Hi I'm new, new to a lot of things. I found this site after visiting Dr. Melvin Morse's website, I've now read all his books and have ordered Bruce's Afterlife Knowledge Guidebook.
I am a hypnotherapist and I'm soon to start working at a hospice on a voluntary basis, Dr. Morse's message to stop alienating the dying and help them not to be afraid has really struck a chord with me.
However I have no personal beliefs apart from a feeling that after all the things I've read there must be something to the fact that this is not all there is.
So I'm looking for experiences I can share with people that are dying, people that may not be spiritual or believe in angels or spirit guides, so if you'll excuse the pun, I'm looking for some 'down to earth' practical experiences or journey's that could make a difference and maybe tip the balance of someone dying lonely and scared out of their wits or embracing death as the next step on the journey.
If that is acceptable I'd love to hear from people.

Greetings LittleOwl,
Welcome! Many/most people who participate on this site came to get answers because their down-to-earth life was interrupted by spiritual crisis. Then many stay on to learn more. In the 83 index pages of the Afterlife Knowledge Forum alone (not counting the book forums or special interest forums for retrieving and dreams) you can find many titles of inquiries called variations on 'I'm New here...' or 'Please help....'
You'l learn alot by reading those of your own choice there, as you know what you're looking for. Not to say that your question won't be answerred but it takes some time to get the collection you might seek as a professional.
Certainly I don't want to turn you away from the help you will get here, but a site that centers on Near Death Experiences might also be helpful.
Bets

Hi

Nice to see you here; you must have read alot before you decided to do this hospice work, no?

Bruce has so many resources on this site, I hope you enjoy them all. His links page has alot on it. So does the resources page.

I'm not sure you need what is here to work to not alienate the dying. People say the most important thing is to be there and ...just be there. Years ago I worked in a research lab at the Mayo Clinic. My coworker's husband was a bartender. Once a patient who had received some really bad news had no one with him. He asked my friend's husband to fly home with him so he wouldn't be alone on the plane and paid for the plane ticket. That's what scared and lonely is all about! That sort of story was not unusual for Mayo at that time, which is really strange, considering how they routinely deal with catastrophic situations. I believe things are better there now. While I was there I heard Kubler-Ross speak...she was quite charismatic. I think she learned about dying by listening to people. She had some really interesting stories, too.

So this site is here for the folks who ask questions and want answers. There is lots to read here.

I assume you are familiar with Dannion Brinkley's work?

Here's another interesting site:
http://www.near-death.com/guggenheim.html

Hope you will come back often.

Welcome Little Owl. I feel you've come to the right place. The best way to learn is by experience and that's what you'll be doing by getting Bruce's Guidebook. I always admire people who volunteer for hospice. Once you KNOW where the souls are going when they transition, it will be so much easier for you to interact with them and their families (if they're amenable to that). You have a very giving soul.  Welcome again.

Love, Mairlyn ;-)

Hi Little Owl,

what I've heard, some down-to-earth people tell things when they're about to die that are different- often about persons or beings visiting them. I think it's important to give those people the feeling they can talk openly about this, without the usual "it's hallucination" responds.

Also, what may be very difficult to one who has no belief or certainty of what comes after, people who are dying might ask about this. Because that's naturally one of the most important things for them. So, read around here and on the near-death-experience sites. You may not believe it all, but you then have something to tell.

Spooky

Little Owl, it is truly wonderful work you are doing.  However, my thoughts are you cannot comfort the dying without talking about their souls and this means talking about the Love of Christ and God.
There is no other way.  And this is what they need to hear - the soul is definately not down-to-earth.  The soul lives with God and the spirit needs to find its way back to God through Jesus Christ.

Once this is understood, there are many analogies that may be spoken to the physical dying body so the soul's spirit may feel calmed and comforted in this time of releasing the spirit back to the soul.

Any other way is a dis-service to the soul and a down-to-earth approach will end up with stuck spirits that need retrieving - prevention is better than cure.

The Love of Christ is not difficult to speak about for it lives within you and will come out of you in simple loving words and gestures.  Love and Light talks to a lonely, scared spirit.

PUL
Caryn

I have to respectfully disagree with what Caryn says.  

