i believe that stigmata can occur  ive read many things on this subject when stigmata happens it shows the wounds of jesus which he suffered on the cross what are your veiws on this god bless juditha

Good topic. I've seen/read a little about it. Just like Demonic possessions, and other wierd annomolies, they are few are far between, but very interesting. My jury is still out on the subject.

One curious thing about the stigmata I've heard about...they appeared in the palms of the hands.  When someone was crucified they were nailed through the wrists...nails in the palms would tear through.

I have heard of interesting studies done on the power of suggesiton and the subconscious.  In hypnotherapy, several subjects had letters traced on their skin without ink.  The suggestion was placed that at a certain place and time, they would begin to bleed - and they did.

Now, I bring this up, not to discredit stigmata, but to say that in hypnosis, sometimes people are accessing an infinite space.   If they believe, deeply in the crucifixation, then their subconscious connection to the all that is may help bring about real stigmata in the physical world.  If they believe the palms of the hands were involved, then that's where they will be.  Just like the traced letters began to bleed several days later ( I can get a reference on this one).

Matthew

Interesting post Doc, I agree, I think our subconsious is alot stronger than we may give credit to. I may do some more reading on this subject, if i can get the time . =/

Oh duh, finally remembered what this thread reminded me of.

When I was two and a half or three, my baby sister (of whom of course I was horribly jealous, having been the one and only for two years) came down with an itchy rash.  My parents and grandparents were making a big fuss over her, exclaiming over the nasty rash, and just, to my two year old mind, wasting a great deal of time and trouble on the squalling brat.  So, in good terrible twos fashion, I went off to have a sulk.  About ten minutes later, according to my mother, I came running in to the room hollering my head off  for everyone to look at my arm...on which there was a perfect square inch of rash...

I was too young to understand that I could induce a contact dermititus, even if I'd had anything to do it with, it wasn't just a red spot, like I might have created by scratching at the spot, it was an actual rash.  Don't know how I did it, have never done anything quite that spectacular since (I've created a few physical manifestations, but nothing like that).  I got my little dab of calamine, and, satisfied, I went off nursing my "owie", which healed up at the normal rate of a real rash.  Weird stuff.

I just accidentally reposted my "God and Destiny" thread to the front, while trying to cannibalize it for personal use.  But the thread does narrate my own apparent experience of stigmata (see reply #42) in case any of you are interested in reading about it.  I am not Catholic and, at the time, did not believe in stigmata!  

Don

Ah, but Don you consciously did not believe in the stigmata, yet you had a firm grounding in religion, and had undoubtedly heard about chritian religious epiphanies presenting this way.  

I will try to find the reference for you for hypnosis documenting letters gently traced over the skin bleeding at a determined time in the future, or actual stigmata.  I don't believe in hypnosis as a separate power, more as a direct link to our subconscious which is associated with infinite abilities.  Thus, I believe it quite possible that your conscious belief was not in stigmata, but that your subconscious had an impression that a profound moving moment can be associated in this way.  

Indeed, it was the universe sending a message to you directly through your body.  Indeed it was an epiphany.  But it also, to me illustrates the relationship of mind/fleeting conscious thought/deeper belief and God.  You were given a sign that was unique to you.  A muslim may have not understood the sign as well or a Hindu, and they may have received other confirmations for their epiphany.

So I leave the cause open ultimately, except to say that I believe it was your deepest belief and connection to God, through your subconscious that was in play.  Quite a powerful post, Don.

Matthew

Greetings,
In regard to #2 post from Cricket about stigmata appearing on the palms,
Depictions of the crucifixion for 100's of years have shown the nails thru the palms. Perhaps our consciousness has been educated by these? We feel it there, if we are the type to empathize with it. I realize that doesn't fully explain why it happens.
I first read about wrist bones being involved in the late 1950s--early 1960's I think, which surprised me since my friend had already exhibited the palm stigmata. She was devout in her Christianity and felt honored to have been chosen to be so marked.
Does anyone know of any non-Christian who showed the stigata? /  Is belief involved?
bets/betson  

Betson,

Your point about the palm wounds is important.  This consensus is false, though the stigmata may be divinely tailored to popular expectation.  It is clear that Jesus was actually impaled to the cross through His wrists.  Interestingly, the Shroud of Turin bucks this consensus by portraying Jesus as crucified through His wrists.  For many reasons, the jury is in my view still out on the shroud's authenticity, especially since the Carbon 14 datings are being increasingly challenged as the result of a medieval church fire.   if the shroud can be dated to the first century, I would consider it genuine because I can trace a possible genealogy for it to ancient times.  In any case, more and better dating tests need to be applied to the cloth.  I am upset that the Catholic church is not cooperating with calls for corrective dating tests.

Don

Hi Don,
one word upon the Turin shroud: If you wrap something around a body, the imprint to it would never ever look like a 2D picture like that of the  Turin shroud due to the distortions when you enroll it again. You can easily try it out at home with some fingerpaint you put on your face and then make an imprint on some stuff. I've never understood why this point regarding the Turin shroud's authenticity is such rarely mentioned.
Spooky

Spooky, there is much about the shroud of Turin that does not make perfect physical sense; it is the seeming impossibility of it all that makes it seem miraculous or true.  


Perhaps, one day the story will be verified or not.


M

Gotta say,i think these are self enduced.

They also, can be very damaging to someone's mental health.

I saw a program about 3 people who had stigmata's and 2 of them commited suicide and the other went off his rockers.

State of mind is fundermental to the body healing.

Also, if jesus was crucified - i dont think the nails would have been placed in his hands, as they would not hold the weight of a person, it's more likely they would jam the nail straight through the wrist.

Spooky2,
When you say distortions of the image on the Shroud should be more obvious, have you seen how flat they cover the bodies?  It's just one panel that lies flat
on top and swings under without twisting, then lies flat along the lower length. Would that have much distortion?
bets/betson

i believe in stigmata and also the crying madonna statue  i feel god has the power to do anything such as the crying madonna  and stigmata  jesus must have suffered terribly when he was nailed to the cross the pain must have been unbearable  i believe when people experience stigmata i think they are chosen by god to show that his son jesus did exist  and was crucified in this way  so his children us can believe  i believe the mother mary appeared at lourdes in france  and the holy water there can heal  people  one day i am going to take my son who has autism and see if he can be cured at lourdes i have enough faith to believe he will be deanna

i read in a book  that this woman had a catholic picture of jesus on her wall and it started to bleed frfrom the hesd and hands the book even showed a picture of it bleeding  i also beleive that statues of the virgin mary actually do cry  god bless juditha

Bets,
yes it would in any case come to distortions for geometrical reasons. If the cover would be flat like a plane, then only the top of the nose will cause a dot. If it is wrapped tightly, there would be an entire imprint, but when you unwrap it again, it will look quite strange. Check it out practically and you will know what I mean. It's the same principle to try to make a flat map of the round earth, it's impossible without distortions.

Personally, I like the theory that Leonardo Da Vinci fabricated the shroud.

Spooky