Hi :'( I and Deanna went to the healing last night and we did nothing wrong to anyone and they were horrible to us especially george who runs it,only problem is as usual ,cant work out why,im seriously thinking of giving up trying to be a medium as i think,if i was meant to be a medium ,there wouldnt be so much opposition in my way,im so fed up with it ,its always the twins,everywhere we go,me and deanna would not be here if it wasnt for the fact,that we love our children,but i know we wouldnt commit suicide,but we know ,when we get to the spirit world,we will be home,because God loves us,im sorry for writing this ,but this is the only place we seem to be accepted,me and Deanna were crying last night,trying to work out why. :'(I said to deanna ,there does not seem many more places we can go,if it wasnt for my children,i would want to die and be with dad. :'(

Love and God bless   Love Juditha

Juditha,

Are you sure that "fitting in" is what you and Deanna really want?

Ask yourself that. Let it sit a while. Is "fitting in" really a healthy response to today's world?

Do you really want total acceptance? It only comes from within.

I only say these things because I know you understand them.

much much much much love, blink :)

Juditha,

I'm so sorry to hear that the meetings/healings are still not going well.  I'm starting to feel like no matter what you and Deanna do, George is going to act ugly anyway. >:(

I agree with Blink, that maybe it's just not the place for you and Deanna to to be.  Is there another spiritulist church you girls could try to attend besides the one you're currently going to?

I don't think you two should give up.  If you truly have a calling for this, something has to work out.  Keep your chin up, okay?

Luv,
Katie

hey, chin up! what if Columbus had turned back? we'd still think the world was flat :-X

notice your pattern of on/off. theres a decision to be made so you will stop the conflict.

I think you're over reacting to some snide comment and the world is full of that. the first thing that came to mind when I read your post, similar to another post you made, was that you are being put through the fire. its like a testing period for you and Deanna, to see if you can stand up to all the hype you're going to find.

only the really tough ones make it around here lovey, and I've seen that you can be tough and loving at the same time, so don't let me down!

I'm with Kate - f they don't treat you well, then the heck with them.  Unfortunately there is often a time at which we have gained all we can fromone set of circumstances and friends and need to move on. Job Number One is to see to your own welfare, because then you can see also to the welfare of others. That's why the Flight Attendants on the airlines say to put on Your oxygen mask first, so that you'll still be there to put one on your kids etc.

By the way - since when did mediumship ever have to do with "fitting in" - I don't get the impression that you're a sheep.

dave

Hi dave aylsia kate and blink   I and deanna cannot go there anymore now as i told George last night to stick his church were the sun dont shine and the reason i did that was because deanna had a go at this woman who's husband is dieing of cancer because she spoke to deanna like she was nothing and deanna went back at her and this woman is always in the kitchen with george sitting on his lap and all deanna did was talk to george instead of wipeing the tea cups up

So this woman got off georges lap and said to deanna,"oh well i will wipe up its obvious your not going to ,your to busy talking to george",so deanna said to her,"Dont talk to me like that ,you can do the bloody washing up on your own in future",so george said to deanna" eh eh eh you can shut up" so i told george to leave deanna alone and stick his church were the sun dont shine and that was it

I also had a go at him because he wouldnt let me and deanna do healing or go on stage  like he does the rest,and that george said to me,"Well you can stay behind one night and do some healing on me" and i just said",In your dreams love" and me and deanna walked out.

Its not so much we want to be accepted were we go ,all we wanted at that church was to be accepted as human beings with feelings,but it just didnt happen and never will now,but perhaps we were not meant to be there.

I was in tears this morning when i wrote about not fitting in,but i realise now that church is not for us,thanks for your kind and loving words you have all wrote back,me and deanna love you all.

Love and God bless   Love Juditha

That sounds like people with social problems, if you ask me. Stay away from them, and find another place. I'm sorry it didn't work out.

Oh good heavens, Juditha, this is just small stuff.
I am surprised to find this in a spiritual group.
You just have to get tougher and not react to it, get above it.

