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Message started by Neno on Jan 6th, 2012 at 7:25am

Title: How to beat the cancer with Self-Love
Post by Neno on Jan 6th, 2012 at 7:25am
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=87TRYkP2zBM&feature=player_embedded

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=52QGhNGjLNQ&feature=player_embedded

Title: Re: How to beat the cancer with Self-Love
Post by Focus27 on Jan 6th, 2012 at 10:17am
The best way to beat cancer is to eat 100% non processed, organic foods. Limiting your ORGANIC red meat intake and eating tons of ORGANIC fruits and vegetables. In fact, almost all cancer is directly related to poor lifestyle choices.

Title: Re: How to beat the cancer with Self-Love
Post by Lucy on Jan 10th, 2012 at 2:34am
Actually, I believe people got cancer back in the day when everything was organic....

Title: Re: How to beat the cancer with Self-Love
Post by Focus27 on Jan 10th, 2012 at 4:51am
True, people worked in uncontrolled conditions being exposed to all kinds of cancer causing factory and other pollutants. Prior to and in addition to this people smoked.... A LOT. Smoking was VERY VERY popular. Plenty of things have always been around even since cave man days that put humans at an increased risk for cancer.

It's a known fact that if a person controls every aspect of they're life including exposure to pollutants and keeps a healthy diet and exercise, they are unlikely to develop cancer until a much older age.

It's also a known fact that due to processed foods cancer has risen dramatically.

Title: Re: How to beat the cancer with Self-Love
Post by Lucy on Jan 10th, 2012 at 5:14am
Interesting how she offers the idea that the fear is a part of cultural conditioning. Probably means we think the fear is a normal state.

I haven't watched the second one yet.

Her website indicates that a doc presented some of the results showing the cancer was gone, but I don't recall ever hearing about this else where. There is more detail on her website.

Title: Re: How to beat the cancer with Self-Love
Post by Lucy on Jan 10th, 2012 at 8:40am
Hey as a similar thought line, what do you think of this about Wayne Dyer being treated by John of God for leukemia:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=endscreen&NR=1&v=VzCy5B_1QpM

hmm interesting not sure what to think...

Title: Re: How to beat the cancer with Self-Love
Post by Rob_Roy on Jan 10th, 2012 at 3:08pm
I am grateful for the reminder of the difference between an answer and a solution. I often forget. The following tirade is not directed at Focus 27. It is directed towards a certain kind of sanctimonious ignorance I have often heard on this topic:


Focus27 wrote on Jan 6th, 2012 at 10:17am:
The best way to beat cancer is to eat 100% non processed, organic foods. Limiting your ORGANIC red meat intake and eating tons of ORGANIC fruits and vegetables. In fact, almost all cancer is directly related to poor lifestyle choices.


Easy, isn't it? All I have to do is eat 'ORGANIC.' Except that it's expensive and I simply can't afford it. I presently have difficulty buying junk to eat. And there are LOTS of people in my position. I guess we're all idiots...'poor lifestyle choice' and all that.

I could stop paying child support but jail would be a 'poor lifestyle choice' and besides, they don't serve 'ORGANIC' food in prison. I'll pay my child support and die of cancer. Such is life in C1, aka The Real World, where not everyone has a good job, is well off, can shovel 'tons' of nice 'ORGANIC' food into their mouths, where the working poor are grateful to eat junk. Being poor means making hard choices. And making hard choices teaches you that solutions are rarely simple.

Btw, when did cancer stop being a disease and become (mostly) a choice?

Ok, rant over. Sorry Focus 27, not picking on YOU. Just what you wrote (which again, I've heard many times before).



Title: Re: How to beat the cancer with Self-Love
Post by Berserk2 on Jan 10th, 2012 at 5:12pm
Wayne Dyer sincrely but cruelly offers dangerous simplistic answers to bafflingly complex mysteries.  He reminds me of some healing evangelists of a bygone era who blamed the victims for their lack of real faith when they weren't healed.  Prayer, attitude, even diet can make a difference in our health.  But the impicit blame and resulting guilt felt by those for whom these tired bromides just don't work is cruel indeed.  Don't get me wrong: I have seen faith work miracles.  But even powerful faith must be exercised with a sense of mystery.  We must know what we don't know.   

Title: Re: How to beat the cancer with Self-Love
Post by Justin aka Vasya on Jan 11th, 2012 at 12:56pm
  Speaking as one whose beloved Mother died from cancer when he was still living in the family house:  Some of her poor lifestyle choices as far as crappy diet, lack of exercise, and smoking, no doubt did a number on her body and was part of what allowed cancer to develop within same.  This is not as a "judgment" against her, but rather a statement of fact--Like ever attracts and begets Like. 

   To be sure, eating as healthy as one can, CAN help with the healing of cancer and of most ills in many peoples cases, but there are other important variables besides diet.  Such as various environmental pollutions one may not even be aware of, attitude, stress,  some genetic predispotioning, etc

  No doubt in my Mom's case, a radically different and much healthier diet and general health lifestyle would have helped her greatly since she was a kind, loving, and positive minded person.  To some extent, she knew better as far as her health practices (or lackthereof) went, but had various outside pressures and stresses which made it hard for her to choose and apply more wisely. 

  To Rob:  Eating healthier is generally more expensive, but it doesn't HAVE to be about eating all organic or what not.  For example, take Lentils, even if i buy "organic" Lentils, i pay about 1.69 a POUND.  Lentils are one of the healthiest and fastest cooking legumes around.  Combine that with regular or organic Brown Rice which one can buy in bulk for anywhere from 1 dollar a POUND to 3 dollars a pound on average, and you have a very nice complete protein with plenty of nutrition otherwise.

  Those same Lentils (or grains, like Wheat), if you soak and sprout them, then become less a legume or grain food (starch and protein), but more of a healthy, living Vegetable source of food.  A good balance can be had by using both methods. 

  Those living near natural areas can also hunt and forage some.

  One can look for small local farms and see if some are willing to set up a barter with them.  Donate an hour or two of physical labor and get a couple of cartons of great tasting and healthier eggs. 

  There are ways, to some extent, around the issue of eating more healthy even when more poor.  Unfortunately, much of this doesn't apply to people in very impoverished nations in places like Africa, Center and South America, Haitii, China, etc

  But i suspect it may apply to you--especially for one who lives in New Hampshire. 

  Much of the above applies to me.  I make only 10.15 an hour and right now can only work part time (and i'm getting paid the same as when i use to work for the same place 4 yrs ago!).  I don't have much money to spend. 

  I well know the frustration of trying to eat and live a healthier life since this is a HUGE part of my path this time around due to karma and self neglect in other lives and physical necessity in this life (sure, i could suffer daily with the immensely uncomfortable and painful hives i use to many times a day in the past or have the blaring red and scaly psoriasis on my face...). 

  But you make it sound like it is impossible...

