Will I have to give these up after I die?
Can you be ALONE on the other side? I
mean, I'm a very private individual, and
especially if others can read your mind,
I wouldn't want them around all the time.
I am one of those people who can spend
MONTHS without seeing another human
being, and it doesn't grate on me - I like
being around others well enough, but I
prefer it in small doses. I like being alone.
AND - truth be told, although there's some
friends I've had that I'd do anything for and
enjoyed being around - the fact is (in the MASS)
I DON'T LIKE people very much, and never have -
for a number of reasons.
So - is it possible to go where you can be
alone, and shut others out for as long as it
takes to get your "solitude fix"?

B-man

Hi Chumley I read in one of medium doris stokes book that you can have a rest period in the afterlife if you choose to be alone to collect your thoughts . i feel like that sometimes just want to be alone with my own thoughts . God bless juditha

B-man,

Will you be stunned if you find out that you are the same person, consciousness when you die?  If you meet guides or loved ones and you ask "can I just be on my own?"  will you then be amazed if the answer is yes, sure?

I have seen no evidence that our minds change suddenly, and so therefore I see no one imposing activities on us after we die, but ourselves.  But you may have questions, when it is your time.  I know I will.  I have theories and thoughts.  I'll want to explore, see what meaning there was for all the various experiences.

That is where the true value lies.  Not in finding out what afterlife is enforced and given to us, but in discovering our own natures, loving ourselves and others and finding meaning/manifestation and relevance in our experiences.  

So yeah, if you want solitude, I think you'll have it.  You may be surprised at the various options you'll have though.  You say you don't like to be around others much.  You may be able to explore past experiences and gain some insight into yourself.  Then you may think, hmmmm.....I'd love to improve on this or that aspect of my spirit.  Suddenly, you are back in the game.

Either way, don't pose the question as can you find solitude?  If you wish to, I believe the answer is yes.  For as short or as long a period as you'd like.

Matthew

The issue of not being able to hide things due to thought being openly communicated there is also interesting to me.  In some ways, the experience may be liberating.  The baggage is out there, and I would bet that most spiritually aware people are not going to try to look for your personal or darkest aspects.

I'm also musing on the ideas of Hells, such as Bruce describes in Max's hell.  It would appear that telepathy may not be present in the lowest levels of the afterlife.  If sadists were in a location where other sadists are perpetrating acts on them (and vice versa), then that self-imposed game could only be played if one's thoughts were not an open book.  So perhaps there are degrees of spiritual openness, and we open ourselves up more and more as we advance spiritually.

Just a thought,

Matthew

If there WAS an afterlife, I thought I might like to use my time there as a "training ground" so to speak - to mold my character to the utmost, to be a "big shot" super-successful sort of guy when I reincarnated (if such were possible.)
If I chose to exist at all after the end of THIS life, I'd like spend ALL my time in a "Jedi Temple" for the training of super-successful alpha male type guys. (The cultivation of an IRON WILL would be a central focus of what I'd be doing for about 200-300 years I think - unshakable mental discipline being the answer to ALL of life's problems, really!)
Anyway, that's about all I desire from the afterlife, should it exist. (At least I know what I want..!)

B-man

I feel a lot the same way...I like people...certain people, in small doses.

It does occur to me that there is a pretty cross-culturally constant image of the "wise man on the mountian"...i.e., the most spiritually advanced person(s) in the story-teller's world go off to be alone and meditate or whatever.  The man-on-the-mountain character is usually perfectly happy to see and enlighten (though sometimes pretty cryptically) the passing pilgrim, but he usually makes himself hard to get to for the "madding crowd".

So, Chumley,
you would trade in the joys of solitude to go into training to be an alpha male? If you read the Intervention thread, you'll see alpha males are no longer in; Darwinism is passe'.
I like you without the alpha-bully role.
bets

Hey,

I like a bit of quiet time but only a very small amount! If the wise spiritual man being on his own is true i dont think im very spiritually advanced! I love being around people and having a laugh and a good time!

Ryan

Hi Ryan,

I'm with you; I think that as conscious beings, we need the interaction with others and with the universe.  I bet that for those who want it, there is solitude.  

However, if you look at human accomplishments on a grand scale on earth, you see a constant refinement and learning with interactions between people.  This holds true for inventions, and spiritual quests too.  Jewish talmud is constantly debated back and forth to find the true meaning.  In so doing, the religion is always expanding its horizons.  Likewise christians will have their conferences on certain questions or topics.  

I guess my point is that much is accomplished either personally or as a group with interactions with others.  

At some point we truly need to be with others.

