End stage Alzheimer's disease and the morality of positive euthanasia

Hello All,

I have long thought about exactly where the soul/mind of an Alzheimer sufferer exist in the End Stage where the person has become so incapacitated that they are zombie like and comatose. Playing Devils Advocate I put a few points for discussion as follows”

Could the degradation of the mind due to end stage Alzheimer’s disease suggest that the mind and, resultantly, the human consciousness could be transient things.

Does this prove that most preconceived notions of an afterlife are fundamentally flawed? ?

Must we be able to perceive, evaluate and understand the afterlife for in to become a reality in the afterlife? E.g. or heaven or hell are creations of the mind which appears dead in the end stage Alzheimer sufferer

Mind might not survive without a functioning human body. Does the eternal soul live on? If the consciousness dies then the thing that makes you an individual, self-aware human might cease at that moment also?

As the disease progresses the Alzheimer's victim goes through anger, rage, violence, depression, regressing to childhood, forgetting current life - almost living in a 'past life' state. in random stages of this disease.?..

The final stage of the Alzheimer sufferer is unspeakably difficult for the family who must look after and nurse the person they loved so much but who is now just a blank eyed robot that somehow retains the ability to eat and drink.
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I have seen the terrible devastation of this disease where the person is apparently absent from the body and the body lives on as a mindless biological entity.

But the body was the vehicle of the soul of a loved one, is this person trapped in the horror of dark void, or has the mind or soul ceased to exist.?

Does the  person trapped inside a dark Alzheimer body suffer unspeakably and if we could really establish this, would not positive euthanasia be an option?.

If God, forbid, I ever got into this state I would welcome someone giving me a huge dose of morphine and releasing me into my destiny

What do you think about this vexing problem?

The difficult question is can positive euthanasia ever be justified?

I haven't met a person suffering from Alzheimers so far, so all I can do is speculate.
I do know however, that a body can "override" us. Basically it's the same thing with blind people. All spirits can "see" or "perceive vision", still some human beings cannot. It's all about what your body allows you to do. (it's not just hobbies, disabilities etc; chemicals even control feelings)


Quote:

The difficult question is can positive euthanasia ever be justified?

I think most people already think it's justified, the problem is the legal side of it; how can laws make sure that it won't be abused by doctors (for organ trade, etc)

take care,
Vagabound

Beau,
this is a topic inwhich I believe I can give some insight into. My Mother is an Alzheimer`s Patient.

I firmly understand her state of being, as I am an empath and sometimes I have found myself "in her state of being", whileas being 600 km away from her. (If you`ve read my other comments to some threads you`ll remember me telling you that I am sensitive and can "feel" long distance - now I finialy have learned thru Bio-Therapy to focus on keeping certain vibs away from my frequency so they not get intertwined)

In any case... the childlike frequency I have come to feel, thru her in those moments, comes in form of E-motion. E-motion is energy in motion, right? This childlike acting out is in fact the rememberance on her mental disk of childhood innocence. She has even held food in her mouth without wanting to swollow it (as a child sometimes does) and I, so far away, was attempting to chew & swallow food which wasnt in my mouth. Her caretaker called me same instant and said: Your mom is driving me nuts, she wont swallow her food simply to aggrevate me.  I laughed and made him put her on the phone.

Do you recall her burning her arm in west part of S.C. whilst baking a cake, I then in Myrtle Beach and have the burn mark exactly where she has hers..

Well now she sometimes drifts off, I can find myself, thru her, on a complete different reality stage. Shes there in her apartment, I am here in mine (600 km away)- yet I sometimes feel as if I were swaying somewhere else. She is glazing into space there, as if she sees something which no one else sees, whereas I then see the world in a defferent perspective.

Of course this scared the living poo poo out of me at first, however over the course of time I am used to it. So I would assume an Alzheimer Patient is for the most part in a somewhat OBE.

Not too long ago something really wierd happened, for which I havent been able to find an explaination at all. I had gotten dizzy and all of the sudden I saw clear as daylight >> A huge DNA strand", it was changing right before my eye. I reached to grab it and it evaporated.

And guess what  ;D >> I dont do drugs nor do I drink..lol.. (PS... I have the same things also happen to me, with my sister - she drops plywood on her toe in NC and I, 6000 miles away from her, get the bruise and swelling of the toe)

Hugs,
Nanner

Hey Nanner,

Since you seem to know quite a bit about it, do you know a movie or documentary that shows what it's really like? I've heard that sooner or later Alzheimer patients lose their personality but I'm sceptical because nowadays they're a bit fast with that kind of statements.

take care,
Vagabound

wrote on Mar 26^th, 2010 at 2:16pm:

Hey Nanner, Since you seem to know quite a bit about it, do you know a movie or documentary that shows what it's really like? I've heard that sooner or later Alzheimer patients lose their personality but I'm sceptical because nowadays they're a bit fast with that kind of statements. take care, Vagabound