Yesterday a girl from India started a chat with me, and after a few words, started repeatedly calling me a liar. She had no reason for it at all. Sometimes they even refuse to believe I live in California.

This is something I have come to expect in this chat room that I go to. Usually I can immediately see that they are out of line, so I turn off any strong reaction on my part, and calmly try to understand what is going on. Avoiding a strong personal reaction is the key. Like its not me, its her that is doing this. I just don't react until I have had a look at it.

The skill needed is to figure out the response that will defuse the situation. Like I know she has got going on something, so what might I say that would not get her going?

Love, Boris

Juditha, I've been in a few churches and I never saw anyone sit on someone's lap, thats too friendly if u ask me. maybe you can find another place to develop your talents?

trust yourself.

I agree with Alysia.

Those folks need to get a hotel room.

I had been wondering what your problem is, that you and Deanna complain that you are not accepted anywhere.   On re- reading your description, it looks like you are part of the problem: your social behavior.

You need to work on ordinary social skills. This is about knowing where people are coming from, why they do what they do, and what is an appropriate and reasonable response to them, that will handle the situation.

So, Boris, I guess you know how Juditha and Deanna feel, what their complete past history is, and what this situation is all about? That's amazing, because you don't seem to understand them at all.

Why would you encourage someone to go back into a place with better "social skills" when this situation is obviously upsetting their spiritual equilibrium?

Do you think they haven't tried? They've been trying for quite a while now, from what I can see, from reading many posts.

Do you know what it is like to be a middle-aged woman expected to shut up and make tea? Do you know what it feels like to be "hit on" even in jest by a person responsible for others' spiritual well-being?

I think it's just fine that they said exactly what they thought and felt. I can feel my "throat chakra" closing up just thinking about encouraging "ramping up" their "social skills" as a solution.

love, blink :)

Hi Juditha. My thought is that it might help if you thought about the situation a little differently. When we start feeling that we don't fit in or that we are being discriminated against we can very easily slide into seeing situations that way all the time.

It's to do with the way we perceive - we always pick the information out of a situation to support our pre-conceived view of what's going on. Lose your purse and you blame the shifty looking guy that walked through an hour ago, have it all figured out how he took it when you went to get coffee. And then you find it on your bedside table when you go home.

If people behave badly towards you a more loving and more constructive approach may be to stay centred for a while, show godwill by your actions and and try to see what's going on while if needed acting to stay clear of trouble. Above all allow them space by not responding with anger.

They may cop on, and either way you won't worsen the situation. If for whatever reason they still keep on being nasty then it may be that you can't teach them anything - that they are not open to it and that you might be better to step away. Either way if your behaving well doesn't produce a result you at least know that it wasn't anything you did that caused the problem.

On perceptions. I've no idea what the story with the situation or with George and that lady was, but regardless of the rights and wrongs maybe they had something  going on that meant they were focused on each other and not on being polite to you. But meant no harm.

Maybe Deanna felt a little put out at what was going on, and as a result came back a little more aggressively than she otherwise might. Maybe it would even have been polite or right for her to clean up. (or not, I don't know) Maybe the lady is a bit stressed out over her husband being ill, and was a bit tetchy. Or wanted some privacy with George. Or consolation from him. Or whatever.

And when things were said maybe you piled in because you felt you had to defend Deanna, and with the slightly heavy vibe that had developed maybe responded in a way that was always going to up the ante even more.

Or maybe the church is a crock, and maybe many of the people involved as a result of their own problems and inadequacies do behave in less than friendly ways.

Maybe you need to step away from it and find another healthier outlet. But maybe you have too much invested in your membership of it to do that  - maybe you somehow feel that your personal value is somehow tied up in it.

Regardless it's not wise for anybody to get sucked into getting angry or trying to force it to change, or feeling bad because they are not treating you as you would like. You can only bring about change through your own example.