I don't believe that we have to tell dying people (souls) anything they don't want to hear.  I believe, like Lucy, that it is enough to just "be there" for them.  Let THEM talk to you first and take it from there.

In my limited experience of nursing my husband for two years with a terminal illness and helping him (I hope) through his "transition" in January this year, I feel that I am able to make some comment here.  John did NOT believe in Jesus.  Nor did he believe in life after death.  I tried to talk to him about life after death on a few occasions and he just laughed and said it was all bulls**t!!  I also received a call from a friend once who asked me if  John had "accepted Jesus".  You can well imagine what I told her - where to stick it!!!  I felt she was arrogant in believing that her way was the "right way" and the only way John would be saved would be by accepting Jesus into his life.  Once I realised that John was comfortable in what he believed, I was happy to leave him alone to deal with his death in the bravest way he could - with dignity and surrounded by my love.  

After his passing I asked a friend to retrieve him as I felt that he would need retrieving.  And guess what??  He was already at Focus 27 and well on his way to healing.  He was not "stuck" anywhere.  I have since had contact with him on a few occasions and he is robust and healthy and our contact has been wonderful.

I believe that most on this board have a good understanding of the Afterlife, a lot coming to this forum from many different religions.  I would like to think that what unites us is our belief that no one religion is the "right way".  We will all go to our final destination in the only way that WE know how to - we don't need to be "saved" by anyone while in this life.  

I too, like LittleOwl, would like to work in a hospice.  I hope to take with me the ability to listen, like I did with John when he spoke and when he DIDN'T, and I hope to be non-judgemental.   Not only will I be helping by just being there and listening but I know that I will gain a great deal of wisdom from them.  

With Love
Irene

Hi Irene

Fair enough.  I expressed my pov and this is my way.  You made some lovely comments, especially with the subject so close to you.  I feel i must just add further;  it is not done in the manner of .. have you accepted Jesus in your life else you will be ....

No, please don't get me wrong that kind of talking to a person who is dying .. or not dying for that matter,  is contrary to loving that person .. Christ needs to be spoken once to that person.  If that person responds positively than a lot of love and light may be spoken to one another.

If the Name does not evoke a positive response then what you have said is great comfort to that person and that is all you could want.

My love
Caryn

Caryn

Thank you for your response.  I responded because of what you said:

However, my thoughts are you cannot comfort the dying without talking about their souls and this means talking about the Love of Christ and God.
There is no other way.  And this is what they need to hear - the soul is definately not down-to-earth.  The soul lives with God and the spirit needs to find its way back to God through Jesus Christ.

Especially - "there is no other way".  

I would still have to say that I would first listen to what the person says to me, whether they mentioned religion, Christ, God or any beliefs that they have.  As a hospice volunteer I would feel that I am only there to listen, not introduce them to any of my beliefs.  

With love
Irene

Thanks everyone, such a lot to take in. I know if I have no beliefs - and I am not religious but like to think I am spiritual  - then I will not convince anyone, I want to take some faith with me to the work at the hospice or I know people will see right through me! So I'm off to explore this forum and other recommended avenues.
I'll keep you posted and thanks again...
:)

HI Little Owl-
Welcome to the forum. I do hypnotherapy too, and use it for past life work. Rather than trying to give you a lot of facts, I essentially agree with Black Panther - and would summarize it by suggesting that most people need a good listening to.

dave

Hello Little Owl:

Sounds like you're off to a good start, volunteering to work in a hospice etc. You'll gain more spiritually by growing in love, than you will by reading every book and having every experience there is.

I agree that you might check out Danion Brinkley. In particular his second book because he talks about doing hospice work in an inspiring way.

I also believe it's a good idea to read some of the many near death experiences that can be found on the internet.

