Has anyone read these books or material?? If, you haven't check it out at www.trufax.org

laters

I was also interested in this material.  It kinda sounds like a compilation of new age theories from various popular sources, including Monroe.  These books are very expensive.  It is apparently material for those on their "final incarnation."  

I Am Dude wrote on Dec 25^th, 2008 at 1:52am:

I was also interested in this material.  It kinda sounds like a compilation of new age theories from various popular sources, including Monroe.  These books are very expensive.  It is apparently material for those on their "final incarnation."

Yes,  the books are very expensive.. Yet, each book is over 600 pages basically..

Yes, it is along the lines of Monroe's work, but a step above it.. They believe polarity is a big mind f*ck.. Non duality is the key to transition to a higher awareness..

The only thing that doesn't resonate with me is the whole thing about the author being quite sexist towards women and what not....

peace

I've researched more about the material and it doesn't resonate with me..
I've had a few people say it's great and worth the read, but then I've had many say it's full of disinformation.. After looking more into it, I agree with the others that it is full of disinformation..

peace

Just an opinion but I find it hard to believe you know you are in your last incarnation while you're here. I mean you can think it, but I don't think I'd spend big bucks to here someone else tell me what I need to know about it. It's not completely without merit though, the site that is.

I believe that the way the material is marketed is a bit much. Reminds me of one of those commercials that sell a product you can buy only by calling the number provided. Quite expensive. According to this article, the physics are inaccurate. Val Valerian has his theories, David Icke has his, Dave Wilcock has his. How much do they agree with each other?

http://quantumfuture.net/quantum_future/thoughts_2.htm

I think when someone begins to write about a topic like this it's so tedious that one may easily lose sight of the whole picture if ever they possessed it at one time, and begin to fill in the gaps themselves. It happens all the time. The channel degrades or something.

I don't know anything therefore I don't NO anything, but I try to discern what I can and stick to my guidelines on these subjects. If it's fear based, even if it says 'have no fear', I steer clear.

Yours,
Beau

Beau wrote on Jan 13^th, 2009 at 9:20pm:

I don't know anything therefore I don't NO anything, but I try to discern what I can and stick to my guidelines on these subjects. If it's fear based, even if it says 'have no fear', I steer clear. Yours, Beau

That sounds very sensible.

I read his books a few years back and there wasn't to much viable info that was new, just presented in a different way. He pulls from Bruce, Monroe and Icke for his main ideas and then goes on a hateful rant about people having misguided manipulated opinions on sex and religion. At first I thought some of his opinions and the language he used was for shock value but he seemed to fall deeper into a hole of his own making and it was soon tiring and an uncomfortable  chore to read further.
Good luck on your search
Larry
 

I've read Matrix 5 Vol. 1, and for me it goes WAY beyond my other favourite books, Robert Monroe's trilogy.

As for hateful, sexist, and disinformation, the Matrix 5 books can be found in the library on focus 27, and when you consider the other information present in the library, this is indeed not for every incarnation of a Higher Self/I-There/Disc/The real you/and so on.

Beau wrote on Jan 13^th, 2009 at 4:38pm:

Just an opinion but I find it hard to believe you know you are in your last incarnation while you're here. I mean you can think it, but I don't think I'd spend big bucks to here someone else tell me what I need to know about it. It's not completely without merit though, the site that is.

Since incarnation is 100% voluntary, I'd say it's pretty easy to know you're done. You just make a decision that you don't want to play anymore after this go-around.

 Incarnation is 100 percent voluntary, but it seems that with quite a few Disks, they have to get convinced by consciousnesses wiser than they that there is a need to come back despite the fact that they would rather not have to face any more difficulties.

 But as ever with most people, the emphasis in on the little self and its freewill and knowledge.    

wrote on Feb 3^rd, 2009 at 3:44am:

Incarnation is 100 percent voluntary, but it seems that with quite a few Disks, they have to get convinced by consciousnesses wiser than they that there is a need to come back despite the fact that they would rather not have to face any more difficulties.  But as ever with most people, the emphasis in on the little self and its freewill and knowledge.

There's a difference between not wanting to play anymore because it hurts, and not wanting to play anymore because the game has little left to offer.  One is fear-based, the other suffused with boredom.

There are lots and lots of excuses for becoming a repeater, and most of them sound like things drug addicts say.  Really, all you need is one life here and you've got the seed you came for.

Re: the Matrix 5 material and John Grace aka Val Valerian, i asked guidance earlier about this material and i got the thought of misinformation and lack of PUL.  

 Shortly after, i found this well written and logical review of these books, and i will share the link in a bit.

My sense is that there is quite a bit of truth in this material, but like all good disinfo, it injects limiting/false concepts in with the more truthful aspects--there is an old saying that pertains to this, "Half truths are worse than whole lies for they can deceive even the Soul".  

It appears from some initial research that John Grace was quite involved with the U.S. gov.  There are forces connected to same that don't want a free, non materialistic, spiritual, and balanced humanity.   They would like the Changes not to happen.

 One of the primary, core "teachings" in this work is so called nonduality.  The author says that there is a Light and a Dark polarity which are in battle with each other, and that the only way to really graduate is to adopt a neutral, balanced way.

 However, with a little deeper probing, this source doesn't seem to understand some basic things about Reality, and its being quite dualistic when it claims that there is a Light and a "Dark" polarity that exists.  
 From everything that i've learned and experienced, there isn't really a light and dark polarity.   There is only Light, Light, and more Light which is the original and eternal aspect of Reality.  

 There is also the potential, temporal experience of lack of Light, and to varying degrees.   But this is a temporal thing, and its not something that Source the Creator Consciousness actually created (but it did allow it to arise).  It is the result of the full Freewill given to us, and its a temporary manifesting until we all fully and fully consciously merge with the Whole and Source again.

 This is similar to what Bruce teaches about PUL.  He says one of the most profound things he has learned, was that Love has no true opposite.  There can only be temporary "unLove" experienced.

 You'll notice even from a brief skimming of his site and descriptions, etc. that Val writes with an extremely elitist kind of vibe and manner.  This is to hook those upon a spiritual/metaphysical path, but who haven't gained a lot of maturity or PUL attunement yet.  

Anyways, here is the link to that review:
http://www.energygrid.com/spirit/2008/05ap-matrixv.html

I Am Dude wrote on Dec 25^th, 2008 at 1:52am:

I was also interested in this material.  It kinda sounds like a compilation of new age theories from various popular sources, including Monroe.  These books are very expensive.  It is apparently material for those on their "final incarnation."