You have to figure it out for yourself Deanna. But remember one thing - don't worry about what people  might be thinking of you because they are normally far too busy thinking about themselves.

Even if they come out with stuff (a) it's meaningless in that it doesn't determine your worth, and (b) they forget it like a shot unless you keep on by your behaviour reminding them to do it again.

Hang in there, and be careful you're not by your fears creating the reality you don't want....

Blink, I was speaking as a person who has learned
how to handle some awful social situations.
So my inclination would be to want  to prevail
and to pass on these skills, how to prevail.
I learned because I am a politically oriented person,
and politics requires such skills. I have reasons for
staying in situations and dealing with them.
Harry Truman said, about politics,"If you cant stand
the heat, stay out of the kitchen".
I can stand the heat.

I see no obligation for her to stay, at all.
She certainly does not need to stand the heat.
Bruce does not need to, either, in his forum.
But when Juditha and Deanna say it has always been
this way, that they have not been accepted anywhere,  
this is not normal, and this is a clue to me that
they need to work on something. It is not just the
cruel outside world that is the problem.

Hi Boris,The only thing i can say is Ive tried so hard through my life and so has deanna,the reason for such negativity in the outside world towards us is something we cant understand or completely come to terms with,we are loving and caring were ever we go,we have had this since we could understand what the word thick means,we were called the divvy twins since we were little and all through our lives ,because we are having trouble living in the outside world and what i mean by that is that, i dont go out anymore apart from going to the mental health centre as im afraid to go out and that is because my fear is meeting someone i know and they are going to put me down as a person.

The centre know of this,this woman at the centre called Corrine has the same problem as me and deanna and she needed to go across the road to get something in the town which she really needed, so Corrine came to me nearly crying and asked me to go with her because she was afraid,so i went with her but we held on to each other as Corrine said to me,If anyone laughs at us or puts us down,we can lean on each other.

The only other place i will go is the spiritualist church,and that was just what i and deanna thought was a place were you could feel like you could be understood for the way we were,but we have decided never to go there again.I do not go out anymore only to the centre,were they understand that i cant face the world out there no more.

Im glad that you can look the world in the face and you have the strength to do that but i and deanna have not got that strength,we had all our human rights taken away from us,we were crying to the preist on thursday at the centre and told him if it wasnt for our children who we love so much ,we both would be gone from this world,our children are the one thing we got right.

We have been treat since we were children,that we were some freak of nature,the one  who knows that we have always tried to be kind loving and good is God ,he knows why we are like we are and that church is supposed to be working along side spirit and spirt is love and they dont know what the word love means,we have had this negativity from that church for a long time now and we had just come to the end of it ,thats why we stood up for ourselves because it goes deep ,the hurt and the pain of mental torture all our lives,we are better off in the mental health centre ,its were we belong,and we do fit in there.

This is the email Deanna sent to the church ,the same night we got home.

My sister Judy and I are never going up the spiritualist church again ,the reasons are ,we are treated like we are a piece of dirt ,like we are fools and we have had enough ,I personally wouldn't go out of my way to hurt anyone ,Judy and I are singled out for people to have a go at for nothing or to be ridiculed ,for everybody's amusement,Judy and I go to a center because we have been treated this way and it has made our nerves bad ,we don't need it at the church as well ,its best for us to keep away ,we started to go to the church because we lost our beloved dad and this is what we get ,I thought it was supposed to be a place where you could go to come to terms with losing our dad ,a place to be able to talk freely about the way we felt and to get some understanding in our lives which we have not had a lot of , I was very hurt tonight up the church I went home and cried , I hope you don't mind me writing to you Mathew about this issue I just had to put how I felt and my sister felt concerning the church ,we will go elsewhere now ,you take care Mathew ,hello to Tracy, hope your both well love Diane god bless

Love and God bless   Love juditha

I didn't mean to speak sharply to you, Boris, but I get a little worked up about these sorts of issues, as you know. I do not mean to demean your experiences which you have every right to share and I apologize for any language I may have used which singled you out.

