrant way.  There are, for wont of a better word, "personalities" on this forum.  Like a crazy uncle at a family gathering, etc. I would not disown them unless they were directly insulting or mean spirited.

Let us agree to avoid speculating on the state of enlightenment or motivations of another, and stick to the conversation...


Matthew

Pat E. wrote on Mar 29^th, 2012 at 1:47am:

wrote on Mar 28th, 2012 at 1:39pm:           Maybe i should tone it down a bit on forums--like i told you via p.m., i will take this question to Expanded Guidance and see what i get.     Good idea, Justin, the toning it down.  Like letting others post without fear of your jumping in and pointing out at length how misguided and unenlightened they are, unlike yourself.  I'm really sorry you chased b2/given off this time; I have always enjoyed her posts and insights.  I'm also sorry that you have recently belittled and attacked Vicky.  Fortunately she isn't leaving; I value her posts--unlike the vast majority of yours and the negative and stifling effects they have on other forum members.

   Pat, if you read Given's replies to me carefully, you will see that she was trying to "teach" me, which is fine and i don't mind one way or another personally, but i disagreed with what she was trying to teach me and stated why.  She is not direct and blunt like me, true to her Cancerian Sun and female nature, she is indirect in how she approaches things.  In her indirect way, she implied that i needed "healing".

  Regarding "driving her away", this is complete b.s. as she has a long history here of getting offended by various others, and leaving for a time, then coming back, and the whole cycle goes on again. 

Last time when she left, it HAD NOTHING TO DO WITH ME, but because a spammer posted an offensive picture of a woman.  The person who did so, was clearly a spammer and not a real nor serious member here.  Funny that you all forget this and solely blame me. 

  Her lack of ability to keep her emotional center and truly tolerate and accept others and the paths they are on, is not my fault nor doing, and i will not take responsibility for her leaving just because i disagreed with her and pointed out that her way was too Yin for me. 

  Re: meditation, i did ask, and i heard back, "be gentle with those who need it, and be firm with those who need it." 

  Re: "attacking" Vicky..  Attack and attacking are mighty strong words.  I disagreed with Vicky and with her beliefs and perceptions.  Beliefs are not "sacred" to me and if someone states beliefs on a forum they are open to being disagreed with.  It is NEVER personal for me when i do so.  It's not about the person, but if someone is spreading limiting beliefs, such as there is no strong hindering forces to worry about, i will disagree and explain why i do so.

  It's funny that a number of you folks cannot keep it about the information, but have to focus on how narcissistic, bad, etc. i am.   Why, because you can't take someone clearly, and with holistic logic challenging your precious beliefs and perceptions.    I am not so attached to beliefs and perceptions and don't get emotionally upset just because someone else shares a different one than mine. 

  If i am correct about this negative E.T. group, and there are many reputable sources that back up my own guidance and messages on this, then there is a lot more at stake here with humanity than debating and differences of beliefs and perceptions. 

  My Teacher used debate in his times to cut through limiting beliefs and perceptions, but like with me, it wasn't personal for him and he didn't do it just to be an argumentative pain in the butt, but to teach a higher way and give broader, more freeing perspectives.

 

Lucy wrote on Mar 29^th, 2012 at 5:02am:

Conversations with some people who come to this board don't feel like exhaanges of ideas. The FEEL like interacting with someone described here: "Narcissists are people who cover up feelings of shame and worthlessness inflicted during their own screwy childhoods by doing whatever it takes to maintain a false sense that they are very special and therefore not bound by ordinary rules. This requires them to surround themselves with people who will constantly pump them up by agreeing with them about everything. In narcissism talk this is called feeding their grandiosity. Here is the short explanation for why they act like this: Narcissists essentially live in a world that is one person big because they never fully outgrow a phase of infantile behavioral development in which baby thinks he and Mommy are the same person. Therefore, when a brilliant, charming, elegant and grand narcissist honors you by allowing you entry into his or her very elite cadre, it is kind of like being annexed by an imperialist country. Your borders have now been erased. The subtext of all future interactions will be: What’s mine is mine and what’s yours is mine. Welcome to a world where there is no you! When you are with a narcissist, their needs must become your needs. Its not enough for a narcissist to be the center of his own world, he must also be the center of yours. Your job is to serve as admiring audience or vent for his anger, Fan Club President or Incompetent Maid. If you are not mirroring him or praising him, you are proving you are a separate person and thus a threat." this is from http://merrillmarkoe.com/enough-about-you-my-explanation-of-narcissism i realize that I don't know anyone personally I've only met one person from here besides Bruce, so I can't say this is what it is, but I am saying that this is how some of the interactions make me feel. These is something going on beneath what is said, a dynamic that goes beyond what the words are. I have an acquaintance who others say is bipolar. He is moody, but when he is on the "up" side, he will go on and on about certain topics. He sounds like the authority on those topics. It ca be politics or economics or health supplements. It is not a conversation. On the oher hand if you cross him when he is in a bad mood, he can go on and on about that too. Some of these conversations here FEEL like that to me.  the way this board feels sometimes happens from time to time and I think we need a better way to address it. I have separate ideas. I can agree to disagree but I cannot blindly follow. yes, where is the line between being balanced and strongly believing something and understanding that an opposite position may also have value, or believing your way is the only way and anyone who disagrees is wrong?