 Vincent, if you want to follow this ultimate, pure truth info, you will have quickly divorce and separate from your wife and become homosexual in sexual orientation, because according to Val Valerian aka John Grace, the real final incarnation people are homosexual males, or should ideally be so.  

 According to this author, all women are more or less power mongers who try to control all the men around them, and they are best left alone.  He characterizes them as kind of energy suckers of men.

 That's just a taste of the lack of PUL, disinfo, and lack of real insight going on here.

 While there are differences between men and women, i don't place one above the other.  They both have their lacks AND their respective strengths.   The Female-Male duality in the physical plane, is representative of the lost Oneness awareness that happened within pure Consciousness originally (originally with a smaller percentage of Disks, but it grew somewhat).   One is not better than another, though they are different...they are One, and will be again in humanity.  

 This is why in some E.T. accounts, like in Rosilands book, the E.T. leaders are completely androgynous in nature, even as to physically (their physical is more akin to our etheric level of energy, more pliable and on a faster vibratory octave).  

 Humanity as a species may never again experience the fully androgynous state in the physical, but it can be reattained on the consciousness levels.  PUL is the great merging catalyst between these seemingly opposite polarities.   Merging and unity is the very meaning of PUL.

 As that article/review mentions, Val seems to seek to manifest yet more separation in this world, though occasionally giving lip service to unity.

Sometimes I get a feeling when I look at a site, and I don't get a good feeling when I look Val Valerian based sites. When something doesn't feel right, I wonder if it makes sense to keep reading.

Perhaps telling people that this information is for people on their final incarnation, is a way of fluffing people's egos so they'll stick around. People look for self worth in various ways.

Without even reading the Matrix V material, I assumed it would contain anti-Christian hate speech.  I have just confirmed the validity of my discernment: e. g.

"Acharya S. is great to read.  Her "Christ Conspiracy: The Greatest Story Ever Sold" will tell you all plus more on the CORRUPTION known as Christianity.  This will be especially helpful to any of you struggling with the last vestige of that POISON from your system."

Acharya S. is not taken seriously by modern critical, secular Jesus scholarship.  For example, what she says about the influence of eastern mythology on the Jesus myth can be summarily dispatched with the observation that none of these myths were even known in first century Palestine.  What she says about the dates of documents and major church councils finds no support in the scholarly consensus.  

When I complain about the New Age Ghetto mentality on display on this site, I am referring to the myopic practice of reading only New Age perspectives which do not take into account the big bad world of secular scholarship in the relevant disciplines.  Astral exploration will never be taken seriously by mainstream scholarship if New Agers continue to be too lazy to embark on an honest and open inquiry that takes into account what reputable experts (and I don't mean Christian experts!) have  discovered about topics relevant to this topic.  I have already refuted Acharya S in great length on this site and my central refutations were not challenged.  

Don

Justin,
"My sense is that there is quite a bit of truth in this material, but like all good disinfo, it injects limiting/false concepts in with the more truthful aspects--there is an old saying that pertains to this, "Half truths are worse than whole lies for they can deceive even the Soul"."

You speak of limiting/false aspects, yet you qoute a saying that portrays the indestructable soul as a possible victim.

"It appears from some initial research that John Grace was quite involved with the U.S. gov. There are forces connected to same that don't want a free, non materialistic, spiritual, and balanced humanity. They would like the Changes not to happen."

If you equate government properties with M5, I don't think you've read that which you are describing.

"One of the primary, core "teachings" in this work is so called nonduality.  The author says that there is a Light and a Dark polarity which are in battle with each other, and that the only way to really graduate is to adopt a neutral, balanced way. However, with a little deeper probing, this source doesn't seem to understand some basic things about Reality, and its being quite dualistic when it claims that there is a Light and a "Dark" polarity that exists."

Easily observed. I know some people who are more into the dark than light, and they view me as a sissy. Too light. Not conforming to their side. As this board is on the lighter side, I'm pretty sure there are those who view me as not light enough, or too dark. Probably confusing that I don't stick to either polarity. Don't know what balance is yet, but I refuse to set camp on either opposite, no matter how unlikeable it is for those who have already set up a camp. "You are either with us, or against us". Nope, doesn't have to be that polaric.
 
"From everything that i've learned and experienced, there isn't really a light and dark polarity. There is only Light, Light,
and more Light which is the original and eternal aspect of Reality."

Duality is a part of the Earth system. Have a look around. High and low, which is easy to understand. With just low being into play, high and the gradation between them wouldn't be available, Which would make for a much poorer palette of experiences possible in this system.

"This is similar to what Bruce teaches about PUL. He says one of the most profound things he has learned, was that Love has no true opposite. There can only be temporary "unLove" experienced."

I think that's comparable to warm/unwarm, because one really likes it warm. Flip side being cold/uncold, and not wanting others to even consider warm.

"You'll notice even from a brief skimming of his site and descriptions, etc. that Val writes with an extremely elitist kind of vibe and manner.  This is to hook those upon a spiritual/metaphysical path, but who haven't gained a lot of maturity or PUL attunement yet."

In my wording; you've compared not liking yeshua to be the same as hurting a puppy, and that those who aren't conforming are spitting in the face of source. What kind of level of maturity and PUL is that?

Justin,
"Vincent, if you want to follow this ultimate, pure truth info, you will have quickly divorce and separate from your wife and become homosexual in sexual orientation, because according to Val Valerian aka John Grace, the real final incarnation people are homosexual males, or should ideally be so."

M5 doesn't say you have to do anything, but I guess someone who hasn't read them wouldn't know, but believe, which is a huge difference. Val is the publisher, not the writer. You mention disinfo, and you're the one doing it. At the end of the day, the M5 series are books with the experiences and perspectives of an individual, not a bible.

"According to this author, all women are more or less power mongers who try to control all the men around them, and they are best left alone. He characterizes them as kind of energy suckers of men."

Hasty generalizations at best.

"That's just a taste of the lack of PUL, disinfo, and lack of real insight going on here."

To me you've displayed all of the above traits in your two last posts regarding this matter.

"Humanity as a species may never again experience the fully androgynous state in the physical, but it can be reattained on the
consciousness levels."

The spirit connected to a physical body already is, a blend of male and female energies. Heshe. A body on Earth can be either gender, ie. a female body, but still can tap into spirit for male energies, and the other way around.