Juditha, you and Deanna have every right to how you feel about your lives, and you also deserve the time and the care to build up your confidence if that is what you need. I know that I feel more confident when I can tell my truth and be supported in it, even if it is a difficult truth.

Definitely, this situation will be in my prayers, because only good can come from exposing the truth, whatever it may be.

Juditha, you and Deanna are only doing what you need to do to feel free. I agree with a few of the other posters that there must be other places of worship you can attend, at least for a time, where you can experience real fellowship on a human to human level. There is nothing wrong with wanting or seeking that, and there are many ways to do it.

Taking up hobbies that you can share with others is one great way of finding some relief.  For me, it has been very healing to go and listen to music with others, and to really get "into" the music.  It really lifts my spirits.  I also need alone time when I'm tired.  I have picked up a card-making hobby that I can share with my mother and sister. Little things like this mean a lot to me right now.

Maybe they can for you too.

love, blink :)

Oh My Heavens---  :-X

First and foremost---- Judy and Deanna--- please send out thoughts of love to those who have misinterpreted your spiritual aspirations.  To all those who have disappointed Juditha and Deanna   in their expectations of what a true spiritualist is:  I sent out the chakra color "green" to surround you and bring peace into your hearts.  When ever you see green, think : green is love. I send you love.  This will become a mantra and the mantra will change ugly into beauty. This is the first step.

Second--- These persons of indifference are in your life to "teach you a lesson".  What positive lessons are you and Deanna learning?  One of " We are better human beings and will send out positive loving vibes so that the Spiritualist group will learn from us what true, unconditional love is ???  What true Spiritualism is?"  Search for the "good" in the lesson that God is sending to you via the Spiritualist group.  Think of how the circumstance may have changed if you "gladly cleaned up after someone" and gracefully exit the room.  That may have dropped a few jaws from the kindness.

Third--- Don't judge/else be judged.  We can't stand before God and say: I did this because  so and so made me angry but I felt justified.   You can say "I became angry and responded poorly and I ask for forgiveness".    I have had to swallow many of my words in my 58 years!  They weren't so easy going down the spiritual esophagus.  My lessons have been just as difficult for me as they are for Juditha and Deanna, because all lessons learned are personal and tailor-made.

Fourth: Begin your own "circle" of mediums, seers, psychics, and "spiritualist".  Begin with a  mutual evening that is agreed upon for you and your sister. Next,  choose a topic for the evening and stick to it. Do your research and have a book handy that you can refer to. Casually invite members of your family and acquaintances/ do not press anyone to attend. Let it go------.  On the designated evening, say the same opening prayer or mantra to be used at each gathering.  If only you and Deanna are the only two, enjoy the evening, and the topic.  Continue your "circle" each week, see the positiveness and love in the meeting, and eventually others will drift in.  You will find that the same persons will attend from week to week and occasionally  your regulars will bring a guest.

Fifth:  after establishing the group on about the third or forth week, suggest that you have a "kitty" or "pot" to put in a couple of dollars which will go toward the tea, cookies and eventually when you have enough, get everyone who attends regularly the same paperback book to read regarding some phenomena or subject that will be of consensus.  

Sixth: Always end the evening with a positive Thanks to All.  

The odd thing, Juditha, is that after all this time you still don't
understand it. There should be some kind of explanation.
I cant see anything wrong, from reading the posts you put in here,
but real life situations can be quite different.

My social intelligence has improved considerably in the last two
years, because I have stayed in situations daily that required it.
I did not understand, in some situations, the effect I was having
on others, until I put more attention to that.

We have had to deal with 3 women here in my area who did not
understand the effect they were having on others, and they produced
serious problems.