  You tread mighty unethical grounds Lucy in diagnosing a fellow poster and attaching such extreme and negative fixed labels to someone when you don't have the professional background to do so and you have never met them in person. 

  This is far more grounds for banishment than disagreeing with another's beliefs and perceptions like i have. 

  I agree i can be a little much here at times and be a little pushy in my communications, but often it's about issues that i'm really and truly concerned with... you know like the domination of Earth by a negative E.T. group. 

  A "narcissist" lacks empathy and concern for others, and i'm speaking out of my empathy and concern for others. 

  Perhaps you folks should get past your personality reactions, and meditate and ask higher guidance what my actual intentions are rather than assuming so much about my person.    No, you won't do that though, because you "know" how "right" you are, and why appeal to sources wiser and more expanded than self?

  So i guess you folks are saying that Linn Conyers, and Bruce's psychic friends Carolene and Caryl are blind and can't see a "narcissist" when they feel one?    Why did they and their guidance then speak so highly about me and my level of maturity?

  People like these professional psychics with a good track record in obtaining verifications, are good at cutting through the b.s. of others and seeing them more clearly. 

What led to my Teacher's false trial, torture and death?  Because he sat around and played patty cake with others?   No, because he disagreed with the spiritual experts of his times, called them out, taught a higher and more expanded way, and was very outspoken and most around him couldn't stand him and only saw red in relation to him. 

  It's only the truth in communication which bothers people.  If you all were secure in your own beliefs and perceptions, i wouldn't be able to upset you with my different views and perceptions. 

  It's interesting that you Lucy, so dislike my Teacher and so dislike me in such a personal way.  Perhaps you should take the claws of those negative E.T.'s out of your back and psyche?  You would become a much, much happier person if you did so.   

   

Because this is a conversation board, it's instructive to check the meaning of this word.  Per Wikipedia:

<<Conversation is a form of interactive, spontaneous communication between two or more people who are following rules of etiquette.>>

<<Conversations follow rules of etiquette because conversations are social interactions, and therefore depend on social convention. Failure to adhere to these rules devolves, and eventually dissolves the conversation."

R

wrote on Mar 29^th, 2012 at 9:21am:

[quote author=6B7F7E777772746F6F1B0 link=1332283769/60#60 date=1333000073][quote author=4779454E474848434A260 link=1332283769/54#54 date=1332956393]            Re: "attacking" Vicky..  I disagreed with Vicky and with her beliefs and perceptions.    It's not about the person, but if someone is spreading limiting beliefs, such as there is no strong hindering forces to worry about, i will disagree and explain why i do so.

I never once said anything about there being no strong hindering foreces to worry about.   I simply shared my own personal experience of what I know and believe of my own experience with psychic ability and Guidance.  I was only talking about myself.  I don't speak for what other people do or how they do it.  Just myself. 