"As that article/review mentions, Val seems to seek to manifest yet more separation in this world, though occasionally giving lip service to unity."

There are articles around about just about anything. One dude loves a band, another one think it's passable, and yet another can't stand it. Different perspectives, and different understandings of the same subject. I've heard talk here and there about PUL, and I've yet to meet anyone talking about it giving anything but lip service to it.

Different teaching, different way to view the big picture, different beliefs, different teachers, different quality of consciousness...

There a vast field of development within the earth school...  The main one is development toward Love.  Whatever the teaching we fellow or belief, if   it doesn't help the majority of the follower to become more love, it's a waste of time and resources...

Hello ALL--- I agree with PM--- no matter the decision of wether this is the last incarnation for a being or not, the love that is learned and take is the lesson.

In this series, does the author explore other incarnations other than to the earth planet? And does he/she explain how, because there is no time, the the spirit is "living" all lives simultaneously, therefore we are at the begining of our first incarnation and at the last, also?
Huuuuuummmmmmm------
cat

Regarding the below:

It kind of bugs me when people claim that Jesus traveled to the East in order to learn, because going by my extensive experience with guru based Eastern teachings, Jesus didn't teach the same thing as the gurus of this World. I've found that non-dual teachings are incomplete and in some ways inaccurate.  I don't believe that Jesus was about finding that there is no such thing as an individual being (soul). I believe he was (and still is) about each soul reaching the point where it can live according to the same love and wisdom that Jesus lives according to. Once we get to the point where we can live completely according to love and the gift of eternal life awaits us, why would we want to think ourselves out of existence? The creative aspect of being isn't a curse when we know how to use it in a wise and loving way. It comes from God just as our awareness does.





Berserk2 wrote on Feb 4^th, 2009 at 10:40pm:

Acharya S. is not taken seriously by modern critical, secular Jesus scholarship.  For example, what she says about the influence of eastern mythology on the Jesus myth can be summarily dispatched with the observation that none of these myths were even known in first century Palestine.  What she says about the dates of documents and major church councils finds no support in the scholarly consensus.   Don

Volu wrote on Feb 5^th, 2009 at 9:50am:

In my wording; you've compared not liking yeshua to be the same as hurting a puppy, and that those who aren't conforming are spitting in the face of source. What kind of level of maturity and PUL is that?

 Exactly in your wording.  I did not say that.  I said that for me, when sources degrade Yeshua in some manner, for me its like trying to hurt an innocent puppy, because of the purity of both.  I was trying to explain why *I* can become overly passionate at times regarding this subject.

 There are some that think that Val Valerian is not just the publisher but also the authors pseudonym and that they are one in the same.  I don't know for sure either way, but so far i lean to that.

 So regarding the authors work, he doesn't advocate homosexuality as the true, and most spiritual path?   So that article and review i shared was completely biased, uninformed, and just trying to put this material in a negative light?

 So the material he quotes in the question and answer question wherein the author keeps telling people that they cannot question this source because they are not evolved enough and spoke to them in a very, very overtly belitting manner, is just another ruse of the reviewer?  

 Are you personally connected to this work in some way, beyond being a fan of it?

Justin wrote:  "So the material he quotes in the question and answer question wherein the author keeps telling people that they cannot question this source because they are not evolved enough and spoke to them in a very, very overtly belitting manner, is just another ruse of the reviewer?"

Recoverer responds: "Perhaps is somebody suggests such a thing, it is time to find the nearest exit. We should always be free to question. I don't remember the precise details, but I remember finding an article on the internet where Valerian stopped making the public forum accessible, because too many people weren't evolved enough to take part in the discussions.  Such a way of thinking is really cult like in nature."  

Quote:

I was also interested in this material.  It kinda sounds like a compilation of new age theories from various popular sources, including Monroe.  These books are very expensive.  It is apparently material for those on their "final incarnation."   Vincent, if you want to follow this ultimate, pure truth info, you will have quickly divorce and separate from your wife and become homosexual in sexual orientation, because according to Val Valerian aka John Grace, the real final incarnation people are homosexual males, or should ideally be so.

Justin, the key word in my statement is "was."  This indicates the past.  When I first came across this material almost two years ago, it initially sparked my interest.  After reading more into it, this interest was lost.  

However, being that I haven't read it, I cannot judge it, only give my surface level impressions.  I do not claim to know the truth about this material.  I am sure there is at least some truth contained inside these books.  But I in no way plan on following this material, so don't worry!  Even if I were to read one of these books, I am not the kind of person who reads something and absorbs every detail like it was the holy grail.  I take what works for me and what doesn't, I leave behind.  In short, reading a book does not make you become the book, and if one wants to read this material, they should, and take from this book what they need.

Vincent, a sensitive and attuned person does not need to read a book in order to know what the main energies and intents behind it are.  

 One could remote view, or just tune into, while relaxed, any book and/or author and get strong impressions of it.  

 I've practiced remote viewing on a couple occasions, both times contained definite hits.  I've practiced many other various ways of psychically tuning into things and people, and have found that i can do this accurately more often than not.  

 One doesn't need to go OOB to explore or get info nonphysically.   I'm at the point where i'm starting to develop what i call "automatic intuition" wherein i don't have to meditate, or get "visuals" or hear things, etc. to pick up on impressions.

 Its like what Albert was saying when he just barely went to the site and felt an offness.  Same with me years ago, and years ago i didn't know about all the blatantly prejudiced and judgmental stuff he said.  I pointed this aspect out to others, because i don't expect people to just swallow just my psychic impressions.  I try to be "holistic" and Whole brained in All things.

I agree.

Identcat,
"In this series, does the author explore other incarnations other than to the earth planet?"

Yep.

"And does he/she explain how, because there is no time, the the spirit is "living" all lives simultaneously, therefore we are at the begining of our first incarnation and at the last, also?
Huuuuuummmmmmm------"

Yes, but I won't try to explain the authors experiences. My, perhaps clumsy, view: I tune into the radiowaves having access to lots of different programs at the same time.

Justin,
"So regarding the authors work, he doesn't advocate homosexuality as the true, and most spiritual path?"

An immature spirit is as likely to have a gay orientation as bi- or hetrosexual. One of my friends is gay, and while I like him and admire his strenght to be who he is in these murky waters, I've met more advanced spirits.

"So that article and review i shared was completely biased, uninformed, and just trying to put this material in a negative light?"

You've read his view of the material. If you vibrate with it, that's what's right for you.

