Regarding those who have experienced encounters with friends/family/etc. in the Afterlife... I'm curious as to how some of these encounters can occur when considering the ramifications of BSTs. I am curious as to how BSTs work, if for instance those who are stuck in BSTs, such as friends and family are still able to meet up with/communicate with friends and family of differing belief systems. From experiences that I have personally heard and read, BSTs seem to not affect these encounters with family and friends.

Also, from what I have gathered there is large population of NDErs who were raised with various rigid religious beliefs, who fostered them throughout life; however, they were not necessarily "stuck" in a BST per say, more like their awareness of their true nature had expanded and the rigid structure of their previously held beliefs had dissolved. Furthermore, upon returning back to this physical plane a good number of them end up straying away from those previously held rigid religious beliefs, only to adopt a much broader comprehension/understanding.

So, where do BSTs sit in this mix:

How are BSTs structured? What are their boundaries and limitations? Shouldn't the "Light" experience expand all awareness as to our true nature; dissolving any uncertainty and limited beliefs (BSTs)? (Like turning on a light in a dark room and saying, "Oh, so that's what I've been tripping over all this time!")

PUL,
Cosmic_Ambitions

Greetings,

I don't know the how, Cosmic, but I'd like to report that my mother was recently contacted in a BST by a member of this group who knew nothing about her except her name. He came back with a description of her appearance, her favorite clothes, her family activities, and her attitude !!! He didn't know why she and her family were 'working the soil,' but I know she has several connections to that BST activity.
It was his first visit to the afterlife, he said.  I think he is now working on how best to show the steps we took to this contact, so that nay-sayers will best understand how this happened. (I'm sorry if I betrayed any confidence in telling this. I hope the process he shows will be of the major importance.)

So however it happens, there is enough light in at least some BSTs to allow for contact--that has been proven to me !!

Bets

Hi CA-
Maybe it would be useful to remember that to the Hindu, everything is a BST - except that they use the Sanskrit term "maya" (literally "illusion").

For Buddhists, the whole of spiritual effort can be summarized as getting over our compulsive faith in maya - the BSTs of everyday experience. When all the illusion is gone, all attachments are also gone, since they are functionally equivalent, and we are free to exist in our "natural state", which allows escape from this world to "nirvana" - where the illusions don;t start up any more.

dave

Thank you both Betson and Dave for your thought provoking responses. Very interesting.

Yes, getting over the BSTs of everyday experience... Being mindful and aware of the illusion as to greet it with open arms. That would be the fundamentals of Radical Acceptance at its core. That is attainment; allowing freedom to exist in our natural state of "being". A state of Nirvana, where illusion is graced with knowledge, wisdom, and the truest of understandings and knowings. Living in that moment of complete awareness, acceptance, calm, and utmost creative possibility. Satiated in PULing Light; letting it flow freely as the source life force that IS - opening all illusory boundaries of communication and connection.

I suppose it's our willingness to surrender, let go, and become that bestows the greatest possibilities; reaching beyond all limits; gifting the heart.

PUL,
Cosmic_Ambitions

what is a BST?

Greetings,

Cosmic, you must be very close to being there--- or there already, to provide such a beautiful description!

Seeker, in Moen and Monroe terminology, BST refers to a 'Belief System Territory". These are zones in the Afterlife where souls group by their beliefs. Eventually some of those souls get bored with their beliefs and realize such beliefs are limiting. They then can use their curiosity to seek out more experience.   ;) Even 17 virgins get boring after awhile (I'd guess.)

But when Cosmic says 'getting over the BSTs of everyday experience," he broadens BSTs to mean getting caught here and now by too narrow expectations of ourselves and what life offers (I think).

Reading about BSTs in Bruce's books will alert you to the many ways they work, and how you can visit them in order to learn from them without spending your time in one.

Bets

From a slightly different perspective, when I first began to study hypnosis, we were told that the most important thing was to keep in mind that we all live in different worlds, limited by our awareness and interpretations of experiences. These might have an origin shared with others, but by the time that we get through with interpreting according to personal history, we see things slightly differently. Thus, in a sense, "the whole world is in  trance". This is the individual part of the BST. Then when a bunch of people get together and evaluate common experiences and decide upon a collectively approved and accepted meaning we have a BST.  

If we carry our analysis to the very end, we wind up with a single Oneness. All the rest is a BST, or collection of them, which we know under the name of "a normal life" etc.

dave

the boundaries between belief systems seem undefinitive..we have the image from some resources here of a couple who were in love, existing within a BST of religion (nonphysical)  and they were comfortable there until the minister began to want them to conform to church standards; wedding I think. they began to feel a bit closed in, and last I heard they simply blinked out, disappeared into the next level of I suppose like-minded. they were probably hippies..lol..they disappeared right in front of the congregation.

thought that was interesting. love, alysia

Thanks Chuckles [smiley=bath.gif] (I had to, it's been too long!), Dave, and Betson.