You might want to put feelers out to see what people's attitude
toward you actually is, and where it comes from and see what you
can find out. When I began dating when I was in college, if things
did not go well, I asked the girls to tell me what was wrong. They
sometimes would not talk about it, but when they did, I learned a
great deal. As a result of this knowledge I was able to do much
better. Perhaps you could get a friend who could observe how things
go in your social life, who could figure out what was going on. Or
maybe someone who knew how people felt toward you could clue you
in. What they tell you might hurt sometimes, but at least you would
have an idea what it was.

Also, even when you are older, the brain continues to grow and
rearrange itself, so that you can understand what you did not
understand before. You might be able to figure things out, in time.

Love, Boris

Those are some good thoughts Identcat. A nice way to start a group of their own, when and if they are ready to do that.

In the meantime, I don't think it is tremendously helpful for people to continue to speculate on what Juditha and Deanna have done "wrong" at this time. When people are discouraged it is the last thing they want to hear.

What is needed, in my opinion, is a break from that community and its perceived frustrations. I do not think it should be this exhausting for them to simply participate in group activities at their church.

Certainly, having gratitude for what they have received at the church would be appropriate, but agreement on other issues is not necessary in my opinion.

When people are trying to develop confidence their feelings can sway back and forth over a large emotional field. That is what I see happening: emotions swaying back and forth from happiness with current successes to grief based on a lifetime of a certain kind of loneliness.

Most artists of any sort suffer from this instability, and sometimes the very instability is the bottomless well of inspiration that they can draw from for their insights.

Artists are not generally spending much of their time thinking about how neat the tea service is, etc. etc., or even if there is enough money for tea in the first place.

Bruce calls his retrievals an "art" and so is mediumship.

I think the first thing is for Juditha and Deanna to recognize that mistakes are in the eye of the beholder. Change often causes upheaval...I think it's a natural thing. I personally take the stand that a little "craziness" from an artist is sometimes the price you pay for their gifts.

Often, that craziness is just the truth.

love, blink :)

Greetings! Wow!

Identcat's format for getting a group together works well ! I used it in my past community for an arts group and later for a book/discussion club, and it built solid groups that still exist there decades later---thanks for laying it out, Identcat !  It takes those super-sensibilities and social conflicts down a tone while a  support structure for a new focus (  :D  oh no, here we go again :D ) yes, using crumpets and tea, helps softens tensions.

Blink, it's so true also that spiritual exploration, and sharing it, is a fine art. I would love to explore ideas about this more. Someone once said that when the Romans fed Christians to the lions, that was the best possible promotion for Christianity and that it accounted for the huge conversions to Christ's way that helped spread the religion. But that's extreme  :o ::)  and there must be other means for presenting super-human capabilities in a human way.

Bets    

Hi Identicat
I thought I had healing techniques down pretty well, but your brief summary is as good as I've seen anywhere. Thanks!

Regardless of Juditha and Deanna - you've given Me a much needed reminder, for which I am grateful. And of course for the two of them, I fully endorse what you said.

I especially like the part about , "I got angry and responded poorly." Listen up folks - that's the real thing. :D

dave

Hi everyone i have been reading all your comments concerning me  and juditha at the spiritualist church and i thank you all ,it is so hard for us both because we do not treat people in this way and it hurts a lot when people treat us this way ,i am a healer and i have been refused everytime i have asked to do some healing up the church ,reason , i smoke ,i know i shouldnt smoke really but i cant see what smoking has got to do with healing also i was told i would have to have my hair cut to do healing because it is too long and it will affect the healing process somewhat ,all these feeble and ridiculous excuses for me not to do healing at the church i just dont understand why they are treating me this way and juditha is a medium yet they will not recognise this it seems me and juditha are singled out all the time to be made to feel we are not worthy to do anything at the church ,this  is  what hurts  and confuses us ,we are just not accepted at the church like we should be love deanna god bless

Hi Blink identicat dave bets and aylsia kate and vajra and boris I and Deanna are going to do this ,get our own circle started and healing circle.im going to have it round my house until we can afford to hire a hall 2nights per week,thanks so much identicat for suggesting that we start on our own as we had not thought about doing this and thanks all of you for your loving words and advice, we will let you all know how we progress,thanks so much for who you are and for being on this afterlife with much much love from i and Deanna.