Vicky wrote on Mar 29^th, 2012 at 10:20am:

wrote on Mar 29th, 2012 at 9:21am: Pat E. wrote on Mar 29th, 2012 at 1:47am: wrote on Mar 28th, 2012 at 1:39pm:             Re: "attacking" Vicky..  I disagreed with Vicky and with her beliefs and perceptions.    It's not about the person, but if someone is spreading limiting beliefs, such as there is no strong hindering forces to worry about, i will disagree and explain why i do so.   I never once said anything about there being no strong hindering foreces to worry about.   I simply shared my own personal experience of what I know and believe of my own experience with psychic ability and Guidance.  I was only talking about myself.  I don't speak for what other people do or how they do it.  Just myself.    Hi Vicky, i have come to think that i spoke too strongly to you earlier and should have spoke more gently.  Yes, you did not technically say there are no hindering forces to worry about, but you expressed frustration with how some here go into talking about these, about the differences between lower and higher beings, etc.    Also, i understand that you were speaking of just your own personal experience, but if people come here and they read the following quotes from you, " Quote: For those reading who believe that psychic ability comes from a being, and beings are either low level or high level...I haven't yet experienced my information coming from a being.  At least that's not how I perceive or interpret it.  I call it my Guidance because that's just what I believe my higher self is.  I don't have dead people or other wordly disincarnate beings talking to me.    Or responding to what i said[quote],... Having awareness of unfriendly influences, is quite a different matter than having fear of same, isn't it?    How can one stop from being influenced, if one isn't even consciously aware of being influenced to begin with or that there are forces which seek to do same!???...   With things like the following from you, [quote]All I said was that I don't experience my psychic ability as coming from this guide or that guide, or this being or that being.  I experience it all the same way, one way, to my perception... ...Maybe I'm just more of an optimist than you are, but I'm pretty confident that the World as a Whole is doing "ok"...

  I have no problem with you, your beliefs, or your experiences, but when you say things like the above, people and especially newbies to this whole "psychic" perception and experience thing might think, "oh wow, there's no reason to use discernment in relation to one's sources of psychic information." 

  Because, you have really over simplified the matter based on your experiences and perceptions. 

  There is an impersonal, Universal Law found in many different teachings, called slightly different things, but i prefer, "Like attracts, begets, and resonates with Like".   

  I figure you are a pretty positive and loving person Vicky, and i figure a lot of your insights probably do come from your higher self, but clearly, if you study psychic phenomena in a more impersonal and universal sense, you would understand and realize that this does not always apply. 

Even Bruce's work contains a little about this, when he talks about a psychic lady whose "guide" "Sean", was not really a guide but a negative imposter and was having a negative, and draining affect on her.  Yet, she refused to see that her attachment to her "guide" was not helping her in the least bit.  These things are more common than you may realize.   

  I don't think this world is ok, and one of the reasons why this world is not doing ok, is because we deal with outer interferences.  "Sean" though and those like him, are the least of our worries as my guidance messages and Expanded Guidance has informed me.  These mischievous, discarnate former human folks masquerading as "guides", etc. do not have the kind of power, influence, and negative affect that the negative E.T. group i've been informed about does. 

  Again, i disagreed with you not because i have any personal issue with you, your experiences, beliefs or perceptions but because i have learned that people really need a better understanding of that Universal Law of Like attracts, begets and resonates with Like, especially in the area of psychism and "getting guidance".   

  I don't take things personally Vicky, and it's not about "me" when i disagree with your or others about these kinds of beliefs and perceptions.  If you and others meditated and sought higher guidance, and asked about my intentions then you might see that more clearly and directly. 

   I apologize for speaking too strongly to you earlier--it was never my intent to hurt or upset you.  While for a man, i'm unusually intouch with my "Feminine" side, you have to realize that i'm still in a male body and tend to be more cerebral, direct, matter of fact, impersonal and about the "info" and less emotionally sensitive than many women tend to be. 

  One of the common issues between women and men, are their different approaches and that more men actually tend to like intellectual debate, intellectual sparring, and can disagree with others without taking it personally or becoming emotionally upset.  Sometimes i forget that more women tend to have a different attunement and tend to be more emotionally centered and don't tend to enjoy debate like us men tend to. 

Perhaps this is why i was told when relaxing last night, "be gentle with those who need it and be firm with those who need it"? 

Justin,
I did ask higher guidance about you, as you suggested I do.

  Hi Bardo,

I also took it to guidance and was told, "be gentle with those who need it and be firm with those who need it"

  I guess it's saying that i should modify the approach depending on who i'm talking to and addressing more directly.  If you feel like sharing what you got, that's fine, also fine if not.

I'm still very much a work in progress, as no doubt you received from higher guidance. 

