Hi,

I just saw a movie about a transgender man who was positive she was a woman , and too me she was most definitely female.

Medical science has an explanation for this phenomenon in that all zygotes are female and only later does the brain become male or female.

In transgender folks they are born with male bodies but to unbalanced hormones while in the womb their brains remain female.

These people suffer the worst kind of discrimination.

My question is Could it not be due to spiritual reasons rather than physical reasons that this happens

A female soul inhabiting a mail body. Do souls have gender etc etc

Alan

Alan

I Believe that are spiritual reasons, we must be free as a whole to reach a state were we fell peace. So whatever it is the experience we need to go trhough to achive such balance nature will provide us whith. According to my studies a soul doesn`t have gender it is the body who need a gender compliant wit the experiences a soul must go through, of course we feel it easier to have a gender than other, but we must be able to deal with both. It`s a long story but I think it`s enough for now. (without understand the reincarnations it's very difficulty to deal with this subject)

Take care.

Hi alan and kardec I have always thought that possibly the spirit of a male can sometimes enter a female baby at the time of birth and visa versa female enters male child,but its a mystery as there are lesbians and gays,so i dont think we will find the answer to this until we get to the spiritworld.

Its like transvestites,whats the reason behind all these different things ?
Life is one big mystery.

Love and God bless   love juditha

kardec,


Quote:

I Believe that are spiritual reasons, we must be free as a whole to reach a state were we fell peace. So whatever it is the experience we need to go trhough to achive such balance nature will provide us whith. According to my studies a soul doesn`t have gender it is the body who need a gender compliant wit the experiences a soul must go through, of course we feel it easier to have a gender than other, but we must be able to deal with both. It`s a long story but I think it`s enough for now. (without understand the reincarnations it's very difficulty to deal with this subject)

Once during a deep coma I had an experience where I saw this huge magestic being, a lot like my avatar in fact.

I could see the whole ethereal body from the from the front  and it was neither male or female. I took this to be an angel There were no sex organs on the being

Juditha,

If reincarnation is a fact then it is possible for a male soul picking the wrong earthly home a male soul entering a female body

Of course this is a possibility

Alan

Juditha,

your comment "Its like transvestites,whats the reason behind all these different things ?"

Transvestites: a person and especially a male who adopts the dress and often the behavior typical of the opposite sex especially for purposes of emotional or sexual gratification have nothing to do with Transgenders: having personal characteristics (as transsexuality or transvestism) that transcend traditional gender boundaries and corresponding sexual norms

:-/Aras

I have a least one guide that I am sure is a hermaphrodite and perhaps they all are.

I think a person winds up in the "wrong" body sometimes simply because they were supposed to. People choose some strange premises for their lives. But the real test is ours, to not judge. It always comes back to us, I think.

 Well said Beau, i completely agree.

 Re: the general issue, it seems more often than not, other lives, karma, and subconscious memories tend to pertain a lot to this issue.  
I think that originally all Souls were more androgynous/hermaphroditic in nature, but this was when they were still fully intune with Source.  

  When freewill got the better of some Souls, and some Souls started to choose in a less creative manner, this threw off the balance of inner Feminine to Masculine ratio eventually.  

 The best and least loaded terms to describe these two Yin-Yang polarities is "passive/receptive and active/outputting", or could be related to what Bruce terms the "observer/perceiver" and the "interpreter".   This imbalance manifested itself in the physical in relation to humans.  
Some sources speak of cycles when some humans, who were more like advanced E.T.'s that we hear of now, were more androgynous in nature, even physically though their "physical" was on a faster and less dense vibration than our current, and more akin to our etheric level of energies.  

 Anyways, some souls, many souls, have tended in their journey to choose one physical sex/gender more than another in their lives.  Sometimes this leads to a more extreme imbalance in that inner ratio.  

 Then as they spiritually develop, and can handle more difficult situations, they may choose to be born in the different gendered body, and thus some experience things like being primarily gay, or feeling transgendered in nature.  

 There is more to it than this, and this is bit of an over simplification, but it does seem to be an averagely true reason.  

 One could have experienced mostly male bodies, and still be rather balanced and in touch with the Yin side, and vice versa.  This is because Souls ultimately do not have gender like our physical bodies do.  

Hi, All

Just to clarify

A transvestite is a normal male except for the fact that they enjoy dressing up as a woman and usually they do it in secret much to the surprise of their wives when they are caught out. They have no Gay tendencies just like woman's cloths

A transgender on the other hand never hides the fact that they are a woman and they dress up as a lady even when heir baffled family tell them not to.

They suffer unspeakable rejection from most of society and I cant see why a soul will ever chose this type of life.

They are usually good moral people just seeking love at great risk from the gender they feel they do not belong to. Society has gone a long way embracing these usually nice creative people

Although physically a male, they are indeed mentally on the inside completely female and feel attracted to the male gender just as any normal woman would feel .