  What is apparent to me though, is the sad state of the matter that many people i've observed could eat and live much healither lifestyles than they do, but just don't want to put in the necessary work, research, discipline, and change necessary to do so.  I see this much more often than the really poor people who deeply desiire and work towards greater health on all levels of their Being. (i've met some of the latter, but they are a definite minority around me at least)

   Attitude and beliefs must change first in many cases.  One such limitation is having the belief or feeling of how impossible it is to eat and have a much healthier lifestyle.  As long as one holds that in the mind and heart, it WILL be impossible. 

  my rant concluded

 

Title: Re: How to beat the cancer with Self-Love
Post by Bardo on Jan 11th, 2012 at 4:00pm
Rob et al,
There is certainly a correlation between health and the ability to provide yourself with good quality food. This is well documented world-wide. It does not negate the value of eating well within your means, and of using ingenuity to maximize your food quality. Then there is the matter of time. Most folks who are working hard just to get by probably don't have time to barter for organic food.

Title: Re: How to beat the cancer with Self-Love
Post by Rob_Roy on Jan 12th, 2012 at 5:06pm
Justin,

"What is apparent to me though, is the sad state of the matter that many people i've observed could eat and live much healither lifestyles than they do, but just don't want to put in the necessary work, research, discipline, and change necessary to do so." 

Oh, so I don't eat organic because I'm lazy, ignorant, undisciplined, and unwilling to live on a diet of beans and rice. Nice. By the way, I live in a small town. To get to anywhere requires a lot of money for gas. The nearest egg farm is 20 miles away. The gas alone would make bartering for a couple dozen eggs a ridiculous cost proposition, assuming they would barter for labor which isn't likely for liability reasons. Not to mention someone else with equal zeal would object with the moral and spiritual claims of a vegan diet (with which I also sympathize).

I am quite aware of the benefits of an organic diet. It was the myopic ignorance of self-righteousness that my 'rant' was directed at. I didn't need a patronizing lecture about beans, rice and bartering, let alone how ignorant and lazy I am.

Rob

PS: I'm not at all offended. I'm just pushing back. I still luv ya  :)

Title: Re: How to beat the cancer with Self-Love
Post by DavidLay on Jan 13th, 2012 at 12:14am
I've learned some useful things from Wayne Dyer and he's helped me to be more open minded and more humble as well as see things around me from a different perspective although I still don't agree with everything he says and he sometimes does offer answers that are way too simple to be a full solution.

Title: Re: How to beat the cancer with Self-Love
Post by Lucy on Jan 13th, 2012 at 4:51am

Quote:
The best way to beat cancer is to eat 100% non processed, organic foods.


And this still doesn't line up with what Moorjani is saying about her cancer.

Title: Re: How to beat the cancer with Self-Love
Post by Justin aka Vasya on Jan 13th, 2012 at 11:21am
  Hi Rob,

  That line that you quoted from me was in no way directed to you personally and individually;  as far as this forum goes it was a very impersonal and generalized statement and if you quoted more of it it would have included a part of, "I've observed". and later "Those around me at least." which was referencing to my inphysical interactions with those physically around me. 

  For an example: I work in home with families, or rather their children.  It is frustrating especially for me when one is working with a child with moderate autism, whom you know his autistic symptoms could greatly be helped if he didn't have such a crappy, junk food filled diet but had a very healthy one with some added supplements. 

  The family involved, can afford to feed him better, but it is easier and more convenient to give him what he wants because he is unusually stubborn/fixed and the foods he likes are very quick and easy to prepare. 

  Re: you, well i don't know you all that well, but i do not have the sense of you being lazy or ignorant (quite the opposite really)--besides, you explained your situation some and i understand that it's unusually tough for you right now. 

  However, i do not agree with the defeatist attitude you so loudly projected in a public space about this issue.  When one asks for help from the purely Creative forces and does so with the intent to improve self as to have a better effect on the Whole--amazing things can and will happen. 

There are no "barriers" or limitations for such powerful and Source attuned forces, except our limiting mind sets and attitudes.  They can help us manifest much, that we might not be able to do on our own.  Heck, if we get ourselves spiritually intune enough, we can experience what Yeshua did, "I have food you don't know about." when asked why he wasn't eating physical food.    Not that this easy by any means--i'm just mentioning it as another possibility. 

  Anyways, i hope things work out for your spiritual best, whatever that entails. 

Title: Re: How to beat the cancer with Self-Love
Post by Justin aka Vasya on Jan 13th, 2012 at 11:53am

Lucy wrote on Jan 13th, 2012 at 4:51am:

Quote:
The best way to beat cancer is to eat 100% non processed, organic foods.


And this still doesn't line up with what Moorjani is saying about her cancer.


  I think it depends on the individual.  I met an older lady at a holistic health conference who had had cancer and she said she healed herself primarily by radically changing her diet--with a huge focus on raw veggies, green super food drinks, and fresh fruits. 

  With Anita it seemed like a more purely energetic/consciousness shift and opening up, which healed her physical body.

  In either case though, the Creative forces are involved and Like attracts and begets Like--Creative energies beget Creative energies. 

Title: Re: How to beat the cancer with Self-Love
Post by crossbow on Jan 14th, 2012 at 2:23am
That is an interesting interview with Anita Moorjani, Neno. I am pleased after watching it. I think the part where she says that she realised that the results of the medical tests she had already had would reflect which ever decision she took is interesting. I expect that will catch the attention of one or two quantum physicists.

Title: Re: How to beat the cancer with Self-Love
Post by Lucy on Jan 16th, 2012 at 7:49am
Interview with AM:

http://www.nderf.org/anita_m%27s_nde.htm

Title: Re: How to beat the cancer with Self-Love
Post by Lucy on Jan 17th, 2012 at 4:32am
I've been trying to find something that debunks AM but I haven't found anything. To debunk her would mean to demonstate that she wasn't dying and that the NDE was not associated with teh cancer reversal. Has anyone else seen anything?

The interview (previous post)has so many points from which one could start a conversation. HEre's one quote I like:

Quote:
Also, let me explain that there is a difference between “being loving” and “being love”.

Being loving means giving love to another whether you have any for yourself or not. It means giving what you yourself may or may not even have to give. This type of giving of love can eventually drain you, because we donąt always have a limitless supply. And then we look to the other to replenish our pool of love, and if it is not forthcoming, we stop being loving ourselves, because we are exhausted.

Being love, on the other hand, means loving myself unconditionally so that it overflows, and anyone and everyone around me just becomes an automatic recipient of my love. The more I love myself, the more it flows out to others. It almost feels like being a vessel for love to flow through. When I am being love, I donąt need people to behave a certain way in order for them to be a recipient of my love. They are automatically getting my love as a result of me loving myself. So to stop being love, to me, means to stop loving myself. Hence, I will not stop being love on account of another.


I have drained myself being loving without accomplishing much, just as she describes, and not practiced self-love enough.

This is one of he reasons it is important to me to call it PUL rather than just "love."

Self-love has been and still is one of my hardest lessons. I took all those Bible lessons about loving your neightbor seriously but always felt I had to reprimand myself. Changing that has been a slow process. I dd realize that if you love your neighbor as yourself and don't love yourself much, then maybe you wouldn't have to love your neighbor either!

In my early 20's I came across a book called The Heresy of Self-Love. Even the title contains a sharp lesson. It certainly alowed me to focus on the fact that nowhere in religious teaching had I come across anything about loving myself. I couldn't do it (love myself) but I became able to at least talk about it, to move from thinking self-love was narcissistic to seeing it is everything.

