I miss this guy.. He's a great guy and full of wisdom! Come back DocM!!! You must be busy with work or something..

peace

Thanks for your kind words.  I have been busy at work.  I wanted to start a good thread about the Bardo Thodol (Tibetan Book of the Dead or Afterlife roadmap), but I haven't had the chance to give it the development it needs yet.  For now thought, I have a few small threads that I have been thinking on, and will put them out to see what everyone thinks.  It only gets interesting when we get several different points of view and experiences.


Doc

Which translation are you using or recommending?

I believe the "standard" is:
Evans-Wentz (editor) Lama Kazi Dawa-Samdup (translator).



Doc

Hi Doc,

The Evans-Wentz translation is terrible, full of errors.  The best translations are the one by Robert Thurman and the brand new one by Gyurme Dorje ( the first 'complete' translation! )

Most of the teachings associated with "the Tibetan Book of the Dead" ( a title given by westerners... there is no such title in the original) are "ear-whispered"... i.e.  passed down through oral history and initiation. I've been working with these teachings for 30 odd years.... very odd years!

I'd be curious to see the thoughts you bring to this material.

It is a very different approach to other traditions that speak of the afterlife.

Tim F.

Tim, with 30 years of study behind you, I'd be more interested in hearing your impressions of the Bardo states and how they correspond to focus levels, than my own outsider interpretation.  I believe that there are significant parrallels.



M

I think there are parallels to the focus levels. And parallels to the Art of Retrieval as taught by Bruce. I'll make a post soon, after I sit with it and have a bit more time.

T

Tim is correct, that the Evans-Wentz translation has errors, and is truncated, but it has a lot of explanatory material by people who are both well versed in the discipline, and also in the idiom. The collected works by Evans-Wentz, "Tibetan Yoga and Secret Doctrines" similarly is rather imperfect, but it presents a very nice scenario overall that gives an impression of the global itegration of the practice.

One of the thngs to bear in mind is that Bardo Thodol is a meditative discipline, and the book is simply one part of the entire package.

A couple related books that shed light on meanings, "The Practice of Dzogchen" by Longchen Rabjam (Snow Lion), "Wonders of the Natural Mind" by Tenzin Wangyal (Station Hill) and more closely related to Monroe's ideas, "Dream Yoga and Practice of Natural Light" by Nankhai Norbu (Snow Lion). I think you might find these helpful in that they express the same ideas in other ways, so that the "parallax"  in perspective makes them more useful.

dave

DocM wrote on May 10^th, 2007 at 12:07am:

Thanks for your kind words.  I have been busy at work.  I wanted to start a good thread about the Bardo Thodol (Tibetan Book of the Dead or Afterlife roadmap), but I haven't had the chance to give it the development it needs yet.  For now thought, I have a few small threads that I have been thinking on, and will put them out to see what everyone thinks.  It only gets interesting when we get several different points of view and experiences. Doc

Your welcome my friend Doc! Sweet that sounds like a good thread.. I have read alittle on the Tibetan Book of the Dead... The book of the Dead is very interesting!  How has your research on nde's gone so far??

peace