Of course the reverse applies for those transgender person born in a female body but knowing without any doubt that they were a male trapped inside a a woman's body.

To them they are understandably usually repulsed by they idea of making love to the opposite gender They believe and know to them the opposite gender is really the exact same gender of the body in which they are trapped and imprisoned for life.

We should embrace these loving people with love and understanding

Alan

Alan

Great discussion. I think some or maybe all of us are born here with both sides to us, but our conditioning when young makes us identify with one side over the other and almost always the side we are conditioned to is the one we appear to be on the outside.

Bruce mentions the woman from Sensuous and that she may actually be the feminine side of himself, but what if you were born with both those parts in tact in your body? Then you would have the choice of which you most wanted to express. Your expression may not match up with your body type and there could be lessons for you and certainly for others around you to learn from in such a situation.

Some men are happy to have a man's body, but choose to dress as a woman. And some transgendered have no intention of becoming a woman surgically, they just want to as close to one as they can...and there are even Men and women who want to be the opposite sex but still make love to ...  well, the opposite sex ie some men want to be women but also make love to women and vice versa. It's a very interesting subject. I'm glad we're talking about it.

Beau,


Quote:

Bruce mentions the woman from Sensuous and that she may actually be the feminine side of himself, but what if you were born with both those parts in tact in your body? Then you would have the choice of which you most wanted to express. Your expression may not match up with your body type and there could be lessons for you and certainly for others around you to learn from in such a situation.

.

As far as I know I am completely male and the thought of making love to another male is repulsive to me.

This is not the case with a true transgender, they cannot identify with those of their physical gender and indeed , as a hidden woman clothed in a mans body making love to a female does not satisfy their deep longing for love. Does It go as far as repulsion? Strangely not .  

Some of them even marry the opposite physical sex but this is never successful. When the curve balls of life and financial restrictions are no longer a barrier they seek hormonal surgical alteration of their bodies so they look on the outside as they feel on the inside.

But not always the surgical route . often hormonal therapy is sufficient as society is slowly coming to terms with their struggle  

But I think even in a total male persona like me there is a lot of female properties, especially in the right brain.

As an Engineer my left logical brain has dominated most of my life. But now on retirement I find a right brain creative part of me emerging.

It expresses itself in poetry, painting and deep philosophical thinking and I have become somewhat of a shaman in the process.

It would be informative if a visitor to this forum who is a trangender person could comment, as all my views are subjective

Indeed the word Shaman more closely identifies my female  part than the term Psychic.

Take Care

Alan

Hey Alan,

What I meant was that some people are bi in spirit but even so would have a preference I imagine in the physical for one sex or the other. If you are all male then it seems like you could never really debate yourself very efficiently. So much of how we view ourselves is programmed from birth. Most seem to take to easily and others do not. My father always saw himself as quite the man, but near the end of his life he found more of his feminine side. It would be nice to get a Transgender opinion on the post, absolutely. I only know what makes sense to me.

There is no gender in spirit/soul, because it isn't necessary. We choose to become male/female by choice while selecting to become human. What happens in the womb is another matter. There are many variables in nature which would contribute to which way the zygotes develop. Keep in mind: we are "all" the same no matter what the psychological/physical outcome.
According to the Encyclopedia Britannica Macropedia, the Dogon African tribe has a myth of creation, which they believe that androgyny is a sign of perfection (Vol. 5, p. 240).
---cat

I agree that we all the same, carol ann. My question is: Can a bald man truly be androgynous?  ;)

I think it is a sign of perfection too. Thanks to all for making this a great thread.

cat


Quote:

There is no gender in spirit/soul, because it isn't necessary. We choose to become male/female by choice while selecting to become human. What happens in the womb is another matter. There are many variables in nature which would contribute to which way the zygotes develop. Keep in mind: we are "all" the same no matter what the psychological/physical outcome. According to the Encyclopedia Britannica Macropedia, the Dogon African tribe has a myth of creation, which they believe that androgyny is a sign of perfection (Vol. 5, p. 240). ---cat

Respectfully Cat how can you make the above statement as if it were a fact?.

My dear departed mother will not change and become my daddy that just makes no sense to me  [smiley=undecided.gif] [smiley=undecided.gif]

During my NDE I did not shed gender but retained it. I think that our souls are created in one of the genders.