Another lesson came from of all places a pratitioner of Wicca, Starhawk, who wrote clearly about the self-hater in many people. She has a great quote in one of her books from ..Doris Lessing I think...that talks about that. Reading that was another profound realization of what I was doing to myself.

I realy think one of the functions of culture that keeps us from our higher self is to teach us to not love ourselves. I think organized religion also teaches that. It is one of the things that keeps us bound to culture (rather than enlightened). Anita makes it sound so simple. But I'm glad she is talking about it. This is a good distinction to make, between being loving and being love.

Title: Re: How to beat the cancer with Self-Love
Post by DocM on Jan 17th, 2012 at 4:59am
Hi Lucy,

This is interesting, but also a slippery slope.  Most of my experience leads me to believe that there is much misery that comes from ego-based thought and action.  Many living people get into all situations such as divorce, affairs, deceptive behavior, etc. for selfish purposes.  Now that is something different from true self love, but for some it is a fine distinction.

What you are saying does gel with my understanding of PUL.  It is my understanding that PUL is the very foundation of our being, whether we know it or not.  To the extent that we let love enter our thought and actions, we are loving.  To the extent that we block this foundation, we are estranged from love and unbalanced.

The most enlightened minds I've known think and act in a loving manner, without thought of self-advancement or recognition.  It simply is part of their nature.  If self-love includes this type of thought and action, then I think we are on the same page.  However, there comes a point where a truly loving person stops making the distinction between self and nonself; there is only one way to be.

If any of us harbor feelings of inadequacy and are self-judgemental, it does follow that we may block this natural flow of love.  But others can justify the notion of self love as acting for the gain of self at the expense of their fellow man/woman.


M

Title: Re: How to beat the cancer with Self-Love
Post by Rondele on Jan 17th, 2012 at 12:43pm
<<It is my understanding that PUL is the very foundation of our being, whether we know it or not.>>

Doc-

Exactly.  PUL is misunderstood by many folks.  They mistake it for an emotion, and think it's something they "have" as opposed to something they are.  It's not a commodity that they can send back and forth to each other.

PUL, as you say, is a state of being.  It's probably the very essence of Existence or God.  Or "All That Is." 

Someone once said PUL is what a new mother has for her newborn child.  No, not really.  She is feeling an emotion that to her is pure and unconditional.  Over time, however, because in her case it's an emotion, it will change. 

Genuine PUL, however, never changes.  It simply IS.

R


Title: Re: How to beat the cancer with Self-Love
Post by Lucy on Jan 17th, 2012 at 3:11pm
So, if you were trying to explain the difference between being selfish and being love to someone, in a practical way, how would you do it? For instance to a friend who was about to embark on an affair  she/he felt was good because it felt right "rhis is for me and I deserve this" (..not that anyone in that situation would be asking for advice! This is hypothetical of course) and full of love, how would you explain the difference? or pick an alternate but practical scenario. Can the difference be defined or must it be experienced?

I think telling people to love themselves is a good thing.  Being taught to turn the other cheeck is not part of your tradition, Matthew, and I don't know if you realize how destructive NOT teaching people to love themselves can be. Or maybe guys aren't tormented with this in the same way, becauase of the culture. Maybe women are more inclined to make doormats of themselves than guys are (not because of any innate difference but because of cultural conditioning).

So narcissism isn't the same as being love, but how does one describe the difference? Though it is interesting to note that one could focus on one's self without loving one's self.

Title: Re: How to beat the cancer with Self-Love
Post by crossbow on Jan 18th, 2012 at 12:29am


Love and the Heart Centre

Those who know the workings of the subtle bodies and can see and know the soul's centre's of consciousness can see that these centres of consciousness each possess their own energetic structure and dynamics.

And all the body's organs function exactly as reflections of the functions of the respective centres of consciousness of which each organ is associated.

And the design and function of every part of the human body reflects exactly the design and function of the same associated part within the soul and subtle bodies.

Some might wish to learn about the soul and its workings from the anatomy and function of the body. 

The workings of Blood and the Heart and their relation to the cells of the body are exact reflections of the workings of Love and the Heart Centre and their relation to the body of humanity.



Blood and the Heart:

Blood is life and health to every cell throughout the body. Blood carries everything that every cell requires. Blood gives, and blood takes away.

Blood must be in motion for the life it carries to pass to the cells of the body.

When blood is stationary or confined, it dies and turns toxic. 

Blood flows through the heart in only one direction, like an arrow.

The heart supplies blood to all cells in the body, except to itself. The heart does not, cannot, supply blood to itself.

There is a one-way valve at the exit of the heart, where the blood flows forth, called the aortic valve, and this valve ensures blood does not flow back into the heart.

When the heart contracts to pump forth blood to all the cells of the body, the aortic valve (which has three cusps) opens wide to accommodate the flow of blood, and in so doing the valve seals shut the arteries in the aorta which supply blood to the heart. The heart pumps forth life-blood to all other cells but does not take a single drop for itself.

After the heart has given forth its blood to all the body's cells, there is a back-pressure which closes the valve back to the heart and in so doing opens the entrances to the arteries that supply blood to the heart.

Only after the heart has supplied the body with its needed lifeblood does the heart receive blood for itself, and even then it does not pump that blood to itself as it does to all the other cells in the body, but rather, the blood comes around to nourish the heart by a natural design that is independent of the heart. A backpressure generated by the structure of the body's arterial system and by all the collective cells within the body causes blood to enter the coronary arteries and circulate around the heart and nourish the heart in preparation for its next exertion of giving lifeblood to the cells of the body. And then again, not by its own effort, but by natural systemic design, it will receive blood back for itself, but always only after it has given that same blood forth to other cells. 

The heart does not put itself last; it does not even consider itself at all; it just gives forth its lifeblood and leaves the greater system to provide its needs.  



 

Title: Re: How to beat the cancer with Self-Love
Post by Lucy on Jan 18th, 2012 at 3:15am
So, the heart can never be narcissistic, but it is always nourished.

Title: Re: How to beat the cancer with Self-Love
Post by Lights of Love on Jan 18th, 2012 at 12:30pm

Quote:
So narcissism isn't the same as being love, but how does one describe the difference?


Hi Lucy,

I'm not sure if this will answer your question or not, but hopefully it will shed some light on the subject.

I would agree that PUL is the very foundation of our being, the substance, the essence of what we are only in the sense that God alone is this underlying foundation or the ground of our very being that we call PUL.  This is what I have believed and have spoken of for many years.  Yet it seems as though, to our limited mind anyway, PUL is more as a guiding light.  Something that we are striving to evolve within our very being.  If PUL is a state of being, and I have thought it is, then there obviously are other states of being that exist as well.  In addition it seems as though there is an element of chaos that resides within our consciousness.  Or at least we can hypothesize this because of the way we express ourselves in our interactions with each other and the varying intents behind the expression.