"So the material he quotes in the question and answer question wherein the author keeps telling people that they cannot question this source because they are not evolved enough and spoke to them in a very, very overtly belitting manner, is just another ruse of the reviewer?"

I've read the review before, but I don't remember the specifics of what you're referring to. The author comes off anything but meek to me though, direct without the PC-straps, and I like that. Most people on the lighter tip of the scale doesn't like that. I for one get tired of all the fluff, especially when I notice that in myself.

"Are you personally connected to this work in some way, beyond being a fan of it?"

Nope, I don't know either Val or the author, and I don't find that interesting, but the material. Not a fan, but I like it.

Volu wrote on Feb 5^th, 2009 at 6:56pm:

An immature spirit is as likely to have a gay orientation as bi- or hetrosexual. One of my friends is gay, and while I like him and admire his strenght to be who he is in these murky waters, I've met more advanced spirits.

 Volu, i wasn't interested in hearing about your opinion on the matter.  I was specifically asking you, as someone who has read this material, what exactly the author says about this topic, and if you don't mind throwing it in, what he also says about the female gender?



Quote:

I've read the review before, but I don't remember the specifics of what you're referring to. The author comes off anything but meek to me though, direct without the PC-straps, and I like that. Most people on the lighter tip of the scale doesn't like that. I for one get tired of all the fluff, especially when I notice that in myself.

 I'm not a big fan of fluff either, and am one of the most blunt and direct people i know (a lot of Fire energy in my chart), but there are times for gentleness and diplomacy as well.   I don't believe its constructive to just belittle people and repeatedly tell them that they are not advanced enough to understand something so fly a kite, even if that may be true at times.   If one understands something well enough, they can explain it to a child so that in some way, the child will grasp something of the concept if not the entire paradigm.    

 Here is a list of his question and answer section in the 1st book.  The psychological tactics that said author uses, are very similar to various religious institutions, power/attention hungry Gurus, and other dogmatic, cultish modes and "teachers".   It starts off more balanced and mild, but gets more personally belitting.  

 First, i will share what he wrote to the reviewer of his material:


Quote:

18th June 2008: Val Valerian defended his work in the following email sent from val_valerian(at)yahoo.com to the author of this review: Andrew, You don't even know me, yet you spout ignorant bullshit you get from the net from those who don't know me either. You order the material, don't understand it, react strongly to it, and do what you do in reaction to the material. If you think its such bullshit, why bother, unless you have another agenda. The following are 35 pages of emails received from people about the material in the M5 books. They clearly comprehended and understood the material. It's here for you to read, unless you're 'afraid' to. That's a lot of people over the last 8 years who have taken the time to write because it has meant so much to them, and has helped them. How many people have you positively affected in your life? I would say, by the way you are, no one. That must make you pretty lonely and unhappy, to choose to be the way you are, but that's your choice. I hope you can live with it. Val

 Notice then in the below question-answer he says he never tries to convince or debate with anyone about the validity of his material.   I will highlight that part for your convenience, as well as some other parts i find particuarly interesting.  


Page 379 "You will realize this in time when your spirit matures more."
Page 379 "My material can be found by anyone in the Library on Monroe level 27… or within their Higher Self IF you are a Final Incarnation. Only a Final Incarnation has this complete access."
Page 390 "You are not yet at the level needed to understand that part of the material. Remember, this material is based on a Final Incarnation's perspective."
Page 391 "When you reach Final Incarnation, AND BECOME AWAKENED TO IT, you will understand what I mean."
Page 392 "Any more information… on this topic will have to wait until you reach that level and experience it for yourself."
Page 397 "If you are more advanced, you can share what you've learned but are cautioned against trying to convince them. It is up to them to take the info and run with it. This is why I answer questions but never debate or justify what I've learned."
Page 398 "You'll know what I mean when you arrive there."
Page 406 "Until you do become free of your DNA wiring [which causes a repulsion to homosexuality], you haven't reached the spiritual maturity of a Final Incarnation."
Page 408 "Many questions people have will not be answered or fully answered until you are in Final Incarnation or just ended Final Incarnation."
Page 414 "When you reach a certain level, you will better understand what I'm talking about."
Page 419 "It isn't necessary for me to say more at this time on this."
Page 420 "Just because someone reads the material does not mean they are in their Final Incarnation…"
Page 434 "In time, when you progress beyond the difficulties of 3rd density, you will come to understand that better."
Page 438 "You'll understand eventually."
Page 439 "This is VERY high material for Earther incarnates and if it can't be grasped, the incarnation is not yet ready to understand the whole of it… Hang in there."
Page 439 "You don't understand probably because you're not quite ready for it."
Page 455 "You will be given this information when you have advanced to the point where you are ready to receive it."
Page 479 "If you cannot understand this, you will as you advance."
Page 483 "That you don't understand the basic nature of the Higher Self (or you wouldn't have asked THAT question) indicates you are dealing with matters too Advanced for you at this time."
Page 486 "You'll understand more when you reach Very Advanced levels. You also should re-read ALL of M5."
Page 487 "Anyone not at that level [VERY Advanced or Finals] would ask just what you did."
Page 487 "You want to understand beyond your current level. This is impossible. I have no problem understanding but you will not be able to grasp this until your Awakened Final Incarnation, wherever in time that one is. Handle what you can and push the rest to the side…"
Page 488 "You will understand this in your own Higher Self's Awakened Final Incarnation."
Page 490
Quote:

"After what I've just written about 'ascended masters', you ask me a question like this?!... Once you reach ABOVE mid-Advanced, you will understand better."

Page 492 "You will eventually move beyond your current views even if not in this incarnation. For now, though, the answer to your question is not what you're ready to hear in full."
Page 499 "It is far more complex than the simple explanation you are looking for. I've given some hints here, but for more, you'll have to take it up with YOUR Higher Self or research the Library on Monroe level 27."
Page 501 "Having an interest in the M5 materials places you somewhere in the Advanced stages."
Page 508 "Yes, you haven't Advanced enough to deduce this yet. You will not be able to until YOUR Higher Self allows it.
Page 509 "If you are unable to grasp this, you aren't ready for the Matrix 5 materials.
Page 510 "Again, if you cannot grasp it, you aren't ready to understand it yet."
Page 510 "If you can't grasp topics in M5, just put them aside mentally. You are still assisting your Higher Self and your more Advanced incarnations."
Page 512 "If you cannot yet grasp this, you have not reached the stage of Advancement necessary to grasp it. Hang in there. At some time in your incarnational progression you will!"
Page 512 "That you use the Lightsider word 'ascension' and are concerned about the use of violence, says you are not ready for all the info in M5 yet…"
Page 517 "[David Icke] is mid-Advanced level. He is aware of M5 but is not ready for it."