And retain it in the afterlife,of course in the afterlife there is no sexual union between soul, but there is a merging and mingling of opposites more beautiful than our bleak earthly reality

Alan

I think to completely understand one another we have to experience both sexes and that spirit is androgynous, but at what point the two sexes merge I would not say. If you maintain your single sex always then perhaps it is that way, I just don't see that you gain as much insight that way. Our feminine "side" comes from somewhere. Logic says to me that it comes from experience. But perhaps not. I am certain that I was not always a man. Even though I am quite comfortable as one today. ;)

My limated understanding is, that in the afterlife there is only male and female gender in the lower 27 some odd f levels. This is because they are directly connected with the phyical life existence. Once we progress past the F27 boundaries we experience existence(?) in a non gendered way. Moving more towards being a sometimes called "light being". See ourselves as not necessarily having a sex before we are past F 27 could be a result of living many of our lives as differant sex's and may show that we are in fact really made up of both sex's. Male and female. (Of course many homophobes would deny ever being made up of part of the other sex in my opinion)
Joe
Joe

Oooooo Alan-- you are such a contratary being! Here you are on the Afterlife Knowledge board, yet still hold fast to earth being beliefs!!!  How wonderful that I have found you. You always find a challange. How can you NOT prove it?? ( I say this with great affection).

And Beau--- you made me laugh. Bald, indeed. I was bald when I was born!! What does that make me???    :P
Love to all--- cat

Hi

I Feel that (in the astral) we keep the "Shape" of the gender we used the last incarnation. Our soul has both gender and when it is going to reincarnate it places the "features" of the gender that it`s going to experience in foreground. If we are not high developed spirits we tend to maintain in the astral the "Shape" we have last used. There's no tranformation of mothers into dadies it would be a limited understanding of the subject. :)

Our personality -  not only the shape - has both gender

I think my thoughts on the subject a similar to hawkeye`s.

"There's no tranformation of mothers into dadies it would be a limited understanding of the subject. "

I think I agree with what you wrote Kardec, but what did you mean by the above statement. It confuses me a little when you use the terms Mothers into Daddies...I'm not sure I follow. Are you just saying female to male or is there some greater significance to the "mother/daddy" terms here?

Beau

Sorry it was a reference to an earlier post from Alan in this topic, just before one of yours. (in the first page)

My dear departed mother will not change and become my daddy that just makes no sense to me

Androgyny of spirit gets complicated in it's simplicity, I think. In truth your mother was your equal-- Am I right? The sex of such a spirit would be there as a reference point for future recognition in the immediate afterlife, but not really the limit of the being itself. Maybe we're all saying the same thing and then again, maybe I'm confused. From what Alan wrote I think I understand that he believes he is Male and always has been and always will be--but I'm not even sure I got that right anymore. I'm going back to read the whole thread again--DOH.

It's not that hard to understand I feel. We are an being that plays different roles using diffrent "oufits". While in astral we keep using the last outfit we had till we start a new lifetime and gets a new outfit.

From a point on we do not need the reicarnation process and we are read to be 100% aware not more 50%. xoxo

Am I being too simplistic. ;D

Not at all too simplistic, Kardec. I liken it to being in a play and having a costume that you shed at the end of your scene. Death is just a means of getting your tired body off stage in many ways. It makes sense to me that you would leave the same costume on until you ready your next role. "All the world's a stage!" after all.

Kardak, And if one was to only be incarnated within the confines of a singular sex, say only male or only female, be a soul of a less developed one? Would it not take incarnations of differant sex's to give us the lessons possibly required to fulfill our primary objective? So the question would be...do we need to be incarnated into both sex's?
Hmmm..

hawkeye

I believe if we are incarnated to develop our selves we must be able to be a man and a woman full of PUL and understanding. It would make sense to know both sides. My thoughts. :)

When viewing my past lives-- I have been both male and female. I have no reservations or quams about being either male or female. To me it's just "natural" to incarnate to either gender to enhance my spiritual growth. I think you get to choose which gender may facilitate your learning.  But as I stated, there are many variables that may occur, including androgyny, hethersexual,homosexual, bisexual. Some are choices by our own mind set, others by a quirk of nature. ---cat  

This thread reminds me that when I was very young like 5 or 6 I could remember what is was like to be a woman, but back then I didn't get that it was a past life memory. I just thought it was natural, but as I grew up I never really thought back on it. It amazes me sometimes what this board has dredged up in me from my past that I haven't given a thought to in so many many years. Thanks to all.

wrote on Jan 12^th, 2009 at 11:50pm:

Well said Beau, i completely agree.  Re: the general issue, it seems more often than not, other lives, karma, and subconscious memories tend to pertain a lot to this issue.   I think that originally all Souls were more androgynous/hermaphroditic in nature, but this was when they were still fully intune with Source.     When freewill got the better of some Souls, and some Souls started to choose in a less creative manner, this threw off the balance of inner Feminine to Masculine ratio eventually.    The best and least loaded terms to describe these two Yin-Yang polarities is "passive/receptive and active/outputting", or could be related to what Bruce terms the "observer/perceiver" and the "interpreter".   This imbalance manifested itself in the physical in relation to humans.   Some sources speak of cycles when some humans, who were more like advanced E.T.'s that we hear of now, were more androgynous in nature, even physically though their "physical" was on a faster and less dense vibration than our current, and more akin to our etheric level of energies.    Anyways, some souls, many souls, have tended in their journey to choose one physical sex/gender more than another in their lives.  Sometimes this leads to a more extreme imbalance in that inner ratio.    Then as they spiritually develop, and can handle more difficult situations, they may choose to be born in the different gendered body, and thus some experience things like being primarily gay, or feeling transgendered in nature.    There is more to it than this, and this is bit of an over simplification, but it does seem to be an averagely true reason.    One could have experienced mostly male bodies, and still be rather balanced and in touch with the Yin side, and vice versa.  This is because Souls ultimately do not have gender like our physical bodies do.