Vagabound Sweetness,
I havent heard of a docu other than those which mental wards have, and personally I think those are biased, tell ya the truth. Since I am a Social Therapist , I come in direct contact with many people whom have severe alkohol and drug addictions anyway but I dont have Alzheimers Patients. My mother is my primary reference. I do remember that before I attained the understanding of the Bio-field directly around the physical of being, I couldn`t walk into a grocery store without getting smacked in face with Emotions. Hmmm, my partner dearly loved goin shopping with me - finially he found a lady who go`s in and gets the heck out within 10 min flat..lol.. Me >> in a shopping mall forget it. I really "felt every single e-motion of the people there as they`d walk by me". It was a roller coaster ride of e-motions. (One lady depressed, the next guy high as a kite, grandpa gentle and relieved, whilst the kiddys in unconditional joy, then the teenager frustrated) God Almighty, it was a trip for me everytime! (What the heck am I babbling about, you see in just a sec)

I dont think they "loose" their personality, theres other options here Love, looking at it from the frequency of a "soul". Maybe they "trade" in their "reality" for the "new one which they have attained to explore unknowlingly as a humanbeing". Keep in mind, We are all ultimately ONE, yet each of us play a "part on this stage called [i]life, which compliments the lives experience of another[/i]". I would think the soul of that Alzheimers person, leads at least 2 seperate realities. 

To "us" of course its like they have changed completely, but to "them" we are just not on their frequency. Heres why I believe that:
See, my apprentenceship when I was 14 was in a childrens mental hospit.

I have always wanted to work with kids and teenagers, so I thought why not go where the help is really needed, right? Well, this ward had one specific kid which the nurses said was a hopeless case. He wouldnt move his arms, merely stared out the window and was for them considered non- responsive, demented etc. Hmmm, well theres nothing which love can`t handle in case of E-motion. Meow - this was definately a case for this little ole kitty cat. I poured so much love into this little guy (I think he was 9 or 10) that when I left he actually noticed I my internship was over and "responded". I felt when he was on our plane and when he wasnt ;-) so I knew what to do and when to do it. 

I did notice that sometimes he was "here" and sometimes he was "gone" and again looking at it from the perspective of the soul, you all know that there is no limitation to what, when, where and how the soul moves about. I am convinced "IT" decides when it wants to leave the body, and not the physical aspects decide. It wouldnt make any sense to me any other way, how is can come to be that a person even with Alzheimers can be here one min and gone the next, but tell you of things from somewhere else. We call em crazy,mad, sick, unbalanced, unhinged, insane  in some places, I call them "advanced".

Hugs,
Nanner

Hi Nanner,

Interesting life you've got there!
I've always liked to be around "lost cases" myself. For some reason these people always made me feel special.
Figuring out the reasons why people act the way they do is quite a challenge to me, one which I enjoy taking on, that's why I like to learn about mental disorders, too. At least some of them really aren't disorders, but just a different way to look at things.

Well, thanx for telling me about some of your experiences. Hope you still like your job, I'm sure it can be very frustrating at times, because it takes lots of energy.

take care,
Vagabound

I can't speak with any authority on the subject but I can still bestow upon you my personal opinion....

I feel that while the body is alive, the soul resides within. The soul sees all and understands all things.... even if the mind and body do not. In order for the person to move on they must die completely.

...just an opinion.

wrote on Mar 26^th, 2010 at 4:20pm:

I can't speak with any authority on the subject but I can still bestow upon you my personal opinion.... I feel that while the body is alive, the soul resides within. The soul sees all and understands all things.... even if the mind and body do not. In order for the person to move on they must die completely. ...just an opinion.

"I am a soul having a human experience, not the other way around"  My current body is like a car, when I trade in my old Pinto for a new Mercedes, I shall not weep over the Pinto :-*

Nanner wrote on Mar 26^th, 2010 at 4:29pm:

wrote on Mar 26th, 2010 at 4:20pm: I can't speak with any authority on the subject but I can still bestow upon you my personal opinion.... I feel that while the body is alive, the soul resides within. The soul sees all and understands all things.... even if the mind and body do not. In order for the person to move on they must die completely. ...just an opinion. "I am a soul having a human experience, not the other way around"  My current body is like a car, when I trade in my old Pinto for a new Mercedes, I shall not weep over the Pinto :-*

Nicely put dear Nanna!!

has anyone ever tried to check in with a person who suffered from Alzheimer's and is now in the afterlife? i think it would be interesting to learn their perception now that they have been released.

bird wrote on Apr 2^nd, 2010 at 11:36am:

has anyone ever tried to check in with a person who suffered from Alzheimer's and is now in the afterlife? i think it would be interesting to learn their perception now that they have been released.

I second that motion. I`d like to find this out as well? Thx Nanner

Nanner wrote on Apr 2^nd, 2010 at 11:40am:

bird wrote on Apr 2nd, 2010 at 11:36am: has anyone ever tried to check in with a person who suffered from Alzheimer's and is now in the afterlife? i think it would be interesting to learn their perception now that they have been released. I second that motion. I`d like to find this out as well? Thx Nanner

Me too, the afterlife is a very big place!!

Peace, light and blessings

Alan