Well I guess we can see the glass as either half empty or half full. If we become overly fussy we might see it as half empty.

When it comes to Justin I prefer to see it as half full because I understand that he is simply trying to tell people about what he has been made aware of. I don't believe this is a bad thing even though he hasn't found an approach that people find acceptable.

I for one don't believe it is necessary for him to keep referring to his teacher because I doubt that Jesus considers this necessary. I figure that Jesus believes that there are a lot of beings of love and light that are worth listening to. I have found it useful to read and hear what some people have to say about unfriendly beings and Earth changes, but if it wasn't for the fact that I received information about such possibilities from beings I consider trustworthy I wouldn't be prone to consider what others have to say about the matter. Not that I trust all people who speak of such things.

Recoverer,

I agree too.  And since I haven't had any personal experience with unfriendly beings and ET groups, I don't talk about such things.  And I wasn't talking about that from the beginning.  I was simply stating how I personally receive and perceive my own psychic guidance.  I said that I don't experience it as coming from a being, or being questionable as to whether it was good or evil.  I just don't see why every topic needs to come down to being about psychic information coming from an entity or being.

It seems that that's a topic that's been talked about to death.  I made my first post about what I wanted to talk about, and Justin has gotten enough attention about his beliefs. 

Maybe I should start my own thread about the simple nature of everyday psychic ability and how it seems to work, and how the average person can learn about it.  I wonder if anyone would be interested in just that...without it having to go into a debate about the fate of mankind and the evil-doing of ETs who are bent on corrupting it. 

   I won't visit your thread and start talking about hindering forces Vicky, though i would probably at least point out that Law of Consciousness which permeates everything, Like attracts, begets, and resonates with Like.

  It's a very important Law to understand and recognize if one is interested in guidance, psychism, etc.  Like i've said before, i don't think  you personally have to be too concerned with it because i sense that you are a pretty mature and Loving person innately and therefore tend to attract and get in touch with more expanded and helpful levels of Consciousness, whatever it is comprised of. 

  Yet, that doesn't apply to a lot of folks.  Just the other day, i was talking to a prospective house-mate (a younger guy), and he told me how psychic he was, etc.  He seems like a nice and decent guy, but he's really into guns, screamo heavy metal, and doing drugs (mostly just pot, but a lot of it and very consistently).  He has a really intensely frazzled energy.

  What he told me, i found extremely interesting because Recoverer just recently mentioned a message relating to this.  We were talking about guidance, meditation, etc and i mentioned the importance of asking specifically for the most Love attuned and helpful guidance one can. 

  He told me one time he meditated and he found that his "guide" was a Praying Mantis like looking being.  I didn't know what to say as i didn't get a good feeling about what he told me.  I just briefly reiterated how important it was to ask for the highest guidance and to feel Love during meditation, especially if seeking guidance or messages of some kind.

  Now, i feel/sense he is an older Soul, but it seems obvious that he's listening to "guidance" and voices probably not best for him and his growth.  If he wasn't doing that, he probably would be a lot happier and peaceful of a person and the outer interests and activities in his life would probably change dramatically. 

  It's a bit frustrating and upsetting, to see someone with so much potential, who is letting themselves be influenced by influences not best for their or other's growth.  Perhaps if he had someone in his life with more experience, and insight than himself, gently nudge in him in a more helpful direction, it could really help him get out of those patterns?

  Is it about judging and looking down on him?  Not at all, but it's a matter of using one's discernment and discrimination to know that there is indeed a difference in Consciousness between "higher" and "lower." and that it's important to recognize and care about this fact, because we are all in this boat together and we all influence each other unconsciously and consciously to varying degrees. 

Justin:

Praying Mantis? I don't remember that at all. Is it possible that you have someone else in mind?

The closest thing I've experienced with bugs is that one time I was meditating and I suddenly found myself on this planet that was inhabbited by intelligent insect like beings and they didn't seem positive. They definitely weren't my guides.

I have had experiences with aliens that felt positive.

I agree completely and I do care.  And if I were to meet some guy who I thought was a creep, low-life, drug-doing-dealing no good weirdo well then I'd just leave him alone and walk away! 

I don't walk down dark alleys.  I don't go to the bad parts of downtown.  I don't got into places where people look scary looking to me.   And so that's my normal, everyday view about life. 