I wish people could leave this sort of negative judgmentalism behind.  Why do you automatically jump to the idea that a soul must have screwed up or have done something wrong in order to be born in a transgendered body?

Are you aware that scientists last year found the gene mutation that appears to cause it?  Souls don't have gender. Bodies do.  Often a soul will cling to a gender for presentation, but that fades away with time.

Then we have hermaphrodites who are blessed(?) at least in part, with both sex's. I, like Lupus believe, if I understand correctly, that we are above being male or female but are in reality more than the sum of one or the other. While in body and only through indoctrination do we move in the direction of a homophobic need for one or the other having an opportunity for a more spiritually advanced life experience. One is no more spiritualy advanced that the other.I beleave we must spend lifetimes in both body types in order to appreciate the lesson both allow. That also includes lifetimes when the experience includes homosexuality and/or lesbianism. Again most likly as require learning.

Lupus wrote on Feb 1^st, 2009 at 4:24pm:

I wish people could leave this sort of negative judgmentalism behind.  Why do you automatically jump to the idea that a soul must have screwed up or have done something wrong in order to be born in a transgendered body?

 With all due respect Lupus, it seems you have completely misunderstood my post and what i was actually saying.   I was not negatively judging transgendered people AT ALL.  

 If anything, i was saying that such people are on average, probably are more spiritually advanced than the average, for they are swinging again into that necessary balance and merging of Yin/Yang.  I've noticed that many Souls tend to choose one gender over another in a series of lives, sometimes they get lopsided, and when they get to the sufficient spiritual developement with enough inner strength (for being gay or transgendered is rarely a walk in the park), they start to choose the gender of which they haven't had enough experience in, and this then leads sometimes to the experience of being primarily gay or transgendered just because they are so used to being the other gender so they naturally gravitate to what they use to be attracted to etc.  Common sense really.

 I myself, consider myself "philosophically bi", and have many friends who are gay or of alternative lifestyle.  I do not look down upon them for their orientation.   Some of them i sense are fairly old souls who have the inner strength to take on difficult roles.  

 How you got what you got from my previous post, i'm not quite sure.   :-?    Perhaps if you listened better you wouldn't jump to negatively judgmental conclusions so quickly?

wrote on Feb 2^nd, 2009 at 1:50am:

Lupus wrote on Feb 1st, 2009 at 4:24pm:   I wish people could leave this sort of negative judgmentalism behind.  Why do you automatically jump to the idea that a soul must have screwed up or have done something wrong in order to be born in a transgendered body?  With all due respect Lupus, it seems you have completely misunderstood my post and what i was actually saying.   I was not negatively judging transgendered people AT ALL.    If anything, i was saying that such people are on average, probably are more spiritually advanced than the average, for they are swinging again into that necessary balance and merging of Yin/Yang.  I've noticed that many Souls tend to choose one gender over another in a series of lives, sometimes they get lopsided, and when they get to the sufficient spiritual developement with enough inner strength (for being gay or transgendered is rarely a walk in the park), they start to choose the gender of which they haven't had enough experience in, and this then leads sometimes to the experience of being primarily gay or transgendered just because they are so used to being the other gender so they naturally gravitate to what they use to be attracted to etc.  Common sense really.  I myself, consider myself "philosophically bi", and have many friends who are gay or of alternative lifestyle.  I do not look down upon them for their orientation.   Some of them i sense are fairly old souls who have the inner strength to take on difficult roles.    How you got what you got from my previous post, i'm not quite sure.   :-?    Perhaps if you listened better you wouldn't jump to negatively judgmental conclusions so quickly?

How does your idea that transgendered people are souls switching over to a new gender jive with the FACT that transgender feelings are caused by genetics?

It doesn't.  This old idea is nothing more than malarkey, a new-age faith-based explanation for something its followers didn't understand. It's completely made-up, and the only way it could be true is if the cause of transgender feelings was purely spiritual.  We know now that that's 100% false. The cause is biological.

Souls switch genders through incarnations regularly, yet less than 1% of the population is transgendered. Even the math busts this theory.

This meshes well with things I've observed on the other side.  Transgendered and gay people aren't having spiritual problems adjusting to a gender at all.  Instead, they've purposely chosen a life that will be persecuted, hunted, hated and oppressed, for the experience.