 This guy, by inference, is supposedly a Final incarnation type.  So if PUL is not the measure of true spirituality, then what is?  Grasping certain mental or intellectual concepts?

 Here is part of the review wherein the reviewer points out the short sightedness and illogicalness of his exalted info.  Talking about the homosexual and like attracts like reasons to support his assertions.


Quote:

TA is also not very sophisticated in his understanding of psychology and the psyche. For him, the rule of "like attracts like" is justification for homosexuality (who said this is a fundamental rule in the first place anyway — it would be more accurate to state that polarization attracts polarization). But what he fails to grasp is that there are masculine and feminine aspects in both men and women, and that attraction is more to do with a projection of the unexpressed sexual quality (in men it is the repressed inner feminine, and in women it is the repressed inner masculine). In this way, a man being attracted to a woman could be conceived of as a "like attracts like" situation, just as it could be when a woman is attracted to a man. For TA, however, men are 100% men and women are 100% women and so that "like attracts like" can only manifest in homosexuality, heterosexuality being alien DNA programming. This viewpoint obviously works well form him because he is a homosexual. However, as a gay man he must also be aware that even in 100% homosexual relationships one partner will usually express more masculinity qualities and the other more femininity qualities. How is this explained by "like attracts like"? There is very clearly a natural interplay between these two gender-associated energies, and it is disingenuous for TA to take such a simplistic perspective on gender to justify his position.

 So much of what the reviewer says about this material strikes me as very logical and common sense like in the above.   Note the reviewer refers to this author as "TA".  Here is some more logical reasoning from the reviewer:


Quote:

Interestingly, the inferiority of women is one prejudice that TA seems to share with traditional fundamentalism. In his words, "The purpose of the female gender (from the simultaneous point of view) was to have a totally different experience than the male, not to have an equal experience… The current female problem is one of the most serious threats to the simultaneously incarnating path on Earth today. You cannot escape the Game and graduate to higher matters until you are aware of this problem and your body has overcome the alien DNA commands to 'serve the female'. [Italics is TA's.] He goes on to write that the source and root of humanity's problems are "DNA commands" programmed into our cells by the matriarchal Orion Empire which "give the body dominance over the spirit" and serve only "the Orion Empire and its queen." This DNA mutation set by Orion, "subjugates the life-giving male by the manipulative, controlling female, as it is in the [body-focused Orion] Empire. The female gender has caused more problems and sadness than anything but religion… In my own life, ALL interpersonal problems have been either directly because of females or men under the control of females. If the female isn't convinced she is in control and manipulating the male(s) in her life… and any other male(s) she chooses, she will make life miserable." From TA's perspective, "Homosexuals are the most connected to their animating spirit. The [matriarchal] alien codes are short-circuited." Men should not be with women because "THE SPIRIT KNOWS IT'S AN ABOMINATION TO BE WITH THOSE THAT DON'T VIBRATE LIKE YOU!!!" [TA's italics, capitalization and exclamation marks.] And he adds that if a person is uncomfortable with homosexuality, "put it aside. It'll make sense in a later time" [when that person is more spiritually developed]. TA's complete intolerance to his philosophy being questioned is demonstrated in a response he gave to someone in the Questions and Answers section of Volume 1 of the Matrix V material in which a reader questioned whether he had any direct evidence for the "female domination" he constantly refers to. It reads (vol 1, page 379): "That you are unable to see this evidence shows your body controls your spirit in this matter. That you are unable to see this is too basic to be addressed here. This material is for Dominant and Final incarnations. It is not debatable, as you seek to do, but is very plain for those advanced incarnations to see." When the questioner then states that explanations for female domination that involve alien Orion influences seem "rather empty" and that it would be "better to stick to observable facts for the majority of people," TA spitefully responds: "Now, who died and make you spokesman for 'the majority of people'? Again, I state this material is NOT for the majority of people for they are their body and are more than 50% controlled by their body. Your comments are pure of the body and of less than advanced spiritual development, which is OK [sic], but is not addressed by this material which has plenty of caution and warning to those it is NOT meant for." In translation: don't you dare question my spiritual authority to state Truth without explanation, you spiritual dwarf!

Justin,
"Volu, i wasn't interested in hearing about your opinion on the matter.  I was specifically asking you, as someone who has read this material, what exactly the author says about this topic, and if you don't mind throwing it in, what he also says about the female gender?"

If you're not asking about my opinions, then why are you even asking me? I'm not a mind reader. I cannot possibly explain others' experiences and perspectives. If I were to describe yours, they would be tinted of my views and my understanding. Basic stuff. If you want to know, you can.

"I don't believe its constructive to just belittle people and repeatedly tell them that they are not advanced enough to understand something so fly a kite, even if that may be true at times."

'to just' is a broad generalization. For me the question is equally important as the answer. If you won't say what you're thinking, it suggests an element of fear on your part, even though you might label it as something else.

"If one understands something well enough, they can explain it to a child so that in some way, the child will grasp something of the concept if not the entire paradigm."

What I've read is surprisingly plain and easy to both read and understand considering the topics. Treating adults like children to me means being afraid of telling it like it is, which may feel hurtful for the one spoken to, but can be a potential for growth if a victim gown isn't put on.

"Here is a list of his question and answer section in the 1st book.  The psychological tactics that said author uses, are very similar to various religious institutions, power/attention hungry Gurus, and other dogmatic, cultish modes and "teachers".   It starts off more balanced and mild, but gets more personally belitting."

For me it's clearly stated several times in the material that the author doesn't want to be anyone's leader, and it's something that would have put me off instantly. I'm my own leader. If a student of music comes to me, clearly lacking even the basics, and yet start lecturing me, I'd not be afraid to let the student know exactly where I stand. As for the answers, they're sequential responses to different questions from different individuals.

"Notice then in the below question-answer he says he never tries to convince or debate with anyone about the validity of his material."

What I notice is that the questions leading to the answers aren't there. And I don't see why would anyone need to convince or prove anything to anybody - both the earth, astral and beyond is open for your very own direct experience.

"I will highlight that part for your convenience, as well as some other parts i find particuarly interesting."