Love is something that can only be given. I think it is correct to say that it is to the exact degree we are able to love and understand one's self, it is to that exact same degree we are able to love and understand others.  So the more we give love and understanding to our self, the more we are able to give love and understanding to others when interacting with them.  The deciding factor as to whether or not it is love being given resides in our intent.  The underlying motivation of our thought and action.  Is the intent love based or is it fear/ego based?  Discerning our intent, our motivation, is not always easy and the resulting outcome of an action does not always reflect one's intent accurately.  So how do we know we are growing spiritually?  How do we know we are evolving, rather than devolving?

If our capacity to love, to give, to exhibit humility and compassion in our daily interactions is significantly increasing, while our ego, fear and material attachments are significantly decreasing, we then can know that we are evolving, improving the quality of our internal being, our consciousness.

It seems to me that spiritual growth/evolving our consciousness (same thing) is directly related to and results from our innate ability (the guiding light within) to interact from loving intent.  It is not about how much we do, wear ourselves out in the service of others, it is about the reason, the incentive, the impetus that drives our thought and actions as we experience and interact with all that we perceive as external from us.   Real spiritual progress, real improvement in the quality of our consciousness must come from the inside, that which is internal.  This involves self love and understanding.  A part of self love involves the understanding of our true intent, our true motivations, as well as the assimilation, the integration of what we create in our lives through our interactions.   In other words, it is through our interactions with others that changes occur within our being, modifies what we are internally. 

We can unquestionably know that we are growing spiritually if we are truly knowledgeable in regards to our true intent, if we are kind, humble, compassionate, helpful, balanced and focused on what we can contribute to the well-being of others in our day to day interactions.  Others will also see our capacity to love, to give, to display compassion and humility.  A highly evolved individual sticks out from the crowd like a shining jewel.  These individuals are beloved and held in the highest esteem by everyone who meets them.  They have gentle and highly effective personal power that is fearless, egoless.  These individuals live gracefully in the face of the unknown because this is a simple and very natural process that occurs when there is an absence of fear within one's being.

If on the other hand our spiritual state is stagnate or of low quality, ego driven and our interactions with people are manipulative, and we are trying to impress them for material or ego ends, then we are failing in our efforts to grow spiritually and improve the quality of our being, even if we have convinced people otherwise, and thereby will have deluded one's self. 

Eventually we will have no difficulty telling the difference between real spiritual growth or delusions of spiritual growth about our self if (and that's a big if) one actually wants to know the truth.

Kathy

Title: Re: How to beat the cancer with Self-Love
Post by Volu on Jan 18th, 2012 at 1:57pm
You can certainly treat a person covered in blood and carrying an axe knocking on the door saying "Top of the morning to you, I'm here to give a slice-job" the same way that you treat the delivery guy. I'd say nope to the first, and yes to the second, as they both brought something to consider. Kind, humble, gentle, compassionate and helpful isn't the key to every situation (it might be later on in the progressing situation, or not) and certainly not balanced. Knowing one's evolving isn't reflected in how well and easily one bends over, while loving it.

What kind of service is it to anyone if you wear yourself out a.k.a give too much? Who's receiving too much? The complimentary muddy tones in the aura of too much isn't much of a beacon of light. Tending your own garden, and the flowers growing there, or that are supposed to grow there, doesn't make one service to self - it doesn't mean that's the only garden tended. Either THIS or either THAT, service to self or service to others, is polaric and pays homage and good fortune to the extremes of both sides.

Love can only be given - what the heck would be the point since no-one would be able to receive the given love?

Title: Re: How to beat the cancer with Self-Love
Post by Lights of Love on Jan 18th, 2012 at 3:21pm
Hi Volu,

It seems my words have been confusing, rather than helpful to you.  That was not my intent and I'm truly sorry.

I'm not quite sure I understand what you're saying.  Perhaps if you could ask more specific questions I could grasp your meaning better and try to improve on further explanation.

Certainly one can be the benefactor, on the receiving end, of someone's loving intent, however love in and of itself is something that can only be given.  Think of love as essence or substance that is radiated from a being.  Love in and of itself is a radiant substance. In this way it is PUL (the guiding light within).  To the degree an individual is able to radiate love, the purity, the clarity of it, is dependent upon a number of factors such as if one has cross-purposes within their intent.

Kathy

Title: Re: How to beat the cancer with Self-Love
Post by Justin aka Vasya on Jan 19th, 2012 at 10:34am
  Hi Kathy, I really enjoyed and agreed with a lot of your well thought out and written post.  Much of it resonated very deeply and strongly.

  Just want to point out one thing, which i think may be important for the larger public and especially for any "He/She" type aspirants:

Kathy wrote,
Quote:
"A highly evolved individual sticks out from the crowd like a shining jewel.  These individuals are beloved and held in the highest esteem by everyone who meets them.


   I wish the above was true--it would be really nice if it were, but history time and time again shows quite the opposite.  Many of the most "highly evolved" individuals that came here were killed, put in jail, or at the very least shunned and mistreated by the majority around them while they were still inphysical and interacting inphysically with many people. 

  The list is quite long, those like Jesus, Dr. Martin Luther King Jr, and to lesser extents those like Gandhi and even John Lennon (though probably not in the same category as some of these men) are just a few well known ones for some example.

  I mention this because it strongly lays out/examples an important energetic and consciousness law which some have called "Like attracts and begets Like"  very, very well. 

  If Like attracts and begets Like, then unLike repels and often dislikes unLike, and especially the slower vibration patterns towards the faster vibration patterns. 

Highly evolved people, especially the most, are very, very, very fast vibratory in nature.   Many in this particular world are not.  The more an individual has cut off connections to their own Sourceness and internal PUL awareness, the more they will tend to react in powerfully negative ways and in increasing proportion to the opposite in another. 

  This is why quite a number of people saw so much red in relation to Jesus and quite irrationally so.  He simply enraged them.  He was so unbelievably evolved, and he was interacting with some rather shut down folks, and all they could think of is, "we need to get rid of this guy, and the sooner, the better." 

  Many other less so, but still unusually mature folks are often just not well accepted or tolerated by many of those around them--especially if they are trying to institute any kind of transformative change and in any case they tend to act as at least unconscious automatic initiators or influencer's of change around them. 

Or more personally speaking, i went through a brief period wherein my "lower self" so called was more in control than my higher self, and i reacted negatively to your, at the time, more fast vibratory patterns than my own. 

With Love

Title: Re: How to beat the cancer with Self-Love
Post by Justin aka Vasya on Jan 19th, 2012 at 10:41am
  Quick p.s. relating to my last reply.  It is usually the moderately evolved/intune folks who tend to garner the most positive reactions and feelings from the majority around them.  This is because there isn't quite the difference in "vibes" with the other or either extremes, and there are more of those who are near that themselves, and Like attracts, begets, and often likes Like on the deeper mental level of existence within the physical and much of the nonphysical.

Title: Re: How to beat the cancer with Self-Love
Post by Lights of Love on Jan 19th, 2012 at 1:16pm

Quote:
Kathy wrote, Quote:

"A highly evolved individual sticks out from the crowd like a shining jewel.  These individuals are beloved and held in the highest esteem by everyone who meets them."