Betson wrote:

"But when Cosmic says 'getting over the BSTs of everyday experience," he broadens BSTs to mean getting caught here and now by too narrow expectations of ourselves and what life offers (I think)."

Hi Betson, thoughtfully, Dave has expounded on BSTs with a great deal of insight:

"From a slightly different perspective, when I first began to study hypnosis, we were told that the most important thing was to keep in mind that we all live in different worlds, limited by our awareness and interpretations of experiences. These might have an origin shared with others, but by the time that we get through with interpreting according to personal history, we see things slightly differently. Thus, in a sense, "the whole world is in  trance". This is the individual part of the BST. Then when a bunch of people get together and evaluate common experiences and decide upon a collectively approved and accepted meaning we have a BST."

Greetings Chuckles, that story sounds very familiar. It definitely has intruiging concepts pertinent to BSTs.

Reflecting on that BST story using a poor analogy it seems sort of like lying in bed and feeling the overwhelming urge to want to move your legs because of discomfort, etc. It becomes extremely uncomfortable and the urge to want to move them becomes top priority; once they are moved, the comfort returns.

PUL,
Cosmic_Ambitions
 

Bruce's use of the term "BST" interested me particularly because of a background in the sociology of knowledge - where thought comes from etc -  The one person version of this is the traditional Buddhist term "attachments".

By ":attachments' is meant much the same thing with respect to figuring out how things work and what they are. The main difference is that the idea of "attachments" specifically extends to include beliefs about one's self state, and one's sensed needs and desires.

The subtlety of "attachments" is that they include the definition of one's self, "I am the [person] who had [those experiences] and who [needs certain things] in order [to live as I do] so that I can [become] a [better individual] ... " and so on.  The contingent "attachments" are in the square brackets. None of those reasons nor expectations nor understandings is valid when taken all by itself in a totally empty universe. They arise because of linkages between us and our circumstances.

This is the reason that Jesus said, "He who would seek to save his life will lose it. He who would seek to lose his life will save it." Or, in Buddhist terms, taken from the Prajnaparamita Sutra, "Existence is nothing, and nothing is existence, and only because existence is nothing can nothing be existence ..." Thus, after we churn these ideas a while it becomes evident that the only thing that keeps each of us from being a perfectly enlightened Buddha is the belief that we are not perfectly enlightened Buddhas because we are too busy being X, Y or Z.

In meditation, we encounter this as clinging to unreality, which blocks the experience of the next level forward, and only when we can totally empty ourselves of "stuff" are we able to merge back into the ultimate unity from which everything emerged, at which time the situation becomes pretty obvious. However, we can see that as we cease to be attracted to the blinky lights and ecstatic experiences of meditation, as well as the sense of being anywhere, or anything, then we automatically proceed to samadhi. (Comments Vajra?)

dave

Dave wrote:

"This is the reason that Jesus said, "He who would seek to save his life will lose it. He who would seek to lose his life will save it." Or, in Buddhist terms, taken from the Prajnaparamita Sutra, "Existence is nothing, and nothing is existence, and only because existence is nothing can nothing be existence ..." Thus, after we churn these ideas a while it becomes evident that the only thing that keeps each of us from being a perfectly enlightened Buddha is the belief that we are not perfectly enlightened Buddhas because we are too busy being X, Y or Z."

It's amazing to me. In the physical sense we are painted by the commonality of tangible dualities; in this way we can acheive experiential materialistic reality which becomes stable and allows tangible values to emerge in order for this particular experience to occur. We can value  a given experience by experiencing its opposite in conjuction. This gives weight, definition, and value to a given experience, from which all other experiences are based. Would it then be feasible for a point of consciousness to observe/comprehend/define the unity masking perceived separation if it weren't for the function and driver of duality? - (Only because existence is nothing can nothing be existence.)

On a side note, this is a great quote from Rumi that I thought I'd post:

"This being human is a guest house.
          Every morning a new arrival.

A joy, a depression, a meanness,
Some momentary awareness
          comes as an unexpected visitor.

Welcome and entertain them all!...

The dark thought, the shame, the malice,
          meet them at the door laughing,
                     and invite them in.

Be grateful for whoever comes,
          because each has been sent
                     as a guide from beyond."

PUL,
Cosmic_Ambitions

Reminds me of the Zen master who was asked about reality and replied, more or less, "There's only one." His students were silent a moment until one responded, "Does everybody know this?" The teacher frowned and growled, "Humph. Now there are two."

;)
d

That's a good one!  [smiley=thumbsup.gif]

PUL,
Cosmic_Ambitions