Now as far as someone's spiritual path, their soul's journey, etc...I have no idea about the what's what and how and why. 

Again, I'm just talking about everyday stuff.  If it gets weird and about things I don't understand, don't believe in or ascribe to, then I don't bother talking about it. 

So my imaginary thread talking about the types of psychic matters I want to talk about?  Sure, you can post about Like attracts Like and all that.  But it still doesn't mean that what I'm talking about is the end-all in psychic topics. 

There are so many ways to look at this topic, just as there are so many ways to look at any topic.  For instance....Let's say I want to write about how much I love French Fries with ranch dressing.  Yum! 

Someone else could write in and say "But there are starving people in the world who could benefit from the $3 dollars you spend on fries!  There are people who have heart problems who can't even EAT fries!!  Yet you talk about fries as if everyone should have them!!!"

Do you see how silly that gets?  My point is, just because a topic is about how I see and sense things, it doesn't mean it has to pertain to everything else about that general topic. 

So yes, like begets like.  You've made that point many times. 

Perhaps Justin had this experience in mind. One time I was meditating and suddenly I saw an alien looking at me from far away, as if he was looking at me through a psychic telescope. At first I responded with fear,  but then I thought that perhaps he is friendly.  This being didn't feel negative so I mentally apologized for assuming the worse. My eyes were open at this time. I saw a white point of light flash in front of my heart area after I thought this. It felt like understanding and kindness.

The being I saw didn't look like any of the aliens people speak of. It had a long narrow head, but it wasn't a Praying Mantis like being as far as I could tell. I wrote "he" because it seemed male even though it didn't look human.

recoverer wrote on Mar 29^th, 2012 at 1:50pm:

Justin: Praying Mantis? I don't remember that at all. Is it possible that you have someone else in mind? The closest thing I've experienced with bugs is that one time I was meditating and I suddenly found myself on this planet that was inhabbited by intelligent insect like beings and they didn't seem positive. They definitely weren't my guides. I have had experiences with aliens that felt positive.

  Hi Albert, the above is what i was referring to.  What that young man said to me, reminded me what you had written about the above--not the specific praying mantis part, but the insectoid, E.T. part.  More generally speaking, i just did not get a good vibe or feeling about this "guide". 

   Yes, i agree, as Becky and i have had experiences and messages with positive E.T.'s.  I figure from my experience and insight so far, that most E.T.'s that interact with us are either helpful in nature, or more neutral and just kind of curious and want to observe us and our process during the Earth changes. 

  It is the helpful and highly evolved E.T.'s that are protecting us from being directly attacked by the Reptilians.  They will not allow this, until we have similar technology and enough awareness to more directly deal with them.  Otherwise it would be a massacre plain and simple.  This is why i haven't agreed with some of your literal interpretations of your messages about them attacking us anytime soon. 

   What will happen though, is that aspects of corrupt human forces, like some connected to the U.S. government, have some knowledge of the coming changes and collapse.  While they don't want this to happen because they like the way the world is now, they figure that they will be safe in their underground fortresses and bunkers, and when enough of us "peasants" die, they will be able to easily take over and institute a dictatorship wherein they will be able to control all the resources and the common folk still alive. 

   There will be battles after the collapse, but not with negative E.T.'s, but with these corrupt humans who will have some advanced technology left and who will try to force others to be worker slaves. 

  However, there will be freedom fighters who will rally the common folk and not let this happen.  Eventually their stored resources will give out and they will have as much problems as just surviving as us common folk who won't get to go into underground bunkers, and the like when the times come. 

  Thankfully, some of us will get help from the friendly, highly mature E.T.'s during these difficult times.  We will be given information in order to help us survive and fight these corrupt human forces that are aligned with the Reptilian E.T.'s. 

  Those corrupt human forces i mentioned, have some E.T. like technology, meaning the U.S. government right now has anti gravity technology. 

    They will use this later, after the collapse, and some will think that these are E.T. craft.  It's the triangular craft that are U.S. government. 

Vicky wrote on Mar 29^th, 2012 at 1:07pm:

Maybe I should start my own thread about the simple nature of everyday psychic ability and how it seems to work, and how the average person can learn about it.  I wonder if anyone would be interested in just that...

I would.  :)

Kind regards,
mj