Justin wrote, Quote:
   "I wish the above was true--it would be really nice if it were, but history time and time again shows quite the opposite.  Many of the most "highly evolved" individuals that came here were killed, put in jail, or at the very least shunned and mistreated by the majority around them while they were still inphysical and interacting inphysically with many people." 

Hi Justin,

Yes, you are correct.  I should probably amend my statement to say most everyone.  If someone has never experienced significant progress in their spiritual development they may have no clue.  It is extremely difficult for anyone to understand in a deep, profound and personal way without having had similar experiences of his or her own. 

I do think most, if not all people can easily recognize a highly evolved individual though.  How they respond or interact with that person is more of a reflection of their own quality of consciousness.  If they respond negatively, it is because they are harboring fear.  Using your example of Jesus, perhaps the negative treatment was a result of their ability to see his amazing personal power and they were afraid of the effect it would have on their own positions in life.  Hence they sought to destroy him.

Much love to you, too.
Kathy

Title: Re: How to beat the cancer with Self-Love
Post by Volu on Jan 19th, 2012 at 2:22pm
Kathy,
"I do think most, if not all people can easily recognize a highly evolved individual though.  How they respond or interact with that person is more of a reflection of their own quality of consciousness.  If they respond negatively, it is because they are harboring fear."

The same can be said about any guru or anyone we like/love/adore, and as a follower: protect his or her position as an authority and at the same time one's own ties to the individual. Someone respond with reason to her or his words, as followers, dub it 'negatively', and then say they're merely harboring fear.

Title: Re: How to beat the cancer with Self-Love
Post by Lights of Love on Jan 19th, 2012 at 4:02pm
Hi Volu,

Yes, I think I understand what you are saying.  All gurus, teachers, humans don't always have good intent.  Sometimes they have a mixture part good and part no so good.  And other times their intent is fear based.  Would you agree?

Kathy

Title: Re: How to beat the cancer with Self-Love
Post by Lights of Love on Jan 20th, 2012 at 1:39pm
I happen think this morning that there may be some confusion about someone's intent or motivation behind an action and the ending result. 

Take for example a woman in the news recently who shot and killed a man that had broken into her home.  Even though a man, the intruder ended up dead because the woman shot him does not mean her intent was wrong.  Her intent was to protect her child and herself from someone that clearly intended harm.  She had right, and yes, loving intent, even though she killed a man. 

K

Title: Re: How to beat the cancer with Self-Love
Post by crossbow on Jan 20th, 2012 at 1:43pm
Maybe she just hated home intruders.

Title: Re: How to beat the cancer with Self-Love
Post by Lights of Love on Jan 20th, 2012 at 2:08pm

crossbow wrote on Jan 20th, 2012 at 1:43pm:
Maybe she just hated home intruders.

Crossbow, the few posts I've read of yours seemed to be full of wisdom, however, this comment is a mystery to me. 

Anyone protecting their child from harm is doing so out of love, not hatred.

Title: Re: How to beat the cancer with Self-Love
Post by crossbow on Jan 20th, 2012 at 3:23pm

Lights of Love wrote on Jan 20th, 2012 at 2:08pm:

crossbow wrote on Jan 20th, 2012 at 1:43pm:
Maybe she just hated home intruders.

Crossbow, the few posts I've read of yours seemed to be full of wisdom, however, this comment is a mystery to me. 

Anyone protecting their child from harm is doing so out of love, not hatred.

Maybe it was love, or maybe it was fear, instinct, curiosity, protectiveness, opportunism, panic, desire, a sense of indignation, hatred, practicality, or other, or probably most likely a combination of some sort. I don't know what her motivating state was. But I do know the range of human motivations is infinitely wide. And I know I've often been wrong when I've assumed what is or was going on inside another. And I've done things that others have told me I did out of love, spiritual calling, self sacrifice, selfishness, etc, when in fact I did them out of sense of adventure and curiosity, sometimes just because I wanted to or because I liked it. When I don't know what a person's motivating state is or was, then I prefer to use the words maybe or perhaps while allowing for all possibilities. I find that wide angle view and receptiveness to all possibilities without preference is part of what enables me to know the truth, when I am able to know it.       

Title: Re: How to beat the cancer with Self-Love
Post by Lights of Love on Jan 20th, 2012 at 5:06pm
Yes, Crossbow, now I understand what you are saying.  Evaluating others true intent is often difficult if not impossible much of the time.  As mentioned earlier in this thread we do often have cross-purposes within our intent. 

Intent can also be seen from two different perspectives: one from the greater consciousness system perspective and the other from a human perspective.

The purpose of my example was to try to show that sometimes one can have good, loving, and right intent even though the outcome (a dead man in my example) is not what someone might expect to occur even though a person's intent was good, loving and right. 

Kathy

Title: Re: How to beat the cancer with Self-Love
Post by crossbow on Jan 21st, 2012 at 5:12am
Yes, we're tricky animals us humans.

Title: Re: How to beat the cancer with Self-Love
Post by Lucy on Jan 21st, 2012 at 5:38am
I think you are referring to the incident in which a young (18 yr old) mother, whose husband had just died of cancer , was home alone with her relatively new baby, and two guys, one who may have been stalking her, started to forcefully break into her home,  and she was on the phone to the rescue services or police, she shot the intruder as he came through the door, which btw is legal in the state she lives in, and killed him.

I think I probably would have done the same thing. But this is not PUL. So maybe this is why we say "PUL" instead of the more generic "love." and I'm not sure what she was feeling, and culturally we talk about a mom's fierce protective love, but I think it is fear-based. Then too, animals do something similar, sometimes fighting to the death to defend their young, or sacrificing themselves in other ways; is that love? Of course, even if the baby wasn't there, she could have shot the guy.

I think, getting back to the original post, that this Anita Moorjani story is really incredible. If it is well-documented, what can people like Randi possibly say? That may be a big "if." I am waiting for the debunkers to come out of the woodwork. Otherwise, this is one of the most astounding events of recent years brought to public attention (I bet there are many private ones).

Of course, here  one is preaching to the choir. Or is one? If this really happened, then what does that change in our thinking? Like, what does that say about all our so called medical knowledge? What does it say about underlying reality?

I think it means we got it all wrong in medical science, but saying why medical science looks successful when it is really an illusion is the difficult part. Do we believe our illusions so completely that we cannot let go of them when something this clear comes along and throws everything into question?

And I also wonder, if I got myself into a situation where some creep was breaking down the door to do me harm, if I could move to a state of accepting my magnificence and enter a state of self-PUL, what would happen? or would I even care?

Title: Re: How to beat the cancer with Self-Love
Post by Lights of Love on Jan 22nd, 2012 at 12:55pm

Quote:
Do we believe our illusions so completely that we cannot let go of them when something this clear comes along and throws everything into question?


I think we do try to hold onto what is familiar especially when we don't understand something or are afraid of change. 


Quote:
And I also wonder, if I got myself into a situation where some creep was breaking down the door to do me harm, if I could move to a state of accepting my magnificence and enter a state of self-PUL, what would happen? or would I even care?


