http://pets.groups.yahoo.com/group/humanchimphybrid/?yguid=11705269

I have often wondered about the possibility real a very real possibly of science genetically creating a chimp/ human hybrid. They already have a name for this creature "humanzee Horrors"

Nearly all dogs like animals can be hybridized and so can cats. There has already been the successful crossing of a sheep/ goat hybrid.

These two animals are further apart on the genetic scale than humans are to apes

A delicate subject and I am not suggesting some sort of human ape sex just manipulation of genetic code in the lab and implanting this onto the body of a female ape such as a chimp. But I see awful consequences if this becomes a reality

I think that behind the secret closed doors of some mysterious laboratory this has already been attempted and maybe, god forbid this Frankenstein like beast created

Would it have a soul and how would human society treat such an entity?

Alan

Alan,

It's my opinion based on my experience that all animals already have souls, including humans and apes, since both are animals. In my opinion so do goats and sheep. So, I cannot see any other possibility than the kind of hybrid you describing having a soul. Probably, this would be a hybrid soul.  

The legends of Atlantis claim that scientists there created many such hybrids with many different animal species. Supposedly, they created a hybrid human-horse to be a work animal.  Unfortunately for these hybrids many retained the same level of intelligence and awareness as human beings, though some were in the realm we might describe as retarded human beings.

Supposedly, many years later, other Atlantean scientists worked toward eliminating the animal traits carried by these hybrid individuals through further genetic engineering.  Supposedly, some of the extremely rare, anomalous human birth defects in which a human infant has some animal traits, are the genetic residual of these early Atlantean experiments in genetic engineering.

Supposedly, some of these Atlantean genetic engineers are presently incarnated within physical reality and once again practicing their art of genetic engineering with the goal of improving human life. Perhaps it would be well for those genetic engineers to realize that they are uncorking a bottle wherein lives a Genie who was allowed out of the bottle in Atlantean times.  

With great power comes great and the sometimes grave responsibility.

Bruce

I figure a Soul is a Soul, regardless of what kind of body it occupies.  I doubt that any Soul gets eternally limited by the kind of body it used for a "short" time while physically incarnated.

There isn't much difference between a human body and an animal body, except for a few IQ points.  Spirit IQ levels are much higher than human brain IQs.

I'm not certain about this, but I figure that when Disks/oversouls came to this World there weren't any human incarnations available. First Disks/oversouls dealt with animal incarnations. Eventually, they started dealing with human incarnations. Perhaps selves/probes that used to play the role of animal, learn from Disk members who play the role of human.

There are also roles beyond the earth life system. In the end each of us becomes a Soul with many types of experiences. I believe that sometimes we human beings get so caught up in being human, we figure it is the only kind of existence that matters.

Hi

I agree that animals have souls   :)  Here are some glimpses of animals souls that perhaps you've noticed too -

The empathy that a family pet can have with its humans is marvelous to experience. A child coming home with a bad report card or an adult coming down with a fever will often get reassurance from a concerned pet;

a recent magazine article by a horse owner told about trail riding with a horse that would stop at the crest of hills but only if the view was beautiful. The horse would then look both ways and sigh deeply before moving on;  

Photos of zoo and research chimps often show the animals looking inward while they consider their plight. What are they looking inward to if not their souls?

:)  Bets

This raises an interesting question....if animals have souls, what about insects?  If I swap a fly, does its soul go into some sort of fly afterlife?

To carry the analogy a bit further, would living flies perform retrievals for those flies who get stuck?

I don't see how we can say animals have souls without at least acknowledging that any living thing, even head lice, have souls.  If not, where do we draw the line?

"where do we draw the line?"
excellent question Roger. When I think about it, what about viruses, and what about things we don't label "living"? Has anything a soul? And what makes a thing a thing, what makes something separate of something?

I have no answer.
Finally, we don't even know what a soul exactly is. We know nothing!

Spooky

Hi, Bruce and others

Bruce Stated


Quote:

It's my opinion based on my experience that all animals already have souls, including humans and apes, since both are animals. In my opinion so do goats and sheep. So, I cannot see any other possibility than the kind of hybrid you describing having a soul. Probably, this would be a hybrid soul

I agree as an animal lover if the afterlife were not also inhabited by souls of animals I don’t think I would like to go there.

I lost a beloved dog as a young boy and I experienced grief unlike any I have had up until this very day. Even the passing of my beloved parents did not affect me this way (strangely)

There might be a dilemma  whether this creature would be considered a human or animal or even a pet.

But I see we all concur that it must indeed have a soul

People will properly be up in arms stating we are interfering with Gods creation, but I do not agree, God gave humanity the intelligence to manipulate the generic molecule code. But to actually create life, only God can do this don’t you think?

Regards

Alan

Ohh....
     yeah... well....
I thought we got around that issue pretty well for a while.   :D

Since we've been told not to kill human life, I'd be hesitant to support making new ones from humans.  We breed species of other mammals in order that they fit human need or particular environments, etc. We got that idea from nature but we wanted it faster, now.

A super-intelligent species ( anyone smarter than us  ;) ) must have some of the same doubts about using humans to shore up their gene-pool, -- if there is such a situation.

Hi Spooky,

You make an interesting pint about viruses. What the heck is the purpose in the balance of nature do these little monsters have except to make us sick?

I posed this question of a science forum and the answer I got is they have a place in the process of evolution. Causing advantagest mutations? I personally have never read about any mutation that was positive.