 Theres a very old saying which I have found personally true in many respects;  its "as above, so below"  above being the nonphysial, or consciousness aspect of reality, below being the physical aspect.  

  Or in other words there is a interconnection, and often the physical mirrors the spiritual in some respects.  

 Hence genetics may just reflect the spiritual or consciousness reality.  

 I'm a long time student of astrology, and i have noticed this pattern in astrology a lot in many various kinds of ways.   One way is that i can more than chance would allow tell a persons rough birth time from what they look like and just knowing their general birth day.  

 I did this with a member of this site.  

 So, again with due respect, i don't think my line of reasoning is just marlarkey myth, etc.

 I have a strong left brain side to me and reason and conclude things from both intuition and logic, along with experience.

Yes, as good as science is, to conclude that something can't be spiritual when it is genetic is not logical. Remember Lupus, finally science is a product of mind. Everything what we perceive and realize is in our minds, including science. Whether particular spiritual theories are true or not is another question.

Spooky

 Lupus wrote,
Quote:

Souls switch genders through incarnations regularly, yet less than 1% of the population is transgendered. Even the math busts this theory

.

 Notice also how i continually said gay or transgendered?  Both seem fairly common within the whole, have had many and predominantly lives in one gender but like you said the transgendered tendencies is much more rare.

This doesn't always happen, i have used the word "sometimes".   Some Souls make the switch without significant gay or transgendered tendencies in a particular life or few.   It's a fairly relative issue and depends on the individual.

 Yet there are averages which can be ascertained by those highly intuitive.  The experience of intuition is beyond that of how most people nonphysically explore wherein they have to sit, or lay down, meditate, make affirmations, etc, and get in that someewhat special place to get info which is often strongly related to and filtered through material sense concepts.  

Quote:

Transgendered and gay people aren't having spiritual problems adjusting to a gender at all.  Instead, they've purposely chosen a life that will be persecuted, hunted, hated and oppressed, for the experience.

 Again, notice how i have continually used the word "sometimes", or at other times the phrase "on average".  I cannot speak for every case, or every individual.   I'm sure that sometimes my above theory does not hold true.

  I'm sure that some are just signing up for difficult lives without the above variable being in the equation, like what you seem to be saying.  
And, karma being what it is, i'm sure that sometimes some people are balancing difficult karma along that line.   There is an interesting case in the Edgar Cayce readings for a man who received a life reading because of his difficulty with his strong gay urges.
 He was told that he had been a cartoonist in an earlier France cycle and had made fun of those of gay lifestyle in his poltical satires, and now was meeting self in his experience with his difficulties with his gay urges.  He apparently chose a body with strong genetic/astrological tendencies towards homosexuality, yet subconsciously he did not vibe or agree with it because he probably remembered subconsciously that he likes women more--that and in his time and place it was not an accepted expression.  

 Having had become aware of some of my other lives and their "histories" or strongest energies, well i have come to know by experience that some of the difficult challenges that i have faced in my own life, are cases of my Disk meeting self in this particularly self/personality.  Particularly issues to do with health, and having emotionally hurt various women in other lives, and experiencing likewise in this life.  

 Some difficulties on the other hand, were just chosen not because of need to balance difficult karma, but because their difficulties were good catalysts to help this self grow more spiritually when those difficulties are squarely faced and over come.  What does it matter anyways, when its all for spiritual growth, and all eventually leads to that?   Yet, to know that you wronged another in another experience and now are meeting self and can overcome that is a worthwile awareness.   Relates to that little thing called "self responsibility".

 Again, its a relative issue, and you can have various factors going on at the same time with different issues just even within one individual.

 It seems rather that YOU are the one being more black and white and extreme about this topic.   Where is your relativity and perception of same?   So, your above one dimesional belief/perception holds true for all cases?    Highly unlikely i would say if one looked at the math of probabilities.  

 

spooky2 wrote on Feb 2^nd, 2009 at 9:00pm:

Yes, as good as science is, to conclude that something can't be spiritual when it is genetic is not logical. Remember Lupus, finally science is a product of mind. Everything what we perceive and realize is in our minds, including science. Whether particular spiritual theories are true or not is another question. Spooky

That's a copout.  You know that more than 0.005% of souls are in the opposite gender as the last incarnation, yet that's how many are transgendered.

It's not spiritual.  It's like homosexuality. It's a product of the body. In assuming it's a dysfunction of the spirit, you are no different than people like Fred Phelps, adding to the burden of these people.

wrote on Feb 2^nd, 2009 at 11:32pm:

Notice also how i continually said gay or transgendered?  Both seem fairly common within the whole, have had many and predominantly lives in one gender but like you said the transgendered tendencies is much more rare.