Many times when a person is confronted with a potentially traumatic or dangerous situation a profound presence of mind comes over them where they feel extremely calm and peaceful, along with an unusually high degree of clarity of mind and awareness.  There is little or no thinking along with little or no emotion and any action one is able to take in the situation is accomplished through that calm, peaceful heightened awareness.  This awareness, this alertness is similar to Anita Moorjani's description of the awareness she had with the exception that the focus of the awareness during a tramatic event is grounded in the corporal situation at hand.

What we seem to forget when discussing these things is that we are not in any way or at any time separate from our total self.  Usually when we think about something happening to us we scare ourselves beyond belief both before and after such an event takes place, yet many times during a traumatic or dangerous event our sense of the totality of our being is clearly present.

Kathy

Title: Re: How to beat the cancer with Self-Love
Post by spooky2 on Jan 22nd, 2012 at 9:30pm
"Love your neighbour as you love yourself".
Yes, I've often heard comments on that saying that one needs to be able to love oneself, only then he/she can love others. Of course this is not wrong, but is this interpretation really helpful?
   I think a more rich and rewarding interpretation would be to see it as a hint to a new perception. Not to perceive anymore two "loves", one for oneself, one for the others, but to realize the identity of both. That would be true PUL, in my opinion. This would require indeed the elimination of the ego, but when I see how "ego" is understood commonly, I'd say we must go farther to reach this ideal. We must truely become aware what we mean when we say "I", and what it really is- or not is.

Spooky

Title: Re: How to beat the cancer with Self-Love
Post by crossbow on Jan 23rd, 2012 at 12:05am
There are many selfish power loving people who like to control others, who even hate others but pretend to be loving. They like to look innocent and caring while implying that those who think differently to them are not. They are the crowd pushing the creeping restrictions and bans across our societies; who force and pressure others to speak and think like themselves and to comply with their narrow socio-political ideology or else be labelled with one of their overused put-downs. They use empty buzzwords like diversity, multiculturalism, compassion, tolerance, equality, but these words are only the tools they use for controlling others and falsely elevating their selves. They portray themselves as the virtuous ones, the caring ones, the good people, but they are the worst of the hypocrites. They really only care about their own image being elevated in comparison to others image. They cannot truly elevate themselves because they reject the very basics of how to do so. They cannot face things as they are, so truth cannot be seen by them. They reject individual responsibility and accountability, so freewill and its potential to learn and grow is not realised by them. Their consideration-for-others is self serving for them, so love remains a mystery to them. They have many false sayings which on their surface sound nice and idealistic, but underneath are used as justifications for getting their selfish ways. One of their many sayings which they use for ill-intent is, "You must love your self before you can love others".



Title: Re: How to beat the cancer with Self-Love
Post by Lucy on Jan 23rd, 2012 at 12:06pm
Yes but Crossbow, I really DO believe that you must love yourself before you can love others. You are not loving others unless you are loving yourself. I think Spooky has a good take on this. (btw, like the new pic Spooky!)

this is not an intellectual argument from me, though you guys do get lots of those. This is from hard core experience.

The difficult part is saying what self-love is, what loving yourself is.

Hving a good grip on what "Love God with all your heart with all your soul with all your might" means...because you are a little piece of God...a chip off the old block, so to speak.

MAybe PUL is a new dimension..not an extension of what we call "love."

That is what those rare fleeting moments of grace and peace have taught me.

Crossbow, at the same time I don't disagree with your admonition to be careful...I always think of the portrayal of Cardinal Richelieu in the movie The Three Musketeers as the embodiment of that diabolically based message. I don't know if the real guy was that ...nasty, I'm just referring to the movie character.


Title: Re: How to beat the cancer with Self-Love
Post by Volu on Jan 23rd, 2012 at 12:34pm
When you meet a lovely, fantastic being, it's natural to smile and want to be near that someone. But life has a way needing focus elsewhere too, so please forgive me mirror, but I'll soon be back with you.

The higher self is the ultimate killer whom pulls the plug when time is up, sorry poor life style to steal your thunder. When you know the time here is circling the drain it's also a possibility for a life review and a window of opportunity to do some actions you otherwise wouldn't do before suddenly dropping dead.

Title: Re: How to beat the cancer with Self-Love
Post by Rondele on Jan 23rd, 2012 at 2:53pm
<<They use empty buzzwords like diversity, multiculturalism, compassion, tolerance, equality, but these words are only the tools they use for controlling others and falsely elevating their selves.>>

Crossbow- These people, by the way, are the very same people who have pushed their "self esteem" agenda to the absurdity that every child gets a trophy regardless of performance.  And increasingly, grades are no longer given out in order not to make anyone feel bad.

I realize this is off topic, but your point is so well taken I couldn't resist.

R

Title: Re: How to beat the cancer with Self-Love
Post by Lights of Love on Jan 23rd, 2012 at 5:02pm

Quote:
The difficult part is saying what self-love is, what loving yourself is.


Yes, it can be difficult not only to describe what self-love is, but also to actually do it.  Sometimes people are filled with such self-hatred they don't even know where to begin the process of self-love.

To me self-love from a human perspective is essentially taking the responsibility to meet your own needs.  On a physical level this means taking care of your needs on a bodily level; eating healthy food in the right amounts, exercising regularly, enjoying physical activities such sleeping, eating, sex, etc.

From an emotional standpoint, one needs to learn to develop a positive, understanding emotional relationship with one's self.  This is where it usually gets more difficult since most of us are unwilling to completely accept ourselves the way we are.  For example, feeling guilty for all intents and purposes is non-productive.  Feeling guilty is essentially rejecting the state we are in, indicating that we are unwilling to accept ourselves the way we are in the moment.  If we are feeling guilty for something we have either done or not done, then we are either procrastinating about doing something to rectify it, or we are still processing it, or we have made the choice to punish ourselves with guilt feelings because our actions did not express our integrity.

Many times it is far easier to feel guilty for something than it is to take the necessary action to maintain our integrity.  We fear whatever it is we must do.  It is easier to feel guilty than to face our fear, so here our guilt suppresses our fear, however that leads to self-rejection.  And we choose self-rejection over fear.

It might sound ridiculous to someone who has not felt self-hatred or to someone who's in denial, but I think it is more than likely that the most epidemic health problem we have is self-hatred.  Whenever you get to know anyone deeply, you will most likely see that inside that person there is a kernel of self-hatred inside them that runs very deep.  Most of the time we use the term low self-esteem and inside each person resides a constant and ongoing struggle for self-esteem that covers up the self-hatred.  We tend to measure ourselves based on a set of standards we learned in childhood. 

We may not be conscious of it, but we try to prove our self worth to others and it shows in our behavior, both by overachieving and underachieving.  We base our self-worth on what we expect of ourselves, many times demanding perfection from ourselves.  Then when we don't achieve perfection we judge and reject ourselves.  And when we do meet our own expectations, instead of acknowledging our accomplishment, allowing ourselves to feel satisfaction, we many times ignore and devalue it.  It's no wonder why there are people who don't even try to accomplish anything.  Like a vicious circle, they see the folly in the whole thing and simply refuse to participate.  Unfortunately, they destroy their spirit, their life energy, their creativity and sometimes their bodies in the process.