God bless you all   Juditha and Deanna    

Hi Deanna, I'm glad you write it down, how you feel. you don't post as much as Juditha and I was wishing to hear from you. I don't have much to say, only that mediums since time began have a unique journey because you are different. if it helps you any I managed to get kicked out of a few places too..although you two were not kicked out, still, you are in the same struggle I was in to be accepted.
its just not going to happen, about being accepted.

just consider the movie about Field of Dreams. they said in that movie a great truth. "build it and they will come."  So you two are in process of building something; you are building your own characters daily. Be proud. You are a child of the universe, you belong here. You will own your own soul through struggle; and I for one applaud the mission you've taken on. keep strong, as somebody's got to do it, what you do, and before you were born you chose to be and do as you do.

anyway, you got us, don't you? lucky little angels you! love, alysia [smiley=engel017.gif] [smiley=engel017.gif]

Hi aylsia Thanks for your loving and encoraging words,they say that angels walk the earth and all of you are loving angels to me and Deanna.

Love and God bless    Love juditha

Thanks alysia you are so kind ,you are an angel lots of love and god bless deanna

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v323/spiritvideo/Alysia/JUST%20ANGELS/bowcc6.gif
as usual, my gratitude to Juditha and Deanna, the twins who help each other.
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v323/spiritvideo/Alysia/obsession/2girlsabstract.gif

It is a shame legitimate mediums (or people who want to become mediums, like yourself) get so many obstacles in the way of you.

Of course, you seem to have joined the wrong group. They sound kind of; I don't know... odd. Try joining a legitimate group of people like yourself, or who are interested in the same subject. Of course, you do not need a fancy building (like a church) for legitimate spirit communication; just the right people. Maybe you can search Google for your town and for a group in your area with the same interest. If not, just keep posting here and we'll try helping out.

Good luck.

Quoting Alysia: "I managed to get kicked out of a few places too".
This has aroused my curiosity, about what kind of place does not accept
ppl like u, and what you did that bugged them.
Who is accepted in what kind of a place is an issue to me,
that I like to learn about. I have successfullyy fitted into
a Moslem group even though I am not Moslem, and I can tell you,
that is an art, considering the difference in religious and political views.
I have had discussions with my lovely Moslem online girlfriend
about issues of integrity involved there. But I dont misrepresent myself there.

But if you don't want to talk about it, I dont want to drag up awkward memeories.

Pls excuse my ignorance here but just what/who is this Spiritualist Church any ways? If I under stand the posts your hair need to be a certan length to administer healing, and ony certan people have the rite to do so. Sound like fixed ideas and suppression of others. And I thought that was a Catholic thing.  Pehaps if I could find out more about this church you speak of. Is there a web page?  

Hi joe  This is the web address for the spiritualist church,ii had to take this web address off because my incredimail which i use to put my links on is going wrong as its putting everything on as well as the web adress i put on so ive got to get it fixed,i will put it back on joe as soon as its fixed.


Love and God bless   Love juditha

Thanks juditha, the web page dosen't say a bunch. Is there somewhere alse?

Hi Joe  its the only web address they have for there church.I dont think they have anything else,i dont know whether there could be anything on Google about them.