If you want to know about a convincing experience somebody had without having a near death experience, here's one I had years ago, when I was an atheist. I found myself in heaven one night. I must say that I got there through grace, because I didn't know how to get there and had no intention of making such a visit. I didn't believe in God and the afterlife at the time, because I had a scientific mind and didn't see how such things could be possible. During this experience I was greatly relieved to find that God and the afterlife did indeed exist, and I completely understood how it was possible for them to exist without having to think about it. It was an automatic knowing that I would call inner, except that the knowing was everywhere. The feeling of happiness there is beyond what can be imagined here.  It was like all the happiness you search for while in the physical is found there.  I had the feeling that in the end things work out wonderfully for everybody. I also felt like Jesus had something to do with it, even though I can't remember the details. At the end of the experience I saw a very bright light like a star.

In regards to what Augoeideian (Caryn) and Black Panther (Irene) have to say, I believe there is a middle ground. In the above experience I believe that Jesus had something to do with it, but not in a stifling you better believe in him or else manner. What I experienced was way beyond thinking of things in a repressive way. Just as you don't have to force a kid to get excited about Christmas morning, you don't have to force a spirit to get excited about God and heaven once a spirit is there. It's quite automatic. I've been receiving messages about Jesus lately, but not in a stifling way.  He's the bearer of a floodlight that shows the way to God and heaven, not the holder of a gun who forces you to go there. Therefore, I believe it is best to speak to each hospice patient according to what touches them inwardly, rather than telling them that they had better believe this or else.

I agree with everyone here. There is no reason not to be the companion which you ARE. Who would like to be alone when they die? Well, perhaps some.... others, may love to hold your hand. Others may love to hear your voice, knowing it will be one of the last voices they hear in life. Others have a great message to give you, one that will change your heart forever. When we are alive we just want to be loved, and to know that wherever we are going, we are going to get there safely and enjoy the happiness of true companionship. We want to feel worthy of peace. Therefore, to be with one who is dying is such a gift. May it always be merciful.

love, blink

Hi Little Owl
owls feature very highly in my life!
May i say that you should probably follow your heart and do what feels right for you! i am sure that you probably already have the answers insode of you.
anyway good luck with you rsearch and I hope you stick around
love Cathy B

Nice replies ... (Cathy btw your pic is great!)

My MSN horoscope the other day said :  Get off your soapbox .. i should have listened!
This song kinda sums it up for me "Pride - in the name of love" U2.  So i'll calm down, it is better to take it for granted that God goes without saying.

This is a good thread.  I think its is also important to recognise that it is hard for the loved ones left behind after a loved one has passed on.  I do think there is a on-going need to counsel people who have temporarily said goodbye to a loved one.  This is the line between here and there and grief can be a most sorrowful emotion for both spirits.

It must be agonising for the spirit who has left to see the grief of their absence.  Especially children (this is heart wrenching)  so with a positive light and attitude towards death; i do think the burden of grief may be soothed with spiritual understanding of both worlds.

I am sure Marilyns experience will testify this.

PUL

This was a PM that I sent to Caryn in response to her last post.  I did ask her if it was okay to post it on the forum and she agreed - for which I thank her.

My children (I have three, a son aged 19, and two daughters aged 17 and 13) and I have coped very well with John's passing.  I believe that we had 2 years to get used to idea.  In the two years I "woke up", joined this forum and another one (which I found extremely supportive and have made some wonderful personal friends) and this made his passing easier.  I have accepted that he has not "died" in the sense of the word - he has just crossed over.  I was with him while he was in a coma and talked to him about where he would be going and what to expect.  I believe he heard me as he seemd quite restless.  It was with a sense of peace that I let him go.  My son was with me, as was John's mother and siblings.  

I prepared my children for John's transition.  I always told my children that it was an honour to nurse their father to the most important event of his life - his death.  Even if John did not want to talk about it, I made sure that I spoke about it constantly to my children, to get them ready to accept the idea of life without a "physical" father.  I was always there to listen to anything they wanted to say, and sometimes I introduced the topic to them - not always a welcome conversation.  And John wasn't always easy to live with.  There were many times that he was angry and nasty with the children, but I would take them aside and explain why he was this way.  I treated him with PUL even on the days when I wanted to hit him on the head!!! LOL!!

On the day he passed over (in a hospice) I came home to a house filled with laughter and joy and music - my children had their friends over.  

In the days following John's transition, we talked and laughed and reminisced about John.  I made sure, and I still do, that we talk about him all the time - be it good or bad memories - after all he wasn't a saint!!  