I've already read all the questions and answers, and I liked them. If you wonder why anybody thinks the way they do, I suggest you ask them, or find out for yourself.

"Reviewer: But what he fails to grasp is that there are masculine and feminine aspects in both men and women[...]"

Sounds like the reviewer has skipped quite a few pages.

"[...]better to stick to observable facts for the majority of people," TA spitefully responds: "Now, who died and make you spokesman for 'the majority of people'?"

Spiteful? More like a nice one.

 Volu, you are talented indeed, talented at evading direct questions, talented at taking quotes and sayings of people completely out of context, and by inference of the two above, talented at manipulation.  

Methinks you are either extremely self delusional re: this work,

OR

one of my little squirrel friends that i got dream guidance about and my present astro. transits indications highlight probability of interactions with via such a forum like this.  i.e. mix 3rd, 11th, and 12th house areas with a Pluto/Moon square in Cardinal signs (i.e. signs having more to do with the outside world, than the inner) involving Capricorn the sign of organized large social-power structures (like gov. world banking, etc) and things connected to same and both Libra and Moon indicating public interactions/relations (12th house corresponding to secret enemies, Libra to open enemies, and Pluto corresponding to such sub groups like MK Ultra, U.S. gov./military remote viewing groups, the "Cabal", etc.. , and square corresponding to friction)

 My squirrel friends love material like the Matrix, and any other material which keeps people confused re: PUL and what spiritual development is all really about, fostering more separation in the world, and generally trying to keep the vibration of humanity at a slower and more limited rate in order for them to be more easily manipulated.  And boy, manipulated on a grand and micro scale we are.
 The Bush admin. was a great at exposing this kind of mass manipulation for reasons of greed, power hunger, etc, yet that is only the surface of the deeper issues going on.   I say, thank God for the Bush admin. if for no other reason to make more people think more deeply about the corrupt nature of Gov. and the forces which really control and influence same the most.  

 Certainly i think the M. material speaks for itself.  Particularly in regards towards the female gender, the authors claims of supposed level of highest spiritual development, and his pretty silly and illogocial view on homosexuality being one of the true marker of the most advanced types around.  

 Like the reviewer of said material said, it also speaks volumes on how silent The Monroe Institute was on the subject when directly asked about this material and the authors supposed connections to TMI.  I became aware of corrupt forces in connection with this group (TMI) as well, when i went there, though there are many sincere and spiritually developed people still yet involved with it.  Monroe himself mentions that they would routinely get agents that came went there undercover to scope it out and to try to learn nonphysical perceptual skills.  It has evolved to something else now, more influence from and by these types who are mostly hired tools for others more unloving and corrupt than they.

 See yah around, but i've lost all interest in talking about Matrix material.  I suggest that if people are interested in this material, then read the review i linked for it brings up many good points.  

 

There are two key things cult leaders do:

1. They try to get their followers to the point where they always put supposed master's words before their own discrimination. Once you buy into the con that somebody is infallible, this somebody has hooked you in.  How could a person possibly question the validity of something said by a source, when this person believes that such a source is infallible? Sometimes our minds can be like limited computer programs, if we don't watch out, and allow somebody else to be our programmer.

2. Cult leaders try to make it seem as if you are special and above the rest of the World. Once your mind becomes dependent upon such a way of self affirmation, it is hard to let go of the related way of thinking, because on some level of your mind you'll believe that your sense of self worth will be negated. A sense of self worth is something that is important to all of us.

One would think that a true master would understand the above, and find ways of helping a person that doesn't include such traps.

Going by his own words and actions, what approach does Val Valerian take?

I need to add that there are spirit beings who are genuine masters, and perhaps some humans that know a lot. However, because of the number of false spiritual teachers that exist in this World, I believe that a person who has a good amount of understanding, wouldn't present his or HER (sorry Val) self in a way where his or her students (not followers) couldn't question he or she.

Here's another question. How could a person come to the point where she (or he) understands what somebody is saying, if she isn't free to question what was said? Wouldn't she need to have the freedom to question the issue in an unbiased manner?

<<Once your mind becomes dependent upon such a way of self affirmation, it is hard to let go of the related way of thinking, because on some level of your mind you'll believe that your sense of self worth will be negated.>>

Albert-

Very good point.  I would just add that most folks who are attracted to cults probably have self worth problems to begin with.  

Documentaries that have been done on Jim Jones and his Jonestown cult demonstrate that most adherents tended to be people who, for one reason or another, were unable to deal with inter-personal relationships.  

The cult became their surrogate home, and Jones became their surrogate parent.  So much so that they willingly drank the kool aid, opting to die rather than to be forced to return to society.

Rondele:

I believe that some cults are more extreme than other cults.  Many aren't as extreme as the Jim Jone's cult. In a way the less extreme cults are a bigger problem, because it is harder to see what they are about. This is especially true when they associate themselves with supposed genuine teachings that have existed for thousands of years. This cult thing was started a long time ago. A lot of people have wanted to be treated as some kind of God.

There are times when what you wrote applies, but there are also many people who become involved with cults because they are sincere spiritual seakers. I've know a number of people who are former cult members, and they are sincere seekers.

Unfortunately, the internet has made cult access much more available.


rondele wrote on Feb 6^th, 2009 at 5:14pm:

<<Once your mind becomes dependent upon such a way of self affirmation, it is hard to let go of the related way of thinking, because on some level of your mind you'll believe that your sense of self worth will be negated.>> Albert- Very good point.  I would just add that most folks who are attracted to cults probably have self worth problems to begin with.   Documentaries that have been done on Jim Jones and his Jonestown cult demonstrate that most adherents tended to be people who, for one reason or another, were unable to deal with inter-personal relationships.   The cult became their surrogate home, and Jones became their surrogate parent.  So much so that they willingly drank the kool aid, opting to die rather than to be forced to return to society.

Justin,
You end with see yah around, but I will respond to that.

I speak for myself, and not on the behalf of others. Simple to understand. You presented quotes, and the answers from the material were indeed taken out of context. Yet you state I'm talented at manipulation. Double talk.

It's indeed fine to form opinions about me, but when you speak of self delusional one moment, and then segway into squirrel friends in a dream guidance, maybe you ought to have a review about your self.

My understanding of astrology is limited, so I can't reply to that, but with the help of your friends you mention government and a mind control project and point the finger at me. I suggest you check out who's helping you point your finger.

