Are there any non-TMI trained teachers that have come to the same or similar conclusions about non-physical reality as Monroe, Moen, Campbell et al? It seems like every time I find what appears to be a credible source for information and experience-based guidance, it turns out to have eminated from TMI. It gives me the impression that Bob Monroe was the first and only explorer to be able to teach the process. If this is true, then the number of people actually doing this must be very small, and the number of retrievals far outnumbered by the number of souls awaiting the train home...

Bardo wrote on Nov 24^th, 2010 at 11:35am:

Are there any non-TMI trained teachers that have come to the same or similar conclusions about non-physical reality as Monroe, Moen, Campbell et al? It seems like every time I find what appears to be a credible source for information and experience-based guidance, it turns out to have eminated from TMI. It gives me the impression that Bob Monroe was the first and only explorer to be able to teach the process. If this is true, then the number of people actually doing this must be very small, and the number of retrievals far outnumbered by the number of souls awaiting the train home...

Hi Bardo: I don't have a definitive answer on this but, Monroe is the first to have a tool hemi-sync which allows a relatively quick entry without drugs into an effective and functional altered state... (read Michael Largo's 'God's Lunatic' to get an idea how loony it could get) he and Moen are also the only ones I have encountered who got the Big picture right fundamentally... there is a long way to go as far as answers go... but we now have the tools and the structural map of the non-physical in hand with a coherent intellectual grasp that was not there before monroe... the Tibetans had (maybe they still do) a highly ritualized retrieval procedure that operates like Moen's -  Heliana experience...

S.

I have a book called "Der Sphärenwanderer" by Herbert C. Engel, which is allegedly written after notes which were made before Monroe became known. It's in German, I couldn't find out anything about the author. There are much similarities to Monroe's findings; mainly regarding the belief system territories.

As well, there's Robert James Lees' double-book "The Gates of Heaven" and "The Life Elysian" which may sound fantastic at times, but I think it's more than fantasy, despite his claim to have received this book from an afterlife-soul.

Then there's Muldoon.

There are other OBEers who wrote books in which they mention for example they first thought they're getting mentally ill, and then came across Monroe's first book, and found they're not alone in what they experienced.

Spooky

Bardo ur right, we here all nutz

CharleyTuna wrote on Nov 26^th, 2010 at 9:10pm:

Bardo ur right, we here all nutz

But we are lovable nutz.

:-*

I am not suggesting that you or we are nuts. I am just really surprised and fascinated by how 'young" this approach is. Further, I am not casting doubt on anything that is being said here, as I know that we can only experience it for ourselves. I do, however, feel like a bit of a pioneer among you more "experienced" explorers, realizing that few, really, have gone down this path so far.

Bardo wrote on Nov 27^th, 2010 at 9:23am:

I am not suggesting that you or we are nuts. I am just really surprised and fascinated by how 'young" this approach is. Further, I am not casting doubt on anything that is being said here, as I know that we can only experience it for ourselves. I do, however, feel like a bit of a pioneer among you more "experienced" explorers, realizing that few, really, have gone down this path so far.

Hey Bardo: Have you read Micheal Largo's God's Lunatics?

S.

S.,
No, but I have heard much about it here. It sounds intriguing.

Haven't there always been ancient traditions on earth where highly trained individuals, mostly spiritual leaders, have experimented with the non-physical body?  Actually, I even remember Robert Monroe referring to that fact at the very beginning of Journeys.  And then there was Don Juan from Carlos Casteneda.  Surely there are hundreds of examples going way back!

Calypso wrote on Nov 29^th, 2010 at 3:03pm:

Haven't there always been ancient traditions on earth where highly trained individuals, mostly spiritual leaders, have experimented with the non-physical body?  Actually, I even remember Robert Monroe referring to that fact at the very beginning of Journeys.  And then there was Don Juan from Carlos Casteneda.  Surely there are hundreds of examples going way back!

Hi Cal: Yes that is exactly Largo's God's Lunatics documents... in most cases they are penetrating the Astral Mud or maleable clay and funneling into the physical plane as 'miracles' thru focused intention... that is fairly easy to do with disciplined effort... the problem is the conclusions that are drawn or were drawn in the past which were narrow and limited thus creating a myriad of cults and practices which are not necessarily duplicable by the followers since they rare attain the ability to focus attention a functionally viable way and they die out..

S.

Just because you manage to get out of your body doesnt mean your a god. You got to take all the knowledge in you can gather and combine it with you own experiences and come to a conclusion. Life makes no sense to me at all. Tons of madness.
If this is the best God can do, I'm not impressed.
-- George Carlin, Napalm & Silly Putty (2001)