Matthew

So, Chumley,
you would trade in the joys of solitude to go into training to be an alpha male?
*****************
-I wouldn't want solitude ALL the time, bets. I was concerned there might not be ANY solitude on the "other side."

If you read the Intervention thread, you'll see alpha males are no longer in; Darwinism is passe'.
*****************
-Wanna bet..?

"the alpha-bully role."
*****************
-Is the past, present, and FUTURE elite of mankind. Read the papers lately? You can't argue, or even reason with, GENETICS...

B-man

Fidel Castro may be little more than an over-used
punchline to jokes these days. Nonetheless...
It is said that when he was in college (1940s)
he was approached by some fellow students
who asked if he would be interested in joining
the Communist party.
Replied Castro: "Yes, if I get to be Stalin."
That pretty much sums it up. Social groups are, by their
very nature - HIERARCHICAL. Every group has
its leader(s) - and below them are the fawning toadies (who don't have anything better to do with their time, I guess, than SERVE the leaders in various ways...) AND every group has its piece of
trash, its designated deviant, its SCAPEGOAT.
I won't even consider voluntarily joining a group, if I even
suspect I'll end up in a low-ranking position. I'm NOT
asocial, you see - I'm STUBBORN, and I wouldn't
want to change that, even if I could.
There is nothing so wretched or CONTEMPTIBLE to
me, than a person who will put up with being shoved around, because "it's better than being alone." I'd rather go to "Hell", complete with fire, brimstone, and flesh-gobbling worms than sink to THAT level.
Hence, my belief that there's nothing better than alpha-maledom. You get the benefits of sociality (which CAN be a great thing!) without the bust-down to ZERO (in fundamental personal worth) that the "toady" or (***ESPECIALLY***) the "designated deviant" gets.
"Nuff said there...

B-man

B-man wrote:
There is nothing so wretched or CONTEMPTIBLE to
me, than a person who will put up with being shoved around, because "it's better than being alone." I'd rather go to "Hell", complete with fire, brimstone, and flesh-gobbling worms than sink to THAT level.
Hence, my belief that there's nothing better than alpha-maledom. You get the benefits of sociality (which CAN be a great thing!) without the bust-down to ZERO (in fundamental personal worth) that the "toady" or (***ESPECIALLY***) the "designated deviant" gets.
************************************

B-man, I know that you don't believe in a "Supreme Being" or "Creator," but have you considered that if there is such, you are a "toady" so to speak?

Also...unless you are ruler of the universe, you are getting pushed around to some extent now.  You are a part of the 'human race group' and bound by the same limitations that all humanity must observe.  Of course, this is unless you are an extra terrestrial...one option that I haven't completely ruled out! Ha ha.  The fact that you participate in this forum is a testament that you don't enjoy solitude all that much.

Stubborn isn't even the word for "I don't wanna play if I can't be the leader" mentality.  Come on...loosen up for goodness sake!
:-*
Much love,
Bug

wrote on Feb 19^th, 2006 at 10:26pm:

I won't even consider voluntarily joining a group, if I even suspect I'll end up in a low-ranking position.

You are a member of the human race and are not a world leader (I doubt)  ;D

Perhaps you cannot choose.

I think this poses the question of what we revert to if there is an afterlife. Many groups in nature are without an explicit leader.

What purpose are leaders in flocks of birds, schools of fish and fields of grass?

What are the functions of an apha male?, and are those functions needed in a group that does not need sustenance and reproduction?

Do we become light or pure consiousness at a level that ignores physical social structures?

Does hierarchy occur in a dream state or OBE's?

Mattb, you wrote...
*****************
You are a member of the human race and are not a world leader (I doubt)  ;D

Perhaps you cannot choose.
*****************
-Ah, but I CAN, Mattb. And I have...
I DID specify ""voluntarily join." I didn't volunteer to be "created" (assuming there is a "creator.")

I think this poses the question of what we revert to if there is an afterlife. Many groups in nature are without an explicit leader.

What purpose are leaders in flocks of birds, schools of fish and fields of grass?

What are the functions of an apha male?, and are those functions needed in a group that does not need sustenance and reproduction?
*****************
-If I can't reincarnate at some point, and set right things I did wrong in this life - well, I'd just as soon forget the whole schmear.

Do we become light or pure consiousness at a level that ignores physical social structures?