 Tell us exactly what those quotes were about then.  Read and write from your books, and outline them clearly and concisely.  This is what i asked for earlier.  Instead of generalizing and making vague statements, back up your claims since you like the reviewer have read said books.

 Re: squirrels.  One time i was wondering if there are people who have the job of trying to mess with, in various ways, certain people for certain reasons.  These people are connected to groups which essentially want to keep humanity down, and there is all kinds of ways that they go about this.  One is promote various "spiritual teachings", that facilitate peoples separatist, negative, and lack of light aspects/tendencies to grow.  

 Anyways, after feeling this in relation to a poster i knew, i thought perhaps i was being overly paranoid re: such thoughts--i doubted my impressions.   As often, i later got guidance during dream state, about this issue.
 I will not into the whole dream here, but my dream guidance seemed to say that yes there are individuals that work for such groups that go out into various public arenas, etc.  My Greater self used the symbol of them being like 'squirrels" for various reasons--mostly to show that they appear innocent at first, but after a couple of the squirrels did specific things to me in the dream, showed also the destructive nature of squirrels (like for one they cause a lot of damage to houses often).  My Greater self was also trying to say, don't worry about it because ultimately they are like squirrels i.e. pests which can do you no real harm on your path and present level.

 They are trained both psychologically and psychically ala the U.S. govs. mind control and remote viewing type programs, both well documented and not "conspiracy theory".  

Most people won't talk about such stuff out in the open for fear of how others will perceive them (most people have a deep, far reaching need to be liked and accepted by others--i don't for the most part), because to most it sounds pretty fear based and loony.  Yet i have no fear when i think of such groups, etc.  I don't give a flying rats arse how people perceive me, and if i think or feel something, why not say it outloud if my intentions are not to hurt people but to make them aware of the shadow side of humanity.  

  Notice i said you seem to either be deluded re: this work (being of a high source, etc) OR ....    I don't know for sure either, and make no definite claims, either one would seem logical to me, and thus i presented both as possibilities.   Those astrological indications indicate such interactions becoming highlighted in my life presently, particularly via a forum like this (for the 3rd and 11th houses were strongly involved--3rd house representing everyday/typical, personal communication between self and others, and the 11th representing groups and forums like this).  

 My wife has likewise gotten info re: the certain aspects of U.S. or rather world gov., being aware of many things like spiritual issues, the changes, E.T.'s, etc. and she likewise has received info on various occasions that there is much more going on with some of these groups than meets the eye.   Heck, Monroe reports running into a psychic bodyguard around one of the Presidents by accident, and that was before the below became more extreme.  

(the below)   The U.S. gov, and other gov's, have been more or less hijacked by forces of almost unbelievable greed and power hunger.  They operate very strongly within the fear range, and thus have an insatiable need for control and to remain top dogs with the most amount of money and material influence in the World.   They have been interested in, and have sponsored via the U.S. (particularly black ops operations, groups, etc. paid for by us) various programs both here and other places which have the goal of keeping humanity dumbed down and more easily manipulated.   Again, one of their ways is to create from scratch, or foster, various belief systems and "teachers" which mislead people in key ways.

After having studied many examples in history of such mass control, they have realized that full out and out dictatorship just doesn't work very well, because eventually a materially repressed peoples will revolt.  
So, they changed their tactics to become much more subtle.  They use half truths to mislead people, they use religion, cults, channeled spiritual teachings, and anything which they think will influence a largely gullible and non spiritually discriminative population.  So far its been pretty collectively successful, but now they are finding it harder and harder because there is a great awakening that is trying to burst through all the collective b.s., illusions, and shadow aspects of humanity.    This great awakening is happening through the worldwide realization of a basic, Oneness and Unity underlying all beings and phenom.  

 So in keeping with the times, they have to change with the times and present material which talks just enough about such concepts, but often in a polarized way.

 They do this in a very ingenuous way, of injecting plenty of truth into these various belief systems so that on some deeper levels some of the info will resonate with people, but at the same time injecting those limiting beliefs, or in the case of a well known channeled book programming polarization into peoples psyche--i know because i got caught up in that "teaching" for awhile, until i got guidance to drop it.  When actively reading, i noticed myself become more polarized and emphasizing ego, etc.    

 Both my wife and i have had waking moments of perceiving some consciousnesses spying on us (why, i'm not completely sure, but one of her dreams talks about this wherein she reflects with guidance while in the in between state) and we perceived them as large spiders.  In my case very black and in her case, more reddish and black.   During these respective times, we saw these very clearly, and i believe our physical minds translated, or they chose the appearance, of spiders because of the nature of same and what certain aspects represent.

 We've also become aware of the deeper aspects of a remote viewer who is involved with TMI.   Me through a meditation vision at TMI, and my wife through that same dream and inbetween guidance state.  

 Even with all the above experiences, dreams, impressions, etc. i still not completely sure about all the aspects of the above.   It's not something i really give much thought to, and rarely think of it in a deeper way.  
But having been very naive in some other lives strongly connected to my psyche; i will not be so naive and trusting in this life (both of which innately tend to because i tend to concentrate on the good in life and in people).  I've had my legs cut out from under me, in a material sense, too many times from similar groups and scenarios to turn a blind eye to such pervasive and concentrated patches of corruption in humanity.  

 I'm aware that even here, very few would agree with most, or even some of the above, and i'm ok with that and being perceived in a less than flattering light.   Perhaps when they have the experiences that i and my wife have had, they may eventually change their tune.  

Justin,
"Tell us exactly what those quotes were about then.  Read and write from your books, and outline them clearly and concisely. This is what i asked for earlier.  Instead of generalizing and making vague statements, back up your claims since you like the reviewer have read said books."

I'm talking to you, Justin. The above make demands both for yourself and 'us'. Who are they? I don't appease demands. If you want something done, my sentiment is to do it yourself. You're trying to push me against the wall and tell me to back up my claims since I like the books. Not one to be pushed around, nor an errand boy. I rebel against being told what to do, and very stubborn about it. My sun sign is also capricorn, but with libra rising.

As you have leo rising; I think you're good at expressing your thoughts through writing. I can be uncomfortably forthcoming, but also friendly. Is that squirrely? My understanding of astrology is basic, but can glean some things.

"I'm aware that even here, very few would agree with most, or even some of the above, and i'm ok with that and being perceived in a less than flattering light. Perhaps when they have the experiences that i and my wife have had, they may eventually change their tune."