Even when you combine them, it's still only 5% of the population.


wrote on Feb 2^nd, 2009 at 11:32pm:

This doesn't always happen, i have used the word "sometimes".   Some Souls make the switch without significant gay or transgendered tendencies in a particular life or few.   It's a fairly relative issue and depends on the individual.

And here you are again assigning deficiency or aberration of the soul to the transgendered and the gay, just like I said you were.  


wrote on Feb 2^nd, 2009 at 11:32pm:

There is an interesting case in the Edgar Cayce readings for a man who received a life reading because of his difficulty with his strong gay urges.  He was told that he had been a cartoonist in an earlier France cycle and had made fun of those of gay lifestyle in his poltical satires, and now was meeting self in his experience with his difficulties with his gay urges.  He apparently chose a body with strong genetic/astrological tendencies towards homosexuality, yet subconsciously he did not vibe or agree with it because he probably remembered subconsciously that he likes women more--that and in his time and place it was not an accepted expression.

There you go, that's a much better example than your previous idea of someone who was switching genders and couldn't adjust because they weren't evolved enough or were defective in some way.

This man was BORN gay.  He could choose to act on that or not, but the sexual orientation is of the body, not the soul.

 Again, its a relative issue, and you can have various factors going on at the same time with different issues just even within one individual.


wrote on Feb 2^nd, 2009 at 11:32pm:

It seems rather that YOU are the one being more black and white and extreme about this topic.   Where is your relativity and perception of same?   So, your above one dimesional belief/perception holds true for all cases?    Highly unlikely i would say if one looked at the math of probabilities.

I am definitely black and white when it comes to calling GLBT people defective for religious reasons.

 Who is saying that it has to be a dysfunction of the spirit?

 My belief system allows for the reality that a Disk self chooses a particular body purely for the sake of difficult earth life experiences to be had, and neither difficult karma OR more neutral karma (karma then just meaning "memory", which is then tipped to a particular gender predominantly).

 Again, it is your assertions that are black and white on this matter and which don't allow for a relativity or possible alternative.  It seems according to you, it can only be and ever is only because of body physical reasons.  Have you met and tuned deeply into every single transgendered person on the face of the Earth?

  This seems to be a dogmatic and narrow viewpoint to promote.  You have 3 posts to your name and obviously new here, anything else to discuss, or do you only want to argue in an argumentative tone about this one topic?

 

Lupus wrote on Feb 3^rd, 2009 at 3:05am:

I am definitely black and white when it comes to calling GLBT people defective for religious reasons.

 I did not say, nor imply "defection" as if people and souls are factory products to be either rejected or accepted  ::)  As i said earlier, some of the people i have met who are gay, and especially those who are bi, i sensed were very spiritually mature.   What's your point?   It's in plain writing in an earlier post of mine.   Methinks you are not very objective about this topic and see attack easily where there is none.  

 I said there are various possible reasons for this experience, and yes one of the common one comes from a kind of consciousness imbalance due to BEING ADDICTED TO ONE GENDER MORE THAN ANOTHER.  For many, this whole Earth life thing pertains to addiction in general (as Monroe learned and wrote about). That doesn't make people or Souls "defective" in my book.  

 So what, is it prejudiced to say that the huge percentage of humanity is imbalanced when it comes to the left and right brain hemispheres?  Or to the Yin/Yang within?  

 Well golly then, lets take up a crusade to argue and fight all people who make claims about so many people!  

  And how do you get religion out of this btw?  You are not talking to one who follows any particular religion.  You are talking to one who has studied and been on a spiritual/metaphysical path for 16 of his 29 earth years.  

Lupus wrote,
Quote:

"And here you are again assigning deficiency or aberration of the soul to the transgendered and the gay, just like I said you were.

 Nope, for that to be the case, i would have to assign a "good" or a "bad" label to the experience of being gay, transgendered, or what not or to gay, transgendered, etc. people.  Nowhere did i say it is preferable to be straight over gay or anything like that.   I did not say that being gay or transgendered was bad.  It just is.  

  This is a classic case of projection.  See ya, i'm done with this thread.  

Hello everyone.

  I haven't posted here for some time but have been reading occasionally once in a while. Being a transgendered person myself, I would like to say that I appreciate the acceptance of my condition on this board. My life has it's up's and down's with some people accepting me while other's don't. My wife love's me and even though she suppresses my feminine appearance whenever I leave the house, she allows me to be my self while at home(woman trapped in a man's body).

  I'm not gay as I'm attracted to women only. I've always had the strongest desire to be a woman. Yet if I was a woman then that would make me a lesbian. My wife has no interest in women, yet she tolerates my obsession with looking feminine. I cannot figure out why I decided to incarnate on this world as a man yet want to be a woman.

  I've spent most of my life as a respected male loved by friends and family. I hid the fact from everyone, except my wife, that I longed to be a woman. She accepted this as long as I kept it private. The last several years I've had a hard time keeping it a secret. So hard in fact that now everyone knows about me and my innermost wishes. I sometimes have left the house dressed like a woman on many occasions. Public acceptance has been for the most part favorable.