The bottom line is to cultivate self-acceptance.  Acceptance does not mean surrender.  It means to deeply trust, love and accept our lives and ourselves no matter what.  It means to really get to know our inner being, communing with it, identifying with it, and finding its divinity or finding God within the very core of our being. It means to live gracefully in the face of whatever life brings our way. Many have no idea how freeing taking out the emotional trash can be. 

Kathy

Title: Re: How to beat the cancer with Self-Love
Post by spooky2 on Jan 25th, 2012 at 9:11pm
Kathy gave a description of how we can drive ourselves mad, and how we can live healthily.

There is but one thing which to me seems not yet enough mentioned:
   "Self Love" implies that each of us is dissociated into at least two parts: One that loves, the other which is loved. This is nothing special, we can pat ourselves on our shoulders, and we can even accuse ourselves, as if we were two persons in one. This means, we are not like a thing, which we can point at, and it is it and that was it. The demand to love ourself insofar should make us think about what all these terms do mean alltogether.

Less theoretically, and more practically, I say about "Self Love":
-- Don't take yourself too seriously
-- After that, take the rests of yourself very seriously and analyze them, what they are
-- After that, focus on the in-between of your viewpoint and what you see as others' viewpoints.
-- After that, drop the past, drop the future, and appreciate the present. At that point, "self love" is something you can smile about. As this self has melted into the ocean of acceptance and necessity.
-- Finally, "Self-Love" turns out to be the same as "Love For Others".

  There is either love or no love: When you direct love to someone or something, you are yourself loved, when you don't love someone or something, you are, at that moment, yourself not loved, as you block it off. This is the trouble with our consciousness.


Spooky

Title: Re: How to beat the cancer with Self-Love
Post by crossbow on Jan 26th, 2012 at 2:23am
Self-love mantra, chanted throughout the new-age movement and the feminist movement: You must love yourself before you can love others. And look how that self-love gets described and exampled - tend to your own needs, eat well, give time to yourself, do something to make you feel good, accept yourself, etc. Come on, criminals and sociopaths do that. Who is leading the way?

The feel-good self-love trend has been socially popular in the English speaking democracies and western Europe for several decades now. It is being pushed essentially by one powerful social movement, and through several fields. The self-love concept is a privelage of affluent societies that were built by previous generations of men and women who did not practice self-love, but practiced real love and self sacrifice.   

If everyone in the English speaking democracies become practicing self-lovers, with every individual living by the code that they must each "love their self before they can love others", and according to their self indulgent philosophy, tending to their own needs before attending to others, then I doubt their countries would last a few weeks before collapse. Maybe we don't need everyone to take up self-loving for that catastrophy to happen, maybe we only need a certain threshold of practitioners of self-love to tip the balance. Maybe that threshold is already tipping.

Its not the feel-good self-lovers who are daily risking their lives and being regularly injured and gradually broken down from working in heavy construction, working in foundries, mines, sewage works, driving trucks long hours for years until they die before retirement from years of sleep deprivation, guarding prisoners, fighting fires, arresting criminals, holding back those millions of enemies who with yellow-green red streaked envy are determined to destroy advancement. Fortunately, for the time being at least, there are just enough people still practicing true love, and self sacrifice, who are out their holding our countries together.

Where are the self-lovers? They are in cosy safe places practicing their feel-good self-love and preaching self-love to other feel-good junkies who hold their desire to feel good as their first priority. 

Am I just stirring the possum here? playing devil's advocate?
No. I feel pretty strongly about it. I am more than sure that love is not self-love. I am 100% certain, in belief, knowledge and experience, but I can't prove it, that love is about concern for others, love for others, working for others, helping others.      
 

Title: Re: How to beat the cancer with Self-Love
Post by Lucy on Jan 26th, 2012 at 5:29am
I'd prefer just to stick with the idea expressed in the Moorjani interview, the idea of being love. If someone wants to call that self-love that may be the best they understand.

Title: Re: How to beat the cancer with Self-Love
Post by DocM on Jan 26th, 2012 at 7:24am
In the past, I found it difficult to understand the Eastern concept of becoming one with the universe.  Individuality was not something I was keen to give up.  But this is common for most of us.  It took a while, but over time, I have come to realize that people who act out of love, or open themselves up to love, really do act without regard to thought of self.  Yet, amazingly, they do not lose their individuality in becoming love-realized!  They simply have come to such a deep understanding, they have synced their thoughts and actions, that they must love thy neighbor as thyself - for it is the only way to be.

Swedenborg recounts conversations with angels (deceased humans).  He emphasizes that they are astounded on hearing how people actually think that all of their actions on earth come merely from their own volition.  Swedenborg is told that God is really the force of love and life which flows into everyone.  Angels do not like being complimented, it seems - getting quite flustered in taking credit for their actions as individuals.  They feel the force of love, and allow it to flow throw them, and point to this as the "cause" and not them as individuals.  They think it daft that anyone one would take credit or individual pride for being in tune with this force of love.  They claim they seek no individual recognition separate from God, but that they are one with and a part of the process.  This is what is meant to love the lord with "all your heart, all your soul and all your might" (from the Old Testament).  This is why Swedenborg states that the two greatest imperatives in heaven is love of God and love of your neighbor.

So from what I gather, while we do continue to exist as individuals, developing and exploring, the personal enlightenment that comes with following the path of love, leads to tuning in to the force of love, and in turn to thoughts and actions which are not based on ego, but what we call selfless.  Yet losing ego-based thoughts does not really stop us from being who we are - we simply fulfill our potential.

M

Title: Re: How to beat the cancer with Self-Love
Post by Lights of Love on Jan 26th, 2012 at 12:48pm
Crossbow,

Absolutely love is about as you say "concern for others, love for others, working for others, helping others."  What you appear to not understand is that the best thing anyone can do to help others and to grow spiritually... become, be love as Spooky, Lucy and others have mentioned, is to change the quality of your own being, change the quality of your own consciousness.  One does that by releasing, letting go of fear and ego.  Self-improvement is what everyone's job is.  The only one you can change is yourself.  That is why each of us is here.  By changing the quality of our self, we thereby, change the quality of the whole.  It's not about what you DO, it is about what you ARE.

Regardless of what you DO... serving your country, digging ditches, guarding prisoners, fighting fires, performing surgery, counseling patients, mopping floors, running a bank, donating food, providing shelter, etc., etc., etc... If your intent is not coming from a place of love, you are not love.  It isn't about doing, it is about the intent from which the action comes that changes our being either for better or worse.

Kathy

Title: Re: How to beat the cancer with Self-Love
Post by Volu on Jan 26th, 2012 at 1:17pm
Crossbow,
"Self-love mantra, chanted throughout the new-age movement and the feminist movement: You must love yourself before you can love others. And look how that self-love gets described and exampled - tend to your own needs, eat well, give time to yourself, do something to make you feel good, accept yourself, etc. Come on, criminals and sociopaths do that. Who is leading the way?"

The general new age movement in my eyes subscribe to the very idea you present, others are the bullseye. Criminals and sociopaths are catering more to the body than being the spark that animates the limbs, or temple as some say. Greed. Progress is steps forward done by one's self and with (the help of) others, they're not mutually exclusive. As incarnations we're not islands, fortunately. Sheep whom should be afraid of the upstream neither, fortunately. The idea that everybody goes around brooming everyone's door but one's own rings alien to my ears.