Love and God bless  Love juditha

Hello my Sweety Joe--

Years ago, when I attended the Spiritualist Church, it was actually held in a church in Methuen, Massachusetts.  The meetings were at 3:00 PM every Sunday afternoon (which puts a glitch in the family day outings).  My friend and I would sit in a pew.  I think the church was a protestant church during "regular hours."  Anyone could go to the Spiritualist Church--- any religion--- any color.  After sitting in a pew, the "leader" of the gathering would say greetings, say a small sermon, then introduce the "Reader" of the day.  It usually was a good selection of different persons who would go to the pulpit, say a prayer for guidance, then close his/her eyes and ask Spirit to be present.  After a little "channeling" inwards toward themselves, the guest Reader would look randomally out into the congregation and select one person to speak directly to.  When I was chosen to receive a message, I would say "Yes-- I'm  ready to receive."  Then the speaker would give me the message he/she was receiving.  The Reader would go around from pew to pew and when finished, would say thanks to the Spirit Guide then retreat.  Next, the organizer of the group would put a chair up to the front of the church ( this particular church was tiny) and get together with two other persons, say a prayer for guidance then ask if anyone wished to receiving a healing.  I went once in the chair because my appendix was acting up. I sat down, closed my eyes and said a brief prayer.  The one of the healers stood behind me, put his hands over my head and started an energy healing "laying of hands" without every touching me.  Well, I felt my overself lift out of the chair, and  after the healing, the Healer told me that he felt me lift out of the chair, and I took him with me!  I eventually had to have my appendix removed because I was no longer able to attend the church.  A donation of our choice followed before leaving the church.

At Spiritualist "circles" we had one leader, she would begin the circle with a mantra, go into a trance, the leave the rest of the readings up to us.  I gave out a lot of messages and really loved the freedom of just being myself with the group.  I always wanted to learn to be a Spiritualist reader (I only work through myself directly and not deliberately calling on a guide to be physically present, therefore was referred to as Clairvoyant).  A Spiritualist Reader ask specifically for a guide to stand next to him/her.   One of our readers would constantly scold his "Indian" guide because the spirit would pull on the reader's ear lobe and taunt him as he gave out messages.  The messages were very accurate.  When it was a private reader, a set fee was involved and everyone in the room would receive a personal message.

I would love to get back into a group as I had been with, as they were all wonderful, giving persons who did not put the other participants down.  As with all things, my life changed, I moved away from the area and haven't found any Spiritualist Group here. ---Carol Ann

Boris wrote on Jul 30^th, 2007 at 2:48pm:

Quoting Alysia: "I managed to get kicked out of a few places too". This has aroused my curiosity, about what kind of place does not accept ppl like u, and what you did that bugged them. Who is accepted in what kind of a place is an issue to me, that I like to learn about. I have successfullyy fitted into a Moslem group even though I am not Moslem, and I can tell you, that is an art, considering the difference in religious and political views. I have had discussions with my lovely Moslem online girlfriend about issues of integrity involved there. But I dont misrepresent myself there. But if you don't want to talk about it, I dont want to drag up awkward memeories.

oh thats all right, I'm not hurting over that stuff anymore Boris. if you want the whole story it's in my book. briefly a minister had me tricked into seeing an exorcist because I had confided, or tried to, that I had spoken with spirits and the minister was young and didn't know what to do about me, it was the first time he had met someone like me I suppose. it has a happy ending.
and I tried to join the choir of another church but a minister came to see me and said I could not be a part of their choir because I was involved with the spiritualist church. >:(  he made me choose which church, as I couldn't go to both of them he said. so I chose the spiritualist church where they taught me hands on healing like what Cat is describing below. its just that we didn't have a choir in the spiritualist church and I was thinking naively we were all gods children. everybody is welcome in spiritualist circles, everyone is friendly, at least the church where I went was.

Ok thanks miss laffing in the rain, that's the kind of feel I wanted to get of the situation.  When one writes, as we do, I like to sense who will be receptive and who will not. Your story was interesting that way.
love, Boris

Hey Guys...All I know is that the spiritualistic church is made up of seekers and those that
run things...Some of them have huge egos, and resent any 'outsiders' butting in..Some use
it as an alternative income!?...Readings, etc!...In my experience, and also with the advice
of others who have been there...LEAVE!!!"...Darth. May both sides of the force be with you.
ps...Develop your own spiritual gifts...There are are 'ALWAYS THOSE' who watch over you.

Hi darth benedict  Sounds just like the church me and deanna went to.

Love and God bless   love juditha

Vajra--- sent a PM back--- cat