  After many meditations I've discovered that I'm actually androgynous in my soul, but when my mind becomes activated in the physical world, emotions can sway me toward my feminine side, as I have more attraction to the yin than the yang. There is a feeling I get that is more spiritual when closer to the yin. Maybe that's why I strive for my female side.

Ralph

Everytime I listen to "Money for Nothin" By Dire Straits I get this image of a very beautiful hermaphrodite. I think that would be cool, you know , to be one, but I'd still wear trousers I think. I don't think it would work for me in my current physical situation though. I'd get tired of shaving my back hair I just know it. And I'm not really attracted to men. But I am a lesbian trapped in a man's body even if it is an old cliche.

 Hi Ralph, good to see you around again.  Hope all is spiritually intune with you.

 Re: your feelings and perceptions that the Yin side seems more spiritual, that makes sense to me in a way, because in my perception the Yin side connects to that innate Oneness and connectivity reality.  To receptive feeling.

 The Yang side, connects more to differences, individuality, and differentiation side of reality.

 I happen to believe that both are equally necessary and important attributes/states/realities, but this World has overdone the latter, Yang side too much and therefore needs a greater balance of Yin.

 I think beings, and consciousnesses which don't prefer one over the other, are existing in the true androgynous state.   Such a state is ultimately an "enLightened" state too.   It is perhaps no surprise then that Monroe labeled the some 1800 year old in physical human "He/She".  It was the best "name" that Bob could come up with at the time, and really very apropos if you think more deeply about it.

 Btw, while i'm neither gay, transgendered, or truly bi (in physical, sexual practice), i've had issues with being accepted by my fellow humans all of my life, which in the past has caused me much pain.   Since i can remember, even as a very little kindergartner i was oft singled out and picked on.  

 I've come to believe that seeking acceptance from others is a limiting tendency, and a sure way to set oneself up for disappointment and hurt.  Its a shadow aspect tendency really, and when one attunes to PUL enough and consistently it gets more and more dissipated until it isn't left at all.

Thank you for that response, Justin.

  I can understand what you mean about the PUL energy drain. I am constantly sending out energy and sometimes I get feeling weak and tired but after a good sleep I'm re-energized and ready to do it again. It gives me a good feeling in helping other people whenever I can.

  I've been taking estrogen for a couple of years now and it has helped me control my emotions. I'm finally getting some breast growth and that makes me so happy that I'm glad I've been patient with myself since my depression and suicide attempt two years ago.

  Now that my yin side has improved, my extrasensory perception has increased. I get an etheric connection with women when I talk to them. I still haven't been able to achieve out of body projection yet, but I feel that I'm getting closer all the time. I'm happier now that I can have better awareness of all the multitudes of connections and perceptions that permeate the universe. As much as I look forward to going to the other side, I can enjoy my physical experience more fully now.

  I would like to add a picture of me, but I can't afford a web address needed to use in uploading it. Maybe someday. That's it for now. May everyone enjoy their cosmic persuits with love and happiness.

Ralph

Ralph you can do it for free. Go to the tech answers section, I think Betson posted a link to the place where you can set one up for free that's what I did.

http://photobucket.com/

Another free place for image hosting and it's very easy to use!

:)Aras

  Thank you Beau and Aras so much for your help. I used photobucket.com to post some pictures of me. After all of this time wanting to add my photo, I never realized that free websites existed that I could use.

Ralph

Excellent Ralph I'm glad you got it to work, and you look great!

  Thank you for the compliment Beau. I temporarily changed my picture this time to show my other appearance.

  I have discovered over the years that different clothing can have an affect on my extra sensory perception. Even more so; if I wear gold jewelry it can help or hinder my awareness depending on the situation I'm in. There is definitely a paranormal power associated with gold. Several times I've taken off my gold necklace and could actually feel the change in my senses.

  Another thing that I've discovered is how my hair affects my perception. My awareness increases whenever I curl up my hair. Even makeup can have an affect on my senses, like the way eye shadow makes my eyes feel more alive and energetic. Sometimes I wonder if women get more out of makeup than just looking pretty.

  The next time I post I'll put back the real me picture.   :-)

Ralph

I don't know much about Jewelry because all I ever wear is a watch and it's mostly plastic, but I do know what you mean about make up. As an actor I wear it quite often and it really does change everything about you. Not just the looks. It's kind of eerie the way it tunes one into stuff. I used to keep mine on for hours after a show was over and even if I wasn't looking in a mirror I just had these very strong and fairly indescribable feelings about myself. Thanks for bringing that up cause I haven't thought about it in years...and I don't have any hair to curl up really, but when I wear a piece or a wig that can make similar feelings like the ones I've had when wearing make up.