I believe that my children are well adjusted.  Yes, they do have SAD days, but these are rare.  They are able to talk to me about their father and I make sure that I always listen.  I too have bad days, but the good days far outweigh the bad days.  

So for this family, it is neither "heart wrenching" nor "agonising".  We may be unusual, I don't know, but I can honestly say that we are coping very well.  I believe its all in the attitude.  If I had taken the attitude that this was a devastating loss, then that would have translated to my children.  Of course, losing John was devastating but I decided to look at it in a different way.  I just changed my whole attitude to death.  And, as I've said, I've made contact with him, and so have other retrievers, and he is robust and healthy - no sign of the mesothelioma that ravaged him.

Hope I can make you see a different perspective - that not all death is "heart wrenching".

With Love
Irene

Irene  :) and as i said please never ever think that you have to ask me for anything, im blushing that you did! Honest comments are appreciated at all times whether against or for and your post is wonderful and id like to reply once ive crawled out the hole in the ground .. lol kidding.

One thing I like to point out, because it seems to get lost in the shuffle, is that there is absolutely no *necessary* connection between believing in a deity(s) and belief in an afterlife.  A total atheist could believe in an afterlife as a kind of "law of nature" thing...that when you die you "fall" into the afterlife just like if you step off a cliff you fall due to the natural law of gravity.  My Dad was an atheist, and still believed in any number of spiritual things...just not that there was a "god" or controlling entity.  More a collection of natural laws, and possibly a very self - "actualized" maybe?  population in the afterlife...

I do know that I would get pretty peevish if someone started on me about Jesus and the Bible when I was on my death bed.  Definitely if you're going to go there, find out their feelings first.  It is extremely unlikely, in this culture anyway, that they haven't been exposed to those teachings, and likely were even raised to some degree in a church.  Most people I know who aren't Christian started out at least nominally so, and left it, rather than didn't ever know about it.  Whether someone would do so or not, a lot of us are conditioned by experience to expect any one who starts in that vein to hang on like a bulldog and refuse to back down, and it's vey stressful when someone starts.

Hi Irene
thank you for sharing that.
You are an ablsolute inspiration
thank you
love Cathy xx

I agree with Cricket. It doesn't matter whether or not people believe in Jesus, God or anything especially on their deathbed. And the last thing a dying person does not need is to be preached to. Listening is the whole key to helping someone pass over. If they express doubts as to an afterlife, etc., then something can be mentioned what the hospice worker believes in, if they feel that it will be well received and if the person seems to want this.  I feel that all paths lead to God no matter what the person's belief or non-belief is.

Love, Mairlyn ;-)

In my experience I have found that I and most other people tend to underestimate the incidiousness of arrogance. We are too used to thinking of it as a superior attitude that is abusive to others. In fact it's usually much more subtle than that.

If you believe that Jesus is the Way, the Truth, and the Light, and that none can enter the Kingdom of Heaven except through Him, then that is absolutely true. FOR YOU, because you have boxed yourself into this. This is YOUR truth. It represents the box YOU have put truth into. To go further and say that your truth is someone else's truth is to try to force the other to keep you company in your box, to accept your reality as their own. If the other peson were to accept this it would make you feel better by giving you additional validation of your beliefs while relieving you of worrying about what is going to happen to that person. What you are actually doing is saying that their reality is invalid and yours is real. You are demeaning the other person with the apparent motive of caring about them. To do this while someone is dying and apparently vulnerable is, well, NOT GOOD. This behavior is understandable from a certain perspective, but if we examine our motives carefully we can see that when we behave like this, we are behaving selfishly. To behave selfishly to the discomfort (expense) of someone else is one example of how incidious arrogance can be. There are many examples that I could pull from my own life for further illustration, but I won't bore you with that. Let it suffice to say that precious few of us are immune to the incidiousness of arrogance and it's something we have to be constantly watchful for.

Love,
Rob

Rob_Roy i understand what you are saying.  I do think it is very important to be aware and awake though.

I do think it is time for me to have a break from this great forum.  I have really said all I wanted to say.  I wish you all the very best - you are wonderful people and may Love and Light be with you always.

PUL
Caryn