I don't think it's a less flattering light, and I do like reading and hearing about other's exp. Your thoughts regarding many governments not being what they seem I totally agree with. I'd say most if not all governments. I've also heard from some sources that some aspects of TMI have been compromised. Some views of spirituality I can agree with, the disc/I-There, others not at all, but that's how it is and very ok. My exp: when starting to realize the immortality of the self, it's easier to observe, not be a part of, the darker areas of this system, without being in fear or producing fear. What I don't like however is a notion of being connected to those forces.

As for mkultra/mind control, I've read Cathy O'Brien's book and seen some videos about/with her. Very rough story. Can't validate her exp, but she comes off as sincere to me.

 You're right Volu, that was a bit demanding of me and thank you for pointing that out.  I will watch/observe more closely those tendencies.  Fellow Capyycorn eh, seems like everyone i've been debating with more lately is a Cappycorn, you, Vince and myself (having Libra Moon i sometimes debate with myself too).  

  I'm sorry if the other (or either) possibility i brought up bothered you in some way.  On reflection, it does seem callous on my part to speak that outloud, but i'm of the opinion that there isn't much difference between speaking and thinking/feeling, except that in the former case at least people have more of a chance to consciously know what you're about.  

 Also, to keep in mind that i tend to be more skeptical of people who, in my perception, support in some way, sources which strike me as disinfo or rather off spiritually in some respects.

  Also your seeming personal concentration on me along with the above, when i did not originally respond to you and your first post at all, but was speaking in general.

The above combo raises various "flags", considering my experiences and guidance, what i know and what they (corrupt, controlling groups) know i know.  One would logically think that if the above is true, then those hired by same, would tend to focus on folks like me.

 To broach another subject and source, i read one of David Ickes books and skimmed others.   With him also i got a sense of quite a bit of truth, but more in the form of half truths and negative concentration.  I.E. typical of "disinfo" type information.    Especially considering what he talks about.

 He talks about similar things as i did in my last long post, except that he gives it such a far out spin, that most people out there, even those interested in similar concepts, are going to think "wow, this guys off his rocker, and so isn't anyone else who believes him or similar info."

  This is purposeful, to ultimately discredit the actual true parts of things he talks about. I.E. the world banking system and families being the real material rulers, and mover and shakers in this world.  Also that unfriendly E.T.'s are involved with Earth (but not in the way that Icke portrays).  Because if you make people think that such a source is so off about some things, they are more apt to believe that its ALL off.  

 It's a kind of propaganda, reverse psychology, and subtle mind/belief control process.   Very ingenious if you really think about it.   And i don't mind being the scapegoat to expose same.  I should perhaps work towards a Phd or something like same, to sound more credible if i wanted to disseminate this kind of info into the mainstream.  But, all in all i'm not too worried about said groups and influences for their time is coming to an end, and major changes are brewing on many levels.    They will be ousted one way or another.   And never again let into positions of power and influence, for people in the future will be able to psychically read one another much better and more clearly in the nearish future and will focus on PUL a lot more, which is already starting to happen with the more spiritually mature folks around.  

"Fellow Capyycorn eh, seems like everyone i've been debating with more lately is a Cappycorn, you, Vince and myself (having Libra Moon i sometimes debate with myself too)."  

Sun, moon and mercury in capricorn. I take my time, but I'm getting there, eventually. How did you get into astrology?

"I'm sorry if the other (or either) possibility i brought up bothered you in some way.  On reflection, it does seem callous on my part to speak that outloud, but i'm of the opinion that there isn't much difference between speaking and thinking/feeling, except that in the former case at least people have more of a chance to consciously know what you're about."

Takes two to tango. :) Seems to me we're speaking our minds. I don't mind heated sometimes, it can bring more to the table, as long as it doesn't get boiling. Heat can challenge one's perception of who you are, or who you thought you were. I sure do mistakes, but I try to correct them when or if I notice them. And sometimes it takes time to realize that I was wrong about something because of my stubbornness. Still learning, and happy to do so.

"Also, to keep in mind that i tend to be more skeptical of people who, in my perception, support in some way, sources which strike me as disinfo or rather off spiritually in some respects. Also your seeming personal concentration on me along with the above, when i did not originally respond to you and your first post at all, but was speaking in general. The above combo raises various "flags", considering my experiences and guidance, what i know and what they (corrupt, controlling groups) know i know. One would logically think that if the above is true, then those hired by same, would tend to focus on folks like me."

Perhaps good to discern as long as it doesn't turn into paranoia, which is a vibration I can be without. Careful instead of fearing. My method is often to look for elements of control, whether guide, friends and so on. I want friends, not leaders. That's what works for me. Other ways work for others.

"To broach another subject and source, i read one of David Ickes books and skimmed others. With him also i got a sense of quite a bit of truth, but more in the form of half truths and negative concentration.  I.E. typical of "disinfo" type information. Especially considering what he talks about.  He talks about similar things as i did in my last long post, except that he gives it such a far out spin, that most people outthere, even those interested in similar concepts, are going to think "wow, this guys off his rocker, and so isn't anyone else who believes him or similar info."

I don't like negative concentration in the sense that 'it's all doom and gloom', because then it's waaaay too dark and random, and missing out on quite a lot imo. What I've noticed is that as I've progressed, I've been able to look into stuff without fear, whereas before I wouldn't have been able to handle that before. And if I notice fear in my thoughts when checking something out, I move on. Some of the concepts Icke convery, especially about self/spririt, I find a bit long winding, and too muddy. An oversoul/disc/higher self/i-there makes much more sense to me.

"This is purposeful, to ultimately discredit the actual true parts of things he talks about. I.E. the world banking system and families being the real material rulers, and mover and shakers in this world. Also that unfriendly E.T.'s are involved with Earth (but not in the way that Icke portrays).  Because if you make people think that such a source is so off about some things, they are more apt to believe that its ALL off."

To me it looks like somebody is gearing up for a one monetary system, and one world government. And in that sense I think Icke
is spot on about problem/reaction/solution. Problem: the monetary system doesn't work, you're broke (threats to the self, which I think is probably harder for somebody thinking they are their bodies). Reaction: do something, anything, now. Solution: What a coincidence, we happen to have a plan for that.

How does your views on unfriendly aliens/E.T's differ from Icke?

Many will think subjects like these are off. But I've chosen to let their greater self deal with that. I don't want to control how they live their lives. I've gotten pretty good at noticing when others are up for these types of conversations or not. That's how I go about.