I've never felt love for my self as I've felt for others, not by a longshot, which is fine because the image of bowing to the mirror is very silly. Though making friends with one's layers of self as well as with others will make the road easier.

"Its not the feel-good self-lovers who are daily risking their lives and being regularly injured and gradually broken down from working in heavy construction, working in foundries, mines, sewage works, driving trucks long hours for years until they die before retirement from years of sleep deprivation, guarding prisoners, fighting fires, arresting criminals, holding back those millions of enemies who with yellow-green red streaked envy are determined to destroy advancement."

Another aspect is jobs to bring home the moolah - lamps rather than fountains of light. The yellow-geen envy is similar to the goodie-two-shoes who think  mediums and other forms of psychics, authors and what not, are their servants - they should have concern for them, love for them, working for them, helping them. For free of course.

Title: Re: How to beat the cancer with Self-Love
Post by crossbow on Jan 27th, 2012 at 2:04am
Thanks for debate Ladies and Gents. Your comments reveal what I should say. I hadn't said it above because I thought the above post on the function of heart and blood had made it clear. Also I didn't want to repeat myself from old posts, such as the one on the Forgiveness thread and others, but I will anyway. This will be rushed and messy typing as I have not much time. Please excuse mess/sloppy layout.

Definitions:
Love is the hearfelt wish that others learn and grow with minimum suffering.

Forgiveness is love regardless.

Help is what we do in light of love.

Descriptions:
Love has nothing to do with loving oneself. Accepting oneself, coming to terms with oneself, being thankful for what one is and has, respecting the equipment/tools/layers/bodies that have been given to us to work through, are all good and right to do. But these things are not love. We must discern.
Love originates in God.
Love is the wish of God for life.
Love flows from the heart of God, and outward to all life. 

We tune ourselves with love. We do this by aligning our will with will of love, our heartfelt wish with the wish of love, which is God's wish for life, that suffering be minimal as life proceeds with its purpose.
Man and woman's purpose is to learn and grow and find our truest self. And suffering is inevitable along the way.
God sends forth man to find himself but not into suffering with no way out, or with no comfort, or with no light. God sends his wish, which is the light and warmth of love.

We can tune ourself with love, by wishing in our heart a heartfelt wish for others to learn and grow with minimum of suffering, and love will flow into our tuned heart from in the top and rear, then flow forth out the front.
But love only flows through the heart when we open up the heart to give love forth to others.
Like the ancient symbolic arrow through the heart, love moves in only one direction.

Love flows only outward from the heart, not back upon itself.
And when the heart is opened up and love flows out to others, its radiance fills our self as well.
But that radiance of love cannot be in us before we give love forth, for love must be in flow for it to be active, otherwise it is inactive.

Our soul is like a tap, and love is like water that may flow out of the tap.
Water only flows through the tap after the tap has opened itself to give forth flow.
Before the tap has open up to give forth flow, there is no flow.
Love is a current; when love moves it exists, when it doesn't move, there is nothing there.

Liking yourself is one thing, love is another. Love is not like or dislike. These things are irrelevant to love.

Acceptance is facing something as it is; and self acceptance is facing our self as we are, is coming to terms with our self. Acceptance enables us to come to terms with things and rightly deal with them. To see them as they are, without exaggeration or diminishment. Acceptance enables us to deal with reality, not with illusions. acceptance sees the truth.
Acceptance is necessary and good, but acceptance is not love.
We must discern differences.

Love is not a human thing. It is Divine; is of God. We tune with it, we enable it to come through us, we make it move, only by giving it away. When we give love forth then love has motion, it has current, it comes to life, and from its motion comes its radiance.

Love is a living thing, not dead, not stationary. It lives and moves and has its own consciousness, its own will, its own intelligence, its own purpose. Our heart must tune accordingly if we would have love flow through our heart.

Love's flow is only ever outward. From its beginning in the heart of God, its flow has only ever been outward. God does not love himself. He does not wish well for himself. He wishes well for life; his wish, his love, flows out to others, not himself.

We can face our self just as we are, accept we are just what we are, and take our self in prayer to God. And we can present our self to God just as we. This is repentance. Repentance is taking our self-honesty to God. And with our self-honesty we take our request for love from God; for love regardless. God's love is love regardless, he will forgives. and our honesty before him is transparency before him, makes us transparent and receptive to his love regardless. We can breathe in his love, his forgiveness, we can breath it into our soul and into our heart. But we must breathe it out again, not back to God, but breathe it out to others. Just like the tap with water flowing in and through and out, so too love flows from God through us to others.

God does not send his love down dead end channels. Only opened hearts recieve and give forth love.

When we stop giving love to others, then love is not in us. Full stop.
"Loving self before you can love others", is a false teaching; a counterfeit; is a deluded trendy fantasy; it is not love. 

Love is not stationary and does not flow back upon itself.

Love is in flow, and flows only outward.

Love is not a still pool, like a pool of water; it is a current, like a stream.

To receive it, to be in love's stream, we must attune with it, attune with its will, its wish for others, its purpose, its nature. Open up and provide our self as access for love to flow to others. Then love flows through su to others and fills us as it passes through.






   



Title: Re: How to beat the cancer with Self-Love
Post by Justin aka Vasya on Jan 27th, 2012 at 11:41am
  Sort of related to what Crossbow has said.  It's important to love self, but to not place too much emphasis on that, but more emphasis on loving others. 

  We live in a reciprocal reality, both in the "physical" and the "nonphysical", and the underlying law in both says, we get what we give out to others, or aka Like attracts and begets Like. 

   In order to more completely love self and be more truly happy, you must first love and give out to others.  Once the process is truly started, it sets up an automatic looping effect.  Some think they are being loving or giving to others, but if there is complaint or long facedness involved, too often it's really more about self, a certain image or attachment to same, a need to feel better about self, etc.

  Here's an interesting tendency about the genders relating to love.  Men at first tend to have a harder time with loving others/self, and arguably there are less men out there open to this than there are women.  Women seem innately to have an easier time opening to love then men.

  But an interesting thing often happens when a man comes upon the importance of loving and really starts this process.  Often, the man gives himself more fully over to love than the woman and becomes a more pure and radiant conduit of Love. 

This is why so many "World Teacher" types have been born in male bodies, because at first it's more challenging, but later there is more intensity and focus. 

  All the above is only speaking as tendency and in general and averages.  It doesn't, and won't apply to some individuals, and eventually we all start to transcend gender via PUL.  (Monroe's "He/She" is a good example of the latter).

  Re: PUL in general, i find it is both a Yin/receptive process of opening up to it, and yet at the same time it is also a Yang/active process of actively choosing, doing, willing, etc.   Again, speaking on tendencies, generals and averages, it's only natural that more women over emphasize the Yin, receptive, opening up part, and more men over emphasize the Yang, active part for what does "female" mean, and what does "male" mean?

  But without both, there cannot be a perfect circulation and conduit of PUL set up within an individual.   

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