Alan

We love to think of our pet dog or cat waiting for us in the afterlife.  But if all living things have souls, does that mean we'll have to put up with their fleas when we die?

Rog

Silly boy silly boy, in the plagues when Moses was trying to get Pharaoh to let his people go God tormented the Egyptians with pests and bugs etc.

So even to God these little beasties are entities without souls, but having a purpose in the balance of nature.

You are not Roger my sibling are you, he has just your type of sense of humor?
Alan

Alan-

Yeah, guilty as charged.

Seriously, however, there was an NDE account posted on this board a few years ago about a lady who, while clinically dead, saw her beloved deceased dog sitting in a lounge chair in a well-appointed library.  The dog was smoking a pipe, reading a book.  Beyond the library windows was a beautiful meadow with towering, majestic trees.

The lady explained that the library was an exact duplicate of the one in which her dog would lie, watching her husband sitting in an identical chair and yes, smoking a pipe while reading.

So, she concluded that her dog was simply re-creating a scene with which he was familiar while alive.

She was thrilled, and claimed it was proof positive that pets exist in the afterlife, waiting anxiously for our arrival (although one would think the dog would want a field full of fire hydrants rather than trees.....).

Personally I would have a slightly different conclusion, but then who knows? Maybe all those gold fish I lost in my childhood are swimming around, waiting for me with open fins.

R

About that lady and her dog, smoking a pipe and reading a book.....

I wonder who was in the doghouse out in the back yard....and what about those fleas....?

Now I'm really confused. :)

This whole soul thing is most interesting. During a trip to TMI, I had the pleasure while doing an exercise that I had direct communication with my All through a tree. I have told the story on this site before some time back..The tree communicated with me the meening of life itself. That everything has a living energy within it that exists for sacrifice. That included the tree that the communication was coming from, rocks, dirt, and even fleas. (apparantely that even includes my X wife who I thought for years had no soul. LOL)The communication was very real and one of the most moving experiences of this lifetime for me. This is All reality as shown to me. That not one is more significant than the other. I, no better or more than that flea, or even a rock. Just different. The flea is just as welcome in heaven as you or I.  As everyone's reality is different, this may not hold true for you or the heaven you believe in. My heaven is open to All.  

Souls existed long before human beings did. Why can't they extend little parts of themselves to experience different types of experiences? It is human vanity that makes a big deal out of human incarnations. What's more important is the basic nature of the spirit that makes use of such a vehicle/means of learning.

<<It is human vanity that makes a big deal out of human incarnations.>>

Albert- didn't Jesus come in human form for a reason?  

His teachings, after all, were directed to humans, not to insects or animals.

To me, being created as a human is a precious gift, and yes, a very big deal indeed.

Very true Albert. The lessons need not only come through human existence. All existences are equal in importance. None less than the other. Only the ego can make us blind to the truth. I know that there have been other lifetimes when I have incarnated as not human. Only through experiencing and learning necessary lessons have I progressed far enough to be so lucky as to be able to have my lessons come while I am in a human form. Its only a body! Not to mention the lessons learned while OOB and/or without a body. 

Rog,

I really don’t think that lady you mention had a NDE. It was either an illusion, delusion. She was kidding or making the whole story up.

May I dare to say even blatantly lying to get a response? Which I am sure she did to debunk the NDE phenomenon

Alan

This thread makes me want to apologize to all the spiders and other insects I keep offing in my apartment. The only ones not getting whacked are wasps and flies, because they are easily led outside without the need to touch them. I wish I wasn't so afraid of bugs. I hope spiders and the rest have souls, and isn't too annoyed at me for having ended their experience.

Roger:

Perhaps animals and insects don't need any spiritual teachers because they simply act according to their programmed nature. When they return to the spirit World they don't have a belief system to contend with.  

Us humans on the other hand, we seem to have higher intellects, more of an ability to make choices, and therefore we get lost at times.

The minds of animals do get messed with at times when people do things like train them to become fighting pitbulls.

If a being is aware, then it is able to suffer or experience happiness and love just like humans are able to, and its being comes from no place other than God.  Why treat the Souls of animals as insignificant?

Look at a dog real closely, and notice that physiologically it isn't that much different than a human body.  Animals and humans reproduce, animals and humans get sick, animals and humans eat, animals and humans...

Albert



Rog_B wrote on Sep 4^th, 2008 at 5:21pm:

<<It is human vanity that makes a big deal out of human incarnations.>> Albert- didn't Jesus come in human form for a reason?   His teachings, after all, were directed to humans, not to insects or animals. To me, being created as a human is a precious gift, and yes, a very big deal indeed.

The belief that lowly life forms have souls has its roots in some Karmic schools ,relating to the process or progress to higher evolved life...

Why I find this idea silly is tell me guys how does a bad cockroach become a good cockroach, even an ascended master cockroach to it can reincarnate into maybe a frog.  :D ::)

Alan

HiHo  :)

With the amount of consciousness they have, cockroaches are busy doing their thing. They probably don't spend alot of time considering good, bad, and future incarnations.  ;) From their cockroach incarnation they can decide if they're ready for more consciousness and therefore more responsibility, say, that of a frog.  :D (Seriously.)

Maybe one aspect of a successful life in any form is whether we can stay in touch with God/ Higher Self/etc.
Maybe that is what feeds our souls the higher energies they need to increases our consciousness in future lives.

Bets