Yours,
Beau

Ralph--- have you ever scenced in a past life that you were a female Egyptian?  I can invision you with beautiful black hair, mysterious eyes and lots of gold jewlery. --cat

As for Beau-- you were an excellent Shakespearean actor!  Very well renouned. ---cat

It's funny that you mention that Carol Ann, because in a reading my mother had done many years ago she was told she had been a very close friend of a famous Shakespearian actor in a past life.  And certainly she and I had been together many times before. I do love Shakespeare and you know, it just could be, I guess.  I've never had that kind of reading done where things were detailed like that. Thank you for reminding me about my mom in such a wonderful way.

Yours,
Beau

 Hi again Ralph, good to see a pic of you, though to be honest i don't care too much what anyone looks like ultimately, i care more about how they feel and what they emanate.  

 Gold... a book could be written about this element and what it signifies...being a physical outer symbol, of a nonphysical energy.

 It is the Sun's energy in a metal, and not just because of the color correlation.  I don't know how to describe it.

 Ever try colloidal gold, or ormus super spin state state gold?   I've tried the former, and the first time felt quite "high" immediately after ingestion.  
But gold, like any gemstone, song or tone, body movement, etc. is in the end, just a prop.  

 With that said, gold, clear quartz, amethyst, and azurite are my fav. props and the ones i most innately gravitate to.   Hemi-sync, and AhhOhhumm are nice ones too.  

  I think that maybe I'm just a visitor from another planet. I'm totally different than anyone I've met in my entire life. I can see a pattern in the way everyone thinks, yet my perspective is always like I'm Mr. Spock on a research mission.

  I feel like a space scientist learning all that I can about life on this planet. I have no sex drive, yet wonder why everyone else makes a big deal about sex. Maybe I'm a hermaphrodite.

  It really doesn't matter to me as long as I can tap into God's ocean of love and mercy for a pick me up to use while exploring the universe.

Ralph

 It's quite possible that you are a "first timer" here from another system of energies.  

 I've met a few here and there; they tend to be rather interesting, intense, unusual people, often with very intense or striking in some way-eyes.  

 In her book Cosmic Journeys, Rosiland McKnight writes that some E.T. groups would be sending in some of their energy to be human, to help out with both the Changes in general, and more specifically with the Human to E.T. communications that have been taking place and which will eventually culminate with more direct interfacing.  

  I'm not a 1st timer/primarily E.T. type, but my Disk has been involved with this communication process and interaction in quite a few in physical lives, and from the info that my Twin Soul and i have received, we will be quite involved with it again.

 Sometimes a very mature Soul who has had a lot of Earth experience, will also feel very different and almost "alien" from most of those around them.   Androgynous tendencies and attractions are common in both E.T./1st timer humans and very mature ELS Disks.   Either bi-sexuality tendencies (or a high tolerance of same) or no sex drive are fairly common, as well as vegetarianism or veganism (as well as more eco minded above the average).  

 Especially to most advanced E.T./1st timer humans, the thought of eating animals to survive is a repulsive thought, though being now human they like other humans can become manipulated and cowed (especially when a child) into such habits.  

 As you seem to mention Ralph, the exact wheres and whys aren't that important, but we're all children of Source and PUL is the most important reality and process to engage in.   That for me, has required, among various things, me trying to forget the feelings and thoughts of "being so different from so many that are around me".    In my case, it has been hard to do at times, because i have never sought to appear different outwardly, and yet was constantly picked on and/or made to feel different from a young age throughout school.  
 For whatever reason(s), the less mature personalities here tend to really dislike the very mature ones, and try to make them suffer in some way.   Odd and backwards world we live in...

  Since you mention it, I am a vegetarian. When I was a child, I was forced to eat meat but hated it. My mother told me that when I was very little, I used to walk around the house with my cheek sticking out because I didn't want to swallow the meat. As far as eco-minded, I always try to use real silverware and plates instead of disposable ones.

  I was never picked on in school though. I seemed to have a talent at changing my personality to match that of the person I was talking to. That always guaranteed me alot of friends. I have strong empathy with others and when other's quarrel, I tend to play ambassador.

Ralph

Hi Ralph,

regarding that people get into make-up for more than vanity, I find a great lift in spirits when I wear eye make-up ! Accenting the eyes and even seemingly changing their shape wakes me up and helps me feel much more focuessed, able to look others in the eyes more directly, etc!

The other side of that is that we absorb a certain amount of the coloring materials, and do so so near some delicate, spiritually important areas. I was told that not much makeup should be used, that women were never expected to get so involved in spiritual activities, and that the two don't work well together when one's vibrational rate has increased.
Oh well.... maybe just for some occasions, eh ?! :D

Bets

I've never met a woman that I thought looked better with make up, but it's not any kind of religious affectation. I had a huge crush on ziggy stardust when I was 8...who knew? I guess if I was gay I would prefer my men with make up...lol