Does hierarchy occur in a dream state or OBE's?
*****************
-One thing's for sure... I'll choose obliteration over being the sh!tbag/scapegoat who's at the BOTTOM...
Or maybe even "Hell," barring obliteration (greatly preferable I'll admit!) FEAR is an inexcusable emotion, fit only for dumb animals and small children. If as an ADULT, you succumb to fear in ANY way, for ANY reason... YOU ARE A COWARD. I knuckled under to my last bully long, long ago. Perhaps "God" is a bully? The Old Testament sure as heck makes him out as one, not to mention the Book of Revelation.
If so - well, F*CK "God."
And if this means no "heaven" for me, and eternal torture...
So Be It.

B-man

wrote on Feb 20^th, 2006 at 9:33am:

-One thing's for sure... I'll choose obliteration over being the sh!tbag/scapegoat who's at the BOTTOM... Or maybe even "Hell," barring obliteration (greatly preferable I'll admit!) FEAR is an inexcusable emotion, fit only for dumb animals and small children. If as an ADULT, you succumb to fear in ANY way, for ANY reason... YOU ARE A COWARD. I knuckled under to my last bully long, long ago. Perhaps "God" is a bully? The Old Testament sure as heck makes him out as one, not to mention the Book of Revelation. If so - well, F*CK "God." And if this means no "heaven" for me, and eternal torture... So Be It. B-man

You are human, and so you experience fear. You speak of fear as an illness instead of its true state which is an emotion. You can only steer your emotions not control them.

The christian God is a christian interpretation of God. I like to think of it as a group of people painting a picture to describe music. It may contain various degrees of truth yet ultimately it is an interpretation, nothing more.

The christian God should not be viewed as a character in a book in my opinion.

mattb1000:
*****************
The christian God is a christian interpretation of God. I like to think of it as a group of people painting a picture to describe music. It may contain various degrees of truth yet ultimately it is an interpretation, nothing more.
*****************
I prefer the story of the six blind men trying to describe an elephant:
"One felt the tusk - and said, "Ah! The elephant is a spear!" And another felt the ear and thought it was a fan, ect.
In other words... if there is a over-arching and impersonal "Creative Principle", then religionists, like the six blind men, have tried to make a personal "being" out of said principle (with gruesome results for human history, BTW.)

B-man

wrote on Feb 20^th, 2006 at 10:31pm:

mattb1000: ***************** The christian God is a christian interpretation of God. I like to think of it as a group of people painting a picture to describe music. It may contain various degrees of truth yet ultimately it is an interpretation, nothing more. ***************** I prefer the story of the six blind men trying to describe an elephant: "One felt the tusk - and said, "Ah! The elephant is a spear!" And another felt the ear and thought it was a fan, ect. In other words... if there is a over-arching and impersonal "Creative Principle", then religionists, like the six blind men, have tried to make a personal "being" out of said principle (with gruesome results for human history, BTW.) B-man

Haha, nice. But  I feel we would have to use both metaphors if we were to describe the overall picture. Many people have a sense of community thanks to the bindings of a religion. So, for as much conflict it can cause, there is also some good in it.

You should also realise that we are an evolved form of a species that revolve around society and community.

Damla, you said...
*****************
i doubt that even when you are alive your thoughts are hidden or out of reach of others livign or dead. it is an illusion that our thoughts are private and hidden. they are litterally  everywhere.  ;D
come on..what is so bad about it?
*****************
-If you knew some of the things I think about on a REGULAR basis - you'd recoil in horror, my dear. (Or maybe you'd puke...)
Suffice it to say, that I'm glad we can't read each other's minds. If there is an afterlife where we CAN read each other "like a book" - I'd have to be so thoroughly changed, that I'm not sure I'd find the sacrifice worthwhile. I suck at being a conformist, Damla. (And I'm not sure I'd want to change that anyway..!)

*edit* it is very difficult..a human to find joy in solitude. see? even then, that person who finds joy in solitude, knows that he is never alone..that is where the joy is in solitude. it is a misconcept. "joy in solitude". a word of make believe. :)
******************
-Are you one of those women who is on her cell phone 24/7, Damla? No offense intended, but women these days (especially 35-and-under) seem like they might as well have surgery to graft their cell phones to their right ears...
Indeed, few people seem to enjoy solitude, and in this "wired" age of ours, few people are ever truly ALONE anymore. (Ever noticed that?) But is this a good thing? I don't particularly like this social development, I find it seriously ANNOYING in fact. (Ever tried to talk to somebody who's having a conversation on their cell while trying to talk to you also???)
Is that what the "hereafter" will be like? (Show me the way to the obliteration chamber, St. Peter...)
To be alone with your own thoughts can be a great thing sometimes. I'd hate to lose that. (Or maybe I've just got a bit more "nerd" in me than most folks? If so, being a nerd ain't all bad...)

B-man